1billsfan Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) I've been a huge fan of Fitzpatrick's, but if he continues his downward spiral (or even if he's just merely ok) even I'll be looking at the QB position in this next draft. If the reason he's been so shaky is because he's playing injured then the Bills should sit him and level with the fans so we can at least understand what happened to the guy playing so awesome the first part of the season. With that being said, the Bills will no doubt be picking around the 8-12 range. My question is, given the parameters of a healthy Fitzpatrick not looking good these final three games, what would you be comfortable with the Bills giving up to get to the #3 selection with someone like the Rams to get RG III? If he looks as good as advertised going into the draft, the most I could think of doing is 2012 1st, 2nd...2013 1st and 2nd. That's a hefty price, but I really believe that's the type of decision the Bills will be facing. It could possibly cost even more. I don't even know if I'd pull the trigger on the trade I just proposed. If Fitzpatrick doesn't look very good from here on out then I would be very interested to know what their thoughts were draft-wize of this RG III guy. BTW, I'm fine going with best LT or LB! I just was wondering how badly we want a franchise QB, because the price is gonna be very very high. Edited December 14, 2011 by 1billsfan
KD in CA Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 With that being said, the Bills will no doubt be picking around the 8-12 range. My question is, given the parameters of a healthy Fitzpatrick not looking good these final three games, what would you be comfortable with the Bills giving up to get to the #3 selection with someone like the Rams to get RG III? Absolutely zero. This team has holes all over the field. LB, CB, WR, DL, OT. If they want to go QB and one of the Big 3 is available when they pick, than fine. But under no circumstances can the Bills afford to burn picks by trading up. I also think the Bills could get into the top 7 of the draft if they lose to Miami since there is no chance they beat Denver or NE.
jr1 Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 If RG3 is available, you take him. Fitz is an unkempt Chad Pennington
Ozymandius Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 The Bills are going to continue the only rebuild in NFL history that didn't include drafting a QB high in the draft. Some rebuilds are successful. Many others have failed. But all of them, prior to the Bills, have at least tried.
polish lover Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 I've been a huge fan of Fitzpatrick's, but if he continues his downward spiral (or even if he's just merely ok) even I'll be looking at the QB position in this next draft. If the reason he's been so shaky is because he's playing injured then the Bills should sit him and level with the fans so we can at least understand what happened to the guy playing so awesome the first part of the season. With that being said, the Bills will no doubt be picking around the 8-12 range. My question is, given the parameters of a healthy Fitzpatrick not looking good these final three games, what would you be comfortable with the Bills giving up to get to the #3 selection with someone like the Rams to get RG III? If he looks as good as advertised going into the draft, the most I could think of doing is 2012 1st, 2nd...2013 1st and 2nd. That's a hefty price, but I really believe that's the type of decision the Bills will be facing. It could possibly cost even more. I don't even know if I'd pull the trigger on the trade I just proposed. If Fitzpatrick doesn't look very good from here on out then I would be very interested to know what their thoughts were draft-wize of this RG III guy. BTW, I'm fine going with best LT or LB! I just was wondering how badly we want a franchise QB, because the price is gonna be very very high. Fitzpatrick is struggling because most of the top playmakers on offense are on IR. The only coaching problem I see is defensive coordinator. If the Bills add some pass rush in the off season and improve depth all around, they will have a very solid team. Did you notice that Fitz's "struggles" coincide with the loss of Jones, Wood and Jackson? Jackson accounted for 40% of the team offense. Its a lot harder for the qb when the pass rush is getting to you, your snaps are off target, the guys who can get open are not on the field, the guys who can make great catches and get yards after the catch aren't on the field. It's not fitz's fault that the 7th string receiver he hit on the hands dropped the ball. Yeah he threw a couple picks but that happens. You normally overcome that by throwing to your playmakers and scoring points. Stevie Johnson is the only threat left and hes getting doubled every play. defenses couldn't do that early in the season. Even Chandler was out last week. Who is Fitz supposed to throw to? Spiller isn't effective enough to help in the lay action game. Its pretty easy to figure out why this season collapsed. IR. no pass rush (the few potential pass rush guys are on IR too but thats the most glaring need for sure.
KOKBILLS Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 Absolutely zero. This team has holes all over the field. LB, CB, WR, DL, OT. If they want to go QB and one of the Big 3 is available when they pick, than fine. But under no circumstances can the Bills afford to burn picks by trading up. I also think the Bills could get into the top 7 of the draft if they lose to Miami since there is no chance they beat Denver or NE. I hear what you're saying...But I'd give up just about anything and the Kitchen sink for Luck...So I would not go as far as to say "under no circumstances."... No way Indy Trades the rights to Draft him...But if they did...
dpberr Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 I don't think RGIII will be there. Even if Indy picks Luck, somebody will take RGIII or get into postion to get him the top 5. Besides, Fitzpatrick is only as good as A) the parts around him and B) the plays being called. Even the greats would struggle missing their starting center, running back and your second wide receiver. Even the greats would have a hard time getting downfield if the defense knows what's coming. Those two things conspire against Fitzpatrick more than anything else.
