PDaDdy Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) When the entire team was healthy was Fitz good enough to beat the Patriots in Buffalo 34-31 in week 3, and didn't he almost beat the NY Giants at their stadium in week 6, 27-24? BOTH SUPER BOWL TEAMS! So, even with only ONE decent WR (Stevie Johnson), a cast off TE that no other teams wanted, a bad O line with 2 decent players, and a very good RB....Fitz managed to beat some good teams, and keep the game close in others. Once the injuries hit the team really started losing big, center Eric Wood and Fred Jackson being the biggest, couple that in with the fact that the defense was still atrocious, and you have a reason for a 6-10 season. No depth on that O line and the same with the WR corps is what screwed the team, not the QB! As old as this owner has become over the last decade even he is smart enough to realize Fitz needs more help and weapons, per Wilson As for Fitzpatrick, Wilson gave full support to his slumping quarterback while saying the criticism directed at him was unfair. Wilson blamed Fitzpatrick’s struggles on a rash of injuries that have hampered the offense, and the lack of a supporting cast. “We’ve got to get receivers. If he hasn’t gotten anybody to throw to, he’s not going to win many games,” Wilson said. “We think he’s a good quarterback, and we’re going to stick with him and get him some better players, get him some runners, some tight ends that don’t get injured and some wide receivers and we’ll be OK.” http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-bills-ralphwilson The Bills need to get the QB more help no matter who he is. AHMEN BROTHER!!! Edited February 6, 2012 by PDaDdy
jimmy10 Posted February 6, 2012 Posted February 6, 2012 (edited) Posted this in another thread. All you have to look at is the Giant's post season DEFENSIVE stats. Points Per Game: 1st First Downs Per Game: 2nd 3rd Down Percentage: 1st Now let's look at their OFFENSIVE stats: Points Per Game: 5th First Downs Per Game: 5th 3rd Down Percentage: 6th What does this tell us? Out of 12 teams that made it into the playoffs the Giants basically had the best defense in these important game stats and they had a mediocre offense that didn't even rank in the top 1/3 of all offenses. Their defense was the best and they did this against pretty good to prolific offenses. The Falcons, the PACKERS, the 49'ers and THE NEW ENGLAND FREAKIN' PATRIOTS!!!! Defense and smart QB play wins championships! Defense and smart QB play win Superbowls. Now if only the Bills could get out of the NFL basement in defense and we can acquire some WRs other than SJ that can catch the ball over their heads with their hands instead of the platoon of body snatchers we have we would be on the right track. Does anyone else notice that good teams have WRs that can catch the ball over their head with their hands? We have guys that are tall but can't catch with their hands over their heads. They are body snatchers that have to be hit perfectly in stride. Exactly. And even the Patsies, who gave up a bazillion yards and points per game in the regular season, (while scoring a bazillion and a half themselves) clamped down in the post-season and gave up a lot less yards and points. Can't remember the stats, but they did reference it during the game yesterday. Like they say: Pitching wins championships. Defense wins championships. Improve the defense, and the offense starts to look a whole lot better. Is Fitzpatrick on his way to Canton? Certainly not. But sweet jebus, we can't upgrade every single unit to A+ talent instantly all at once. Fitzpatrick has demonstrated he is at least serviceable. Get a healthy offense around him, and a defense that can actually get off the field, and then let's see where we stand. Edited February 6, 2012 by jimmyo
ryan42790 Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Can someone fill me in a little bit more on Chandler Harnish? I watched some clips and he looked pretty damn good, especially in clutch situations; but as we all know youtube videos are not a way to scout players, so can someone tell me some downside on him?
Toshiero Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Ask Trent Dilfer or Brad Johnson !!!!!!!! Or ask Jim Kelly if being a Elite NFL QB is all you ned to be to win a super bowl !!!!!! That could be why it's a TEAM sport !!!!! YA THINK ?? You need a franchise QB, to still debate this is beyond stupid
Rob's House Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Luck and RGIII will certainly be gone. Tann, who knows, but I don't think he's better than Fitzy. Fitz proved early in the season that he's quality. Rumors of broken ribs out there, tons of injuries at WR, OL, and especially on D after that strong start. I'd rather shore up the depth on the D front 7 and see what we really have before giving up on a guy that beat the Pats, Raiders, Bengals, Chiefs, and should have beat the SB champs NYG. I fell off the Fitz bandwagon during the losing streak, attributing a lot of it to everyone around him dropping like flies, but also attributing to him the way he was throwing the ball. Now that we know about the ribs it all makes sense. I don't get why others don't get it. Perhaps they're just committed to "Fitz sucks" & get some kind of secondary payoff from it.
