bbb Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Interesting perspective about these two individuals. With regards to Ali, I sometimes wonder why the man is so beloved to this day. Sure he was a great boxer and no one could deny that. As a person he did not come off as all that likeable. He was a constant trash talker, always belittling his opponents;some of the things he said about Joe Frazier were downright racist. His vanity was almost as big as his ego. Also he put down America numerous times, despite all the opportunities he got from this country. The Vietnam thing is a different story, since he chose not to fight over there, fine, that's his decision. Not to mention that he cheated on all of his wives. Ali was quite a slimy person, and yet he's still hailed and loved for his boxing achievements, and he gets to light the torch at the Olympics in Atlanta. Very interesting how Ali is beloved and how Tebow is scorned. That's another thing I am at loss with Tebow. Why are people so obsessed with the man? How many players, not just in football, but in all sports giving thanks to God? Yet Tebow is the one singled out. Can someone please explain it to me. Because, I don't get it. One last thing. Who in the hell is Bill Maher anyway? If you don't know who Bill Maher is, consider yourself lucky. But, your comments about Ali I have often thought myself. As a kid, I really loved him, but then as I knew more about him as an adult, not so much........I really wasn't aware at the time of what he was doing to Frazier. And, his ego stuff. The one thing that bugged me because it was said so many times it was taken as truth. He said "It ain't braggin' if you can back it up." Well, that is the definition of bragging. Otherwise, you're just lying. I actually think that a lot of the later love came from sympathy for his condition.
SactoBillFan Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I don't recall much of a backlash when one of the greatest athletes of all time praised Allah at every opportunity. That man was Muhammad Ali and millions of fans loved him regardless of what religion he was affiliated with. I think Christians in America are very tolerant of all religions and that is one of the basic ideas that the founding fathers fought for. Freedom of religion is one of the cornerstones of American values. It is extremism that is the problem, not religion. Anyone who says that others have to die because they practice a different religion, does not understand what their own religion is all about. Tebow has every right to wear his beliefs on his sleeve. It shows that he truly is a man of faith, who is not afraid of the backlash. Might want to google Cassius Clay. Those of us who remember the sixties know he wasn't always that "loved".
bbb Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Who is Cassius Clay? We're talking about Muhammed Ali....
SactoBillFan Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Who is Cassius Clay? We're talking about Muhammed Ali.... I think he's the guy that won his first title fight against Sonny Liston. Changed his name later don't remember to what...
Mark Vader Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 If you don't know who Bill Maher is, consider yourself lucky. But, your comments about Ali I have often thought myself. As a kid, I really loved him, but then as I knew more about him as an adult, not so much........I really wasn't aware at the time of what he was doing to Frazier. And, his ego stuff. The one thing that bugged me because it was said so many times it was taken as truth. He said "It ain't braggin' if you can back it up." Well, that is the definition of bragging. Otherwise, you're just lying. I actually think that a lot of the later love came from sympathy for his condition. That is probably true.
truth on hold Posted December 31, 2011 Author Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) Who's Lew Alcindor? Edited December 31, 2011 by Joe_the_6_pack
Gray Beard Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I don't recall much of a backlash when one of the greatest athletes of all time praised Allah at every opportunity. That man was Muhammad Ali and millions of fans loved him regardless of what religion he was affiliated with. I think Christians in America are very tolerant of all religions and that is one of the basic ideas that the founding fathers fought for. Freedom of religion is one of the cornerstones of American values. It is extremism that is the problem, not religion. Anyone who says that others have to die because they practice a different religion, does not understand what their own religion is all about. Tebow has every right to wear his beliefs on his sleeve. It shows that he truly is a man of faith, who is not afraid of the backlash. Ali and Kareem were before 9/11. That was a game changer. Maybe not justified, but it makes a difference on perceptions. My father in law was drafted twice in the 1950s and 1960s. Ask him what he thinks of Ali, and then stand back. He gets pretty upset and animated for a guy in his late 70s.
