Dear Mr. Brandon, Instead of coming down on the fans.

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

Are you sure of this? Not one stadium in America has a designated smoking area? This would make RWS the very last stadium to do so. I rather doubt this.

I think he means in the seating area; not do they have a designated smoking area.

 

This link confirms that no NFL stadium allows smoking in the seating areas and about half of them have designated smoking areas, and it seems like most are outside the facility.

[thebandit27]

Are you sure of this? Not one stadium in America has a designated smoking area? This would make RWS the very last stadium to do so. I rather doubt this.

 

I was also curious about this...here's what I found:

 

http://www.no-smoke.org/pdf/smokingpoliciesNFLstadiums.pdf

 

It looks like the places that allow smoking anywhere inside the stadium are Baltimore, Denver, Houston, Jacksonville, KC, Miami, New England, Tampa Bay, Tennessee, and Washington.

 

10 out of 32 teams.

[Mr. WEO]

I was also curious about this...here's what I found:

 

http://www.no-smoke.org/pdf/smokingpoliciesNFLstadiums.pdf

 

It looks like the places that allow smoking anywhere inside the stadium are Baltimore, Denver, Houston, Jacksonville, KC, Miami, New England, Tampa Bay, Tennessee, and Washington.

 

10 out of 32 teams.

Actually, none of your listed stadiums "allow smoking anywhere inside the stadium", per your link. All ban smoking in seating areas.

[JohnC]

This is an unfair comment imo. Many here are incensed by the changes wrt the lots, but in favor of the smoking ban. Are you going to take them to task as you did OC?

 

I was responding to the smoking issue and not the parking issue. Whether you agree or disagree with the smoking ban is not the point. It is not an unreasonable rule. If a person objects to the rule and openly breaks that particular rule then I have an issue with the person flaunting the rules. Picking or choosing to abide by whatever rule one wants is what I am being critical of. If you are directed to park in a certain area by the team's employees and you decline to obey their directions I will certainly be critical of your actions.

 

I have parked in Lot 1 for the last 17 years and am not affected by these changes. But, I sympathise with those who are. I think that they are being victimized, squeezed and villianized. Tailgates by themselves are not money producers. Brandon would much rather sell you a 12 dollar beer than have you enjoy one of your own.

 

Whenever there is a change in policy for whatever reason not everyone is going to be satisfied with the change. It is impossible to please everyone. I'm sure you and the people you associate with at the tailgate parties are very responsible. Not everyone is. From what I have read the level of drinking and intoxication has gotten out of hand and has spilled over into the stadium. The league is trying to get a grip on that problem.

 

 

 

Jmo, but I see a danger in a smug jackass like Brandon costing WNY their franchise. He is taking some of the fun out of the game day experience, and this means a lot to fans.

You see, this team sucks. And, I am talking long term. Yet fans like me still attend games for 17 consecutive years. It's great to get together with friends and have a beer in the lot. At the rate we are going, this will be a thing of the past.

 

Brandon should be fired for this mess, and his role in the way that the team is simply awful.

 

Russ Brandon works for Ralph Wilson. The owner is very pleased with his performance. Brandon has little to do with whether the team stays in the region. It has all to do with the owner.

 

I don't live in western NY any longer. But if I did or had the ability to attend the games, even from a distance, I wouldn't. I choose not to financially support this particular owner. I do have DirecTV so indirectily I do provide some support. But that is the extent of my investment. I used to regularly buy Bills' paraphernalia. As long as Ralph is the owner I won't do so.

 

You see, this team sucks. And, I am talking long term.

 

Evidently the owner isn't very much bothered by the long term state of affairs as much as you are. I absolutely agree with you that this franchise is in a sad state of affairs. How can anyone not come to the same conclusion that you have? I don't believe that there is going to be major changes until there is a new owner.

 

To end on a positive note I do believe that if the owner allows Nix to operate without much interference, he will, in time, improve the prospects of the team. It's not that I see Nix making dramatic changes so much as I do see him making solid football decisions that will ultimately work out well. From my vantage I see a direction that didn't exist before. That in itself is a positive.

