John Cocktosten Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 I re-ran every defensive play from the first quarter last night. Kelsay did seal the edge, did get into the backfield, did force plays inside. No, he didn't get sacks or make spectacular plays. But he did his job well, and helped make it possible for Williams, Dareus, and Merriman to make such plays. Did you watch the first defensive play of the game? Reverse comes to Kelsay and where is he? Squeezing the play inside instead of keeping contain. Seriously, get some glasses.
BillsFan74 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Would he be a better fit as an ILB in the 3/4?
NaPolian8693 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 ya, that reverse totally broke contain and went for huge yardage bro!
DaGimp Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 The best fit for him would be to retire and go fishing with aaron schobel
Thoner7 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 (edited) I'm beginning to think the peoe that start Kelsey sucks threads don't truly understand football. You do know you can "make a play" without making the tackle right? Yea I know that very well. The thing is, Kelsay never makes the play without making a tackle. He is the one over pursuing, he is the one not drawing a double team, he is the one who cannot contain a play. These have been his problems since the day he was drafted. All that said his second half of last season was by far and away the best he has ever played. He was actually OK last night too. He almost had a good pressure but got pancaked before getting there on Merrimans 2nd sack. He was easily pushed past the QB on Merrimans first sack too. he was handled fairly easily by a rookie from Wisconsin. If no one else noticed Kelsay played with his hand down last night. I dont think I saw him stand up once. From how we were aligned, I still think he had the responsibilities of a LB though. After seeing Carrington play with the twos, and a few plays where he was standing up, I think Carrington is Kelsays replacement, unless we go to a more traditional 34. Edited August 14, 2011 by Thoner7
DrDawkinstein Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Im about as supportive and optimistic as fans come. I long supported Kelsay the entire time he was playing opposite Schobel. Thought he did ok at 4-3 DE... Over the past 2-3 seasons, Kelsay has done everything in his power to prove me wrong, and nothing to show he is even just "ok". He's horrible. Cant rush the passer. Cant stop the run. Always out of position. Not holding the edge (FIRST series last night). Cant tackle in space. He's just a complete liability out there. It truly pains me to say that about a player who has bought into the Buffalo community and has been a "good soldier" during these years of losing. But facts are facts, and the fact is, he doesnt belong on the field. Not at least on a defense that is moving forward with players like Dareus, Merriman, Barnett who are intense, ferocious AND make plays. He and Maybin need to be cut. I agree that a llot of things said about Evans can be applied to Kelsay, the problem is NO ONE wants to trade for Kelsay, so we're going to have to release him. And the sooner the better. Sorry Chris, you've been a good guy, but this team has to move on...
Thoner7 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Did you watch the first defensive play of the game? Reverse comes to Kelsay and where is he? Squeezing the play inside instead of keeping contain. Seriously, get some glasses. I'm not sure what you mean, but squeezing the play inside is keeping contain.
26TrapDraw Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Why do so many people here hate Kelsay? He isn't a great player, but he does work extremely hard and give it everything he has. He doesn't get in trouble off the field and doesn't seem like an arrogant a** , as far as I can tell without knowing him. It seems like he ought to be well regarded by fans, but he sure is some folks' favorite whipping boy. He isn't a great player...stop right there. This is whats wrong with the Bills we have too many of these and at a position like the one Kelsey mans where he regularly gets beat by RB's and TE's in coverage like he stole something, we need to get better...period
DrDawkinstein Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 He isn't a great player...stop right there. This is whats wrong with the Bills we have too many of these and at a position like the one Kelsey mans where he regularly gets beat by RB's and TE's in coverage like he stole something, we need to get better...period Exactly! The time for those excuses are over. Maaaybe for a rookie, but Kelsay is a 10 year vet. We know what we have and he's only going to get worse, not better.
NaPolian8693 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 (edited) Droolers ITT Kelsay struggled to adjust to the 3-4 last year, no doubt. He was awkward out in space. It was an experimental process. Towards the end of the year he looked better. Last night he looked fine. He's not going to be some highlight reel guy, but he did a fine job out there. As someone else pointed out he spent his time with a hand in the dirt, so the coaches perhaps will utilize his strengths a bit more this year. Everyone hopes Carrington is the future. But the reality is Kelsay is still holding him off for the job. If you want him cut, you are honestly embarrassing yourself by saying so. It would be ideal if Carrington developed into a good player and Kelsay then became a solid reserve - but why cut him now? That makes absolutely no sense. He can help this season, perhaps a transition will be made to Carrington and perhaps it won't, and things can be reevaluated in the offseason. Edited August 14, 2011 by NaPolian8693
BobChalmers Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 The best fit for him would be to retire and go fishing with aaron schobel Troll, right?
DrDawkinstein Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 Is rather have Carrington in there, learning as he goes, than Kelsay on the downside of his career. Carrington is on his way up. Kelsay is on his way out. Make the move now, imo.
