Jason Peters -- First Team All-Pro

[PromoTheRobot]

You have it correct Gary. The NFL doesn't "rank" anything - they collect the data and present it hI. So in short that link shows the Bills have given up the lowest number of sacks this year. It is foolish to rank anything based soley on the numbers anyway, considering it is a team game and each of the three phases influence each other.

 

I can only think that PTR is ignorant to that or flat out lying. You would have to go to a site like pro football focus to find rankings that go beyond the actual numbers.

We can go back and forth about Peters value but to me the bottom line is he quit on the Bills. End of discussion. I don't care if his vagina hurt over the way he felt he was treated. You don't quit on your team. Peters could be a 5-time SB MVP. I would still be glad he's gone. If Peters were on fire I wouldn't piss on him to put him out. Some of you jock clingers may be okay with quitters. I'm not.

 

PTR

[dave mcbride]

More grist for the mill. Pro Football Focus has its all-pro team out now, and they say that Petersutterly dominated the LT position this season.

 

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/01/05/2011-pff-all-pro-team/

Edited January 8, 2012 by dave mcbride

[Billsguy]

Please do not say the All-Pro team is a popularity contest, it is not, at all. Look at all of the other starters. Some big names, some not, all of the guys that excelled that weren't expected to are near the top.

 

Peters is a great player and worth the money, and would have been on the Bills too.

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/06/rodgers-tops-brees-easily-megatron-and-allen-lead-all-pro-voting/#more-177937

 

Is it time to start another "Ralph Wilson is not cheap" thread?

[BADOLBILZ]

He's also a back stabbing piece of with no sense what so ever of loyalty !! Where would he have been if the Bills staff wouldn't have noticed his talent at a different position & nurtured that ? By now he would have been retired from the NFL or on a practice squad some where .

 

Him & Mcgahee are one & the same !!!

 

But that's what we get show the guy what he's all about & all's we got was grief from the guy because he was & will always be a greedy ingrateful turd !!

 

GOOD RIDENSE TO BAD RUBISH !!!!!

 

Peters was not an unknown commodity. He had a great combine and he was considered a likely third round draft pick despite never playing OL in college and essentially being a seldom used blocking TE.

 

He wasn't drafted at all because the coaching staff at Arkansas basically told everyone he was a no good POS because he didn't work hard at Arkansas and they were pissed that he was leaving.

 

It was later reported that they were shocked at how hard he was working when he returned to Arkansas to train after the draft.

 

Imagine that, a young player motivated by a chance to go pro!

 

See Nick Fairley last year. See Whitney Mercilus in this upcoming draft. Bills fans? See Pat "second string at Texas A&M" Williams.

 

Lots of players find motivation when the prospect of pay comes into the equation. Perhaps if Arkansas had put Peters at OT the season before they would have gotten that work out of him.

 

Is Peters a guy of Tebow-like character? No he's not.

 

But as an employer who has had well over a thousand individuals in personal employ, I can tell you that when you have elite talent at your disposal, it's your job as management to make it work if at all possible. You hate to do it, and when the tables eventually turn you can justifiably fire that a-hole with no remorse, but that's basic management.

 

(With all the time that some of you spend on this board I'm willing to bet that some of your employers spend a lot of time biting their tongue about your own underachievement......but I digress)

 

Peters and his agent got in a pissing match with a marketing expert who had never been a GM and Brandon and company made some glaring mistakes in their handling of the situation.

 

They should have known the kind of guy they were dealing with....that's how they got him for free in the first place. They should have been pro-active and shouldn't have taken the negotiations to the press, which they did to gain support from D-bag fans like PTR. Bottom line: he was asking for market value.

 

Peters is one of those guys who is a pain in the asss to mgt, but the players like him(see the freakin' pro bowl voting) and he can destroy an opposing RDE.

[BADOLBILZ]

Is it time to start another "Ralph Wilson is not cheap" thread?

 

He's cheap sometimes, He's not cheap other times.

 

He's a bad owner most of the time.

 

What's frustrating with Ralph is that he never grew as an owner.

 

Years of experience should make you better.

 

See Art Rooney and his family. The Steelers were a laughingstock for decades in the NFL but once it clicked, it stayed clicked. They've been to the Super Bowl with 3 different coaches since.

 

Same with the Mara family with the Giants. The Giants missed the playoffs for like 18 straight years in the 60's and 70's. They've been to the Super Bowl with 3 different coaches since.

 

Ralph is just Ralph. He's a mercurial, emotional decision-maker. He's not a football guy and he hasn't learned from his mistakes. He's like the fan on here that says "we can lose WITHOUT that guy". Next thing you know, the team is drafting that guys replacement in round one.

