Temper your expectations on Smith...

[DreReed83]

I'm looking back at Brad Smith highlights from his days against the Jets and I notice one thing. The Jet's offensive line is GOOD. The holes they opened for him were pretty mindblowing and gave him time to do whatever he wanted to do. If we're going to have that kinda success with him, then our offensive line better step up. If not, then this was another waste of a FA pickup.

[starrymessenger]

I still expect him to be a playmaker, but the lack of a RT will detract from our O in many ways. Still think they should have made Clabo an offer harder for him to refuse.

[saundena]

That just means he'll be good when we address our O line AFTER NEXT SEASON

[reddogblitz]

You just now noticed the Jets have a good OLine? Their OLine has been good for years and years. We should take a lesson from that, but we don't.

[RuntheDamnBall]

I still expect him to be a playmaker, but the lack of a RT will detract from our O in many ways. Still think they should have made Clabo an offer harder for him to refuse.

We really have no proof that they didn't offer Clabo more or equal money. I'm sure that returning to the NFC's top seed in 2010 and sticking with a system he knew was a pretty easy sell.

 

Unless the Bills wanted to blow the Falcons out of the water - and for what, another 2, 3 million more than Atlanta would have paid? - I think it's far more likely Clabo was using the Bills for leverage. Even in overpaying you have to have some kind of budget, and I know that we laugh about how cheap Ralph is, but paying $7MM or more for a right tackle is a really bad precedent, especially for this team. I guess they could have looked at more frontloaded/guaranteed money, but it's a moot point right now.

[starrymessenger]

We really have no proof that they didn't offer Clabo more or equal money. I'm sure that returning to the NFC's top seed in 2010 and sticking with a system he knew was a pretty easy sell.

 

Unless the Bills wanted to blow the Falcons out of the water - and for what, another 2, 3 million more than Atlanta would have paid? - I think it's far more likely Clabo was using the Bills for leverage. Even in overpaying you have to have some kind of budget, and I know that we laugh about how cheap Ralph is, but paying $7MM or more for a right tackle is a really bad precedent, especially for this team. I guess they could have looked at more frontloaded/guaranteed money, but it's a moot point right now.

Of course the terms of the offer are unknown and Clabo is a Falcon so agree by definition you might say its moot. Except we stil have a glaring hole at RT. No question Clabo wanted to stay in Atlanta and we would have had to "overpay" to secure his services. One report that makes sense to me is that the money was not far apart. The issue was duration of the contract. Falcons initially offered three, Clabo wanted five, which we were prepared to do. Eventually Atlanta chined up and that was the end of it.

Our interior O line, even after Woods injury and rehab, should start coming together this year. With a very nasty 6'6" 330 lb probowler anchoring the right side my expectation would have been that by mid season (barring injury) we would probably have had a good O-line by NFL standards. I can't see that happening now. Means, amongst other bad things (including to the running game), that we can't open up the playbook as much for plays that take more time to develop and makes us more predictable. After Fitz took over from Edwards last year and had some success NFL defences started to adjust to him with greater success. Thats what NFL defences do and thats why rookie QBs who have some success initially tend to struggle as sophomores. Even when Chan went to schemes that enabled Fitz to get rid of the ball quickly, we still ranked 20th in pass pro - not great.

We gave Walker 25MM. Clabo is twice the tackle Walker was, so we could have offered him half again as much money, which we could afford besides.

They must think the world of Hairston. Hope they are right.

[RuntheDamnBall]

Of course the terms of the offer are unknown and Clabo is a Falcon so agree by definition you might say its moot. Except we stil have a glaring hole at RT. No question Clabo wanted to stay in Atlanta and we would have had to "overpay" to secure his services. One report that makes sense to me is that the money was not far apart. The issue was duration of the contract. Falcons initially offered three, Clabo wanted five, which we were prepared to do. Eventually Atlanta chined up and that was the end of it.

Our interior O line, even after Woods injury and rehab, should start coming together this year. With a very nasty 6'6" 330 lb probowler anchoring the right side my expectation would have been that by mid season (barring injury) we would probably have had a good O-line by NFL standards. I can't see that happening now. Means, amongst other bad things (including to the running game), that we can't open up the playbook as much for plays that take more time to develop and makes us more predictable. After Fitz took over from Edwards last year and had some success NFL defences started to adjust to him with greater success. Thats what NFL defences do and thats why rookie QBs who have some success initially tend to struggle as sophomores. Even when Chan went to schemes that enabled Fitz to get rid of the ball quickly, we still ranked 20th in pass pro - not great.

We gave Walker 25MM. Clabo is twice the tackle Walker was, so we could have offered him half again as much money, which we could afford besides.

They must think the world of Hairston. Hope they are right.

I like a lot of your post, I'm not sure I agree with the suggestion that because we made a giant mistake with Walker in paying him double his value (and probably the same with C Green), that it rationalizes another questionable decision.

