mjt328 Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 A year ago, the "experts" said that Tim Tebow was a long-term project that would take YEARS to even get on the field. They said he had to completely re-tool his throwing motion. But he learned enough to end up starting the last three games of the season during his rookie year. In those three games, he had 8 touchdowns and 4 turnovers. The Broncos averaged 25 points a game during that stretch, including those against two of the top passing defenses in the league - San Diego and Oakland. Not bad for a guy that people doubted would ever be good enough to actually PLAY under center his first year. Now was this a spectacular performance. No. But it proved that Tebow was making significant progress during his rookie season. More progress than other first rounders like Jamarcus Russell, Brady Quinn, Matt Leinart, Aaron Rodgers, JP Losman, Jason Campbell, Alex Smith did in their first seasons. A lot more progress than his critics are willing to admit. If Tebow did this for the Bills, he would be the talk of the town. It's no surprise that Kyle Orton give the Broncos the best chance to win now, and of course, the players are going to support the guy who gives them the best chance to win now. Orton had a really good season last year, but fans know that he has likely hit his ceiling. They want to see what Tebow can do.
Jauronimo Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 WTF are you even talking about? We should be patient with second year QBs in Denver, who need time to develop. But second year RBs, head coaches and GM's in our very own market are afforded no such luxury. I believe San Jose was commenting on the dichotomy in views I mentioned above.
dave mcbride Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 I don't necessarily disagree with you. I don't think he's gonna be that great either. But didn't he throw for 300 yards against Houston? I think J.P. Losman did that once in his entire career and Trent Edwards never did it. For a rookie, that's not too bad. And Losman did it against ... Houston. Edwards threw for 279 against Oakland and for 273 yards against a dreadful KC defense in 2008, which goes to show that weak QBs can have career days against bad teams. I wouldn't put too much stock in a number like that.
DrDawkinstein Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 And Losman did it against ... Houston. Edwards threw for 279 against Oakland and for 273 yards against a dreadful KC defense in 2008, which goes to show that weak QBs can have career days against bad teams. I wouldn't put too much stock in a number like that. Neither Losman nor Edwards had people saying that "they'd never amount to anything more than an H-back in the NFL". People want to make these grand negative statements about Tebow, and he's so far proven them wrong every single time. His game, as a whole, is still coming along. But I think he's already proven that most of his pre-draft detractors were wrong. Obviously, he still needs to work on his motion and prove he can do it consistently. But he is already much farther along than most of the haters expected.
eball Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 Michael Lombardi of NFL Network is now reporting in his blog that Tebow may not even be in Denver's plans, after being given every indication before the lockout he would be the starter. This is so odd. Not an auspicious start for Elway and Fox.
Zulu Cthulhu Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 Whether you believe he'll improve or not, Denver would be foolish to cut ties and trade him away. Unless they want a full on fan rebellion on their hands.
mob16151 Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 Whether you believe he'll improve or not, Denver would be foolish to cut ties and trade him away. Unless they want a full on fan rebellion on their hands. If an NFL front office is making moves just to please the fans, then they've already failed.
Alaska Darin Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 88 TDs to only 16 Ints, 66.4 comp% and 10k yards at UF. I assure you that he can throw the ball.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 (edited) Wow. Watching you, Dick Drawn, and Harvey Lives being so patient and eloquent in your defense of something you like is touching. WTF are you even talking about? I'll spell it out for you then. You personally have regularly criticized some young Bills players such as CJ Spiller and Steve Johnson. You've also criticized guys that are new to their jobs such as Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey. But you think we should all withhold judgement on Tim Tebow. Is that clear enough for you because I can make it clearer if necessary? Edited August 5, 2011 by San Jose Bills Fan
eball Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 I'll spell it out for you then. You personally have regularly criticized some young Bills players such as CJ Spiller and Steve Johnson. You've also criticized guys that are new to their jobs such as Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey. But you think we should all withhold judgement on Tim Tebow. Is that clear enough for you because I can make it clearer if necessary? San Jose, what you fail to understand is that Ralph is cheap.
