The One and Only Stevie Johnson Thread

[RkFast]

So the Lions should have gotten rid of Calvin Johnson at the end of last year. I mean really, what was their record WITH him???? Dumb logic like that is why this team continues to suck. You have to keep decent players and compliment them. Not lose players and replace them!!!

 

If preferring to go for better character players who are not me-first selfish asses doing NOTHING but bringing negative headlines to the team is "dumb logic", I fear what you think SMART logic is.

 

 

It's funny that SJ just had a shirt that said Happy New Year's. Yet fans, most who are older than 25 years old, respond by name calling and attacking the character a person they know nothing about except he plays on a football team they watch.

 

Stevie got a penalty and benched, but who needs to grow up more, the players or the fans who attack said player?

 

OH PLEASE.

 

First of all, all this talk is in the context of his football game and how he does it. Ive never met the man personally and have nothing to say about that. And lots of this can be considered personal becuase JOHNSON MADE IT SO with his tweets and his talk and all the other antics. He SCREAMS "LOOK AT ME!!!!!"..."REACT TO ME!!!" But now when people do just that, youre going to say its bad?

 

And Second of all, go look back at the posts in this very thread and then lets talk about "name calling" and "attacks" and who needs to "grow up."

Edited January 3, 2012 by RkFast

[San Jose Bills Fan]

That's fine and that point has been made several times now.

 

The counter argument is contained in the expressions pyrrhic victory and draconian measures.

 

Come on. That counter argument is a bit extreme. I guess we can't win a game without the great Stevie Johnson then? We should have signed him up long ago if he is irreplaceable. How did this guy not make the Pro Bowl?

 

What was Chan supposed to do? Sit him out for one series or one half? That is a little league punishment. Just as a player has to earn his time on the field he can also earn time on the bench.

 

Chan did the right thing, he stuck to his word, and yes the consequences adversely affected the whole team. At that point is it up to the players to step up. If the right leadership existed among the players they would have talked to Stevie in the locker room and put an end to his antics. Instead, as Stevie said, it’s all good and he got a lot of love.

 

Pull that crap on the Ravens with Ray Lewis around and see how much love you get.

 

PS - I don't want to see him leave but I think the coach was 100% correct given Johnson's past issues.

It's simple to me, Bob.

 

Does the punishment fit the crime?

 

There were extenuating circumstances surrounding the penalty on Stevie… a lack of consistency in the officiating which clearly caused confusion for Stevie and for Coach Gailey.

 

It was an opportunity for Gailey to show that he can think on his feet and not be the stubborn, bullheaded, obstinate coach that some people are believing that he is.

 

Stevie was ejected with about 5 minutes left in the first quarter.

 

In view of the fact that the rules and the understanding of the rules was not black and white, I think benching Stevie for the remainder of the first half (about 20 minutes) would have been appropriate and sufficient.

 

So I disagree with you.

 

I think the punishment exceeded the crime.

[billsrock61]

That's fine and that point has been made several times now.

 

The counter argument is contained in the expressions pyrrhic victory and draconian measures.

 

I agree with the counter argument...

 

another counter argument is why wasn't he flagged last year for doing the same thing, with last years being more unsportsmanlike?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Please don't lock this post...

 

Its about the lack of consistency in the NFL and officiating....

 

We have LB's and DE's ....doing sack dances.... example (the pee-wee herman).... no penalty or nuffin

WR's doing the chacha.... WR's talking smack to the opposing crowd ...no penalty.....

TE's spiking and Dunking Footballs....no penalty......

 

But stevie johnson ...... with a 15 yard penalty for a shirt that says "happy new year"...btw: the why so serious didn't get a penalty....

 

It wasn't obscene, it wasn't taunting, it didn't delay the game ...... instead of limiting what is an okay celebration.... the NFL might as well as end celebration all together .... because I'm not clear what is okay and what's not anymore

 

Elda, I got to agree that the NFL officiating needs improved consistency.