[starrymessenger]

I like a lot of your post, I'm not sure I agree with the suggestion that because we made a giant mistake with Walker in paying him double his value (and probably the same with C Green), that it rationalizes another questionable decision.

Clabo, IMO is the real deal. And if you consider what he might have done for our O thats what I thought made "overpaying" a rational decision in this case. But who knows. Had we upped the ante Atlanta might well have followed suit and he did want to stay there. I can't blame the Bills for not getting into an ugly bidding war, especially when given the player's sentiments, we were at a disadvantage. Buddy is not the kind of gut who would do that and neither is Ralph. Arguably Clabo is more valuable to Atlanta in keeping Matty Ice upright and road grading for Turner.

[DreReed83]

You just now noticed the Jets have a good OLine? Their OLine has been good for years and years. We should take a lesson from that, but we don't.

 

Yea. I JUST noticed it. This very second. Living 10 minutes away from the Meadowlands I've NEVER seen a Jets or Giants game.

 

The reason I say this now is because I don't see him succeeding with this line. Especially when these plays require u to run outside a lot, with Bell and whoever starts at RT? Bell is still an average tackle. I don't like him at all.

Edited August 9, 2011 by DreReed83

[It's in My Blood]

Clabo, IMO is the real deal. And if you consider what he might have done for our O thats what I thought made "overpaying" a rational decision in this case. But who knows. Had we upped the ante Atlanta might well have followed suit and he did want to stay there. I can't blame the Bills for not getting into an ugly bidding war, especially when given the player's sentiments, we were at a disadvantage. Buddy is not the kind of gut who would do that and neither is Ralph. Arguably Clabo is more valuable to Atlanta in keeping Matty Ice upright and road grading for Turner.

 

I think you might be over-valuing Clabo somewhat. Is he an average RT, yes, above-average, maybe not. He has had one solid pro bowl worthy year and the fact of the matter is that the Atlanta Falcons feel that they are on the brink of a Superbowl appearence and losing a piece of your offensive line when you feel you are that close to a championship could be devestating, especially with a RT free agent market as weak as 2011. Clabo was never going to sign here. Atlanta knew it, Clabo knew it, and alot of teams knew it. We threw our best offer out there, crossing our fingers that Clabo just might sign here. The Bills were nothing more than leverage.

 

I would've loved it if Clabo signed with us, but he didn't and the sky isn't falling because of it. Is Clabo better than what we have on our roster as of today? Yes. However, I wouldn't say that the prospects that we do have on our team right now do not have the potential to be as good or better than Clabo.

[Doc]

Yea. I JUST noticed it. This very second. Living 10 minutes away from the Meadowlands I've NEVER seen a Jets or Giants game.

 

The reason I say this now is because I don't see him succeeding with this line. Especially when these plays require u to run outside a lot, with Bell and whoever starts at RT? Bell is still an average tackle. I don't like him at all.

Opinion duly noted. However the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

 

As for Clabo, without knowing exactly what the Bills offered, you can't fault them for not trying hard enough. From all accounts, Clabo wasn't looking to break the bank and just wanted a decent payday to stay in Atlanta.

[starrymessenger]

I think you might be over-valuing Clabo somewhat. Is he an average RT, yes, above-average, maybe not. He has had one solid pro bowl worthy year and the fact of the matter is that the Atlanta Falcons feel that they are on the brink of a Superbowl appearence and losing a piece of your offensive line when you feel you are that close to a championship could be devestating, especially with a RT free agent market as weak as 2011. Clabo was never going to sign here. Atlanta knew it, Clabo knew it, and alot of teams knew it. We threw our best offer out there, crossing our fingers that Clabo just might sign here. The Bills were nothing more than leverage.

 

I would've loved it if Clabo signed with us, but he didn't and the sky isn't falling because of it. Is Clabo better than what we have on our roster as of today? Yes. However, I wouldn't say that the prospects that we do have on our team right now do not have the potential to be as good or better than Clabo.

I'm not saying the Bills necessarily mishandled this. Without actually knowing of course, I tend to think that if Atlanta had not caved and offered him the 5 years he wanted he would have come here. I don't blame the Bills for avoiding a bidding war.

I don't think I am overrating Clabo. Hes a legitimate probowl RT in the prime of his career (meaning I expect him to be a multiple probowler before he is done) as well as an outstanding individual and teammate. He is absolutely a top run blocking tackle and he is above average in pass pro. He has started every game since being designated the starter three years ago. Unlike you, when I look around I don't see anything remotely resembling this on the horizon here. Given the talent in our interior O-line it would have instantly gone from a weakness to a strength, or at the very least bona fide respectability by NFL standards. Would have done wonders for our O overall IMO.

[DefenseWins]

Opinion duly noted. However the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

 

As for Clabo, without knowing exactly what the Bills offered, you can't fault them for not trying hard enough. From all accounts, Clabo wasn't looking to break the bank and just wanted a decent payday to stay in Atlanta.

