Enough is enough!!!

[MikeSpeed]

I'm not sure it is even possible to build a team completely through the draft. The numbers just don't add up.

I'm not a stat guy, and I don't have hard core facts to back all this up, so I theorizing quit a bit.

Lets say a team needs 3 probowl quality players, 10 very good players and 9 quality starters.

Free agency now starts after a players forth year, so a team needs to be built in that time span. (We have a hard time re-signing our best players)

So in that 4 years you would have to hit on 75% of your first round draft choices believing that they will be the probowl quality players.

Assuming that rounds 2 and 3 will bring the very good players 2 rounds x 4 years that's 8 add the one missed first rounder for 9 and a possible lower round surprize to get to 10.

That leaves rounds 4,5,6, & 7 plus UDFA to make up the other 9 starters. 4 x 4 = 16 add 2 for the surprize UDFA that gives 18. We need 9 out of the 18 that's 50%.

 

Summary:

A team would need to hit on...

75% of its first rounders.

100% of its 2 and 3 rounders.

and 50% of its low rounders and UDFAs.

 

This does not include quality depth and ST personel.

 

I know that the number can be mixed at different consistancy but it still seems highly unlikely all these dominos will fall correctly. Looking at the Bills track record it's down right impossible. The nice thing is we do have some quality starters and 1 for sure probowl quality player (Williams). The real key is re-signing our best players when their contracts are up.

 

I hope this make some sense to someone other than me.

Edited July 26, 2011 by MikeSpeed

[Jauronimo]

I can't tell you how upset I am that the lockout meant missing four months worth of these threads.

I love these threads. Its always interesting to see what non-event will set off the next inmate in this asylum to go crazy and try to rally the others into boycotts, protests, making meat helmets, buying a time share or multi-level marketing or some such crap. These threads always present good opportunities to get in some nice one-liners and have a hearty laugh at the expense of others.

[Chandler#81]

I love these threads. Its always interesting to see what non-event will set off the next inmate in this asylum to go crazy and try to rally the others into boycotts, protests, making meat helmets, buying a time share or multi-level marketing or some such crap. These threads always present good opportunities to get in some nice one-liners and have a hearty laugh at the expense of others.

 

That's the spirit!

[RyanC883]

Between being a Pirates and Bills fan I can't take this cheap ass approach to "building a team" anymore Sure, the Pirates are having a good year because Hurdle is getting every bit of talent out of his players, but will management spend the money to add a bat, NO. The Bills, likewise, could be a suprise team this year, but will they spend the money to get a good FA that could put them over the top....NO.

[Wagon Circler]

I like Nix's philosophy of building the core of the franchise through the draft. BUT when you say you want to supplement through free agency you have to actually supplement through free agency.

 

If you brought in Cullen Jenkin and Nick Barnett to help the front 7 how would that hurt the team? If you spent big on Zack Miller who would he be taking snaps away from?

 

You can only do so much for a team with drafts. Buddy Nix needs to learn the meaning of the word supplement. Supplementing would be bringing in just 2-3 starters in free agency and some depth. Doing nothing would hurt the team as not everyone on the depth chart is worthy of taking NFL snaps.

Well said. A tight end, offensive tackle who are quality starters would be nice. we have some holes on the roster you could drive a truck through.

[Glory Bound]

Between being a Pirates and Bills fan I can't take this cheap ass approach to "building a team" anymore Sure, the Pirates are having a good year because Hurdle is getting every bit of talent out of his players, but will management spend the money to add a bat, NO. The Bills, likewise, could be a suprise team this year, but will they spend the money to get a good FA that could put them over the top....NO.

Yeah...stupid Green Bay Packers...idiot cheeseheads with their cheap @$$ approach to buiding a team....morons!

Edited July 26, 2011 by Enuf-is-Enuf

[John from Riverside]

Actually yes if a player IS producing then he IS good enough to keep because you cannot be all pro at every position.

 

Its the philosphy of....if x amount of guys do their job and x amount of guys are NOT doing their job then replace the cant hack its and see if you win.....

 

You want to know why solid teams like the Packers and Steelers do this? Because it works while teams like the Redskins have been right there picking with us at the top of the draft every year.

 

Its called biulding a solid sure foundation....and it works.

 

Do you want to know why you should not be complaining about this? Because there are plenty of positions on this team where they HAVE NOT been doing their jobs......

[Green Lightning]

I like Nix's philosophy of building the core of the franchise through the draft. BUT when you say you want to supplement through free agency you have to actually supplement through free agency.

 

If you brought in Cullen Jenkin and Nick Barnett to help the front 7 how would that hurt the team? If you spent big on Zack Miller who would he be taking snaps away from?