Edited August 11, 2011 by JohnC

[JohnC]

Actually, none of your listed stadiums "allow smoking anywhere inside the stadium", per your link. All ban smoking in seating areas.

 

Thanks for that clarification. So far I don't have to retract my "no smoking" comment. I'm very much relieved. LOL

[mattsox]

Win some f'ing games, tool.

 

Instead of f'ing about trying to harass smokers, and inevitably failing in your efforts....win some f'ing games. Your 3 Neon Nazis aren't going to stop a pack of 80 people from smoking, ever. People will be less likely to go out and smoke, or even think about it, if they don't want to miss the, winning, action on the field.

Instead of f'ing about trying to stop people from drinking so much, and inevitably failing in your efforts...win some f'ing games. People will be much less likely to hit the concession stand for that final beer that sends them over the edge, if they don't want to miss the, winning, action on the field. Hell, people won't even drink that much before the game, because they won't want to miss what happens.

Instead of f'ing about with parking and everything else that simply wasn't a problem when we were winning games....focus on job #1! Win some f'ing games!

 

I'll make this as simple as I can so that people in marketing, like you, can understand it. There is absolutely no way in hell you are ever going to get people to stop:

drinking

smoking when they drink

chasing women(without boyfriends mind you)

swearing

harassing(good natured mind you) opposing fans

because this is Buffalo, and that's how we roll. When I was 10 my grandfather was tailgating in the parking lot, handing out cherry bounce shots to whoever would cheer when he said "Go Bills", and giving the Jets fans crap about drafting Ken O'Brien instead of Marino. Nobody was getting arrested, there wasn't a problem. What's the only difference here? Back then we would win some f'ing games!

 

The fans are going to do these things, as we always have, and you will FAIL by placing your focus on us. You will WIN the second you realize that winning makes us do all of those things LESS! Wake the f up and realize it really is that simple. You can blow coming down on the fans, and accepting exactly 0 of the blame for the last 10 years, right out your ass.

 

This is your problem far and away more than it is the fans. You need to take demonstrable steps to correct your own bad behavior before you start talking about anyone else.

 

 

Yes!!! This is all win.

 

These changes suck. Basically this is what they're saying.

 

Give me YOUR money to come see our Piece of **** football team lose week in and out. You can't smoke, or drink. And I'll tell you where to park. When you can come and when to leave. Enjoy, thank you...

 

This is all a bunch of nonsense. Let freedom ring for godsake!!!!

[Bill from NYC]

Yes!!! This is all win.

 

These changes suck. Basically this is what they're saying.

 

Give me YOUR money to come see our Piece of **** football team lose week in and out. You can't smoke, or drink. And I'll tell you where to park. When you can come and when to leave. Enjoy, thank you...

 

This is all a bunch of nonsense. Let freedom ring for godsake!!!!

 

[DrDawkinstein]

Lots of people talking like spoiled brats in here.

[thebandit27]

Actually, none of your listed stadiums "allow smoking anywhere inside the stadium", per your link. All ban smoking in seating areas.

 

I meant inside the stadium gates, not in the seating area

 

Lots of people talking like spoiled brats in here.

 

You noticed that too, huh?

 

Yes!!! This is all win.

 

These changes suck. Basically this is what they're saying.

 

Give me YOUR money to come see our Piece of **** football team lose week in and out. You can't smoke, or drink. And I'll tell you where to park. When you can come and when to leave. Enjoy, thank you...

 

This is all a bunch of nonsense. Let freedom ring for godsake!!!!

 

Wait, they don't sell beer and outlawed tailgating?

 

I hadn't seen that...or are you using hyperbole?

