C.Biscuit97 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Shocking. You would think the guy who called the owner's daughter a see you next tuesday would be a great guy. Polian is a good GM but he benefited from picking his spots. Inherited Kelly and got to draft Bruce #1 overall; went to Carolina when the NFL allowed them to stacj their teams (see how great the early Jags teams were); and got to draft Peyton Manning #1 overall. IMO, great GMs don't draft teams that go 2-14 because they lost one player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted February 28, 2012 Author Share Posted February 28, 2012 Shocking. You would think the guy who called the owner's daughter a see you next tuesday would be a great guy. Polian is a good GM but he benefited from picking his spots. Inherited Kelly and got to draft Bruce #1 overall; went to Carolina when the NFL allowed them to stacj their teams (see how great the early Jags teams were); and got to draft Peyton Manning #1 overall. IMO, great GMs don't draft teams that go 2-14 because they lost one player. The colts made the playoffs 11 out of 12 seasons -- 1999-2010. That's pretty f'ing impressive. The bills made it in 1999. They haven't made it since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Shocking. You would think the guy who called the owner's daughter a see you next tuesday would be a great guy. Polian is a good GM but he benefited from picking his spots. Inherited Kelly and got to draft Bruce #1 overall; went to Carolina when the NFL allowed them to stacj their teams (see how great the early Jags teams were); and got to draft Peyton Manning #1 overall. IMO, great GMs don't draft teams that go 2-14 because they lost one player. great GMs find a way to tank 1 season to get the greatest QB prospect in a generation after already drafting the best QB of the last generation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 4 Super Bowl teams. I think you mean 5. The last Bills SB team was under Butler and the Colts made it twice. The Panthers made it to the NFC Championship as well. The guy had two HOF QB's, plus a guy in Collins who played well for a very long time and took one team(Giants) to a Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 The colts made the playoffs 11 out of 12 seasons -- 1999-2010. That's pretty f'ing impressive. The bills made it in 1999. They haven't made it since. If the Bills had the luxury of picking Manning #1 overall and the Colts ended up with a guy like JP Losman, how does that trend work? For as bad as the Bills drafted, they still won 6 to 7 games starting Losman and Edwards at QB. Do you honestly think that they are superior to Curtis Painter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 (edited) If the Bills had the luxury of picking Manning #1 overall and the Colts ended up with a guy like JP Losman, how does that trend work? For as bad as the Bills drafted, they still won 6 to 7 games starting Losman and Edwards at QB. Do you honestly think that they are superior to Curtis Painter? To me the point is Polian does a hell of a job with talent desicions and building a team.The Bills have had the luxury of having high draft picks for what, 10-11 years? We have done squat with them. Do you think we would be in this position if Polian was running things in Buff for those drafts? Polian doesn't seem to "end up" with guys like Losman or Edwards. For as bad as the Bills drafted, they still won 6 to 7 games starting Losman and Edwards at QB. Do you honestly think that they are superior to Curtis Painter? Maybe I am Dopey but, what ?!?! Painter was brought in as a Backup to a very durable HOF QB, he wasn't supposed to be a savior. Polian did the right thing here. As for the Bills, we drafted these guys thinking they would lead our team to the playoffs. Big difference. Painter wasn't expected to carry the Colts, unlike Losman and Edwards.If Polian were looking for a franchise QB, he wouldn't be looking at Painter.If he was still here, I don't think we would have wasted all of those high picks, or drafted guys like Losman or Edwards. He turned the Bills, Panthers and Colts into winners. Franchises that were pretty much in the dumps when he arrived, and "Bam" now they're winners. "till he leaves, that is. Edited February 28, 2012 by Dopey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 To me the point is Polian does a hell of a job with talent desicions and building a team.The Bills have had the luxury of having high draft picks for what, 10-11 years? We have done squat with them. Do you think we would be in this position if Polian was running things in Buff for those drafts? Polian doesn't seem to "end up" with guys like Losman or Edwards. For as bad as the Bills drafted, they still won 6 to 7 games starting Losman and Edwards at QB. Do you honestly think that they are superior to Curtis Painter? Maybe I am Dopey but, what ?!?! Painter was brought in as a Backup to a very durable HOF QB, he wasn't supposed to be a savior. Polian did the right thing here. As for the Bills, we drafted these guys thinking they would lead our team to the playoffs. Big difference. Painter wasn't expected to carry the Colts, unlike Losman and Edwards.If Polian were looking for a franchise QB, he wouldn't be looking at Painter.If he was still here, I don't think we would have wasted all of those high picks, or drafted guys like Losman or Edwards. He turned the Bills, Panthers and Colts into winners. Franchises that were pretty much in the dumps when he arrived, and "Bam" now they're winners. "till