Sully: Bills need OT

[Turbosrrgood]

The grand irony here is that I find as much fault with Sully's alleged analysis and poor (in my humble opinion) writing style that ironically I thought this was one of his better pieces.

 

I guess mostly this is because the best of Sully is not that high of a standard.

 

Well it's tough to go wrong when you are stating the obvious, lol...The Bill's 0-line is weak...Surprise news of the year...

[jcbillsfan]

Read the article , sounds like somebody at 2 bills drive kicked sand in sully's face. Not sure what else could have been done They went hard for Clabo , Colon was never leaving pittsburgh. In reality they signed Merriamn, barnett, thigpen, brad smith and kept florence .As for Poz they were the worst run d in the history of the world last year with him . They will get by at right tackle with what they have providing something doesnt shake lose , but this upcoming draft is loaded with tackles . The list of holes is strating to get smaller and smaller .

[Scrappy]

So what available OT do you propose we sign? It's easy to B word and moan without offering any realistic solutions.

 

I still like Gaither if he can pass a physical with a 2 year incentive laden contract based on games played.

 

League minimum for passing a physical Guaranteed

$1,000,000 for 3 games played

$3,000,000 for 12 games played

$5,000,000 for 16 games played

 

If he plays in 12 games or more, he automatically gets a $5 Million second year guaranteed with a Bills option for another year (for a total of 3 years) at the same value.

 

This whole scenario does several things, it creates a potential for talented depth at some point during this season, especially if someone gets hurt (which is almost assured with no other training during the off-season). It also forces Gaither to not play the oh my back hurts coach / I can't play thing & there is a better than average chance that Gaither could be rotated in to help keep our opponents off track. The guy is 340 lbs & only 25 years old, one would think he has something left in the tank here. As long as it's based on playing time, it's a decent bet. He could also help the other OT's on our team gain his experience, which is sorely needed (Wang comes to mind). So, there is one solution.

Edited August 2, 2011 by Scrappy

[mannc]

[quote/ He's in his second year at the helm and I for one believe he's doing all the right things. For those of you who still don't get it, we have to start over with him. Give this football man and the outstanding staff he's put together some time to build this team.

What's your evidence for this statement? The scatback he drafted with our no. 1 pick last year, or the d-back he took this year with the second pick? How much production did we get out of last year's entire rookie class? The point of the article is that, for whatever reason, once again the Bills will be going into the season with huge question marks ( at best) at crucial spots on the O-line. It does not bode well.

[Fingon]

What's your evidence for this statement? The scatback he drafted with our no. 1 pick last year, or the d-back he took this year with the second pick? How much production did we get out of last year's entire rookie class? The point of the article is that, for whatever reason, once again the Bills will be going into the season with huge question marks ( at best) at crucial spots on the O-line. It does not bode well.

You mean Aaron Williams? The best player in camp so far?

[nucci]

I still like Gaither if he can pass a physical with a 2 year incentive laden contract based on games played.

 

League minimum for passing a physical Guaranteed

$1,000,000 for 3 games played

$3,000,000 for 12 games played

$5,000,000 for 16 games played

 

If he plays in 12 games or more, he automatically gets a $5 Million second year guaranteed with a Bills option for another year (for a total of 3 years) at the same value.

 

This whole scenario does several things, it creates a potential for talented depth at some point during this season, especially if someone gets hurt (which is almost assured with no other training during the off-season). It also forces Gaither to not play the oh my back hurts coach / I can't play thing & there is a better than average chance that Gaither could be rotated in to help keep our opponents off track. The guy is 340 lbs & only 25 years old, one would think he has something left in the tank here. As long as it's based on playing time, it's a decent bet. He could also help the other OT's on our team gain his experience, which is sorely needed (Wang comes to mind). So, there is one solution.

I agree but it seems he can't pass one and if he could he would be in more demand than he is. While he seems to be a great talent he has too many injury issues to take a chance. He might be one of the guys that plays one game, misses two.....

[White Linen]

What's your evidence for this statement? The scatback he drafted with our no. 1 pick last year, or the d-back he took this year with the second pick? How much production did we get out of last year's entire rookie class? The point of the article is that, for whatever reason, once again the Bills will be going into the season with huge question marks ( at best) at crucial spots on the O-line. It does not bode well.

 

You want evidence from me to make my point, while you bring up a rookies production and mention a guy who hasn't played yet? Yawn.

[hondo in seattle]

Ralph has owned the Bills for 50 years. In the old days, they won the AFL championship a couple times with high priced players (before the merger and Super Bowl). The Bills of the 90s (Kelly, Smith, Thomas, Reed, et al) were hardly underpaid. Sully's Ralph-is-cheap mantra is 'proven' by the fact that the Bills have been under-cap for the past 3 years (about 6% of the Bills history). Like most any team, the Bills spending has gone up and down over the years.