[Astrobot]

I don't smoke but the tailgating restriction are very concerning. I have had season tickets for 12 years now & every year I get a little less motivated to actually go to the games. When we first started with tickets, we had 12 guys & our whole week revolved around the games. Years gone by & guys dropped. Some guys got sick of the losing, some guys got married & their wives gave them tough times about going & they just did not feel like having to deal with it & 2 of the guys moved away. We are down to 4 guys now. The games are not what they used but they are still fun & I still enjoy being out at the stadium. With the NFL Ticket & High Def TVs & such I am starting to question with all these restriction why I should even make an effort to go to the games anymore. Last year even with Season Tickets I only wnet into the stadium 3 times. 2 times I went to the tailgate & when it was 1 I had my wife pick me up & watched the games at home.

I hope that football is never played in a studio rather than a stadium.

[K-9]

So, if the Bills go 19-0 then everybody is happy with the new smoking and parking policies?

 

If they end up with a losing record then the new smoking and parking policies are a problem?

 

Interesting.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[DrDawkinstein]

So, if the Bills go 19-0 then everybody is happy with the new smoking and parking policies?

 

If they end up with a losing record then the new smoking and parking policies are a problem?

 

Interesting.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

 

The "logic" in this thread is astounding, isnt it?

[Jauronimo]

I briefly scanned the thread and it seems that Russ Brandon has hired glow in the dark fascists to enforce major restrictions on our genitals and how they may be displayed in dining establishments. And we can't smoke in the stadium. Is that about right?

[Captain Caveman]

I briefly scanned the thread and it seems that Russ Brandon has hired glow in the dark fascists to enforce major restrictions on our genitals and how they may be displayed in dining establishments. And we can't smoke in the stadium. Is that about right?

 

Precisely.

[pkwwjd]

I'm definitely with Biscuit on this one.

 

As for your "reality" statements, here's a counterpoint or two:

 

1) The revised fact is that now nobody is permitted to smoke within the stadium. Additionally, if the same 10s of thousands of people cannot attend a game without smoking, then they do not have to go. Nobody is forcing them to. As I said in the uber-long thread when the policy was first announced, when I was a pack-a-day smoker, I still didn't smoke at games. It just wasn't that big a deal to go 4 hours without a cigarette. Also, it definitely is an issue that's within everyone's scope of concern. Certain people are bothered by cigarette smoke, and it is undeniably a health issue, so I beg to differ with your assertion in that regard.

 

2) If this is the predominant mentality of the majority of fans, then the policy is absolutely necessary. The whole "spit in the face of authority just for the sake of it" sentiment is juvenile at best, destructive at worst, and--in my opinion--should be discouraged fervently.

 

Lastly, I would submit to you that it is the "legions" that need to work on their acceptance of the reality that if they smoke, they can (and likely will) be removed from the game. That's a fact. No offense intended here, just realize that thumping your chest with the "screw the man" rhetoric doesn't change that reality.

 

Winning games won't stop people from being self-destructive; they either will or they won't. The threat of losing the privelage (not right) to watch a live game, however, might encourage a change.

+1

Thank you for a simple and true response containing no attacks on someone who is already riled up ...

 

And to the ones who think that things like wanting to smoke more is a result of not winning ... watch an old Bills highlight reel and you'll see PLENTY of people smoking right in the stands ... even during the glory years.

[Vinny4sum]

I am trying to see if I understand this thread so here it goes:

 

blue collar fan = rowdy drunken fan

white collar fan = polite tennis like fan..looks like that class warfare strategy is working very well!

 

And we should have no rules and when there are rules we do not like we should ignore them and have a small civil riot.

 

I have been a season tick holder for 22 years, got my own seats when I turned 21 and this thread is why I can no longer attend games. When the buttheads finally invaded my section I could not enjoy the experience at all.

 

It's funny how we have multiple threads about the Bills leaving, but ultimately we will kill this team ourselves by forcing away fans that yes want a winner, but also don't want to be puked on.

[OCinBuffalo]

I am trying to see if I understand this thread so here it goes:

 

blue collar fan = rowdy drunken fan

white collar fan = polite tennis like fan..looks like that class warfare strategy is working very well!