 

He is competitive though, so when he is not winning, he gets cheap because making profits is the OTHER way the owners compete.

 

Financially, the Bills have been a small market dynasty past decade.

 

The challenge for the often underqualified management he hires is to catch lightning in a bottle and win so that Ralph gets excited about the project and invests in his own players like he used to (lavishly) during the Kelly/Bruce/Thurman era.

 

It has proven difficult......in my opinion.

[zazie]

Peters was not an unknown commodity. He had a great combine and he was considered a likely third round draft pick despite never playing OL in college and essentially being a seldom used blocking TE.

 

He wasn't drafted at all because the coaching staff at Arkansas basically told everyone he was a no good POS because he didn't work hard at Arkansas and they were pissed that he was leaving.

 

It was later reported that they were shocked at how hard he was working when he returned to Arkansas to train after the draft.

 

Imagine that, a young player motivated by a chance to go pro!

 

See Nick Fairley last year. See Whitney Mercilus in this upcoming draft. Bills fans? See Pat "second string at Texas A&M" Williams.

 

Lots of players find motivation when the prospect of pay comes into the equation. Perhaps if Arkansas had put Peters at OT the season before they would have gotten that work out of him.

 

Is Peters a guy of Tebow-like character? No he's not.

 

But as an employer who has had well over a thousand individuals in personal employ, I can tell you that when you have elite talent at your disposal, it's your job as management to make it work if at all possible. You hate to do it, and when the tables eventually turn you can justifiably fire that a-hole with no remorse, but that's basic management.

 

(With all the time that some of you spend on this board I'm willing to bet that some of your employers spend a lot of time biting their tongue about your own underachievement......but I digress)

 

Peters and his agent got in a pissing match with a marketing expert who had never been a GM and Brandon and company made some glaring mistakes in their handling of the situation.

 

They should have known the kind of guy they were dealing with....that's how they got him for free in the first place. They should have been pro-active and shouldn't have taken the negotiations to the press, which they did to gain support from D-bag fans like PTR. Bottom line: he was asking for market value.

 

Peters is one of those guys who is a pain in the asss to mgt, but the players like him(see the freakin' pro bowl voting) and he can destroy an opposing RDE.

Peters has a better character than hollier-than-thou let me foist my virtues on you.

 

He wanted fair money for his services. During his holdout he said not one word, positive or negative, about the bills or buffalo. His agent was in control of the situation, as Peters paid his agent to be.

 

Tebow is a d-bag, I don't know why being religious makes him of good character in many peoples eyes. fior me it is a definate nagative.

 

Peters wanted to get what he was worth, and when Philly paid him, it emontrated that he was correct to want that and he should have gotten it from the Bills.

 

I have no issue with Peters. He wa 100% correct. And he did show up and played for his under-paid contract, per the contract, when the games actually started.

[GaryPinC]

 

 

...Peters is one of those guys who is a pain in the asss to mgt, but the players like him(see the freakin' pro bowl voting) and he can destroy an opposing RDE.

 

Great post, just wanted to add that Peters also watched the Bills shell out stupid money to Dockery, Langston Walker, and Melvin Fowler then turn around and ignore their best linesman's request to be paid more appropriately.

 

I don't like Peters much(and don't want him back) because of the way he handled the situation but even a higher character person would have been demoralized by this on-and-off the field incompetance.

[BADOLBILZ]

Great post, just wanted to add that Peters also watched the Bills shell out stupid money to Dockery, Langston Walker, and Melvin Fowler then turn around and ignore their best linesman's request to be paid more appropriately.

 

I don't like Peters much(and don't want him back) because of the way he handled the situation but even a higher character person would have been demoralized by this on-and-off the field incompetance.

 

Correct you are. There was a period of about 14 months beginning when Levy was hired that brought this franchise to the pitiful lows of the past 6 years.

 

They hired Jauron, which was never going to yield great results, and they botched premium draft positioning. But by seasonss end a team with a lot of Donahoe-assembled talent had developed an identity as a run-first, play action, throw deep offense with an opportunistic, playmaking defense

 

They were a team on the rise.

 

But rather than build on that, they traded McGahee when he was poised to play his asss off in a contract year and buried a first round pick on Marshawn Lynch to replace him. They let playmakers Fletcher and Clements go for NOTHING. They dealt Spikes, honoring his wish to play for a team with a chance at the playoffs....he was an underrated loss....as he probably could STILL have been starting on this team in 2011.