 

I personally don't think the shirt should have been a penalty...it was not a prop, it was an alteration to his uniform, that's a league fine.

 

But, I also think Stevie showed very poor judgement. When the league has dinged you several times, the refs are watching for more of the same, and will apply a stricter standard. That's a fact of life in every endeavor. Add that to Chan's clear pronouncement, the next penalty for end zone celebration gets benched, Chan had no choice, whether he agrees or disagrees with the penalty. I don't understand what drove Stevie to try to "find the loophole" where he could plan a celebration and not get penalized. Why look for a loophole? Why not just hand the ball to the official and run off to chest-bump Fitz or whatever? Why run the risk of getting benched and hurting the team?

Edited January 3, 2012 by Hopeful

[billsrock61]

Elda, I got to agree that the NFL officiating needs improved consistency.

 

I personally don't think the shirt should have been a penalty...it was not a prop, it was an alteration to his uniform, that's a league fine.

 

But, I also think Stevie showed very poor judgement. When the league has dinged you several times, the refs are watching for more of the same, and will apply a stricter standard. That's a fact of life in every endeavor. Add that to Chan's clear pronouncement, the next penalty for end zone celebration gets benched, Chan had no choice, whether he agrees or disagrees with the penalty. I don't understand what drove Stevie to try to "find the loophole" where he could plan a celebration and not get penalized. Why look for a loophole? Why not just hand the ball to the official and run off to chest-bump Fitz or whatever? Why run the risk of getting benched and hurting the team?

 

Stevie told Fred he wishes he could take it back...would TO or Ocho? no...let's move on....stevie will be resigned as long as he and his agent aren't greedy.

[davefan66]

Stevie told Fred he wishes he could take it back...would TO or Ocho? no...let's move on....stevie will be resigned as long as he and his agent aren't greedy.

 

Define greedy?

 

If it's the Bills definition, anything over 7 million is greedy.

 

Hate saying it, but I came to grips with it a long time ago, he won't be back.

 

The Bills won't pay for talent. They have a few guys in the pipeline that showed

flashes of ability and will go with them - Easly being the most prominent and Roosevelt

has shown flashes.

 

Stevie may want to be here, but the Bills will not pay him. The excuse will be that Stevie

asked for too much.

[Bob in STL]

It's simple to me, Bob.

 

Does the punishment fit the crime?

 

There were extenuating circumstances surrounding the penalty on Stevie… a lack of consistency in the officiating which clearly caused confusion for Stevie and for Coach Gailey.

 

It was an opportunity for Gailey to show that he can think on his feet and not be the stubborn, bullheaded, obstinate coach that some people are believing that he is.

 

Stevie was ejected with about 5 minutes left in the first quarter.

 

In view of the fact that the rules and the understanding of the rules was not black and white, I think benching Stevie for the remainder of the first half (about 20 minutes) would have been appropriate and sufficient.

 

So I disagree with you.

 

I think the punishment exceeded the crime.

 

 

Gailey is a football coach, not a lawyer.

 

At the time he said he did not even know exactly what he did, he just knew he had an excessive celebration penalty, once again.

 

Levy used to talk about having to make split seconds decisions as a football coach. No replays, no announcers, no time for in depth reflection because there is always the next and the next play.

 

Sure he could have re-evaluated at haltfime, but why? He already stated in his presser that he did not want to get into the grey area surrounding the call. I don't blame him.

 

If only everything in life was fair.

Edited January 3, 2012 by Bob in STL

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

Was watching Today show today and they discussed what SJ did. One of the folks commented how different is Happy New Years on his shirt different than Tbowing? Very Interesting question. The NFL has gone way overboard on what is or isn't excessive celebration just as overboard as they went on calling that Penalty on the "bump" against CryBaby on the INT.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Stevie told Fred he wishes he could take it back...would TO or Ocho? no...let's move on....stevie will be resigned as long as he and his agent aren't greedy.

 

Exactly. As Chan has said "he's not a bad guy. he's a good guy."

