BuffaloBillsForever Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 You better check your facts then! 6 of Freddys other 15 carries went for 4 or more yards. So yes I do believe they should have tried to run the clock and get a first down and then get the FG to win the game. To think that passing there was not the right call especially on first down, that was not the time to play gunslinger football. Given the circumstances, time left, field position, score, and how awful the defense was playing, running time off the clock would have been the right decision. I like Chan and Fitz but the hard truth is they both brain farted there, period. Since you have the facts tell me what Freddie did in the 2nd half? We were successful in the 1st half running the football NOT in the second half. Throwing the ball on first down is not a bad call. If they ran I wouldn't be screaming either, but in hindsight and how the defense scheme was a pass play was certainly not a wrong call.
John Cocktosten Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I don't know if he is or isn't; I'm leaning towards him being a great stopgap and the best backup in the NFL. But my issue wasn't necessarily with it being Fitz not being able to make that throw; more that I think there were a lot of other and better ways for the Bills to put points on the board and deny the Giants time to get those points back. Run that slant to Stevie against teh cover 1 the Giants were showing, keep your spread personnel on the field and throw the dig at David Nelson and let him do what he keeps doing at big moments, play action to Fred and let CJ run that circle route that no LB can cover; all those calls likely end up 2nd/short with the clock running and a pile of options to play with. We just didn't need to try and win the game on that play. True but I still like the aggressiveness. It reminded me of the Pitt game last year when on the first play of that drive in OT they were in a 5 wide set. Then on the infamous "God made me drop it play" they were in a double tight power I with only Stevie flanked. What did Gailey call? He went for the home run and it was a perfect call because no one expected it. The play today has a lot in common with the Stevie drop becasue they were perfect calls but they just weren't executed.
Bufcomments Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I thought Chan called a good drive until THAT last pick by Fitz. They have an MVP running back, give him the rock. We could have put 3 up and put more pressure on Manning to tie. He was having a good game and might have drove the Giants down the field but still a running play takes time off the clock. Good game. We could be 6-0 but this was an NFC loss. We still in good shape in the division. 3-0 at home. I think we still good.
Simon Posted October 17, 2011 Author Posted October 17, 2011 True but I still like the aggressiveness. The fact that it was aggressive is the one redeeming factor that differentiates me being pissed about it from merely disagreeing with it. I like the attitude but I just wish he would have held his water for 3-4 more plays before he went with the five point palm exploding heart technique
FreakPop Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Since you have the facts tell me what Freddie did in the 2nd half? We were successful in the 1st half running the football NOT in the second half. Throwing the ball on first down is not a bad call. If they ran I wouldn't be screaming either, but in hindsight and how the defense scheme was a pass play was certainly not a wrong call. Never got a chance to be sucessful in the second half. Out of 32 plays 9 were runs. Jackson was 6 for 14 yards and Smith was 3 for 8 yards. Total 9 for 22 yards. If a team can't play smash mouth and chew up at least a couple of minutes running the ball there is something seriously wrong. Instead of getting cute and trying some Tom Foolery on first down the right thing to do would have been to run the ball even if it only gained 9 yards given the circumstances.
KD in CA Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I don't know if he is or isn't; I'm leaning towards him being a great stopgap and the best backup in the NFL. But my issue wasn't necessarily with it being Fitz not being able to make that throw; more that I think there were a lot of other and better ways for the Bills to put points on the board and deny the Giants time to get those points back. Run that slant to Stevie against teh cover 1 the Giants were showing, keep your spread personnel on the field and throw the dig at David Nelson and let him do what he keeps doing at big moments, play action to Fred and let CJ run that circle route that no LB can cover; all those calls likely end up 2nd/short with the clock running and a pile of options to play with. We just didn't need to try and win the game on that play. I don't disagree that they could have taken a more conservative tack, but Fitz is a big boy --- he has the option to throw to an underneath guy and should have if he wasn't comfortable with the throw. Realistically, they had to score a TD so if they had a play to get it, I don't have an issue with going for it -- they just have to execuse. If anything, the fact that SJ was open validates the play call. There's no way they were going to burn all the Giant TOs and run the clock down to zero as some here have suggested, and a 3 point lead would have been way to precarious, so again, going for a TD was not the issue IMO.
John Cocktosten Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 The fact that it was aggressive is the one redeeming factor that differentiates me being pissed about it from merely disagreeing with it. I like the attitude but I just wish he would have held his water for 3-4 more plays before he went with the five point palm exploding heart technique There really is no right answer. However, Fitz has to be better than that throw and the one he made earlier. Without the deep ball threat, the defense will press and 3 step passing game will be thrown off it's rhythm and the box will be stacked for the running game.