polish lover Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 to paraphrase quote both Gailey and Nix prior to game 1 of 2011. We have a pretty good team if we can stay healthy we can make the playoffs. Our depth is very young and inexperienced. They were right. We had a good team with not much depth to count on and we ended up with one of the longest IR lists in the league. For those of you calling for a new GM and a new coach it is amazing to me that you still haven't figured out why its been so long since the Bills have been to the playoffs! The biggest problem with this team is that they fire either the head coach or the GM or both every 2-3 years. This results in no continuity whatsoever so our offense is always still figuring things out, our defensive system is in constant flux. each new coach or gm releases half of the players, most of which end up being picked up and playing well on other teams. Its moronic. When a team is as bad as Buffalo has been in the last few years, you can't expect them to turn it around overnight. Last season they flushed out the roster and evaluated what they had left. they found some diamonds in the rough and started working on getting new draft picks up to speed. this year they built on that and turned the offense into a competitive unit. The defense although improved, still needs work. There were way too many problems to fix in one season. I don't think Nix has drafted poorly or made any major questionable moves. If fitz had a top 5 salary I'd say his signing was a mistake, but he is the 16th highest paid starting QB. That sounds about right to me. Good move not over paying. The Bills have a lot of very young players that are showing good potential and a lot of them are getting a lot of playing time right now thanks to the injury situation. If the Bills don't do anything stupid like fire Gailey or Nix or both, this should be a solid team next season. Our record isn't much better than last year but the difference is that we beat teams with winning records this year. not just scrubs. Had so many key injuries not happened we would still be in the running if not at the top of the division.
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 If you believe the guy to be a franchise QB, you take him. Fitz will be 30 and will never be elite. The perfect situation is for Fitz to start another year while RG3 learns under him. IMO, RG3 is the perfect Buffalo guy - great family and he's engaged. He's going to be a stud.
EldaBillsFan Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 Let's start from scratch again!!! With a rookie qb! .....smh .... Because the loss of fred jackson, wood and tons of other key player had nuffin to do with the decline
HeHateMe Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 You better believe RG3 will be gone before the Bills pick. Probably the pick right before.
todd Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 The Bills are going to continue the only rebuild in NFL history that didn't include drafting a QB high in the draft. Some rebuilds are successful. Many others have failed. But all of them, prior to the Bills, have at least tried. Bull. They drafted Losman in the first round, and traded for bledsoe. Those are two first round QBs. How did that work?
marauderswr80 Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 I laugh when this organization says we don't have depth.....well since we dont have depth why don't we sppend somme of the millions we have under the cap and fix that problem?
Ozymandius Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 Bull. They drafted Losman in the first round, and traded for bledsoe. Those are two first round QBs. How did that work? Obviously was talking about Nix / Gailey current rebuild attempt. They are going to get fired in two years without having drafted a QB high. What a waste. At least try.
Turbosrrgood Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) I am fine with taking a QB if a good one is available (decent chance there will be one). We definitely do not have the luxury of being able to trade away picks though. We desperately need quality LB and WR help. Actually the most important thing the Bills can do this off season is dump George Edwards and try to pick up a real DC... If RG3 is available, you take him. Fitz is an unkempt Chad Pennington This has to be the worst QB comparison I have ever heard...It's pretty obvious you just pulled a random name out of thin air...The two of them couldn't be any different. Fitz is a big physical guy, with no problem initiating contact. Pennington was a weak fragile QB, he had amazing accuracy combined with the weakest arm in the history of NFL football. Fitz has average at best accuracy and a decent arm, his strength is being aggressive and making quick decisions. He can however, through the ball all over the field (even though it's not part of Gailey's system). Edited December 14, 2011 by Turbosrrgood
KOKBILLS Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 I just looked this up and to be honest it almost freaked me out...Surely someone has posted this already...But if not... Fitz's numbers through 13 games in 2010 and 2011 are virtually identical 2010 255/441 57.8%, 3000 yds., 6.8 average, 23 TD's, 15 INT's, 81.8 rating 2011 278/449 61.9%, 3013 yds., 6.7 average, 20 TD's, 16 INT's, 81.6 rating Now I know there was a HUGE amount of conversation last summer about whether or not Fitz would continue to grow or regress...And I think the answer is...Neither...He's exactly the same QB as he was in 2010...He neither grew, nor regressed...And I'm guessing this is who he is...
