KD in CA Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 1327198304[/url]' post='2367990']Sad but true Horsemen. Valvano was a habitual NCAA rule breaker...but now the JimmyV fund has raised $115M for cancer research and Roy Williams and Mike Krzyzewski, who hated competing against a cheater work on behalf of his legacy. JoePa turned the other way to protect a friend, a program and a legacy he built -- but it was horribly wrong and its his last act...you are only as good as your last act unfortunately. Somehow however tonight for those of us of faith in God like JoePa--I think God has added to heaven's football staff...and JoePa has been forgiven.. Seriously? Drawing a comparison between recruiting violations and enabling a serial child molester? The only thing that's sad in this story is the number of people who lionized (and still do) a guy who turned out to be a disgrace.
Búfalo Blanco Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 Hopefully now he can find some peace...
Mark80 Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 It will be said that he died of lung cancer, but it's more likely that he died of a broken heart from what happened to his program that he always took so much pride in being top class. RIP.
Rob's House Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) It will be said that he died of lung cancer, but it's more likely that he died of a broken heart from what happened to his program reputation that he always took so much pride in being top class. RIP. fixed Edited January 22, 2012 by Rob's House
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 Seriously? Drawing a comparison between recruiting violations and enabling a serial child molester? The only thing that's sad in this story is the number of people who lionized (and still do) a guy who turned out to be a disgrace. I think there's a middle ground. Whether you view him Asa good man that made a mistake or a bad person that happened to do a lot of good..... He impacted a ton of lives, mostly very positive.... But some in the darkest ways possible. I'm not going to build a shrine to him but i will say I dont wish suffering, cancer and death on he and his family.
EasternOHBillsFan Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 I feel sorry most of all for the victims of Jerry Sandusky and those who decided to fire him today, because they will inevitably be blamed for his death which is totally insane... and the man lived to be 85 years old, which is really over the average life expectancy. RIP.
jester43 Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 i'm not a penn st. fan at all, and i don't think joe is without blame, but i also believe he took just a little too much heat for his role in the scandal. i'd love to see a list of horrible things TBD members have done to compare them with joe's transgressions. that would be interesting.
Rob's House Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 i'm not a penn st. fan at all, and i don't think joe is without blame, but i also believe he took just a little too much heat for his role in the scandal. i'd love to see a list of horrible things TBD members have done to compare them with joe's transgressions. that would be interesting. Uh...yeah. None of us are perfect, but I somehow doubt that if the average TBD member found out his buddy was butt-raping 10 year olds, he'd give him a pass and look the other way. I'm guessing there must be some pretty nasty skeletons in your closet for you to make such a projection. Further, how many TBD posters will be widely mourned and glorified when they redeem their reservations in hell?
KD in CA Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 1327247391[/url]' post='2368174']I think there's a middle ground. Whether you view him Asa good man that made a mistake or a bad person that happened to do a lot of good..... He impacted a ton of lives, mostly very positive.... But some in the darkest ways possible. I'm not going to build a shrine to him but i will say I dont wish suffering, cancer and death on he and his family. I don't wish ill on him or his family either but i'm also not going to join in the desire to lionize him now that he's dead for his supposedly wonderful program or sweep what he failed to do away with the all-to-convenient 'mistake' label. Allowing that to continue day after day for ten years is one hell of a mistake. It seems to me there are still plenty of his sycophants who didn't think he deserved any blame at all for what happened. 1327248180[/url]' post='2368181']i'd love to see a list of horrible things TBD members have done to compare them with joe's transgressions. that would be interesting. And for those people that did anything as bad as enabling a serial child molester, I won't give a rat's ass when they die either.
EasternOHBillsFan Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 I don't wish ill on him or his family either but i'm also not going to join in the desire to lionize him now that he's dead for his supposedly wonderful program or sweep what he failed to do away with the all-to-convenient 'mistake' label. Allowing that to continue day after day for ten years is one hell of a mistake. It seems to me there are still plenty of his sycophants who didn't think he deserved any blame at all for what happened. And for those people that did anything as bad as enabling a serial child molester, I won't give a rat's ass when they die either. Inevitably it is not just a mistake over not escalating the Sandusky incident, but a series of cover-ups that put the Penn State reputation above all else. It wasn't just one case of a 'mistake', and it is sad that there will be people who will defend him to the hilt.
Lurker Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 No matter how hard I try I just can't get upset about this. It never ceases to amaze me what people will "say" ensconced in the safe anonymity of an Internet connection...
