billsfreak Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 All I ask is pick a week when Spiller gets forklifted, Fitz sacked with the game on the line......and they lose. The team clicked for 41 points yesterday. 41 POINTS!!!! ON THE ROAD!!! To say Spiller was not part of that is ignorant because a)he was actually on the score sheet, and b) Spiller may actually contribute by just being on the field forcing deeper safeties, etc. And you know what...it's just annoying. The crazy thing is: If Spiller was cut tomorrow and the Bills signed Joique Bell to replace him, there are some on this board who would be ecstatic. Don't squeak just to squeak. Bell is on the Saints, you can't sign him if he is already on another team. I agree. If Jackson needs a blow, then I would prefer to see White in those short yardage situations. Without a doubt. White has some power, Spiller might be able to outrun a cheetah out on the edge, but he probably couldn't run through a wet paper towel up the middle without dancing and being thrown for a loss.
eball Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 I agree, so why does Chan keeping putting him in on short yardage and sending him up the middle, only to lose yards the majority of the time? Because he's looking for the one time the OL provides a crease, and then CJ is gone. You have to run those plays in the hope you hit a home run every once in a while. I don't see Gailey doing that on 3rd and one, however.
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Give him time and carries and he will be fine. Once Freddy gets some injury you al will see it. Spiller will be fine if we run him on passing downs and visa verse.
Homey D. Clown Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Better question: How long before the fans stop with this constant need for a RB whipping boy? Spiller is fine. He will be fine. He got a TD yesterday when he was finally able to do what he does best. Couldn't have been better said. He is an excellent athlete, and everyone knows when he is in the game, he is there to get tome touches. The guy can play, it's just not his time yet, this is not another Maybin situation, Spiller has made plays with the limited amount of time he has gotten.
Kelly the Dog Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 I agree, so why does Chan keeping putting him in on short yardage and sending him up the middle, only to lose yards the majority of the time? On the first carry he had on short yardage, if you watched it, there were four Chiefs in the Bills backfield before Spiller got the ball. It was 2-2. He really had zero chance. I love Fred jackson and he's incredible falling forward, but I very much doubt he would have gotten anymore out of that carry. Later, CJ had another where he was tackled immediately on a 2-1. In that same drive on a 2-1, Freddy was tackled immediately for no gain as well.
Hplarrm Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 My sense is that we need to remember the example of Stevie Johnson. First he had two non-productive years for the Bills before bursting out. Spiller had an even bigger rep so giving up on him even if he is non-productive this year would be pretty stupid. 2. I would like to see Spiller at our #2 WR spot, It would get him the ball in space and he had some good receiving stats in college. We have a need there.
mattsox Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 CJ will improve as his blocks improve. He is Gailey's waterbug. You will see much more from him this season is my guess. Agreed. Thought he had a better showing. Still needs improvement. But was a nice TD run!! Hopefully he'll just get it and become what we all want him to be. A Big Weapon!
xsoldier54 Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 I think anyone would agree, Buddy and Chan have done a pretty good job shaoing this roster into the team they envisioned before they signed up for thier tour of duty at One Bills Drive, however, how long do you think it will take until they cry uncle on the CJ Spiller choice? I don't get where he even fit's their M.O. of what they want their team to look like...he is simply a poor man's Reggie Bush and will never be anything more than this... Sure' he has done infinitely more than the Aaron Mayhem pick, but considernig all of the needs we had/have and the clear vision for a team they have - we missed the mark greatly taking Spiller where we did. I would argue that Chief's second round pick McCluster is more electrifying and is doing what we had expected from Spiller-time.... The only thing that I can see that is preventing Spiller from being more productive is the way he is being utilized. They put him in twice yesterday in second and short situations and had him run straight ahead. That is not his game. He is not a short yardage back or a power back. They need to get him the ball in space by using some counter plays or sweep plays that allow him to get outside where he can use his speed. Line him up in the slot with Fred in the backfield and throw him the ball. They just haven't done enough of this IMO and that is where Spiller's strength lies. Speed doesn't do you any good if there is no space to run in.
NoSaint Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 The only thing that I can see that is preventing Spiller from being more productive is the way he is being utilized. They put him in twice yesterday in second and short situations and had him run straight ahead. That is not his game. He is not a short yardage back or a power back. They need to get him the ball in space by using some counter plays or sweep plays that allow him to get outside where he can use his speed. Line him up in the slot with Fred in the backfield and throw him the ball. They just haven't done enough of this IMO and that is where Spiller's strength lies. Speed doesn't do you any good if there is no space to run in. i agree with the caveat that you have to go in the middle sometimes. he will learn how eventually. it takes time. i know that we want him great yesterday, but it will be ok.
Kelly the Dog Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 The only thing that I can see that is preventing Spiller from being more productive is the way he is being utilized. They put him in twice yesterday in second and short situations and had him run straight ahead. That is not his game. He is not a short yardage back or a power back. They need to get him the ball in space by using some counter plays or sweep plays that allow him to get outside where he can use his speed. Line him up in the slot with Fred in the backfield and throw him the ball. They just haven't done enough of this IMO and that is where Spiller's strength lies. Speed doesn't do you any good if there is no space to run in. True, but 2-1 is an anything down. It's pretty much the best down and distance that you can have. They chose to run him up the middle but they could have easily faked and thrown it to him or anything they wanted. They gave him the ball up the middle on a 2-5 and he broke it outside for a TD. They gave it to him on 1-10 right up the middle on the second drive and he made one nice cut and got 7-8 yards. People may have not given him credit for it because Marv Albert called that Fred Jackson but it was CJ. They threw a one yard pass to him on 2-3 and he made another nice cut and picked up 5 and a first down.