Zulu Cthulhu Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 Totally agree with San Jose and that's the issue I tried to express earlier - the problem isn't Tebow himself. At the end of the day he's just another guy with marginal pro QB skills trying to make a living in the NFL. The problem i have is with his fanatic supporters who seem to be multiplying like rabbits and are all insistent that the guy can do no wrong. These people jump to call CJ Spiller (for example) a gigantic bust after one season. But the same slack you are so eager to yank away from guys like Spiller you are eager to lend to a guy like Tebow, simply because you're in love with the IDEA of Tebow, not the actual player. His image, fostered in large part by his very public Christianity, makes his supporters swoon. It's a double standard of the highest degree. His supporters are eager to cite predictions from "experts" about Tebow's long term viability in the NFL, and that's fine. But those experts, even ones like Mike Mayock, are wrong as often as they are right. I'm interested in the present. Presently, Tebow is playing like a third string quarterback, and a bad one to boot. I'm not saying he won't improve, but I'm certainly not saying he will either.
Jim in Anchorage Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 Totally agree with San Jose and that's the issue I tried to express earlier - the problem isn't Tebow himself. At the end of the day he's just another guy with marginal pro QB skills trying to make a living in the NFL. The problem i have is with his fanatic supporters who seem to be multiplying like rabbits and are all insistent that the guy can do no wrong. These people jump to call CJ Spiller (for example) a gigantic bust after one season. But the same slack you are so eager to yank away from guys like Spiller you are eager to lend to a guy like Tebow, simply because you're in love with the IDEA of Tebow, not the actual player. His image, fostered in large part by his very public Christianity, makes his supporters swoon. It's a double standard of the highest degree. His supporters are eager to cite predictions from "experts" about Tebow's long term viability in the NFL, and that's fine. But those experts, even ones like Mike Mayock, are wrong as often as they are right. I'm interested in the present. Presently, Tebow is playing like a third string quarterback, and a bad one to boot. I'm not saying he won't improve, but I'm certainly not saying he will either. Learning curve RB a LOT different then QB.
Zulu Cthulhu Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 Learning curve RB a LOT different then QB. You're right it is Jim and for that reason Spiller isn't the best example. I would say though that the one aspect of the RB position that is difficult to transition from college to the NFL is pass protection and Gailey has said that Spiller's pass protection was one area that needed work last season. That may have been one reason why Spiller did not receive much playing time.
John Cocktosten Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 He was drafted as a project. He never played under center and had to change his throwing motion after he was drafted. Mid season in his rookie year he loses his coach and changes systems in the off season with no OTA's or coaching contact. Then an 8 year vet who played very well last year is playing better than him 3 days into camp. What am I missing here? Aaron Rodgers, super bowl MVP and one of the best QBs in the NFL, sat and watched for 3 FULL years until he started a season. He had exactly 1 TD and 1 INT through 3 his first 3 years. But a QB who is the all time leader in rushing td's in the SEC is supposed be ready? Makes sense.
SteamRoller67 Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 I think the whole fascination with Tebow is based more on his personality rather than on his potential to actually progress to the next level. Most of the coverage before the draft emphasized his "speed" and "leadership" qualities, and the fact that he was a "winner". But most of the evaluations by real NFL scouts indicated that he wouldn't be able to make the transition. I'm not saying he won't, but there have been a lot of guys that have been through the NFL with the same kind of athletic abilities but couldn't take the next step. I hope he makes it, but so far it doesn't look good. Not at 6'3" 245 pounds there wasn't... He's a freakish athlete playing QB with linebacker size, speed, strength and toughness. So his throwing motion isn't polished, it's too slow and he sails some passes. He's a bulldozer and had 6 rushing TD's in limited duty last year. I think he could be a more athletic version of David Garrard at his best. People who can see further than the front of their nose can see the potential in this guy. He'll never be Peyton Manning or any other "true" pocket passer, but who the hell cares? If he wins and the team is successful, stats are irrelevant. Sounds awful familiar to Buffalo's previous love affair with Doug Flutie, does it not?
yungmack Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 Of all the problems Tebow has (so well documented here, there and everywhere), the biggest one is his horrendous inaccuracy as a passer. Anything over a few yards and it's hold your breath time. I like Tebow well enough as a person but like most rational people around here and elsewhere, I thought his chances of transitioning to a prototypical NFL QB were slim to none, and that he shouldn't have been picked probably higher than the 4th round. There's one hell of a difference between being a big bullmoose running QB in college, where the quality of the rosters is so much lower than in the NFL, and operating in an environment where even the worst player on D was probably one of the better players in his college conference. I think he was better suited for the sort of hybrid player Brad Smith is, if he's suited for the NFL at all. That said, even his most ardent supporters coming out of college said he needed two or three years of serious and patient mentoring before he'd be ready for the pros. So #3 back-up is exactly where he belongs while he learns. Unfortunately, the new regime in Denver seems unwilling to do that any longer. I wish the kid well but things don't look so promising for him just now.
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