Just in Atlanta Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 ummm....have we already forgotten our need for a franchise long snapper? Garrison Sanborn is the bedrock of this team.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Can someone fill me in a little bit more on Chandler Harnish? He's a fine Amish craftsman. Originally from a family of coopers, he married outside the family business because he had no desire to make barrels for a living and Lancaster County, PA was too touristy for his likes. He and his young wife moved to Ohio where he set up shop as a wheelwright in the underserved Amish community surrounding Berlin and Holmes Counties. He's good, honest folk.
K Gun Special Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Good grief. So wait, all of sudden Fitz doesnt suck because he had broken ribs? You dont think that info was released now for a reason? Cmon, its not like he regressed completely, he simply had an average Fitz year. He's always been an inaccurate passer who takes a lot of risks and is an INT machine. Broken ribs did not change who he was. He wasnt playing all that well for weeks before the injury supposedly happened. Im not a Fitz hater, but fans are delusional if you think this revelation is going to get you an awesome QB next year. He is what he is, nothing more or less.
Beerball Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 He's a fine Amish craftsman. Originally from a family of coopers, he married outside the family business because he had no desire to make barrels for a living and Lancaster County, PA was too touristy for his likes. He and his young wife moved to Ohio where he set up shop as a wheelwright in the underserved Amish community surrounding Berlin and Holmes Counties. He's good, honest folk. He should have considered going into the copper clapper industry. To find a cooper copper clapper is very rare indeed. His wife's name is Clara isn't it?
thewildrabbit Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 You need a franchise QB, to still debate this is beyond stupid TWO WORDS.... Steve Young! The man was drafted in the NFL by the Tampa Bay Buc's, he then proceeded to have back to back 2-14 seasons on a bad Tampa Bay team. He went 3-16 as a starter, 11 TD's - 21 INT's and completed fewer then 55% of his passes. The 49ers traded for him and the Buc's were happy to trade him because they thought he was a bust. The Buc's then drafted Vinnie Testaverde #1 overall. ( that year the Colts selected Cornelius Bennett #2 overall) 1987 Young sat on the bench behind Joe Montana for 4 years before he became a starter in 1991... 3 time super bowl champion , 7x pro bowls, 2x league MVP. QB rating 96.8 TD-INT 232-107....BECAUSE HE HAD A TEAM AROUND HIM!!! What is beyond stupid is to draft a franchise QB to a bad team with bad players and bad coaches as history has proven that is a fail idea. No rookie QB is going to turn this Buffalo Bills team into a SB champion by himself. A bad quarterback decision in the first round of the draft can set a franchise back for years, just ask JP Losman. But then its tough to win without a #1 pick at QB. There are 32 teams in the NFL and of those 32 teams, 20 of them have quarterbacks starting for them that were drafted in the FIRST ROUND. 1992 Tommy Maddox- David Klingler- Dave Brown- 1993 Drew Bledsoe- Rick Mirer, 1994 Heath Schuler- Trent Dilfer- 1995- Kerry Collins- Steve McNair. 1996 none. 1997 Jim Drunkenmiller. 1998 Peyton Manning, Ryan Leaf. 1999 Tim Couch, Donovan McNabb, Akili Smith, Daunte Culpepper, Cade McNown. 2000 Chad Pennington. 2001 Mike Vick. 2002 Davis Carr, Joey Harrington, Patrick Ramsey 2003 Carson Palmer, Byron Leftwich, Kyle Boller, Rex Grossman 2004 Eli Manning, Phillip Rivers, Ben Rothlisberger, JP Losman 2005 Alex Smith, Aaron Rodgers, Jason Campbell\ 2006 Vince Young, Matt leinart, Jay Cutler 2007 JaMarcus Russell, Brady Quinn 2008 Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco 2009 Matthew Stafford, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman 2010 Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow 2011 Cam Newton, Jake Locker, Blane Gabbert, Christian Ponder, 18 made an impact, of those 5 have won a super bowl ....out of 49 players 3 of those 5 SB winning QB's played on teams with a very good running game. Only Rodgers and Manning didn't have a top running game. As a rookie Big Ben made the playoffs and went 14-1, but he played on a dominant running team with Jerome Bettis that first & second year Trent Dilfer won a SB but only because he played on a team with the best defense in the NFL. Bottom line, it looks like a much smarter move to build up a team with a top running game, receiver corps and defense. Rather then drafting a QB #1 and hope he can develop properly in bad conditions....you know, like JP Losman
Beerball Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 You put Brady, Manning(s), Brees on the bills in 2011 and we end up with the same record. Wow.