 

You could tell that after the game Chan was just furious, and was holding himself in so as not to say something he might regret at a later date, because he really does like and respect Stevie and wants to keep the door open.

 

Still at the same time, Stevie's learning curve on these things is slower than one would like. One wonders if he'll come up with something else attention-getting that he doesn't expect to be penalized...and maybe it won't be once, so he'll do it again.....and get penalized again at a bad time....

 

Offbeat analogy for a football board: SJ reminds me of this scene in a Laura Ingalls Wilder book where the naughty little girls slide down the haystack and ruin it. Pa says "no more sliding down the haystack". The next day the haystack is in ruins again. "Did you girls slide down the haystack?" "Oh, no Pa. We...ROLLED". They weren't intending to be disobedient and flout their Pa, but they were missing the point. At some point it doesn't matter if you roll down the haystack, slide down the haystack, hop down the haystack or whatever - the point is going forward, the hay stays stacked.

[section122]

wow 22 pages for a happy new years wish. This is where I'm at after reading this entire thread...

 

There is definitely a generation gap here. I wouldn't be surprised if the younger posters on here are the ones defending Stevie with the older one bashing him (generalizing I'm sure there are exceptions). Seeing as I fall in the younger category - not for much longer but i still do I will see if I can't change some perceptions.

 

For those of you who have been parents: Have you ever laid out a threat that was unreasonable only to have your child do it and be forced to follow through? e.g. If you do that you'll be grounded for a month! How many times does that actually work? What happens (again generalizing) is that your child shows contrition and you shorten the penalty. Stevie cheering on the sidelines for his team showing he is still involved and cares should have imo done that.

as an aside to the guy who's 9 year old listens to him and had no problem with the stevie benching - that's awesome... until you talk about taunting players getting a fastball in the ribs - dude they're kids playing a kids game holy crap!

 

For those of you that have been coaches: You know that problem player that is to good to sit but you wish you could? Players are on board when you penalize that player to a point. In the higher levels of competition winning becomes the important factor. A lesson can be taught until it starts to affect the teams production. That is when you have to reconsider what you are doing.

 

Stevie is a contributor and our top one at wr. He has 3 penalties on 18 td grabs. Thats 45 yards! People want to run him out of town for that?! All I ask is for people to step down from their pedestal and think about this, if the team was better around him (better d, better coaching, better qb, etc...) would you care as much. I feel very strongly that he is taking the brunt of fans frustration. This thread has carried on longer than any thread about the actual loss to the Pats yesterday, or the fact that our d gave up 49 points, or the ralph preaching patience yet again, or wanny being promoted, or edwards being fired.

 

15 yards = 22 pages = how easy it is for fans to be distracted from the real problems of this team = Ralph continuing to sell and profit from an inferior product!

[DrDawkinstein]

Was watching Today show today and they discussed what SJ did. One of the folks commented how different is Happy New Years on his shirt different than Tbowing? Very Interesting question. The NFL has gone way overboard on what is or isn't excessive celebration just as overboard as they went on calling that Penalty on the "bump" against CryBaby on the INT.

 

Tim is not allowed to "Tebow" after a TD. He has to go over to the sideline and do it behind his bench. And low and behold, he somehow has no problem following that simple rule.

 

So if you want to say they are about the same, then Stevie should know to just go celebrate on the sideline.

[RealityCheck]

It's simple to me, Bob.

 

Does the punishment fit the crime?

 

There were extenuating circumstances surrounding the penalty on Stevie… a lack of consistency in the officiating which clearly caused confusion for Stevie and for Coach Gailey.

 

It was an opportunity for Gailey to show that he can think on his feet and not be the stubborn, bullheaded, obstinate coach that some people are believing that he is.

 

Stevie was ejected with about 5 minutes left in the first quarter.

 

In view of the fact that the rules and the understanding of the rules was not black and white, I think benching Stevie for the remainder of the first half (about 20 minutes) would have been appropriate and sufficient.

