plenzmd1 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) So listening to Steve J on WGR when the question of contract came up..and he said no talks were going on and it looked like they would just ride out the season. Then he said the dreaded"I am a Bill for for this season" and left it at that. Sully had a good line in his column today about being underestimated can motivate, being underpaid can do the opposite.We all know Buddy has said the way to build the team is to draft well and keep your own. Which begs the question of when do you start to look at giving guys new deals. Seems to me the two big ones out there are Steve and Fitz as their deals are up this year. I would think as a player, if I do not have a deal by game 4 or 5..I will take my chances and hit the market..so the time to get these deals done is in the next month. You can franchise one of them..but which one? For my money, I see what Fitz does this first 4 games..and then get something done. I pay him as a second tier QB, right below the top 6 guys( I don't know what that is).I think Fitz knows a big part of his success is working with Gaily..and he will be willing to take a hometown discount to stay. I work on Steve through the year, but use the tag if needed at the end of the year.I don't worry about Freddy, he has two years left. You can redo Freddy next spring..but as much as I love Freddy, he is going to be 31 next year..gotta be smart there. I think losing either of these guys will be very detrimental..and I do think getting them done if possible in season will send the right message after the Lee debacle . Edited September 13, 2011 by plenzmd1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmjoyce113 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The Bills will pay Stevie, I have no doubt in my mind. They will use the franchise tag and sign him to a long term deal. The Fitz situation could get interesting. If he plays well all year and ranks as a top QB he will have a lot of suitors. I think he understands that his success stems partially from Chan and his offense. I think they will be able to work something out. Supposedly "Winning Cures Everything." I think the one thing it will cure is holding a team together. You never see guys leave Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc. If Buffalo continues to win this year and continues to grow as a team players will want to be here. I think that is one good thing we have going for us is this seems to me to be a true team. Obviously money talks, but it's easier to get the money right for a player when they want to be somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 I honestly believe Nix would gladly sign any of these guys to reasonable contracts tomorrow. But what do you do if someone wants money above their value? Cave in? It's easy for us to say "pay the man" but you can unravel a locker room pretty quick if you start overpaying people. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The Bills will pay Stevie, I have no doubt in my mind. They will use the franchise tag and sign him to a long term deal. The Fitz situation could get interesting. If he plays well all year and ranks as a top QB he will have a lot of suitors. I think he understands that his success stems partially from Chan and his offense. I think they will be able to work something out. Supposedly "Winning Cures Everything." I think the one thing it will cure is holding a team together. You never see guys leave Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc. If Buffalo continues to win this year and continues to grow as a team players will want to be here. I think that is one good thing we have going for us is this seems to me to be a true team. Obviously money talks, but it's easier to get the money right for a player when they want to be somewhere. Unless Johnson raises his game to a new level, there is no way they are paying him franchise tag money which for 2011 was anticipated to be 11+ mil. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81e4d644/article/potential-franchisetag-numbers-highlighted-by-increase-for-dts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBD Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) The franchise tag for a QB is over $16M, I don't think you can justify giving that to Fitz. Franchise tag for a WR is around $9.5M, I'm curious if Stevie is asking for more than that right now. Edit, nevermind must have been looking at 2010 numbers. Edited September 13, 2011 by Carey Bender Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The Bills will pay Stevie, I have no doubt in my mind. They will use the franchise tag and sign him to a long term deal. The Fitz situation could get interesting. If he plays well all year and ranks as a top QB he will have a lot of suitors. I think he understands that his success stems partially from Chan and his offense. I think they will be able to work something out. Supposedly "Winning Cures Everything." I think the one thing it will cure is holding a team together. You never see guys leave Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc. If Buffalo continues to win this year and continues to grow as a team players will want to be here. I think that is one good thing we have going for us is this seems to me to be a true team. Obviously money talks, but it's easier to get the money right for a player when they want to be somewhere. I think if they want to keep Johnson, they need to extend him before this season ends. Franchise Tag-I don't see it. Johnson had one good season and has tons of potential, but to pay him in the top 2 or 3 receivers in the league? Did you see Larry Fitzgeralds contract? Do you really think Ralph would come close to that for Stevie, honestly, I wouldn't. He deserves a raise, no doubt, but the 15-17 million a year, no way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phlegm Alley Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 As CMJ said, they can always franchise him and then hammer out a long term deal. If they can do this it would mean they wouldn't have to pay him the average salary of the top 5 at his position. Signing him to a long term deal would give him the guarenteed amount of money, but lower his cap number immediately. Same can be said for Fitz, but I think Fitz's potential extension is directly correlated to the success of this team. If they overachieve and he has a great year, I think he gets the extension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckeyeBill Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) I think the priority here has to be Fitz... he is a smart guy and realizes that he doesn't deserve Brady/Manning/Vick type money. Stevie Johnson I believe may be a bi-product of Fitzpatrick. Don't get me wrong, I believe him to be a very good wide receiver... but he is no where near the level of Larry Fitzgerald or the Johnsons (Andre and Calvin). Sadly, Stevie might think he deserves a similar payday. If that's the case, I would let him test free angency. We have many good young Wide outs, but Ryan Fitzpatrick is better than most give him credit for. Edited September 13, 2011 by BuckeyeBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 As CMJ said, they can always franchise him and then hammer out a long term deal. If they can do this it would mean they wouldn't have to pay him the average salary of the top 5 at his position. Signing him to a long term