first_and_ten Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 James, you're a good poster and this is not directed at you personally. I'm just springboarding off your comments. At 5 pages and counting, it's reached the point where I don't expect everyone to read through the entire thread before commenting, although very conscientious posters will do that. The discussion was about providing smoking areas for smokers or allowing them to leave the stadium (security gates I assume) and return so that they can smoke. There is no smoking areas at The Ralph anymore and those leaving the stadium to smoke are not allowed to return. I'll add, that smokers are being called whiners in this thread. But if there was a smoking area as apparently there was in years past, you'd have people smoking OUTDOORS in a designated smoking area with a very few fans getting SMELLS of second-hand smoke. SMELLS, not some sort of actual smoke/health hazard. In this context the smokers are not the whiners. It's the people who smell the smoke from afar in an outdoor setting who are the whiners. People who are anti-smoking will conveniently ignore all the real issues in this discussion. Ranting onto a tangent, no one is arguing whether smoking is bad, or a bad decision. Smoking is bad and a bad decision. But this country has extracted many billions of dollars from smokers in taxes and from tobacco companies in settlements but they want to restrict the behavior of smokers while allowing drunks to ruin the gameday experience for others. I don't think they try to allow drunks to ruin the gameday experience for anyone. They have put a number out that is available for anyone to call if a drunk is acting in a way that is inappropriate. What more can they do? They can't go around with breathilizers and test everyone. They do what they can to prevent drunk people from ruining your gameday experience. Comparing what you percieve to be unequal treatment of smokers compared to drunks is not really a good argument in defense of smoking at the games. Are you saying the real issue is the drunks? It's an issue, but it's seperate from the smoking issue. I personally would not have a problem with a designated smoking area for smokers but I still have a hard time understanding how a person cannot go 3-4 hours without a cigarette.
Jim in Anchorage Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I don't think they try to allow drunks to ruin the gameday experience for anyone. They have put a number out that is available for anyone to call if a drunk is acting in a way that is inappropriate. What more can they do? They can't go around with breathilizers and test everyone. They do what they can to prevent drunk people from ruining your gameday experience. Comparing what you percieve to be unequal treatment of smokers compared to drunks is not really a good argument in defense of smoking at the games. Are you saying the real issue is the drunks? It's an issue, but it's seperate from the smoking issue. I personally would not have a problem with a designated smoking area for smokers but I still have a hard time understanding how a person cannot go 3-4 hours without a cigarette. Maybe they just don't want to? Again you are paying to have a fun experience. If it's not fun, why go?
first_and_ten Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Maybe they just don't want to? Again you are paying to have a fun experience. If it's not fun, why go? Are you saying you can't have fun at a game without smoking?
Jim in Anchorage Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Are you saying you can't have fun at a game without smoking? People Quit [or not] whan they wish. It's not up to me or you to make the call. If I say I will stop Bills games because I don't enjoy the experience without a smoke, There it is. It's not a job.
first_and_ten Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) People Quit [or not] whan they wish. It's not up to me or you to make the call. If I say I will stop Bills games because I don't enjoy the experience without a smoke, There it is. It's not a job. I don't tell people to quit or not. I just find it hard to believe a person needs a cigarette to have a good time at a game. If it is true, I feel sorry for them because it's obviously a bad addiction. Edited December 28, 2011 by first_and_ten
Jim in Anchorage Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I don't tell people to quit or not. I just find it hard to believe a person needs a cigarette to have a good time at a game. If it is true, I feel sorry for them because it's obviously a bad addiction. Or, you've never enjoyed the pleasure of a good smoke? To bad. There is no right or wrong here.