 

Ralph's biggest shortcoming has been with GMs. He's hired some bad ones and chased some good ones away. Our problem right now in 2011 isn't that Ralph is cheap. I think the Bills would happily sign a good tackle at market price if that was an option.

[Scrappy]

I agree but it seems he can't pass one and if he could he would be in more demand than he is. While he seems to be a great talent he has too many injury issues to take a chance. He might be one of the guys that plays one game, misses two.....

 

Henceforth, the incentives to keep him on the field. I personally think that with a proper medical evaluation & training, he might be able to overcome because of his age. If he was 30 YO I can see this being a problem but he is only 25.

Edited August 2, 2011 by Scrappy

[PromoTheRobot]

Ralph has owned the Bills for 50 years. In the old days, they won the AFL championship a couple times with high priced players (before the merger and Super Bowl). The Bills of the 90s (Kelly, Smith, Thomas, Reed, et al) were hardly underpaid. Sully's Ralph-is-cheap mantra is 'proven' by the fact that the Bills have been under-cap for the past 3 years (about 6% of the Bills history). Like most any team, the Bills spending has gone up and down over the years.

 

Ralph's biggest shortcoming has been with GMs. He's hired some bad ones and chased some good ones away. Our problem right now in 2011 isn't that Ralph is cheap. I think the Bills would happily sign a good tackle at market price if that was an option.

Exactly...

 

Ralph hires poorly and because of that has a team that no one wants to play for, in a city with a less than stellar reputation. While he doesn't spend like Terry Pegula, it's not like he's never spent any money ever. The "Ralph is cheap" crowd just need their mantra. Who cares if it's inaccurate? Facts make their brains hurt anyway.

 

PTR

[TheMadCap]

I hear you. I saw the article linked on the home page, clicked on it and saw "Jerry Sullivan," and immediately closed it.

 

Really? You can't tell a Jerry Sullivan article by its title alone? I play a game every Monday morning by trying to guess which article is Sully's just by the byline on TBD. I get it right nearly 90% of the time...

[Scrappy]

Really? You can't tell a Jerry Sullivan article by its title alone? I play a game every Monday morning by trying to guess which article is Sully's just by the byline on TBD. I get it right nearly 90% of the time...

 

Gorn pic is really tight & all of us are near 90% for article titles.

[ACor58]

Buffalo News not spending like a winner

 

By acor58

News Sports Reporter

[Lurker]

The "Ralph is cheap" crowd just need their mantra.

Sadly, it should always have been "Ralph is clueless" rather than "cheap."

 

His inability to hire GMs from outside the organization has been the one constant in the 50 years. Polian and Butler were guys he lucked into rather than ones he targeted and brought into the organization to increase the talent mix. The good news is that Nix falls into the same category, so I remain optimistic that Buddy's 3-year plan will work out.

[Coach Tuesday]

The biggest problem with the article is that it confuses two separate points:

 

1) Ralph is cheap etc.

 

2) OBD has failed to build the offensive line

 

Point (1) is debatable and Sully does a poor job of backing up his argument - as others have pointed out, he doesn't bother to list anyone out there that the Bills should go spend money on.

 

Point (2) is the real meat of the article but unfortunately Sullivan doesn't know how to articulate what is actually his stronger point. He's right that the offensive line is sub-par and has been for some time. What he SHOULD have done was write about how the Bills have perplexingly avoided using first and second day picks on tackles. It's a no-brainer to many of us that Bulaga would've been a better pick than Spiller because then they wouldn't be scrambling to try to overpay a guy like Clabo. Or Veldheer instead of Byrd, etc. etc. There are lots of quality young tackles out there that the Bills have passed over in the first few rounds (including under Nix) in order to take skill guys.

[Scrappy]

The biggest problem with the article is that it confuses two separate points:

 

1) Ralph is cheap etc.

 

2) OBD has failed to build the offensive line

 

Point (1) is debatable and Sully does a poor job of backing up his argument - as others have pointed out, he doesn't bother to list anyone out there that the Bills should go spend money on.

 

Point (2) is the real meat of the article but unfortunately Sullivan doesn't know how to articulate what is actually his stronger point. He's right that the offensive line is sub-par and has been for some time. What he SHOULD have done was write about how the Bills have perplexingly avoided using first and second day picks on tackles. It's a no-brainer to many of us that Bulaga would've been a better pick than Spiller because then they wouldn't be scrambling to try to overpay a guy like Clabo. Or Veldheer instead of Byrd, etc. etc. There are lots of quality young tackles out there that the Bills have passed over in the first few rounds (including under Nix) in order to take skill guys.

 

This is an excellent review of the article & the reason for my title, Sully shorted a true point of concern for the Bills today (Bills need OT).