 

The previous offseason they signed about 15 free agents, the best of which was Robert Royal for chrissake. Then as you mentioned they go out and pay Langston Walker, who nobody else wanted, $5M per. Then the ridiculous Dockery deal.

 

The result was a decimated defense which made the play action game difficult to implement and exposed the mental shortcomings of JP Losman.

 

The trading of players who preferred to play elsewhere and the overpaying of free agent scrubs lead to bad acting by not only Peters, but also by Lynch and Aaron Schobel who felt they could force the teams hand by acting disgruntled and they would either be traded or paid better.

 

 

As for your last point......it's not surprising some fans wouldn't want Peters back. Fans want the perception of loyalty. It is managements job to insulate fans from contract issues etc. because when they don't it turns fans on players. The reality is that in private you find out that it takes all types to make up a team. Good guys, bad guys, smart ones, dumb ones etc..

Edited January 8, 2012 by Dick Drawn

[San Jose Bills Fan]

They dealt Spikes, honoring his wish to play for a team with a chance at the playoffs....he was an underrated loss....as he probably could STILL have been starting on this team in 2011.

Yeah Spikes has had a nice career re-birth after the requisite 2 years it takes to come back from an achilles rupture.

 

Sadly and ironically, Spikes has still never played on a playoff team… 14 seasons and counting.

 

Probably one of the greatest players to never appear in the playoffs.

 

 

 

[DC Grid]

Jason Peters deserves to be an all pro as much as Ruben Brown deserved to be a pro bowler almost every year of his career.

[zazie]

Bottom line, despite all the negativity surrounding Peters, was that he is a football player. He has an agent, to whom he pays a lot of money, to advise him on all business related to anything not on the football field. He was smart enough to not second guess his agent, who, after all, is a professional negotiator.

 

The hate is mis-placed, and the argument that he could have told the agent what to do is bad logic (if you are going to do that what is the agent getting paid for??).

 

Peters kept his mouth shut and did what the guy he paid to advise him, told him to do.

 

Now he is a perennial all pro at a crucial position, for another team.

 

Peters agent 1, Bills 0

[dave mcbride]

Jason Peters deserves to be an all pro as much as Ruben Brown deserved to be a pro bowler almost every year of his career.

This is so wrong. Do you even watch the games? See my post above about pro football focus.

 

Interestingly, if you read the analysis through, you"ll see that they graded Poz as the third best 4-3 mlb in the league (and arguably the second best). Amother case of the Bills letting talent walk and signing his replacement. The bills could easily have both barnett and poz, and they look even dumber now because they appear to be shifting back to a 4-3.

Edited January 8, 2012 by dave mcbride

[NoSaint]

Bottom line, despite all the negativity surrounding Peters, was that he is a football player. He has an agent, to whom he pays a lot of money, to advise him on all business related to anything not on the football field. He was smart enough to not second guess his agent, who, after all, is a professional negotiator.

 

The hate is mis-placed, and the argument that he could have told the agent what to do is bad logic (if you are going to do that what is the agent getting paid for??).

 

Peters kept his mouth shut and did what the guy he paid to advise him, told him to do.

 

Now he is a perennial all pro at a crucial position, for another team.

 

Peters agent 1, Bills 0

 

Oh come on.... You can't believe that a player should have no input

[Hplarrm]

We can go back and forth about Peters value but to me the bottom line is he quit on the Bills. End of discussion. I don't care if his vagina hurt over the way he felt he was treated. You don't quit on your team. Peters could be a 5-time SB MVP. I would still be glad he's gone. If Peters were on fire I wouldn't piss on him to put him out. Some of you jock clingers may be okay with quitters. I'm not.

 

PTR

It strikes me that what we have here is a division of opinion based on a chicken amd egg situation ofr what came first the Bills giving up on Peters or Peter giving up on the Bills.

 

PTR chooses a view that given the Bills had given Peters a chance to prove what he could do by signing him as UDFA the Billd had given Peters a ior playchance to suceed and he had then earned a series of compensatory contracts which came because of his superrior play and attitude (unlike other UDFAs, Peter proved to be unblockable as an ST player.

 

If the Bills had actually put themselves on the line first by giving Peters by dedicating a precious draft spot then I would say that Peters owed the Bills loyakty. However, Petera was a UDFA in demand due to his talent but going undrafted. He chose apparenntly between several offers from Bills to make his run.

 

The Bills did GIVE hin sew contracts based on his play level and the Bills receiving longer amd longer term commitments based upon the rules of the CBA. For examaple as a PS player initially, Peters Peters great prospects in practice forced the Bills to activate sign him as a full year NFL player or risk loaing him to another team which risk loaing him to another team which would be sign him to a fulltime player. Peters quickly established this as a good move by demonstrated this was a good move by showing the desire and discipline to by blocking a punt and recovering the ball for a TD. He also proved to be a quick study and not only made the switch to the OL but did this so well he earned a starting job as an RT.