Simon Posted October 17, 2011 Author Posted October 17, 2011 I don't disagree that they could have taken a more conservative tack, but Fitz is a big boy --- he has the option to throw to an underneath guy and should have if he wasn't comfortable with the throw. Realistically, they had to score a TD so if they had a play to get it, I don't have an issue with going for it -- they just have to execuse. If anything, the fact that SJ was open validates the play call. There's no way they were going to burn all the Giant TOs and run the clock down to zero as some here have suggested, and a 3 point lead would have been way to precarious, so again, going for a TD was not the issue IMO. The first read on that play against that defense is Stevie, and Fitz is going to take it every time. The second the Giants showed the single high safety, there were no more decisions involved. That was The play well before they snapped the ball so I disagree that Fitz would realistically gone any other way with it. And it wouldn't have necessarily been easy, but two first downs could have fried that clock so the Giants only had a couple plays left when they received our short corner kickoff that burned up a little more time.
Bufcomments Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 My thing is Fitz threw an INT on the same go route earlier in the game. Why go to it agian?? He said all the right things in the presser after the game but still id like to see a slant or a screen to Fred or CJ.
BeastMode54 Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 The guy has 131 yards on 16 carries, and we don't go to hm on their 13 yard line on 1st and 10. It's unreal. Gailey, while I like him, gets pass happy. Nad Fitz, while I like him, is not Tom Brady. RUN THE BALL!!!!.If I was Fred I'd be pissed. If we run 3 times on that play on the NYG 13, we get a TD or FG, but NO PICK! Awful call. LEt FRED RUN!
San Jose Bills Fan Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Just have to point out that I'm tickled that this topic was started by BeastMode.
PromoTheRobot Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 80 off those 131 yards came on 1 play. The Giants stuffed Fred all game. Stop looking at starts at look at the actual game. PTR
KOKBILLS Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 My thing is Fitz threw an INT on the same go route earlier in the game. He also threw a similar Pass short vs. The Raiders that Donald Jones had to break up to save our chances of winning that game...This is why I put most of the blame on Gailey in this situation...We had a chance to run off some more clock or force the Giants to burn their TO's at the very least...And there are Passes and Pass plays that Fitz throws very well time in and time out...Plus we have that guy named Fred Jackson...Instead he calls this Play that Fitz has a tough time throwing and it's basically an automatic read for Fitz when he gets that Defense...Gailey's got to know his QB a bit more...He HAS to Coach around Fitz's weaknesses and he has for the most part...Plus he's got to know that every second counts when you give ANY Team the Ball back in the 4th Quarter with this Bills Defense...It was a bad throw no question, but it was also poor Game Management and Play Call on the part of our HC... The good news is Gailey is no idiot...And I'm about 100% certain this was a valuable lesson learned...A tough lesson, but one that will help the Bills Win Games down the Road...
John Cocktosten Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 80 off those 131 yards came on 1 play. The Giants stuffed Fred all game. Stop looking at starts at look at the actual game. PTR That being said, it takes one play to pop a long one. Long ones happen when defenses are tired in the 4th. The Giants did that to the Bills. 16 carries is a little low for me. I still like the play call though.
PromoTheRobot Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 That being said, it takes one play to pop a long one. Long ones happen when defenses are tired in the 4th. The Giants did that to the Bills. 16 carries is a little low for me. I still like the play call though. All you are saying is keep doing what isn't working with the hope it might work once. PTR
John Cocktosten Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 My thing is Fitz threw an INT on the same go route earlier in the game. Why go to it agian?? He said all the right things in the presser after the game but still id like to see a slant or a screen to Fred or CJ. He's thrown ints on a lotta different routes. Gotta run your offense.
San-O Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Best case scenario that plays puts us up 7 and puts the game in the hands of our defense (GULP) with 4 minutes to go. We saw the worst case scenario play out. You run the ball there and kill some clock, especially when your QB already threw a pick trying the exact same pass earlier in the game. Bingo. I am starting to think maybe Chan is lacking some situational awareness. + 1
John Cocktosten Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 Just saw the replay of the pick. HORRIBLE MECHANICS ON FITZ'S PART! He threw it off his back foot and appeared to hop as he threw it. He gets so god damn lazy with his mechanics sometimes!
Virgil Posted October 17, 2011 Posted October 17, 2011 I'm sorry, but even if they made the 1st down, I still hate the call. Giving the Giants the ball, down 7, with 4 minutes left and our D means nothing to me. I'd expect to get the ball back, maybe, tied with a few seconds left in the game. With our D, we should have take the clock down as much as possible, still trying to score, but not on a play like that. We were working our way down the field just fine. Time wasn't an issue. That was just a dumb, dumb call.
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