JPS Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Yeah but they weren't ELITE coordinators. Talented players make the coach. Not the other way around.
The Big Cat Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 There are 32 teams in the NFL and of those 32 teams, 20 of them have quarterbacks starting for them that were drafted in the FIRST ROUND. And I can think off the top of my head of at least three first rounder starters from 2011 (Brees/Palmer/Campbell)who started for other teams, which renders the ratio damn near 1:1 of teams who drafted their starter in the first round, and those who did not. Of the 12 playoff teams, however, only three of them (Texans, Saints, Patriots) did not draft their starting quarterback in the first round.
Bronc24 Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 (edited) funny how a lot of people still dont get it..... We need defense(schemes and players) and most importantly, pass rushers. Add an o-line.... then watch the bills enter the playoffs. You put Brady, Manning(s), Brees on the bills in 2011 and we end up with the same record. Perhaps the dumbest thing written here and that's saying something. I have been outspoken about our need for a franchise QB and have argued vehemently about how I believe Fitz will never take this team to the playoffs regardless of the talent around him. People (PDad) have taken this to believe I hate Fitz and wish him to fail. Nothing is further from the truth. I want Fitz, if he is our QB, to win a Superbowl. However I am a realist and do not believe Fitz can get us to the playoffs, let alone a Superbowl. People can disagree, that's fine. I have read endless reports on how Eli was almost run out of town, blah blah, blah. No doubt Eli has a better supporting cast. No doubt his defense is great. But Fitz is no Eli, no Brees, no Brady. But anyone who thinks Fitz even approaches his level knows nothing about football. Fitz has always been and always will be average at best. We will never get to the promised land with him. Period. Edited February 7, 2012 by Marauder24
section122 Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 I have read endless reports on how Eli was almost run out of town, blah blah, blah. No doubt Eli has a better supporting cast. No doubt his defense is great. But Fitz is no Eli, no Bree's, no Brady. But anyone who thinks Fitz even approaches his level knows nothing about football. Fitz has always been and always will be average at best. We will never get to the promised land with him. Period. Last year Eli led the league in interceptions This year Fitz led the league in interceptions so he IS on his level Guess that means Super Bowl next year!!!!!
The Big Cat Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 Perhaps the dumbest thing written here and that's saying something. I have been outspoken about our need for a franchise QB and have argued vehemently about how I believe Fitz will never take this team to the playoffs regardless of the talent around him. People (PDad) have taken this to believe I hate Fitz and wish him to fail. Nothing is further from the truth. I want Fitz, if he is our QB, to win a Superbowl. However I am a realist and do not believe Fitz can get us to the playoffs, let alone a Superbowl. People can disagree, that's fine. I have read endless reports on how Eli was almost run out of town, blah blah, blah. No doubt Eli has a better supporting cast. No doubt his defense is great. But Fitz is no Eli, no Brees, no Brady. But anyone who thinks Fitz even approaches his level knows nothing about football. Fitz has always been and always will be average at best. We will never get to the promised land with him. Period. Your theory is not completely air-tight, though. It's just not that simple. It's not a black and white issue. Fitz was one bad pass (an ill-timed pick) from beating the Super Bowl champion in his own backyard this season. Tom Brady essentially threw the same bad pass, among others. So if you argue that "a franchise quaterback doesn't make the mistake Fitz did when the game was on the line," what does that say about Tom Brady's status as a "franchise guy." I personally don't believe in "franchise" quarterbacks. If you buy the notion that Valentine's Day was invented to sell greeting cards, then you'll understand where I'm coming from when I say "franchise quarterback" is a concept invented by the talking heads to sell shaving cream. I think the whole thing's a scam, a myth. BUT, I do believe that it's only the rarest of circumstances under which the Super Bowl can be won without a statistical top 15 quarterback. And given the bondo-mobile receiving corps we fielded and the fact that the team MVP (Jackson), a guy who could been a candidate for LEAGUE MVP was stripped from Fitz's arsenal, I fully disregard the idea that it was quarterback play hampering this team, and that a change in quarterback will somehow right the ship. Also, listen to players on BOTH sides of the ball talk about Fitz. Listen to Dareus' interview from last week. He's the leader. No stats can account for that, that's the kind of aurora the elusive "franchise" player you speak of brings to an organization. So champion the concept all you like, champion the need for change, but I'm afraid there's just no validation in what you're fighting for.