John Cocktosten Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 (edited) I'm not sure what you mean, but squeezing the play inside is keeping contain. No it's not. Kelsay's first job is find the ball and if he reads that the play is going away from him, he "squeezes" the play inside and has cutback and backside pursuit. The "squeeze" comes from closing the gap in the cutback lanes. Contain is when the play is coming at you and your job is to turn the play back up inside where you have help. Kelsay read the play as if the play was going away and the reverse ran right past him. This is something that Kelsay does quite often so I can see how you are confused. Edited August 14, 2011 by John Cocktosten
Dr. K Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 But facts are facts, and the fact is, he doesnt belong on the field. Not at least on a defense that is moving forward with players like Dareus, Merriman, Barnett who are intense, ferocious AND make plays. I like Barnett, but did you see him on the first series where Cutler scrambled for ten yards? There was great pressure on the play, and Barnett had an open lane to Cutler in the backfield, but he whiffed on him completely and Cutler went by him up the middle. On that play Kelsay held his side and forced Cutler inside. I'd be pleased to see someone better than Kelsay take his job, and I'm confident that when one of the younger players steps up (Carrington?) that will happen. Gailey won't hesitate to get rid of someone if he has somebody better. I'm no knee-jerk Kelsay fan, but I'm tired of the drumbeat.
DrDawkinstein Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 No it's not. Kelsay's first job is find the ball and if he reads that the play is going away from him, he "squeezes" the play inside and has cutback and backside pursuit. The "squeeze" comes from closing the gap in the cutback lanes. Contain is when the play is coming at you and your job is to turn the play back up inside where you have help. Kelsay read the play as if the play was going away and the reverse ran right past him. This is something that Kelsay does quite often so I can see how you are confused. I get what you're saying now, and yes agree. But the way you originally wrote it was a bit confusing...
NaPolian8693 Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 No it's not. Kelsay's first job is find the ball and if he reads that the play is going away from him, he "squeezes" the play inside and has cutback and backside pursuit. The "squeeze" comes from closing the gap in the cutback lanes. Contain is when the play is coming at you and your job is to turn the play back up inside where you have help. Kelsay read the play as if the play was going away and the reverse ran right past him. This is something that Kelsay does quite often so I can see how you are confused. How many yards did the reverse gain? If the play went completely away from help, why do you think it was unsuccessful? You are trying to take one play that the defense stuffed, and use that as your argument to say that Kelsay played poorly in that game? Nice logic. Is rather have Carrington in there, learning as he goes, than Kelsay on the downside of his career. Carrington is on his way up. Kelsay is on his way out. Make the move now, imo. ro·ta·tion [roh-tey-shuhn] noun
DrDawkinstein Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 I like Barnett, but did you see him on the first series where Cutler scrambled for ten yards? There was great pressure on the play, and Barnett had an open lane to Cutler in the backfield, but he whiffed on him completely and Cutler went by him up the middle. On that play Kelsay held his side and forced Cutler inside. I'd be pleased to see someone better than Kelsay take his job, and I'm confident that when one of the younger players steps up (Carrington?) that will happen. Gailey won't hesitate to get rid of someone if he has somebody better. I'm no knee-jerk Kelsay fan, but I'm tired of the drumbeat. As Im typing this, they are showing the game highlights on ESPN and I just re-wound that play. Kelsay comes off the edge and gets SHOVED outside by the OT. By then Cutler is already scrambling and decides to go up the middle for 10 yards. Kelsay was completely ineffective that play other than being just a body in a spot. Cutler was ALREADY going up the middle because he read we blitzed our ILB. Kelsay did not "contain". Sorry, Im not giving Kelsay credit for doing nothing just because the play went away from him. I reeeally dont want to hate on him, believe me. But he does nothing well. Its that simple.
marsadale Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 As a defensive end he is awful. Playing outside linebacker he is worse. No speed, no power. I haven't seen him make a play since he has been here. watch the highlights from last nites game and see Kelsay drive the guy trying to block him up into Cutlers lap. He set the edge exactly like hes supposed to. I havent seen a Kelsay basher do **** since Ive been watching Bills football.
Bob in STL Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 How/why is he still on the team? If you have to ask than either you are not watching or you don't know what you are watching. I did not see him make any mistakes last night. Every coach he has ever had says he is solid and plays the defense he is instructed to play. He does not look good as a LB, especially in coverage but he did not ask to play there either. As a DE on the line of scrimmage he is decent. He lined up on the line with Dareus inside on those key passing downs and he did his job. Football is a team sport. Calm down and assume that Nix, Gailey, Edwards and Wannestadt know a little bit more about football than you do?
Dr. K Posted August 14, 2011 Posted August 14, 2011 As Im typing this, they are showing the game highlights on ESPN and I just re-wound that play. Kelsay comes off the edge and gets SHOVED outside by the OT. By then Cutler is already scrambling and decides to go up the middle for 10 yards. Kelsay was completely ineffective that play other than being just a body in a spot. Cutler was ALREADY going up the middle because he read we blitzed our ILB. Kelsay did not "contain". Sorry, Im not giving Kelsay credit for doing nothing just because the play went away from him. I reeeally dont want to hate on him, believe me. But he does nothing well. Its that simple. My point on that play was not that Kelsay did anything great, but that BARNETT completely whiffed in the backfield. Look at it again. It was Barnett's play to make or not make, and he didn't make it.
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