 

You can only do so much for a team with drafts. Buddy Nix needs to learn the meaning of the word supplement. Supplementing would be bringing in just 2-3 starters in free agency and some depth. Doing nothing would hurt the team as not everyone on the depth chart is worthy of taking NFL snaps.

 

I think this is correct. I'm behind Buddy's building philosophy 100%. But you cannot just ignore a chance through FA to fill a major hole on your team. To break the bank on the "so called" top 10 FA's may not make sense. Don't tell me there it's only a choice between signing a player the caliber of a Nnamdi Asomugha or signing another stiff like Cornell Green. Don't tell me there's no area for this team to bring in one or two solid starters to improve this team. Making a splash for me would be to find a decent starting RT, maybe a safety or ILB and just for crazies...a TE.

[Lurker]

I can't tell you how upset I am that the lockout meant missing four months worth of these threads.

 

All that free time was a real Godsend...

[Defend Greece]

I just read the latest from Buddy...Though I am a fan, his latest installment of philosophy cramming has pushed me over the edge! When are we, as fans, going to demand better from this franchise!? Why do we force ourselves to get excited year after year for the mediocrity that has become synonomous with the Buffalo Bills!?

 

I understand that a team should be built through the draft...really, I do! But you must suppliment the draft by other means to be successful...um, like...FREE AGENCY and TRADES! We have one of the most successful franchises in the NFL right in our back yard, *NE. Year after year, we see that franchise jockey for position in the draft, pick up a key FA, and not hesitate to pull the trigger on a trade. Yet all we hear from Nix is "we're not gonna make a splash in the draft...we're gonna pay our guys that produce for us...if he don't produce we'll find someone who does..." Yeah..? Where..? on the practice squad of another team?

 

There is a ton of talent, in area's we NEED to address, in this years FA class...Young guys...talented guys! We're in a position to be able to make those kind of pick ups and not break the bank, as well as addressing our own key FA's. To that point, I don't see Poz or Flo as a key FA! There are guys out there that are better, guys we should be spending our money on!

 

I love the Bills, and the Bills' fans, and I love being a Bills fan, but most of us think we know more about football than we really do! I know this game...I've been in it for a long time...I still play and I study offenses and defenses alike. Poz is NOT a top tier ILB! He's, self admittedly, undersized MLB and he lacks the prowess to plug a hole at the line, or even take out a blocker or two to let someone else make the play. If you disagree, I beg you to watch him play...if you're like me, you have a handful of games DVR'd. Really watch him, focus on him and try and forget the play happening around him! I say let someone else overpay him. I'd rather sign Rudd from TB. He's been much healthier than Poz throughout his career and he's that hard nosed corn shuckn' Nebraska MLB who'll stick his nose in the fire nd make most of his tackles within a coupleyards of the LOS.

 

I can't be to hard on Flo...I love the guy. He's a solid player that deserves a solid contract, but with the $$ the Bills have available, why not sign a top gun? Why not make a run at Asomugha or Cromartie? Though the Bills' secondary has turned out some very good players, we've never seen a shut down corner on this team.

 

Unfortunately, this is a giant waste of time, yet theraputic! Until there is someone else at the top, this franchise will play second fiddle to the the rest of the NFL. Ralph makes a pile of cash every year, and do you know where a large percentage of it comes from...? Me & you, the fans. Because we refuse to stand up for our right, as fans, to have the best possible product on the field! We cower in the corner in fear of losing our team and buy tickets to the next game instead of protesting the only possible way we can by not going to watch an average team lose by three because we couldn't hold them, or finish, or score on the first posession in OT.

Dude tried to read this but it was like a novel

[Malazan]

I think I understand what you said.

But riddle me this: If The Bills have a lack of talent, and they're not going to make a big splash in the FA market - then who's going to get the extra 10-30 million that they HAVE to pay out this year?

Man, people went ballistic when Kelsay got a cap-floor-generated-fat-azz contract extension. Maybe they'll extend Maybin and McKelvin with some of that cash.

The money's got to go somewhere. What could end up happening is that instead of getting a bunch of overpaid FA from outside the organization is that Nix creates his own set of overpaid younguns.

 

Once they sign the FAs they want, I think they're going to give Fitzgibbons a royal contract. That should chew up a lot of the money that they're required to spend.

 

It's going to go to middle tier 'non-big splash' free agents aimed at upgrading the overall talent pool. Didn't take too long to figure out.

[billsfan89]

I think this is correct. I'm behind Buddy's building philosophy 100%. But you cannot just ignore a chance through FA to fill a major hole on your team. To break the bank on the "so called" top 10 FA's may not make sense. Don't tell me there it's only a choice between signing a player the caliber of a Nnamdi Asomugha or signing another stiff like Cornell Green. Don't tell me there's no area for this team to bring in one or two solid starters to improve this team. Making a splash for me would be to find a decent starting RT, maybe a safety or ILB and just for crazies...a TE.