 

So I disagree with you.

 

I think the punishment exceeded the crime.

The entire team was told by Gailey that whoever draws a 15 yard penalty for celebrating or taunting that they would be benched for the game. SJ drew a 15 yard unsportsmanlike penalty and was benched. What is not black and white about that? The inconsistency of NFL officiating is well documented and is a different subject entirely from Gailey's edict to the locker room about drawing those types of penalties. I guess the lesson to the children out there should be stick to your principles and your word, unless it costs you something. Got it.

[davspo]

Ok. I have had a chance to calm down after watching SJ screw his teammates and fans by his very selfish act. Watching bowl games last night, I was taken back by how they young men in college were able to control themselves in the biggest games, and potentially last games of their lives. I did not see one show boating call all day. Makes you wonder who the pro.

 

Unlike many, I agree with what Chan did in this particular case. This does not mean that I think Chan is a good coach, just that I agree with him here. Had this been a playoff game- or a game with any meaning whatsoever, it may have been different. It was just an end of the season game with nothing on the line at all- we are certainly use to those.

 

With that being said, my original opinion was screw this guy-let him go. I am still for that if we could use the money to bring in big name free agents. Given the history- this is not the case. We will be well below the salary cap next year and will stay that way, until Ralph Wilson a.k.a Kim Yung Il meets his maker and we get new ownership that actually realizes the bottom line can be increased with wins. Spending money can make money. Hey- what do I know, Ralph is the billionaire and I'm just a working schelck.

 

So I would have no problem bringing SJ back with the understanding that if he is called for an excessive celebration check in the future, his game check would be forfieted.

 

Thoughts?

[Kelly the Dog]

The entire team was told by Gailey that whoever draws a 15 yard penalty for celebrating or taunting that they would be benched for the game. SJ drew a 15 yard unsportsmanlike penalty and was benched. What is not black and white about that? The inconsistency of NFL officiating is well documented and is a different subject entirely from Gailey's edict to the locker room about drawing those types of penalties. I guess the lesson to the children out there should be stick to your principles and your word, unless it costs you something. Got it.

The gray area is because the team rule was "if you get a penalty", it was not, if you celebrate a TD you get benched. Players celebrate TDs in the NFL every single game. Some go temporarily insane. Stevie thought he was celebrating the TD with something that was perfectly fine and would not draw a penalty and he had very good reason to believe that. Should he have just thrown the ball to the official? Probably. Was he testing the limits of this coach and the team rule? Absolutely not. Not one bit.

[Heels20X6]

wow 22 pages for a happy new years wish. This is where I'm at after reading this entire thread...

 

There is definitely a generation gap here. I wouldn't be surprised if the younger posters on here are the ones defending Stevie with the older one bashing him (generalizing I'm sure there are exceptions). Seeing as I fall in the younger category - not for much longer but i still do I will see if I can't change some perceptions.

 

For those of you who have been parents: Have you ever laid out a threat that was unreasonable only to have your child do it and be forced to follow through? e.g. If you do that you'll be grounded for a month! How many times does that actually work? What happens (again generalizing) is that your child shows contrition and you shorten the penalty. Stevie cheering on the sidelines for his team showing he is still involved and cares should have imo done that.

as an aside to the guy who's 9 year old listens to him and had no problem with the stevie benching - that's awesome... until you talk about taunting players getting a fastball in the ribs - dude they're kids playing a kids game holy crap!

 

For those of you that have been coaches: You know that problem player that is to good to sit but you wish you could? Players are on board when you penalize that player to a point. In the higher levels of competition winning becomes the important factor. A lesson can be taught until it starts to affect the teams production. That is when you have to reconsider what you are doing.

 

Stevie is a contributor and our top one at wr. He has 3 penalties on 18 td grabs. Thats 45 yards! People want to run him out of town for that?! All I ask is for people to step down from their pedestal and think about this, if the team was better around him (better d, better coaching, better qb, etc...) would you care as much. I feel very strongly that he is taking the brunt of fans frustration. This thread has carried on longer than any thread about the actual loss to the Pats yesterday, or the fact that our d gave up 49 points, or the ralph preaching patience yet again, or wanny being promoted, or edwards being fired.