PDaDdy Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 TWO WORDS.... Steve Young! The man was drafted in the NFL by the Tampa Bay Buc's, he then proceeded to have back to back 2-14 seasons on a bad Tampa Bay team. He went 3-16 as a starter, 11 TD's - 21 INT's and completed fewer then 55% of his passes. The 49ers traded for him and the Buc's were happy to trade him because they thought he was a bust. The Buc's then drafted Vinnie Testaverde #1 overall. ( that year the Colts selected Cornelius Bennett #2 overall) 1987 Young sat on the bench behind Joe Montana for 4 years before he became a starter in 1991... 3 time super bowl champion , 7x pro bowls, 2x league MVP. QB rating 96.8 TD-INT 232-107....BECAUSE HE HAD A TEAM AROUND HIM!!! What is beyond stupid is to draft a franchise QB to a bad team with bad players and bad coaches as history has proven that is a fail idea. No rookie QB is going to turn this Buffalo Bills team into a SB champion by himself. A bad quarterback decision in the first round of the draft can set a franchise back for years, just ask JP Losman. But then its tough to win without a #1 pick at QB. There are 32 teams in the NFL and of those 32 teams, 20 of them have quarterbacks starting for them that were drafted in the FIRST ROUND. 1992 Tommy Maddox- David Klingler- Dave Brown- 1993 Drew Bledsoe- Rick Mirer, 1994 Heath Schuler- Trent Dilfer- 1995- Kerry Collins- Steve McNair. 1996 none. 1997 Jim Drunkenmiller. 1998 Peyton Manning, Ryan Leaf. 1999 Tim Couch, Donovan McNabb, Akili Smith, Daunte Culpepper, Cade McNown. 2000 Chad Pennington. 2001 Mike Vick. 2002 Davis Carr, Joey Harrington, Patrick Ramsey 2003 Carson Palmer, Byron Leftwich, Kyle Boller, Rex Grossman 2004 Eli Manning, Phillip Rivers, Ben Rothlisberger, JP Losman 2005 Alex Smith, Aaron Rodgers, Jason Campbell\ 2006 Vince Young, Matt leinart, Jay Cutler 2007 JaMarcus Russell, Brady Quinn 2008 Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco 2009 Matthew Stafford, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman 2010 Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow 2011 Cam Newton, Jake Locker, Blane Gabbert, Christian Ponder, 18 made an impact, of those 5 have won a super bowl ....out of 49 players 3 of those 5 SB winning QB's played on teams with a very good running game. Only Rodgers and Manning didn't have a top running game. As a rookie Big Ben made the playoffs and went 14-1, but he played on a dominant running team with Jerome Bettis that first & second year Trent Dilfer won a SB but only because he played on a team with the best defense in the NFL. Bottom line, it looks like a much smarter move to build up a team with a top running game, receiver corps and defense. Rather then drafting a QB #1 and hope he can develop properly in bad conditions....you know, like JP Losman But but but ....we need a messiah savior that will somehow turn a team with one of the worst defenses in the league and a dearth of talent at WR into an immediate super bowl contender. Don't you realize all is lost? We should just take a QB with every pick for the next 10 years hoping to hit the lottery. We can worry about building an actual team then. By the time we get that team built the QB will be dead or have his confidence and career ruined. ROFLOL!!!!!!!
thewildrabbit Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 And I can think off the top of my head of at least three first rounder starters from 2011 (Brees/Palmer/Campbell)who started for other teams, which renders the ratio damn near 1:1 of teams who drafted their starter in the first round, and those who did not. Of the 12 playoff teams, however, only three of them (Texans, Saints, Patriots) did not draft their starting quarterback in the first round. Drew Brees was a 2nd round pick...
Just in Atlanta Posted February 7, 2012 Posted February 7, 2012 We all can agree Brady, Rodgers, P. Manning and Brees are the best of the best of the best. But was Eli "elite" before he won two Superbowls? Or did he become elite because he won? Same question could be asked of Kurt Warner or even Big Ben. Would Big Ben be elite if he played for the Bills? I'm on the fence on that one. The point is, with very few exceptions, you have to have a team that is Superbowl quality to win Superbowls. The Bills are not Superbowl quality and would not even make the Superbowl with any of the quarterbacks who have won in recent years. Let's see how Fitz does with a (hopefully) good team around him next season. He has the potential, IMO.
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