dave mcbride Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 This is very apropos, and I couldn't agree more with the owner's sentiments: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AqE4A3UrdvAqIFDqzuZq6Bc5nYcB?slug=ms-silver_morning_rush_romo_handcuffs_garrett_101711
Thoner7 Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Man, I cant believe this call is getting so much attention. So we score a TD on that play and people are pissed we leave them 4 mins? Yea our D sucks, but if we ran it we would only steal a couple TOs and they would have 3 mins to score instead of 4!!!! Big deal. 25 yards out, 4 mins left, 2 TOs, the 2 min warning, time wasn’t a factor yet, we needed to beat the Giants not the clock. I mean lets say we ran it twice, got stuffed, the Giants took two TOs, and Fitz threw the pick on 3rd down with 3:47 left…. The Giants still win on the last drive. And besides, who is to say they didn’t have a run play called along with the pass, and Fitz decided to throw it bc he had SJ singled up on the outside? Id rather take the shot for the end zone than sit back and take it up the pooper on the next drive. The Cowboys gave up that same 1v1 look with D Bryant v the Pats last night and they lost, it’s a double edged sword, and it boils down to throwing a better pass. Really? You don't think the Giants would have marched right down the field on the Bills defense and scored with 4 minutes to do so? I do! They didnt need a full 4 mins to do that. They coulda done it in 2 if they could do it in 4.
PromoTheRobot Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Who ever thought we'd miss Dick Jauron's "play-not-to-lose" offense? PTR
dave mcbride Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Who ever thought we'd miss Dick Jauron's "play-not-to-lose" offense? PTR Promo: Only certain people here seem to miss it - the ones who don't seem to understand the rate at which time passes in close NFL games circa 2011.
JM57 Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Can't believe people are criticizing this call. It shows that fans here at TBD have a very hard time separating their emotions from football logic. Stevie had a TD on the exact same play. Unfortunately, Fitz ended up being 3 for 3 on this play..two of them to Corey Webster. Johnson beat Webster off the line all 3 times, and if Fitz threw it right, chances are he would have had a 3 TD game. This one is ALL on Fitz. Great playcall, terrible execution by #14
BuffaloBillsForever Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) Who ever thought we'd miss Dick Jauron's "play-not-to-lose" offense? PTR No kidding! The kicker is that a pass is the correct call on first down against the defense shown in hindsight. You had Stevie 1 on 1 and he beats the CB close to the line of scrimmage! Promo you just have to realize that a lot of people don't quite understand football. The "call" doesn't fall on the head coach, it falls on the players in this case the quarterback not executing the throw. Edited October 17, 2011 by BuffaloBillsForever
Phlegm Alley Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I was calling for the run as soon as David Nelson caught that pass and got us into field goal position. I like Gailey and his aggressive nature, however, there are times when I think he deserts the run. It cost them at least 6 points yesterday with the end of the 1st half debacle that saw 3 straight pass plays result in a 2 sacks and put us out of field position. I don't care if you guys think it is a great play call because he is going for the jugular. Yeah it would've been great if Fitzy hadn't thrown another terrible pass and was able to connect with Johnson. But, it was the wrong play call. The Bills were averaging 6.7 YPC at that point and they would've forced the Giants to take their last two timeouts. Worst case scenario are 3 runs and you don't get the 1st down, and Lindell kicks the go-ahead FG with 2 minutes remaining. Best case scenario is, and IMO very realistic, Freddie gets another 1st down and the Bills are able to run the clock down to the 3 seconds and Lindell kicks the FG with no time remianing.