opfball91 Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) Cigarettes are a gate way drug and yes, smokers are second class citizens. Their willingness to be price gouged on a product that can cause respiratory failure is absurd. Get a real vice for Christ' sake. Oh noes, not a gateway drug!! Didn't realize I was in Dare class, I'm well aware as are all smokers the risks smoking puts on my health. Who are you to tell me what I should and shouldn't put in my body? Second class citizen? I'm not going to even indulge that comment, you're ignorance is implied within. Well, the comparison to drinking is not a real comparasion. One drink a day has no effect on your health, and some studies show it to be beneficial. But, one cigarattee a day increases your risk of cancer to some degree, and has no known health beneefits. Drinking is only dangerous to yourself and/or others when done irresponsibly. Smoking is always dangerous to yourself, and can be dangerous to others in varing degrees if done irresponsibility. I'd put a good 25% of fans at the Ralph have been drinking "irresponsibly" (consisting of three drinks or more in a short period), point is, drinking excessively is still an awfully bad habit, one that loads of fans at the stadium partake in every home game. If cigarettes were illegal, then treating them differently would be more understandable, even though I would still disagree, but they aren't. Edited December 28, 2011 by opfball91
zazie Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Oh noes, not a gateway drug!! Didn't realize I was in Dare class, I'm well aware as are all smokers the risks smoking puts on my health. Who are you to tell me what I should and shouldn't put in my body? Second class citizen? I'm not going to even indulge that comment, you're ignorance is implied within. So long as you carry your own health insurance, you are 100% correct, your business and your business alone what you put into your body. And you ar first class for me, all the way!
8-8 Forever? Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 It's a league wide ban, don't expect to be able to smoke on any of your road trips either. It is sad that you're giving the tickets up, and that you let smoking control your life so much, also that you joined a Bills message board and your first post is a complaint about smoking not being permitted at the stadium. smokers are gross. quit. now.
CodeMonkey Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 So long as you carry your own health insurance, you are 100% correct, your business and your business alone what you put into your body. And you ar first class for me, all the way! Not good enough. No reason to burden the health care system because of a persons choice to put a carcinogen into their body. I have no problem with people smoking in an area away from me as long as they pay for their own treatment for anything caused by smoking now or in the future out of their own pocket. If they can't afford treatment, then they die.
Turbosrrgood Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) Yet again (for about the 5th time in this topic) I'm talking about a smoking section, NOT people smoking in their seats. So your second-hand smoke argument doesn't apply here. And again to another issue, people are not allowed to leave and return to the stadium which is absurd considering that this practice is permitted in numerous other stadiums and that the technology is already in place to allow the practice. I agree with many of your posts, but you are getting awfully defensive about this one... I responded to EXACTLY what you said, that's all. You had basically said smoking is no different than drinking, and should be treated similarly. I merely explained how they are VERY different. What I said applies regardless of a smoking section or not. Relax, have a smoke. Personally, I don't see where in the Ralph they could have a smoking area that WOULDN'T affect non-smokers. Letting people out obviously would make sense for smokers. I can see wanting that, but it is what it is. The stadium is about football, not smoking. I guess people will have to choose which one is more important to them... Edited December 28, 2011 by Turbosrrgood
UConn James Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I agree with many of your posts, but you are getting awfully defensive about this one... I responded to EXACTLY what you said, that's all. You had basically said smoking is no different than drinking, and should be treated similarly. I merely explained how they are VERY different. What I said applies regardless of a smoking section or not. Relax, have a smoke. Personally, I don't see where in the Ralph they could have a smoking area that WOULDN'T affect non-smokers. Letting people out obviously would make sense for smokers. I can see wanting that, but it is what it is. The stadium is about football, not smoking. I guess people will have to choose which one is more important to them... This thread really doesn't have anywhere else to go, does it? Some people are upset that parameters allowing for smoking aren't in place. Some people are happy that there's no smoking. Some people are dismayed that even with the ban, in true theory-meets-reality, people are still smoking in the stadium. The rule is the rule and bitching about it isn't going to make a damn bit of difference, b/c no doubt they expected that there would be some backlash, but they still made the choice to ban it. If you don't like it, TFB. You can watch from a bar that allows smoking or at your own place. The owner and/or tenant of the stadium makes the rules.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 Relax, have a smoke. I don't smoke. I quit. But now that I'm all upset about this thread… Seriously, I'm not worked up about this. I'm just trying to pound some clarity into the discussion… particularly trying to point out that the opinions stating that smoking is a gross habit and that smokers lack willpower are totally irrelevant to the discussion. If lawyers were arguing this issue in court, smoking being "gross" and the discussion of the willpower of the individual wouldn't even be discussed. IMO, the issue is to what degree if any, should smokers (as paying customers) be accommodated. Implicit in the entire discussion is the idea of fairness in the treatment of paying customers and within the context of many fans abusing another legal vice (drinking).