 

 

The trouble with that argument is that if Nix knows RT is a weakness why didn't he make offers SIMULTANEOUSLY to the top 4 OT's available (I liked Yanda who can play G/T supposedly, as well as Doug Free from Dallas - Pick your 4th best Willie Colon?) The 1st one that signed would automatically cancel our offers to the other three... Buddy instead allowed himself to be played... The Four offers wouldn't necessarily be for the same amount of money or years but only the 1st guy who agrees gets the money...)one of them would've taken the money...

[Doc]

The trouble with that argument is that if Nix knows RT is a weakness why didn't he make offers SIMULTANEOUSLY to the top 4 OT's available (I liked Yanda who can play G/T supposedly, as well as Doug Free from Dallas - Pick your 4th best Willie Colon?) The 1st one that signed would automatically cancel our offers to the other three... Buddy instead allowed himself to be played... The Four offers wouldn't necessarily be for the same amount of money or years but only the 1st guy who agrees gets the money...)one of them would've taken the money...

Colon missed all of 2010 with a torn Achilles. Free is a LT and got paid $8M/year. Forget about both of them. As for Yanda, he got a deal averaging $6.4M/year. Like Clabo, he wasn't probably wasn't going to leave unless he was paid significantly more than that, which would have made him the highest-paid RT in the league, without ever having even made a Pro Bowl.

[RealityCheck]

I'm looking back at Brad Smith highlights from his days against the Jets and I notice one thing. The Jet's offensive line is GOOD. The holes they opened for him were pretty mindblowing and gave him time to do whatever he wanted to do. If we're going to have that kinda success with him, then our offensive line better step up. If not, then this was another waste of a FA pickup.

You are a master of the obvious. Congradulations.

[Cash]

Yea. I JUST noticed it. This very second. Living 10 minutes away from the Meadowlands I've NEVER seen a Jets or Giants game.

 

The reason I say this now is because I don't see him succeeding with this line. Especially when these plays require u to run outside a lot, with Bell and whoever starts at RT? Bell is still an average tackle. I don't like him at all.

 

Thank you. It seems like the RT spot was so bad last year that it somehow gave the LT spot a free pass. Demetrius Bell has exactly zero quality seasons in his career. Yes he's young, yes he's raw, yes he's had some injuries, but it's not he's a former Pro Bowler that we're expecting to return to form. And even if he does step up and play really well (fingers crossed), what happens if/when he gets hurt again? The Ed Wang Show? The Cordaro Howard experience? And when did the immortal Kraig Urbik become a rock-solid starter? Face it, our line has a lot more questions than answers right now, and not just at RT. I feel like we're solid at LG & C, and that's about it.

 

On the bright side, we're slowly inching back towards being able to draft an OT high. 5th round a couple years ago, 4th round last year... we should expect a stud OT in the 2014 draft.

[Thoner7]

He is just going to be another gimmick/return/slot reciever guy. We have 3 or 4 of those now. N need to temper any expectations as I wasnt really expecting anything.

 

Now if only we had 3-4 new OLman to block for those gimmick players....

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I think you might be over-valuing Clabo somewhat. Is he an average RT, yes, above-average, maybe not. He has had one solid pro bowl worthy year and the fact of the matter is that the Atlanta Falcons feel that they are on the brink of a Superbowl appearence and losing a piece of your offensive line when you feel you are that close to a championship could be devestating, especially with a RT free agent market as weak as 2011. Clabo was never going to sign here. Atlanta knew it, Clabo knew it, and alot of teams knew it. We threw our best offer out there, crossing our fingers that Clabo just might sign here. The Bills were nothing more than leverage.

 

I would've loved it if Clabo signed with us, but he didn't and the sky isn't falling because of it. Is Clabo better than what we have on our roster as of today? Yes. However, I wouldn't say that the prospects that we do have on our team right now do not have the potential to be as good or better than Clabo.

I agree with you a bit more than with Starry on this one.

 

Clabo was undrafted, and played for 4 teams before making the Pro Bowl as an injury replacement (for Jason Peters) at the age of 29.

 

Don't get me wrong. I loved the thought of him here and posted that desire back in February.

 

I LOVE Jon Runyan/Kevin Gogan type maulers who are mean, nasty, and physical.

 

Clabo is an outstanding run blocker.

 

However I'd heard that he's pretty average in pass pro and this is certainly believable because if you are a superior pass-blocking tackle, you usually end up on the left side.

 

It makes more sense that he's a classic push the pile right tackle but this is only my impression of him.

 

One thing is for certain, there was not much of a market for Clabo's services… although in fairness, the free agent market was pretty underwhelming this year (it was a buyers market).

 

 

[Malazan]

I am totally on board with this. They should have offered Clabo money equal to what Peyton will get

[bowery4]

I am hoping that we STILL are not done working on that line, there are cut downs that will make some talent available and we can raid more teams PSs again this year. It actually goes along good with the "building through the draft" as Nix pointed out when they picked up Urbik last year he was like a free draft choice. I am not entirely sold on him as I thought Rhinehart was better but the Bills have faith.