bills44 Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I was calling for the run as soon as David Nelson caught that pass and got us into field goal position. I like Gailey and his aggressive nature, however, there are times when I think he deserts the run. It cost them at least 6 points yesterday with the end of the 1st half debacle that saw 3 straight pass plays result in a 2 sacks and put us out of field position. I don't care if you guys think it is a great play call because he is going for the jugular. Yeah it would've been great if Fitzy hadn't thrown another terrible pass and was able to connect with Johnson. But, it was the wrong play call. The Bills were averaging 6.7 YPC at that point and they would've forced the Giants to take their last two timeouts. Worst case scenario are 3 runs and you don't get the 1st down, and Lindell kicks the go-ahead FG with 2 minutes remaining. Best case scenario is, and IMO very realistic, Freddie gets another 1st down and the Bills are able to run the clock down to the 3 seconds and Lindell kicks the FG with no time remianing. excellent post
bills_fan_in_raleigh Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I was calling for the run as soon as David Nelson caught that pass and got us into field goal position. I like Gailey and his aggressive nature, however, there are times when I think he deserts the run. It cost them at least 6 points yesterday with the end of the 1st half debacle that saw 3 straight pass plays result in a 2 sacks and put us out of field position. I don't care if you guys think it is a great play call because he is going for the jugular. Yeah it would've been great if Fitzy hadn't thrown another terrible pass and was able to connect with Johnson. But, it was the wrong play call. The Bills were averaging 6.7 YPC at that point and they would've forced the Giants to take their last two timeouts. Worst case scenario are 3 runs and you don't get the 1st down, and Lindell kicks the go-ahead FG with 2 minutes remaining. Best case scenario is, and IMO very realistic, Freddie gets another 1st down and the Bills are able to run the clock down to the 3 seconds and Lindell kicks the FG with no time remianing. take away th e80 yard run and it wasnt 6.7YPC sorry run game wasnt going anywhere
RealityCheck Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 take away th e80 yard run and it wasnt 6.7YPC sorry run game wasnt going anywhere
Magox Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) take away th e80 yard run and it wasnt 6.7YPC sorry run game wasnt going anywhere No, but you don't take away the 80 yard run, it was part of the game. Also, everyone seems to be missing the point, it wasn't about playing for a 3 and out field goal, it should of been about playing for a first down or two and fieldgoal. Our short to intermediate game was on. Look at Fit'z completion average, plus you add the fact that Jackson by far has been our MVP of this offense, you play to your strengths and you play the odds. 4 freaking minutes left at the 25, you play to milk the clock. And No, milking the clock doesn't mean run, run, run Fieldgoal. Milking the clock means game planning for a first down. There were a number of plays that we could of run that would of been relatively safe that could of gotten us to a first down. Listen, I love Gailey's aggressive nature, and I normally applaud it, and I'm happy as hell that he is our coach, but that was the wrong strategy. Odds are if we attempted to play for another first down or two, we would of succeeded and won the game. Edited October 17, 2011 by Magox
Bangarang Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how much time they thought we could have killed on the Giants' own 25 yard line with 2 time outs and the 2 minute warning. This not Jauron's team anymore. I am happy that Chan goes for the throat. Had Ditz connected there people would be praising Chan for that play call.
Phlegm Alley Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I'm still waiting for someone to tell me how much time they thought we could have killed on the Giants' own 25 yard line with 2 time outs and the 2 minute warning. This not Jauron's team anymore. I am happy that Chan goes for the throat. Had Ditz connected there people would be praising Chan for that play call. I mentioned that the worst case scenario would be the Bills running the ball 3 straight times and kicking a 37 yard FG with 2 minutes remaining. The Giants would still have 2 TOs, but the Bills would've had the lead. Don't get me wrong...it would've been great had Fitz connected. But it was the wrong play call.
JM57 Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 No, but you don't take away the 80 yard run, it was part of the game. Also, everyone seems to be missing the point, it wasn't about playing for a 3 and out field goal, it should of been about playing for a first down or two and fieldgoal. Our short to intermediate game was on. Look at Fit'z completion average, plus you add the fact that Jackson by far has been our MVP of this offense, you play to your strengths and you play the odds. 4 freaking minutes left at the 25, you play to milk the clock. And No, milking the clock doesn't mean run, run, run Fieldgoal. Milking the clock means game planning for a first down. There were a number of plays that we could of run that would of been relatively safe that could of gotten us to a first down. Listen, I love Gailey's aggressive nature, and I normally applaud it, and I'm happy as hell that he is our coach, but that was the wrong strategy. Odds are if we attempted to play for another first down or two, we would of succeeded and won the game. Without that big run they averaged a pedestrian three yards per carry on the ground and iirc Freddy had less than 20 yards in the second half on six or seven carries.