[PromoTheRobot]

What's ironic is that WGR is run pretty cheap,. If they were a first class operation they would have local sports talk middays and evenings and all weekend instead of running generic network talk from ESPN. WGR is cheap.

 

PTR

[Captain Caveman]

I still like Gaither if he can pass a physical with a 2 year incentive laden contract based on games played.

 

League minimum for passing a physical Guaranteed

$1,000,000 for 3 games played

$3,000,000 for 12 games played

$5,000,000 for 16 games played

 

If he plays in 12 games or more, he automatically gets a $5 Million second year guaranteed with a Bills option for another year (for a total of 3 years) at the same value.

 

This whole scenario does several things, it creates a potential for talented depth at some point during this season, especially if someone gets hurt (which is almost assured with no other training during the off-season). It also forces Gaither to not play the oh my back hurts coach / I can't play thing & there is a better than average chance that Gaither could be rotated in to help keep our opponents off track. The guy is 340 lbs & only 25 years old, one would think he has something left in the tank here. As long as it's based on playing time, it's a decent bet. He could also help the other OT's on our team gain his experience, which is sorely needed (Wang comes to mind). So, there is one solution.

 

It's an idea. Seems like a lot of assumptions:

 

1. That he could pass a physical. He did not play at all in 2010, and also missed the last 5 games of 2009. If he still failed his physical with the Raiders, it leads me to believe he probably is not going to pass our physical either, and may have some permanent damage. (Notice that no other teams have shown any interest since he failed his physical with the Raiders.)

 

2. Assuming he passes his physical, how much of an improvement will a guy who hasn't played football in a year and a half due to a back injury (and who by all accounts still seems to have some issues with his back) be over our existing lineman? I would imagine that back injury may have limited his workout routine.

 

3. That he'd be willing to agree to this kind of salary arrangement. Maybe he would. I don't know.

 

I would think that if the Bills (or any other team) thought he had any chance of passing his physical, and agreeing to this type of contract, he would have had some more interviews by now. There's at least 15 other teams out there who like like some help at tackle too.

Edited August 2, 2011 by Captain Caveman

[mannc]

The biggest problem with the article is that it confuses two separate points:

 

1) Ralph is cheap etc.

 

2) OBD has failed to build the offensive line

 

Point (1) is debatable and Sully does a poor job of backing up his argument - as others have pointed out, he doesn't bother to list anyone out there that the Bills should go spend money on.

 

Point (2) is the real meat of the article but unfortunately Sullivan doesn't know how to articulate what is actually his stronger point. He's right that the offensive line is sub-par and has been for some time. What he SHOULD have done was write about how the Bills have perplexingly avoided using first and second day picks on tackles. It's a no-brainer to many of us that Bulaga would've been a better pick than Spiller because then they wouldn't be scrambling to try to overpay a guy like Clabo. Or Veldheer instead of Byrd, etc. etc. There are lots of quality young tackles out there that the Bills have passed over in the first few rounds (including under Nix) in order to take skill guys.

 

Absolutely! And there is no evidence whatsoever to believe that Nix and Co. will do any better job than Donahoe, Levy, Modrak, et al at addressing this problem. In fact, the evidence is to the contrary. Although obviously it's too early to write off Spiller, it's safe to say that 9th overhall was way too early to pick a 3d down back--or any running back for that matter--especially for a team with such a crying need at both Offensive Tackles. In fact the 2010 draft class as a whole is looking very shakey right now.

[White Linen]

The biggest problem with the article is that it confuses two separate points:

 

1) Ralph is cheap etc.

 

2) OBD has failed to build the offensive line

 

Point (1) is debatable and Sully does a poor job of backing up his argument - as others have pointed out, he doesn't bother to list anyone out there that the Bills should go spend money on.

 

Point (2) is the real meat of the article but unfortunately Sullivan doesn't know how to articulate what is actually his stronger point. He's right that the offensive line is sub-par and has been for some time. What he SHOULD have done was write about how the Bills have perplexingly avoided using first and second day picks on tackles. It's a no-brainer to many of us that Bulaga would've been a better pick than Spiller because then they wouldn't be scrambling to try to overpay a guy like Clabo. Or Veldheer instead of Byrd, etc. etc. There are lots of quality young tackles out there that the Bills have passed over in the first few rounds (including under Nix) in order to take skill guys.

 

 

I largely agree with most of what you've written, except the premise. I'm sorry I just don't think the o line is that bad and I don't think they've failed to build it. They like Bell, Levitre and Wood are cornerstones, and I think Urbik is the front runner with Rinehart having an opportunity to unseat him, and there's a hole at RT that needs to obviously be filled within or a veteran brought it. But I think we are building the O-line.

 

Let's not forget Nix had to build both lines when he got here. I think the D-line is about to get real good, real soon. If the only thing we have left is Right Tackle and o-line depth. I'd say cheers to Ralph for letting Buddy get it done.