Ted William's frozen head Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Maher's a comedian? Hahahaha - that is the funnier than anything that's ever come out of his mouth! I love Sally Jenkins and this article shows why: Set aside the intriguing question of whether Maher would have the nerve if Tebow were Muslim. Maher slams Muslims all of the time. Those who don't find him funny are usually people that can't accept anything beyond their narrow vision of what they *think* "truth" is....
Billsguy Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 From CNN article "Bill Maher Takes on Tim Tebow .... " *An earlier version of this story incorrectly had the Detroit Lions as the Broncos opponent. We regret the error and apologize to Bills fans everywhere. They have suffered enough this season. http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/29/bill-maher-takes-on-tim-tebow-and-feels-the-wrath/?iref=obinsite Hasn't this board seen enough of the "Bills get no respect.... Bills get snubbed.... Buffalo gets dissed, etc... threads? Enough already. Get over it.
bbb Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Maher slams Muslims all of the time. Those who don't find him funny are usually people that can't accept anything beyond their narrow vision of what they *think* "truth" is.... The truth is that Ted Williams' Frozen Head is a funny handle. Bill Maher is not.
Buftex Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 The truth is that Ted Williams' Frozen Head is a funny handle. Bill Maher is not. It's funny, bbb, you and KD are two of my favorite posters here on TSW. I agree with you both on almost everything, except politics and Bill Maher! I am not going to defend him in this instance, cuz, I don't agree with him...in fact I often don't agree with him...but I still think he is funny, in an intellectual way...this "tweet" is not one of those instances. I happen to agree, to a degree, with his stance on religion, but I, for the life of me, can't figure out why people hate Tim Tebow so much...I think it is more his "followers" than the man himself. And, he does seem to have a fanatical religious following. But honestly, while I haven't seen as much Tebow as Kurt Warner over the years, I think Warner was much more vocal about his Christianity than Tebow...maybe I am wrong there, but I have never heard TT utter a Christy word...I know he crosses himself and genuflects a lot...but stfw! When I was flying to Buffalo, for the holiday, I sat across from a guy and his girlfriend, both wearing Tebow jerseys...I was in a Bills hoody, so naturally, we talked about the game...they were flying to Buffalo just to see Tebow (cuz it is "so cheap")...I asked them if they were Broncos fans, neither was. Just Tebow fans. I didn't bring up the religion thing with them, but the crosses they both sported outside their jerseys was kind of a clue... So, in that regard, Tim Tebow is, for some, the equivalent of the Grateful Dead...their fans turn me off so much, it sometimes gets in the way of me enjoying their music. But, I don't begrudge them their overzealous appreciation, just like I don't begrudge Tebow enthusiasts their love of all things TT.
bbb Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 It's funny, bbb, you and KD are two of my favorite posters here on TSW. I agree with you both on almost everything, except politics and Bill Maher! We have to disagree on something I guess, so it might as well be the big stuff! One of the local radio personalities here, I email back and forth with a lot and whenever he brings something up on the air, I am like Holy crap - that's exactly what I think and nobody ever says that. We have the same tastes and opinions on almost everything (like you and I do).............Except for politics and God!