dave mcbride Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 (edited) I mentioned that the worst case scenario would be the Bills running the ball 3 straight times and kicking a 37 yard FG with 2 minutes remaining. The Giants would still have 2 TOs, but the Bills would've had the lead. Don't get me wrong...it would've been great had Fitz connected. But it was the wrong play call. How do you get us to the two minute warning? With 4:10 left, even if the Bills use the maximum 40 seconds between plays (which they wouldn't have), that gets you to about 2:40-2:45 because the Giants would have called a TO on fourth down. After the FG (about 8 seconds), the Giants would have about 2:30-2:35 with a TO and the 2-minute warning. That's an eternity in today's NFL. The Bills were running the ball very poorly by that point of the game. The Giants have an active d-line, and the Bills' best interior run blocker had shifted to LT. Edited October 17, 2011 by dave mcbride
YOOOOOO Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Can some of you stop it with the run wasnt working....so it wasnt an option....bull **** Bradshaw had 21 for 49yds...but the Giants sure as hell didnt shy away from using him on that last drive... bottom line with 4min remaining in Giants territory you have to come away with points, while chewing up the clock....if your going to pass...it has to be a high percentage play(no risk involved).....
Phlegm Alley Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 How do you get us to the two minute warning? With 4:10 left, even if the Bills use the maximum 40 seconds between plays (which they wouldn't have, that gets you to about 2:40-2:45 because the Giants would have called a TO on fourth down. After the FG (about 8 seconds), the Giants would have about 2:30-2:35 with a TO and the 2-minute warning. That's an eternity in today's NFL. The Bills were running the ball very poorly by that point of the game. The Giants have an active d-line, and the Bills' best interior run blocker had shifted to LT. youtube.com/watch?v=W42iiCcFbxE Let the play clock tick down to one second, average play is :5 seconds and if you use the entire play clock, that would be about :45 seconds for each play. Say the Giants use a TO on both first and second down. Bills would run their 3rd down play with just under 4 minutes remaining. 45 seconds off the clock later and they are kicking the FG with about 3 minutes left on the clock. The Giants then only have the 2 minute warning to stop the clock. This is assuming the Giants use their last 2 TOs during this time. I think the Giants would probably save the TOs based on what the Bills did with their first play after the David Nelson 1st down.
billsfreak Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Maybe not the time to go over the top in a tie game and the Giants already having wasted one of their TO's. Lots of foolishness out there today but Chan still had a late lead on the table and gave it away.... Chan called the correct play, Fitz plain and simply blew it. On a play like that, you either have to complete it, or over throw it so the only one who can get to it is your receiver. That was almost identical to the underthrown pass he had picked earlier. Those two passes cost the game, despite the defense being horrendous.
dave mcbride Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Can some of you stop it with the run wasnt working....so it wasnt an option....bull **** Bradshaw had 21 for 49yds...but the Giants sure as hell didnt shy away from using him on that last drive... bottom line with 4min remaining in Giants territory you have to come away with points, while chewing up the clock....if your going to pass...it has to be a high percentage play(no risk involved)..... I'm sorry, but when your best run blocker moves to LT and a scrub replaces him, then yes, your running game has an inherent problem. They ran eight times for 19 yards (9 times for 22 yards if you include Fitz's sneak) in the second half.
Bangarang Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Can some of you stop it with the run wasnt working....so it wasnt an option....bull **** Bradshaw had 21 for 49yds...but the Giants sure as hell didnt shy away from using him on that last drive... bottom line with 4min remaining in Giants territory you have to come away with points, while chewing up the clock....if your going to pass...it has to be a high percentage play(no risk involved)..... There's always risk no matter what play you run. It's the NFL. Guys could fumble running the ball. The QB could fumble the snap. There's no such thing as a no risk play. However, as I've stated before, we've ran that passing play twice in the Giants game and both times (3 total) Stevie badly beat his man. One of those plays resulted in a TD and the other in an INT. As a coach you have to trust your players to make plays. Stevie and Fitz both make plays. It just so happens that on that particular play, Fitz wasn't able to make a play.
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