he leaves, that is. Um, the Colts drafted Manning with the #1 overall pick. The Bills haven't had the #1 pick since Bruce Smith. And as bad as they have been, they rarely draft top 5 (like the Lions and Rams). They only had 3 top 5 picks since the 80s. The Bills are average to slightly below average, which is probably worse. But my main point is that if you get a franchise QB, everything else falls into place. If Luck is as good as people make him out to be, does that mean the new Colts' GM (whatever his name is), is some kind of genius? Or does it mean he just inherited a great situation? For example if the Bills were as awful as the Colts were this season, would Nix be a genius for drafting Luck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Um, the Colts drafted Manning with the #1 overall pick. The Bills haven't had the #1 pick since Bruce Smith. And as bad as they have been, they rarely draft top 5 (like the Lions and Rams). They only had 3 top 5 picks since the 80s. The Bills are average to slightly below average, which is probably worse. But my main point is that if you get a franchise QB, everything else falls into place. If Luck is as good as people make him out to be, does that mean the new Colts' GM (whatever his name is), is some kind of genius? Or does it mean he just inherited a great situation? For example if the Bills were as awful as the Colts were this season, would Nix be a genius for drafting Luck? If we have the run that the Colts did with Manning, then yes. Don't forget there was alot of debate over Manning and Leaf, he picked the right one.The Bill rarely drafted in the top 5, but the Colts almost always drafted in the late 20's and still fielded a quality team for a long time undr Polian.Even if we base Polian on only 2 desicions in his career as a GM (Manning over Leaf, and Edjeran James Vs. Ricky Williams) he came off as a genius, like him or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Um, the Colts drafted Manning with the #1 overall pick. The Bills haven't had the #1 pick since Bruce Smith. And as bad as they have been, they rarely draft top 5 (like the Lions and Rams). They only had 3 top 5 picks since the 80s. The Bills are average to slightly below average, which is probably worse. But my main point is that if you get a franchise QB, everything else falls into place. If Luck is as good as people make him out to be, does that mean the new Colts' GM (whatever his name is), is some kind of genius? Or does it mean he just inherited a great situation? For example if the Bills were as awful as the Colts were this season, would Nix be a genius for drafting Luck? First, "franchise QBs" are not limitied to #1 picks in the draft. Second, yes, Painter was far worse than JPL and Edwards. That is a silly question. There were several backup QBs (Moore, Yates,--even rookies Gabbert, Locker, Skelton) that played better than paniter this year. Any one of them would have won more than 2 games on the Colts this past season. Hell, even Orlovski--the Colts 3rd string QB--was far better than Painter. But if he had played all season then the Colts wouldn't be picking 1st. Third, picking Manning didn't make anyone a "genius". But Manning wasn't the only player on pretty well stacked Colts teams that Polian drafted. There is a lot of bashing of gratuitous Polian bashing going on now. I imagine there was no such sentiment in the minds of Bill sfans as his teams were appearing in 4 consecutive SBs. Back then, before the era of free agency? Practically. Ridiculous. Few teams have ever been as stacked with talent as those Bills teams. Polian's main deficit was picking the right head coach to turn talented teams into serial SB winners--both in Buffalo and Indy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Bill Polian, in a nutshell: Above average talent evaluator Shrewd negotiator Arrogant douche If you value the first two items above all else, then you'll defend Polian (and trash Ralph) all day long. Unfortunately, Bills fans are saddled with more than a decade of futility so everyone wants to remember the "good old days" fondly...leading to a slightly skewed view of how "great" Polian was. There are a lot of GMs who would look pretty good with Jim Kelly and Peyton Manning falling into their laps. One could argue that Polian's arrogance in refusing to upgrade the other parts of his teams is a big reason he doesn't have more than one Super Bowl championship ring. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Ridiculous. Few teams have ever been as stacked with talent as those Bills teams. Polian's main deficit was picking the right head coach to turn talented teams into serial SB winners--both in Buffalo and Indy. Please. Go take a look at the Pro Bowlers from those SB-winning teams before the FA era, doc. They were all stacked with loads of Pro Bowlers. As for HC'ing, the only game the Bills had a shot was the Giants game, and I could say that both coaching and the players let the team down. The Redskins came out of nowhere and were unstoppable, and the Cowboys had a lot more talent, to go with excellent coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 If the Bills had the luxury of picking Manning #1 overall and the Colts ended up with a guy like JP Losman, how does that trend work? For as bad as the Bills drafted, they still won 6 to 7 games starting Losman and Edwards at QB. Do you honestly think that they are superior to Curtis Painter? I understand not wanting to praise a guy who by most accounts is a real !