Webster Guy Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I'm addicted to the most disappointing team in football. I've tried wearing the patch (other team's stickers that is, trying to like a team to watch in the post season once in awhile) Doesn't work. I've tried alternative drug therapy (drinking a few extra beers to ease the pain of constant losing seasons) Didn't work. I go to the support groups (the stadium wall message board, the men's room at the Ralph) and admit I have a problem. I've called Ralph Cheap. I drink the "its a new year" Kool Aid every year during training camp. I tell my kids to pick another team. I offer up my tickets for underprivileged kids. I even retired my custom Buffalo Bills Santa Suit until we can get to a playoff game. Quitting smoking was a lot easier boys......
Hapless Bills Fan Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 They should ban cigarettes everywhere. Those things just cause cancer. You want to smoke - cool. Just be prepared to be treated like a 2nd class citizen. You will get no sympathy Hey Bub I'm humming your song: http://sniff.numachi.com/pages/tiAWAYRUM5;ttAWAYRUM3.html
opfball91 Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) smokers are gross. quit. now. Again, I agree smoking is an awful habit, I agree the smell is pretty horrible, and I've been trying to quit for some time now with some success here and there. Again, those points hold no weight in this discussion. Edited December 28, 2011 by opfball91
Bob in STL Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 I don't smoke. I quit. But now that I'm all upset about this thread… Seriously, I'm not worked up about this. I'm just trying to pound some clarity into the discussion… particularly trying to point out that the opinions stating that smoking is a gross habit and that smokers lack willpower are totally irrelevant to the discussion. If lawyers were arguing this issue in court, smoking being "gross" and the discussion of the willpower of the individual wouldn't even be discussed. IMO, the issue is to what degree if any, should smokers (as paying customers) be accommodated. Implicit in the entire discussion is the idea of fairness in the treatment of paying customers and within the context of many fans abusing another legal vice (drinking). SJBF, Please quit while you are not to far behind. Don't you know that Chan sucks, the Bills suck, Fitz sucks, smokers suck, drunks suck, and Ralph is cheap and sucks. I thought you knew all this?
Kevin Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 SJBF, Please quit while you are not to far behind. Don't you know that Chan sucks, the Bills suck, Fitz sucks, smokers suck, drunks suck, and Ralph is cheap and sucks. I thought you knew all this? Where's deep voice when you need him? YEAH!
Mike32282 Posted December 28, 2011 Posted December 28, 2011 They tried a smoking section, but idiot smokers bitched and wanted to keep smoking somewhere else, forcing the rest of us to breathe that **** in. A bunch of them would start out at the designated smoking areas, then just end up bringing their cigarette somewhere else that wasnt a smoking area. It was harder to enforce. Plus this state is pretty much banning smoking anywhere possible now, so why are you surprised that the Bills banned it inside a stadium? Smoke your heart out for the 4-hour tailgating and then take a little 3 hour break to watch the game. Whats wrong with that?
Jim in Anchorage Posted December 29, 2011 Posted December 29, 2011 Not good enough. No reason to burden the health care system because of a persons choice to put a carcinogen into their body. I have no problem with people smoking in an area away from me as long as they pay for their own treatment for anything caused by smoking now or in the future out of their own pocket. If they can't afford treatment, then they die. I assume as a non smoker you will die Quickly, at no cost. Just like turning off a light bulb. Cool.
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