ajzepp Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) I can't stomach Maher anymore cause he's a condescending douchebag. He's clearly very intelligent and I know that people I respect enjoy his humor, but I can't get into him at all anymore. As for Muslims, my issue with them is that they seem to rarely, if ever, have a voice against all these extremists who are out there setting off bombs and threatening to destroy America or whatever. If Islam is a peaceful religion as they say, then get off your asses and start taking a stand against these crazy fukks who are misrepresenting your faith and causing Americans to react to you in the manner that many of us do. I've always been of the belief that every individual needs to find their own path in life in terms of their spirituality or lack of it. I don't take issue with anyone because of their religious beliefs, the fact that they are atheist, or whatever. But to me, Maher is just as big of a hypocrite (and equally a annoying) as these hard core Christians who go around with the "holier than thou" attitude. The only TRUTH here is that nobody knows for sure whether God exists or not. That's why we're called to have faith. Maher doesn't know God doesn't exist anymore than you or I know that he does. Edited January 1, 2012 by ajzepp
justnzane Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 I can't stomach Maher anymore cause he's a condescending douchebag. He's clearly very intelligent and I know that people I respect enjoy his humor, but I can't get into him at all anymore. As for Muslims, my issue with them is that they seem to rarely, if ever, have a voice against all these extremists who are out there setting off bombs and threatening to destroy America or whatever. If Islam is a peaceful religion as they say, then get off your asses and start taking a stand against these crazy fukks who are misrepresenting your faith and causing Americans to react to you in the manner that many of us do. I've always been of the belief that every individual needs to find their own path in life in terms of their spirituality or lack of it. I don't take issue with anyone because of their religious beliefs, the fact that they are atheist, or whatever. But to me, Maher is just as big of a hypocrite (and equally a annoying) as these hard core Christians who go around with the "holier than thou" attitude. The only TRUTH here is that nobody knows for sure whether God exists or not. That's why we're called to have faith. Maher doesn't know God doesn't exist anymore than you or I know that he does. To be fair, the best part of Maher's show is usually the panel he constructs for each episode. His condescending brand of humor can abrasive when he is ranting on and on about legalizing pot and why religious people are retarded. That said, AJ I respect you as a poster, but I have to play devil's advocate here. Where are the moderate Christians, when you have televangelists, Texans, and Republican Presidential candidates spewing off garbage about the world being 6000 years old and that evolution is false? Islam doesn't have a worldwide face for the moderate Muslims who aren't batshit crazy, where as the Dalai Lama and the Pope generally represent the more moderate rational people their religions. It is unfair to compare a moderate to an extremist in any religion, and unfortunately we have a skewed view as Bin Laden became a religious symbol as well as a terrorist symbol. That is like comparing the IRA, or a terrorist bent version of Jeremiah Wright to the average parishner at the local church. It is so inherently unfair, but we as a society have bought into the stereotype that the news networks have provided.
ajzepp Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 To be fair, the best part of Maher's show is usually the panel he constructs for each episode. His condescending brand of humor can abrasive when he is ranting on and on about legalizing pot and why religious people are retarded. That said, AJ I respect you as a poster, but I have to play devil's advocate here. Where are the moderate Christians, when you have televangelists, Texans, and Republican Presidential candidates spewing off garbage about the world being 6000 years old and that evolution is false? Islam doesn't have a worldwide face for the moderate Muslims who aren't batshit crazy, where as the Dalai Lama and the Pope generally represent the more moderate rational people their religions. It is unfair to compare a moderate to an extremist in any religion, and unfortunately we have a skewed view as Bin Laden became a religious symbol as well as a terrorist symbol. That is like comparing the IRA, or a terrorist bent version of Jeremiah Wright to the average parishner at the local church. It is so inherently unfair, but we as a society have bought into the stereotype that the news networks have provided. That's a great point, and I hadn't really thought about Islam's lack of a "worldwide face", as you put it. It just seems that I'm always seeing American Muslims talking about unfair treatment and the way they are stereotyped (which I agree with them is totally wrong), but very very little condemnation of the acts of the extremists, particularly 911. Even on just an individual basis, whether it's an interview I've seen or an article I've read, I never seem to notice any effort on the part of the Islam community to attempt to separate themselves from the Bin Laden's of the world. I'm Catholic, and if someone were interviewing me about bombings at abortion clinics by other Catholics or fundamental Christians, there would be no doubt how I felt about that and I would make every effort to be clear that this sort of action was inexcusable and NOT what the Catholic faith teaches. So while I do agree with you about the worldwide face, it's even the individual examples I've seen where there is just no attempt at all to condemn the extremist actions...you know what I mean? You also make a great point about the media and that also plays a huge role in our perception, obviously. As for Maher, I like when he has a panel on there, but quite often it seems as if the guy belittles or dismisses the views of those who are "not on his side", and then he treats those with similar beliefs as he has with greater respect. It's just frustrating for me, because I'm a weirdo who actually likes it when others have a different viewpoint or belief system than what I have. I don't take it personally when others disagree with me, because I think one of the best ways to learn about life is to consider the views of others and compare them to your own. Sometimes when I do that I end up with a modified view on the issue that is sort of an evolution from where I stood before, you know? People seem to take offense or become insecure when others don't share their views, and I think that's what leads to a lot of our problems in this country. So you can play Devil's Advocate with me anytime, brother!