 

The Bills raiseed his compensation to that of a starter RT and got the compensation of his extending longterm at the market rate for a starting RT.

 

However, he then showd extraordinary skill and also discipline to his craft and team by winning the LT job by winning the LT job, In fact he proved to be so valued he earned Pro Bowl status (whether one feels he deserved it or not the facy hr drserved it or not with his play he earned the ability to negotiate with the Bills for a lifetime contract at huge LT dollars.

 

However, he already choaen to ohosen to committ to the Bills longterm with a starting RT level contract with the Bills. Sure the Bills had already signed him longterm and were under no contractual obligation to pay him market rate him more.

 

However, the Bills already set the precedent of extending Schobel's conytact by giving him a raise in mid contract to pay him as much as they were paying to a much more market rate contract to match what thet gave a less productive D player Kelsay. Given that the team was rewarding two less productive OL players Dockery and Walker.

 

In my view it was the Bills who quit on Peters first when they when they made bad compensation judgments for Walker and Dockery while Peters was easily the best player on OL.

 

Sure, Peters had no contractual right to more money, but the Bills were forced by their bad contractual decisions to quit on Peters and not pay him the market rate for his LT services.

 

The Billa held to their contractual obligations by not renegotiating first and then Peters held to his contractual obligations by refusing to show up at camp and the Bills fined him to the max the CBA allowed. The Billa then allowed Peters to dell his services on the free market and the Eagles then proved that he was vslued at the contract he demanded.

 

Peters then proved (again whether you think he deserved it or not is another thing) that he won All-Pro status as an Eagle.

 

The Bills quit on Peters first by making a bad decision to pay two OL players at above market rate. They made this football mistake an insult to Peters by setting a precedent with Schobel that they would give raises to some players to exceed contracts they stupidly chose to pay less productive players like Kelsay.

 

it seems hard for me to demand that Peters not demand that he receive payment at a level the market would give him and we could not because of our poor football judgments!

[4BillsintheBurgh]

We can go back and forth about Peters value but to me the bottom line is he quit on the Bills. End of discussion. I don't care if his vagina hurt over the way he felt he was treated. You don't quit on your team. Peters could be a 5-time SB MVP. I would still be glad he's gone. If Peters were on fire I wouldn't piss on him to put him out. Some of you jock clingers may be okay with quitters. I'm not.

 

PTR

My issue with what you said remains your misrepresentation of the information you're trying to use to prove a point and you didn't clarify when questioned.

 

As far as I'm concerned the only issue I have with Peters is he wasn't professional enough to stay in great shape when he came back. Look at what Walter jones had to do. What peters did was to play the game by the rules, he didn't quit on his team any more than the bills front office quit on him. I think what Stevie has done to the team is worse than what Peters did. I think the team understood that he was making josh reed money and he needed to do what he did.

 

As far as the current oline goes and if they're doing things like the steelers, you will not have the same oline next year because they have not even spoken to bell. That tells me he is not coming back and that oline was not the same without him.

 

The irritating thing about the whole situation is if the bills had been able to recognize the talent, if they had paid him when he asked we would have our LT now and for less than what he is making in philly. But we failed, and I really think it is mainly due to the turnover at obd. I wish fans could realize when you change the front office they will bring in their guys and not value the guys who are already here. Take Jasper for example. Buddy seems to like him, but if takes him 3 years to get on the field and in that time the majority of folks are gone from the front office I think they would be more likely to under value him. Especially if there is no quality football people there at the time, like what happened to Peters. I remember hearing ralph "learned" he needs to have football people in the front office. I thought it was unfortunate it took so much time for him to learn that.

 

I guess it's the jock sniffers vs the depends sniffers around here, huh? I happen to think ralph wants to win more than most of us think, but I also think he won't take chances with his money especially at this point in his life. Hopefully ralph will stick to his word and give Nix the required time to put some real talent on the field through the draft before just flushing him.

[CodeMonkey]

Oh come on.... You can't believe that a player should have no input

About the business aspect? A player would have to be a moron not to listen to the advice of a good professional agent. I'm sure there is the occasional exception, some player with the business smarts to see a better option than the agent does. But every other time the player should STFU, play the game, and let the agent work out all the other stuff.

 

Look at Peters now. Making good bank, playing for a better franchise, and living in what most would consider a much better city. And the only down side is that some Bills fans don't like him. You can't believe he made the wrong decision.