Rob's House Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 It never ceases to amaze me what people will "say" ensconced in the safe anonymity of an Internet connection... Are you suggesting that I'd for some reason feel unwilling to express the fact that I don't give two ***** and a good God Damn about "Joe Pa" and the fact that he's dead? It never ceases to amaze me how people will overlook the most atrocious behavior to maintain their idolization of heroes. Especially grown men who should have enough perspective and maturity to take off the rose-colored glasses and realize there are few if any deserving of such lofty praise.
JoeF Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 Seriously? Drawing a comparison between recruiting violations and enabling a serial child molester? The only thing that's sad in this story is the number of people who lionized (and still do) a guy who turned out to be a disgrace. Wasn't implying that at all. A couple of things on this KD: If you think Valvano's only "crime" was recruiting -- you are horribly wrong. Just look at the criminal records of those recruits -- he did nothing to discipline them or control them once at NC State--he ignored and in fact actively covered up addiction, rape, felony burglary -- all under his watch--so for you to pontificate on this as recruiting isn't factual. Its very similar to Sandusky in the scope of crimes against people. Chris Washburn, Charles Shackleford, etc...Valvano stood by and watched and not only didn't care but worked his network to cover it up. Yet all was forgiven when he was diagnosed and waged a public battle against cancer. Second, I never justified how JoePa dealt with this--Sandusky should have been outed, banned from the program and fully investigated in the late 90's when this came to light--There is no doubt in my mind that the allegations are why JoePa got rid of his direct coaching in the program in the late 90's -- but still it wasn't enough. He covered it up and allowed it to go on next to the program. These are unthinkable and unspeakable crimes.
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) Are you suggesting that I'd for some reason feel unwilling to express the fact that I don't give two ***** and a good God Damn about "Joe Pa" and the fact that he's dead? It never ceases to amaze me how people will overlook the most atrocious behavior to maintain their idolization of heroes. Especially grown men who should have enough perspective and maturity to take off the rose-colored glasses and realize there are few if any deserving of such lofty praise. I've seen pretty limited praise, and even less football related. I don't really think there's much (if any) idolization here. Edited January 22, 2012 by NoSaint
JoeF Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) Are you suggesting that I'd for some reason feel unwilling to express the fact that I don't give two ***** and a good God Damn about "Joe Pa" and the fact that he's dead? It never ceases to amaze me how people will overlook the most atrocious behavior to maintain their idolization of heroes. Especially grown men who should have enough perspective and maturity to take off the rose-colored glasses and realize there are few if any deserving of such lofty praise. Rob--most of me shares your anger and judgement of JoePa. A bit of me holds back the harshness--because I look at my own life and can point to things I have done for which I wish I could be forgiven. It won't happen. I also believe -- the torture of this situation killed JoePa--it took any will to live he had--so yeah he got a death penalty for his mistakes -- horrible mistakes. He knows in his heart covering this for over a decade was wrong -- sad that it took a tidal wave of public attention for him to see this. Its a great lesson that trying to protect a reputation, a program, a history by covering up and lying is never justified. We are having a debate/discussion here that will last years...I think we fall pretty much like the public in general -- at the core of this were young boys who were exploited under the worst of circumstances -- a man with ill intentions who was disguised as helper...I hope all the focus on JoePa doesn't protect the real culprit... Edited January 22, 2012 by JoeF
Rob's House Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 I've seen pretty limited praise, and even less football related. I don't really think there's much (if any) idolization here. I can only assume Lurker revere's the man after his comment: It never ceases to amaze me what people will "say" ensconced in the safe anonymity of an Internet connection... I was hoping he might provide some clarification. Some jerk off wrote some syrup laden piece about heavens football team and how Paternoe's sins are forgiven, which made me gag. As I stated earlier, I don't have any burning intense hatred for the man. By the same token, If he was on fire I wouldn't piss on him to put it out. I just don't get why people want so desperately to remember him fondly.
JoeF Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) I can only assume Lurker revere's the man after his comment: I was hoping he might provide some clarification. Some jerk off wrote some syrup laden piece about heavens football team and how Paternoe's sins are forgiven, which made me gag. As I stated earlier, I don't have any burning intense hatred for the man. By the same token, If he was on fire I wouldn't piss on him to put it out. I just don't get why people want so desperately to remember him fondly. I would be that jerk off.... ;-) Sorry... I, I, I just get really emotional around death...I take it back..... Edited January 22, 2012 by JoeF
Rob's House Posted January 22, 2012 Posted January 22, 2012 I would be that jerk off.... ;-) Sorry... I, I, I just get really emotional around death...I take it back..... Ha ha ha ha. Sorry dude. No offense. It just kind of triggered my gag reflex.
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