truth on hold Posted January 1, 2012 Author Posted January 1, 2012 I can't stomach Maher anymore cause he's a condescending douchebag. He's clearly very intelligent and I know that people I respect enjoy his humor, but I can't get into him at all anymore. As for Muslims, my issue with them is that they seem to rarely, if ever, have a voice against all these extremists who are out there setting off bombs and threatening to destroy America or whatever. If Islam is a peaceful religion as they say, then get off your asses and start taking a stand against these crazy fukks who are misrepresenting your faith and causing Americans to react to you in the manner that many of us do. I've always been of the belief that every individual needs to find their own path in life in terms of their spirituality or lack of it. I don't take issue with anyone because of their religious beliefs, the fact that they are atheist, or whatever. But to me, Maher is just as big of a hypocrite (and equally a annoying) as these hard core Christians who go around with the "holier than thou" attitude. The only TRUTH here is that nobody knows for sure whether God exists or not. That's why we're called to have faith. Maher doesn't know God doesn't exist anymore than you or I know that he does. You need to understand that active media forces like fox do what they can to drown out moderat Muslim voices and present radicals as the face of Islam. For example the man behind the WTC mosque was drowned out and demonized and never had a chance, even though the US government has been using him as an ambassador in the middle east for years. Yet the radical London cleric with a following of a few hundred is showcased as speaking for all Muslims.
Ramblin' Rob Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 1- Bill Maher is an equal opportunity offender, he hates all religion and rips on muslims too, so sally jenkins can do a bit of research before her next blog. 2- Christians are tolerant of other religions? That is laughable.Maybe the ones you know, but christians hate everyone. Gays, people who dont agree with them and especially other religions. I know not every christian hates, but the vocal ones do. 3- Everyone needs to chill the funk out on tebow. Not every attack on him is because he is a christian, it is because he is the most over rated QB since vick. the next qb with unique abilities(ie- not a drop back passer) to not get figured out by NFL defenses will be the first. Tebow will either improve or fall by the wayside. I personally have not heard one sports caster, and i listen to a lot of sports talk, say one negative thing about his religion,but people like to pretend he is being persecuted. Basically if you fall on either side of the tebow religion debate, you suck at life and are searching for ****, cause there is almost nothing there except a good kid who happens to believe in a story that was passed down for 45 generations before it was ever written down.
truth on hold Posted January 1, 2012 Author Posted January 1, 2012 (edited) 1- Bill Maher is an equal opportunity offender, he hates all religion and rips on muslims too, so sally jenkins can do a bit of research before her next blog. He's not though. He demonstrates a personal contempt for Christians and a political one for Muslims, all the while making excuses for anything Israeli Edited January 1, 2012 by Joe_the_6_pack
CosmicBills Posted January 1, 2012 Posted January 1, 2012 Mahers a twat. I'm not religious but I respect those who are and would never attack them in this way. What's more he's a hypocrite. Portends to dislike all religious equally but really only shows contempt for Christians and Muslims while being a blatant propogandist for Israel. I don't have Hbo because it sucks but I did I'd cancel it and make it clear he's the reason. He's not though. He demonstrates a personal contempt for Christians and a political one for Muslims, all the while making excuses for anything Israeli Soooo... You don't even have HBO, so you don't watch his show. Yet you continue to make the claim he never says a word against Israel. If you had actually ever seen his program or bothered to do any sort of critical thinking on the subject of your own, you'd realize that not only are you wrong (he throws Israel under the bus often), you're also a fool. But parroting talking points from what someone else tells you about something you know nothing about is much easier (and fun) I guess.
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