JohnC Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) I'm sure NYBill is going to grow tired of my standard response that CJ will ultimately turn out to be a positive contributor for this team. Spiller has to adjust to the pro game as opposed to the college game where he simply outquicked the defenders. He also has to learn that there is nothing inherently wrong with taking what you can get from the play without requiring to make every play a big play. The one play around the end where he scored showed a glimpse of his speed and potential for the big play. As CJ gets earns more playing time and Chan designs plays for his particular talents the complaining over his lack of productivity will diminish. I urge NYBill and others to exhibit a little more patience. It's still premature to rate last year's draft strategy of taking him as a failure. I'm not suggesting that there isn't a valid argument to using the pick for other needs because a good argument can be made for going in a different direction. My preference would have been to trade down, acquire another pick or so and then draft Bulaga. But that didn't happen. Nix stuck to his board and took a higher rated player. As far as I'm concerned that was a reasonable approach to take. This year, Nix again did not attempt to trade down in the second round when he could have, and instead stuck to his board and took a CB from Texas. I believe he is soon going to be an integral player for our defense. Buddy Nix is not comforgtable trading down in the draft and acquiring additional picks. He has stated that in general his philosophy is to to take the best player when your turn comes up and don't try to outsmart yourself by maneuvering around. He is more of a checker player than a chess player when it comes to the draft. All anyone can judge him on is the caliber of his picks. It's still a little early to fairly judge him on his two years of drafting. But so far I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt and not make too early of a judgment. 33 Edited September 12, 2011 by JohnC
xsoldier54 Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 True, but 2-1 is an anything down. It's pretty much the best down and distance that you can have. They chose to run him up the middle but they could have easily faked and thrown it to him or anything they wanted. They gave him the ball up the middle on a 2-5 and he broke it outside for a TD. They gave it to him on 1-10 right up the middle on the second drive and he made one nice cut and got 7-8 yards. People may have not given him credit for it because Marv Albert called that Fred Jackson but it was CJ. They threw a one yard pass to him on 2-3 and he made another nice cut and picked up 5 and a first down. I believe we are in violent agreement. If there is a hole or if they can get him the ball in space, I think we both agree he can be productive. Where he falters is in those situations where power is required instead of speed and finesse. He just isn't very good at that type of run.
Billzfan23 Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 I just don't think Spiller's recognition of the kind of run that is required is quite there yet. He sees each handoff as an opportunity to break one, rather than just a chance to move the chains (especially in short yardage)... These plays are designed for a specific hole, it's not zone blocking in short yardage. I'd love to see him cut back when the DT blows up the primary hole, but instead he hesitates and dances. I think Chan will start faking the handoff to him in those spread sets and then dump it to him in the middle before the season is out, he had great hands in college.
truth on hold Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 No defenses are changing their schemes around our back up running back. Real surprise there. My post was in response to the preceding one that claimed defenses keep safeties deeper when spiller's on the field. Read much?
John from Riverside Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 Its funny how different people see different things....I actually see a improving spiller....he had the TD and he had a couple of runs where he hit it up the middle decently...... BUT I really scratch my head when I see him on a 3rd and 1.....he is NOT that type of back unless he is being used as a decoy..... Still to early to make a judgement on Spiller.
Coach Tuesday Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 The only thing that I can see that is preventing Spiller from being more productive is the way he is being utilized. They put him in twice yesterday in second and short situations and had him run straight ahead. That is not his game. He is not a short yardage back or a power back. They need to get him the ball in space by using some counter plays or sweep plays that allow him to get outside where he can use his speed. Line him up in the slot with Fred in the backfield and throw him the ball. They just haven't done enough of this IMO and that is where Spiller's strength lies. Speed doesn't do you any good if there is no space to run in. The problem is that they haven't built their offensive line for those types of plays. There is a reason you don't see too many sweeps being called - Urbik ("Jerry Crafts Light") and Pears would collide and trip over each other while trying to kick outside. This is not a finesse line. I've wondered about that since the Spiller selection, as his skills don't seem to fit what Gailey has built up front.
truth on hold Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) Its funny how different people see different things....I actually see a improving spiller....he had the TD and he had a couple of runs where he hit it up the middle decently...... BUT I really scratch my head when I see him on a 3rd and 1.....he is NOT that type of back unless he is being used as a decoy..... Still to early to make a judgement on Spiller. My fear is they've given up on his ability turn a run outside the tackles and receiving skills out of the backfield so they're desperately trying to turn him into something he's not. Edited September 12, 2011 by Joe_the_6_pack
Kelly the Dog Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 My fear is they've given up on his ability turn a run outside the tackles and receiving skills out of the backfield so they're desperately trying to turn him into something he's not. He started the second drive of the game/season. They ran him on 1-10 for 7 yards and then threw to him on 2-3 for a first down. Part of the reason he wasn't more involved in this game, IMO, was that Freddy was playing so well, and most everything was working. Same reason that Roscoe and Smith weren't given more touches.
JPS Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 No defenses are changing their schemes to stop spiller. Why would they ? Hasn't shown he can do anything special. You are a DC. Freddy splits out wide. You send a linebacker out to cover him. Spiller comes in. Splits out wide. You comfortable in the same coverage? I don't see Bart Scott running with Spiller. He changes the defense and there's value in that. That's all I'm saying.
please stop the pain Posted September 12, 2011 Posted September 12, 2011 So far, spiller is NOT doing particularly well. He has not been finding the holes and struggles moving forward following contact. The idea that we should compare him to other backs as equal after we remove their longer runs is frankly moronic. He appears to me to be hesitant and spends more time dancing than committing to the run. I was giving up all hope when he did produce the TD run. Gave me hope. Way too early to identify as a bust, but seriously what has he shown so far? He did average 4.5 in the preseason..... I really don't think Freddie loses any sleep hearing footsteps
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