 

And we should have no rules and when there are rules we do not like we should ignore them and have a small civil riot.

 

I have been a season tick holder for 22 years, got my own seats when I turned 21 and this thread is why I can no longer attend games. When the buttheads finally invaded my section I could not enjoy the experience at all.

 

It's funny how we have multiple threads about the Bills leaving, but ultimately we will kill this team ourselves by forcing away fans that yes want a winner, but also don't want to be puked on.

Who said anything about class warfare having anything to do with it? One of the biggest battle royales I have seen was in the club seats started by a supposedly well-off guy and his buddies.

 

Again, here is wisdom: never give an order you know won't be followed. I know, and, unless you are psychologically committed to anit-smoking, you know, that 10ks of people smoke at the game. You expect them all to listen to you, when they don't even listen to the "designated smoking area" rule?

 

This is not about anarchy, this is about common sense. Moreover, if the Bills win some f'ing games, more people will be watching, and less smoking. Again, common sense.

 

I am sure the "buttheads"....not the Bills "losing", is the only reason you cancelled. Hmmmm.

 

EDIT:

1. Somebody is hacking up this thread...and it isn't me. Mods.

2. I can't believe I have to explain to anyone the difference in the group dynamics and mindset of 70k people with the expectation of "hey we have a chance, should be a good game" vs. "we have no chance, and that A-hole Pats fan, who doesn't even know what happened to them in 1985, won't shut up...."

Edited August 15, 2011 by OCinBuffalo

[benderbender]

I love that a "tool" is a guy making 6 figures to work for a pro sports team. What does that make the person criticizing them on a message board?

 

Here's a thought: why don't you stop killing yourself for 6 hours or so? Is it really that hard? I couldn't care less that people want to give themselves cancer, but stop freaking crying about it. They banned smoking in NYC parks and guess what? You can walk without seeing cigarette buds everywhere. The public shouldn't suffer because you can't control your "cravings." Stop whining.

 

Alcohol is responsible for more deaths than tobacco but nobody is slapping beers out of your hand and telling you its for your own good

[Hammered a Lot]

county owns/runs stadium & parking

The Bills run the parking.

[pkwwjd]

Who said anything about class warfare having anything to do with it? One of the biggest battle royales I have seen was in the club seats started by a supposedly well-off guy and his buddies.

 

Again, here is wisdom: never give an order you know won't be followed. I know, and, unless you are psychologically committed to anit-smoking, you know, that 10ks of people smoke at the game. You expect them all to listen to you, when they don't even listen to the "designated smoking area" rule?

 

This is not about anarchy, this is about common sense. Moreover, if the Bills win some f'ing games, more people will be watching, and less smoking. Again, common sense.

 

I am sure the "buttheads"....not the Bills "losing", is the only reason you cancelled. Hmmmm.

 

EDIT:

1. Somebody is hacking up this thread...and it isn't me. Mods.

2. I can't believe I have to explain to anyone the difference in the group dynamics and mindset of 70k people with the expectation of "hey we have a chance, should be a good game" vs. "we have no chance, and that A-hole Pats fan, who doesn't even know what happened to them in 1985, won't shut up...."

I can't believe that we needed someone to produce a link for how many stadiums allow smoking for proof of that statement, but no one to this point has asked OC to backup his claim of 10s of thousands that smoke at each game. Does anyone reallybelieve that 1 in 7 smoke at every game? OC, you are making up a number to bolster you case ... A number that is absurdly high. I only bring it up because you continue to use it in your argument. It really isn't 10,000s of people who are thumbing their nose at the prohibition of smoking in the stands. It is a small handful. There's not even 10,000s of people who smoke in the stadium if you include the designated smoking areas along with those smoking in the stands. It's not even 1,000s ... More like a few hundred. Or I could use OC's method of determining a number and declare that there is no one smoking at a game ... But that would be incorrect and obvious to anyone who pays attention at a game.

Edited August 15, 2011 by pkwwjd