Turbosrrgood Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 I laugh when this organization says we don't have depth.....well since we dont have depth why don't we sppend somme of the millions we have under the cap and fix that problem? I definitely understand where you are coming from, they are cheap no doubt about it. However they did make some pickups that had huge impacts this year. They signed Barnett, by far our best LB. They signed Merriman, even though it has now been confirmed that he is washed up... They picked up Erik Pears who has looked pretty good, and now have signed him again. They also picked up Urbik, who has been better than expected and has now become our starting center. I never understood why Gaily thought we were so strong at WR that he said they didn't even look at them in the draft I thought it was a pretty obvious weak spot. I really like Nelson, but he is a depth guy. SJ is our obvious starter, but the lack of a real #2 has killed us. Donald Jones was awful last year, awful in the pre-season, and awful while he was healthy this season. I never understood the hype there. Brad Smith? Sure he's quick, but his hands are crafted from solid brick... Why didn't we try for Lloyd for a measly 6th round pick? The only look they took was at Buster the Bust Davis, and the mighty Ruvell Martin...
1billsfan Posted December 14, 2011 Author Posted December 14, 2011 I just looked this up and to be honest it almost freaked me out...Surely someone has posted this already...But if not... Fitz's numbers through 13 games in 2010 and 2011 are virtually identical 2010 255/441 57.8%, 3000 yds., 6.8 average, 23 TD's, 15 INT's, 81.8 rating 2011 278/449 61.9%, 3013 yds., 6.7 average, 20 TD's, 16 INT's, 81.6 rating Now I know there was a HUGE amount of conversation last summer about whether or not Fitz would continue to grow or regress...And I think the answer is...Neither...He's exactly the same QB as he was in 2010...He neither grew, nor regressed...And I'm guessing this is who he is... I had high hopes for him and the start he had this season was ridiculous. I know he's had tough breaks like a horrible defense leading to him possibly pressing the issue, injuries to key team mates and big drops in crucial games but you've got to rise above these things. He's been so careless with the ball. What the heck happened to that "off the charts" guy at the beginning of this season! What a weird season. I know it's off topic, but I hope the Bills give Spiller 75 carries these last few weeks. Enough with giving Choice the ball. This team is so stupid.
Turbosrrgood Posted December 14, 2011 Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) I just looked this up and to be honest it almost freaked me out...Surely someone has posted this already...But if not... Fitz's numbers through 13 games in 2010 and 2011 are virtually identical 2010 255/441 57.8%, 3000 yds., 6.8 average, 23 TD's, 15 INT's, 81.8 rating 2011 278/449 61.9%, 3013 yds., 6.7 average, 20 TD's, 16 INT's, 81.6 rating Now I know there was a HUGE amount of conversation last summer about whether or not Fitz would continue to grow or regress...And I think the answer is...Neither...He's exactly the same QB as he was in 2010...He neither grew, nor regressed...And I'm guessing this is who he is... I definitely see the logic in your post, but I think you have to take into account the self-destruction of the rest of the team. Fitz was lights out the first 7 games of the season...Then the rest of the team fell apart, Jackson, Wood, Jones (even though he sucks), Kyle Williams (yes this matters, losing him and George Wilson completly broke our fragile defense forcing a changed game plan). Losing Jackson and Wood was a huge loss, Jackson was also our most effective receiver... Sure these are excuses, but Fitz is still by FAR the best QB we have had since Bledsoe's one year wonder. There are way bigger problems on this team than Fitz...like GEORGE EDWARDS and the lack of WR and LB depth. I know it's off topic, but I hope the Bills give Spiller 75 carries these last few weeks. Enough with giving Choice the ball. This team is so stupid. I kind of agree with this, but Choice actually looked ok last week. His first game was absolutely horrendous, he just ran around in circles and fell down. While Spiller has shown big play potential, he has also shown he has no ability to run in traffic. He can't break tackles, or even push for a yard. He is one of the weakest RB's in the league. He just isn't starter material, our best hope would be for him to turn into a Sproles type. Edited December 14, 2011 by Turbosrrgood
1billsfan Posted December 14, 2011 Author Posted December 14, 2011 I definitely see the logic in your post, but I think you have to take into account the self-destruction of the rest of the team. Fitz was lights out the first 7 games of the season...Then the rest of the team fell apart, Jackson, Wood, Jones (even though he sucks), Kyle Williams (yes this matters, losing him completly broke our fragile defense forcing a changed game plan). Losing Jackson and Wood was a huge loss, Jackson was also our most effective receiver... Sure these are excuses, but Fitz is still by FAR the best QB we have had since Bledsoe's one year wonder. There are way bigger problems on this team than Fitz...like GEORGE EDWARDS and the lack of WR and LB depth. I kind of agree with this, but Choice actually looked ok last week. His first game was absolutely horrendous, he just ran around in circles and fell down. While Spiller has shown big play potential, he has also shown he has no ability to run in traffic. He can't break tackles, or even push for a yard. He is one of the weakest RB's in the league. He just isn't starter material, our best hope would be for him to turn into a Sproles type. The same things were said about Aaron Maybin. Spiller has looked very very good at times and shown some very special talents, that's why they need to give him the rock 75 times. We aren't going anywhere and Fitzpatrick looks like he's punch drunk throwing the ball. Give CJ the football!!!!
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