deal would give him the guarenteed amount of money, but lower his cap number immediately. Same can be said for Fitz, but I think Fitz's potential extension is directly correlated to the success of this team. If they overachieve and he has a great year, I think he gets the extension. But if they franchise him and his agent plays hardball in terms of a new contract and they can't come to an agreement, you end up paying him franchise tag money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) Every body always talks about signing big name FA because we are under the cap & have the space to spend some of that money DON'T WORRY ABOUT THE FA SIGN THESE GUYS we know what they bring to the table !!! All 3 are Bills players !! :thumbsup: I hope they don't dick around and let any of them go , this is the first time the team has had this much up side in quite a while & it won't take much to send it down hill again !! Edited September 13, 2011 by T master Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cincinnati Kid Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 I think they'll definately extend Fitz and Stevie by season's end and I think Fred is third in line. I don't see us playing next season without any one of those three guys. Even if Fred and CJ split more carries as the year wears on, he is still more than deserving of a 3-4 year deal with some good money. I know Fred will be 31 but he is not going to be 31 with 8, 9, or 10 years of NFL running back legs/knees. He has only been getting significant carries for 3 years. He has 3-4 more quality years left in him, if not more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 "we aren't talking" is a good way to say "we don't want a distraction, even if we are talking- I'm not telling the media" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpcolosi Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) A couple of things... 1.) I worried whether Thigpen was brought here to eventually replace Fitz "on the cheap" for the next few years. I think this will play itself out over the season. If Fitz has a similar season to last a 4 year 30-35mil contract is legit. 2.) Stevie rarely talks about loyalty to the Buffalo community and often hints at "taking care of my family." I love Stevie. I think he's exactly what the Bills need at WR. He's a lot like Andre but with better size - great routes, above average speed, charisma, etc. But I think he is like anyone - he wants to get paid his market value. And being a recording guy, he's the type that likely may want to test the market. Oddly, I think it might be TO and Chad 85 that help push him to stay in Buffalo. CJ played for a small market for awhile but still got paid, and TO seemed to thoroughly enjoy his time here. How this plays out will be very interesting... I think he may get a pretty big deal around 5 years at 30-35. 3.) FJ - I think Fred will have to have a monster season or holdout next year to get paid. It's just what it is. The Bills have had him by the balls due to NFL Europre's ridiculous rules. I'd like to see him get a 4 year, 16mil extension. It isn't a big raise, but doubles his current worth through age 35. It's not Kelsay money, but cutting Kelsay at some point will help foot this bill 4.) Wood, Levitre, Byrd will be next up. I think McKelvin will not be coming back to Buffalo once his deal is up. Finally - a few attractive things the Bills will do to try to keep players here - instead of giving a high annual salary, they will give a nice chunk in guarantees, ala the KW deal. Expect a large portion of Fitz and SJ to be guaranteed but low overall. Not paying Lee or Hangartner immediately frees up "cash" for roster bonuses this upcoming season, which is the move Overdorf uses to keep actual cash dished out consistent from year to year. He gets a lot of crap, but Overdorf is good at managing the numbers and has given us the freedom to spend on homegrown guys. It just comes down to saying invest the money into our guys, and I think, I hope, Nix has convinced Ralph this is the route to go. Edited September 13, 2011 by rpcolosi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 It looks like Stevie wants to test the market. We're probably going to have to pay him 9mill +. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 It looks like Stevie wants to test the market. We're probably going to have to pay him 9mill +. Andre Johnson who is arguably the best WR in the game(worst case, he is in the top 3), just signed a new contract in the offseason averaging 10.5 mil a year. Stevie isn't getting anywhere close to 9 mil a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playman Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The Bills will pay Stevie, I have no doubt in my mind. They will use the franchise tag and sign him to a long term deal. The Fitz situation could get interesting. If he plays well all year and ranks as a top QB he will have a lot of suitors. I think he understands that his success stems partially from Chan and his offense. I think they will be able to work something out. Supposedly "Winning Cures Everything." I think the one thing it will cure is holding a team together. You never see guys leave Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc. If Buffalo continues to win this year and continues to grow as a team players will want to be here. I think that is one good thing we have going for us is this seems to me to be a true team. Obviously money talks, but it's easier to get the money right for a player when they want to be somewhere. dont know about that. especially with the pats*. its the core they keep, not everybody. think malloy or merryweather. but with steve and fitz i think they wont even use tags. they redo soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Andre Johnson who is arguably the best WR in the game(worst case, he is in the top 3), just signed a new contract in the offseason averaging 10.5 mil a year. Stevie isn't getting anywhere close to 9 mil a year. Somebody will lure him with that contract. A 4th year receiver likely coming off two productive seasons? Ya someone will pay big money for a proven commodity and the Bills should be that team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 If the Bills can't extend during the season, they'll likely lose players to whatever teams can pay them more. It's the same thing every year, pretty much. We have a hard time keeping talent around because we either run them out of town, or they want to play for a better team with a bigger contract than we can offer. Somebody will lure him with that contract. A 4th year receiver likely coming off two productive seasons? Ya someone will pay big money for a proven commodity and the Bills should be that team Not a chance they will. It's likely they'll let him sign elsewhere and concentrate on developing your cheap guys... until they do develop, and leave to another team... as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Dickie J might be hot commodity after we squeak out a win over Jamarcus Russell this week, somebody get on that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cincinnati Kid Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Dickie J might be hot commodity after we squeak out a win over Jamarcus Russell this week, somebody get on that HIlarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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