@#$, but let's be honest here. The guy's had a lot of success in a highly competetive zero sum game for a lot of years. He's not just real lucky, or else he's the luckiest guy in the world. If you're looking for someone to hate on you should look for a loudmouth, self-aggrandizing, immature bag of vinegar and water who had his life status handed to him on a silver platter. Like Jim Irsay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDaDdy Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-silver_jim_irsay_peyton_manning_colts_andrew_luck022512 Imteresting. Silver is a pretty solid and ineresting reporter, but he seems to have more of an agenda than most. I think Irsay is a dolt, but thisarticle does seem to match up with many over the years that portray Polian as an insufferable and domineering Napoleon type. My own two cents--nepotism is a bad thing, and Polian's promotion of his son as heir apparent was bound to fail. That's hubris on Polian's part. What about the Irsay promoting HIS son? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 What about the Irsay promoting HIS son? Very different. His son is an owner in waiting. No position he can hold in the organization is a promotion from what he already is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 If you're looking for someone to hate on you should look for a loudmouth, self-aggrandizing, immature bag of vinegar and water who had his life status handed to him on a silver platter. Like Jim Irsay. And if you were the owner of a team you would disown your son so that he could try to replicate your business success? I didn't think so. What matters is the kind of owner he has been. Yes, he is a bag of douche. But he has been a good owner since he took over for his father...........who happened to be an AWFUL owner. Inherited or not, he has been a huge upgrade as an owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Did anyone else note the irony of that list of teams in the running to sign Manning? Most of them had made deals to bring in a "franchise" QB earlier, and apparently still need one. PTR Chalk it up to 32 teams perpetually chasing 5-10 guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 (edited) Bill Polian, in a nutshell: Above average talent evaluator Shrewd negotiator Arrogant douche If you value the first two items above all else, then you'll defend Polian (and trash Ralph) all day long. Unfortunately, Bills fans are saddled with more than a decade of futility so everyone wants to remember the "good old days" fondly...leading to a slightly skewed view of how "great" Polian was. There are a lot of GMs who would look pretty good with Jim Kelly and Peyton Manning falling into their laps. One could argue that Polian's arrogance in refusing to upgrade the other parts of his teams is a big reason he doesn't have more than one Super Bowl championship ring. Just sayin' He refused to upgrade the other parts of his team?? Mathis? Freney? James? Wayne? Clark? Viniateri? The reason the Colts only won a single SB wasa because they had Dungy as HC. Please. Go take a look at the Pro Bowlers from those SB-winning teams before the FA era, doc. They were all stacked with loads of Pro Bowlers. As for HC'ing, the only game the Bills had a shot was the Giants game, and I could say that both coaching and the players let the team down. The Redskins came out of nowhere and were unstoppable, and the Cowboys had a lot more talent, to go with excellent coaching. Yes, they were all stacked with PBers--like the Bills. And they all won multiple SBs. Bills had more ProBowlers than the Skins in '91 and the Boys in '92. If the Cowboys and the Bills switched HCs, the Bills would have blanked the 'Boys. And yes, the Skins, with future HOFers Mark Rypien, Gary Clark and Earnest Byner simply could not be stopped. Edited February 29, 2012 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 I understand not wanting to praise a guy who by most accounts is a real !@#$, but let's be honest here. The guy's had a lot of success in a highly competetive zero sum game for a lot of years. He's not just real lucky, or else he's the luckiest guy in the world. If you're looking for someone to hate on you should look for a loudmouth, self-aggrandizing, immature bag of vinegar and water who had his life status handed to him on a silver platter. Like Jim Irsay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Yes, they were all stacked with PBers--like the Bills. And they all won multiple SBs. Bills had more ProBowlers than the Skins in '91 and the Boys in '92. If the Cowboys and the Bills switched HCs, the Bills would have blanked the 'Boys. And yes, the Skins, with future HOFers Mark Rypien, Gary Clark and Earnest Byner simply could not be stopped. No one would agree with you that the Cowboys teams from 1992-1993 had less talent than the Bills. That's just crazy talk. As for the Skins, they weren't stacked with HOF'ers, but the team was unstoppable, even without the questionable officiating that went on in the SB. To believe that the players didn't come up small time and again and that it was all just coaching is silly, but you're entitled to believe it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in STL Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 4 Super Bowl teams. One of the best GMs in the business and a certain Hall of Famer. Being a jerk has not hurt his performace. Kind of like that coach in New England. I'll bet he retires for good after this fiasco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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