 

15 yards = 22 pages = how easy it is for fans to be distracted from the real problems of this team = Ralph continuing to sell and profit from an inferior product!

 

Easily the most reasonable post in this thread. Too bad others are so caught up in creating a villain and histrionics to care about what you've written.

[billsfan182]

i would like to see them resign SJ and him be back on the field next year, he is a playmaker personally i like the guy..can deke DB's and run routes good. However he needs to mature and stop taking the dumb penalties, im a huge SJ13 fan but i like alot am getting sick of how its all about him, wich I know the guy means well, but just cut it out. Earlier in the year his asking price was around 9mil/year, now talks are down to 7.5mil this is reasonable asking price IMO especially for a #1 WR on this roster. If they let him walk, they are in need of a new #1, and potentially a #1 and #2 guy. We all know the bills are cheap and build through the draft..a rookie WR picked in the top rounds would demand high price as would any top WR in FA, more than likley around 9mil wich the bills turned SJ down for, and i dont want to see us pick up another bust for depth like Brad Smith and hope the guy works out. We already know what Stevie can do, and his attitude can be corrected as far as the stupid penalties and maturity

[BRH]

as an aside to the guy who's 9 year old listens to him and had no problem with the stevie benching - that's awesome... until you talk about taunting players getting a fastball in the ribs - dude they're kids playing a kids game holy crap!

I don't want to dig back into the thread, but if I didn't say it I meant that it's what happens when the kids get older. I have no problem with a high school (or above) pitcher laying down the law like that.

[Thirty Year Fan]

Resign him

+1

[section122]

I don't want to dig back into the thread, but if I didn't say it I meant that it's what happens when the kids get older. I have no problem with a high school (or above) pitcher laying down the law like that.

OK I was nervous there

 

Seems to me though if the umpire feels there is intent that pitcher would get ejected from the game. Doesn't that and wouldn't that hurt the team as well? Also isn't getting your feelings hurt because someone is taunting you to the point you react with violence also a bit childish?

 

I understand these are men being paid. There is no running up the score in pro sports. Therefore it should be handled on the field. The Pats* could have "scoreboarded" him at the end of the game and got the better of it. Or for your way a lb could have laid him out on a crossing route. Either way the message would have been delivered by the other team like it should be. Not by the refs not by his coach but by the competitors.

 

As for the penalty he received it seems Chan put to harsh of a penalty out there then had to follow through even though he didn't really want to. I address that in my post above. A simple conversation at half time with Stevie could have rectified the entire thing and they could have moved on. Instead he was stuck holding himself to a blanket punishment and imo hurting the team more than stevie's 15 yards.

[Kelly the Dog]

As for the penalty he received it seems Chan put to harsh of a penalty out there then had to follow through even though he didn't really want to. I address that in my post above. A simple conversation at half time with Stevie could have rectified the entire thing and they could have moved on. Instead he was stuck holding himself to a blanket punishment and imo hurting the team more than stevie's 15 yards.

My problem with Chan was that I think he easily could have and should have put him in after halftime for the rest of the game. I don't think the rule was dumb. I don't think he would have lost credibility one bit if he sat him for over a quarter for breaking the rule and then told Stevie and the team at halftime that he had to put him on the bench because he made the rule. But it clearly was not penalty last year, it clearly was not excessive stupid celebration, and it clearly was not an open defiance of the rule. It's like going out to a bar at 3 am. Nothing good can come of it so do not put yourself in a position to get in trouble. You already hurt your teammates and self enough.

 

I think the team would have respected him for it and it would have been fair and the right thing to do and not went back on his word. Like most things, the real issue is intent. The intent was not defiance, the intent was not excessive celebration. The intent was clearly not to test the limits of the rule.