 

Fully agree but it seems like Nix won't even go after those types of players. But I could be proven wrong come Friday.

Edited July 27, 2011 by billsfan89

[Buckeye Eric]

The Redskins always build through free agency. It has worked so well for them, hasn't it?

[spartacus]

The OP is wrong.

 

The Packers do not participate in FA under Thompson... Solid team -- with no glaring holes. They can lose players like Nick Barnett and Cullen Jenkins and not miss a beat.

 

Buddy is doing it right. I applaud him for being able to tune out our rabid fan base.

 

Dona-ho would have listened to you.

 

Thompson can play that game because his draft picks produce on the field, so there is no need to find a lot of talent elsewhere.

 

 

When your top draft picks like Maybin, Spiller, Troup and Carrington can't even get on the field, then building solely thru the draft may not be such a good idea.

 

With the Bills draft picks stuck to the bench and their replacements generated from the practice squads and team rejects, it's inconceivable that the Bills will ignore FA as a source to improve the talent level of this team. But then again, the team has no urgency to produce a winner - so that message has clearly filtered down to Buddy and Cahn.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I like Nix's philosophy of building the core of the franchise through the draft. BUT when you say you want to supplement through free agency you have to actually supplement through free agency.

 

If you brought in Cullen Jenkin and Nick Barnett to help the front 7 how would that hurt the team? If you spent big on Zack Miller who would he be taking snaps away from?

 

You can only do so much for a team with drafts. Buddy Nix needs to learn the meaning of the word supplement. Supplementing would be bringing in just 2-3 starters in free agency and some depth. Doing nothing would hurt the team as not everyone on the depth chart is worthy of taking NFL snaps.

This is true

 

Every team in the league participates in the draft

 

 

Well run teams also add talent thru free agency

 

The Bills, by ignoring FA, are falling farther behind the talent levels of other teams - as evidenced by their deterioration over the last decade.

 

Free Agency is even more important when you continually strike out in the draft - with ZERO impact players acquired thru the draft under Buddy and for the 10 prior years

 

 

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I hope this make some sense to someone other than me.

That was an excellent post, Mike. Thanks for positing a theory and putting in a lot of effort in thought and work.

 

I would say that on a 53 man roster, you're typically not going to have more than 2-3 marquee free agent acquisitions… so we're talking about 5-6% of the roster.

 

I seem to remember an article about the "typical" composition of a Super Bowl Champion. I'll try to find it.

 

I agree with most here that judicious use of free agency is a great team-building tool.

 

The best scenarios for a splash free agent, IMO are 1) adding an upper echelon player just entering his prime to a team that is trending upwards or 2) adding an older superstar at the end of their career (Reggie White, Charles Woodson) to a team on the brink of winning a championship.

 

I definitely see the merit in adding a Zach Miller (26 years old) or Kevin Boss (27 years old) to a team like the Bills.

 

When you do the audit you have an excellent young player who will still be around when the rebuild is done… at a position of need, with little or no downside and good character.

 

Not agreeing with those who are throwing names like Cullen Jenkins, Kelly Gregg, or people like that. IMO, those are guys on the downside who 1-2 years from now might only be better than the Bills younger players (Troup, Carrington, etc) simply because they deprived those players of developmental time.

 

The fit has to be perfect to make it worth it, IMO.

 

 

[sllib olaffub]

Dude...you don't have things so bad. Matter of fact you're such a glass is half full guy that you think that mediocrity is synonomous with the Bills.

 

I'm hear to tell you that the recent Buffalo Bills were looking up at mediocrity. They have a ways to go to get there.

+1

[BillsFan74]

No need to get excited it's the same every year with the bills.

[K-9]

... I can't be to hard on Flo...I love the guy. He's a solid player that deserves a solid contract, but with the $$ the Bills have available, why not sign a top gun? Why not make a run at Asomugha or Cromartie? Though the Bills' secondary has turned out some very good players, we've never seen a shut down corner on this team. ...

 

We saw one of the original shutdown corners in the game: Robert James.

 

But seeing as how you needed to vent I'm willing to forgive this oversight.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[MikeSpeed]

The fit has to be perfect to make it worth it, IMO.

I was begining to think no one understood me or that I've been placed on everyone's ignor list.

 

Agree 100%! You don't need to get your superstars in FA, but the players you get should up in coming guys young enough to grow with the program.

[Bill from NYC]

I can't be to hard on Flo...I love the guy. He's a solid player that deserves a solid contract, but with the $$ the Bills have available, why not sign a top gun? Why not make a run at Asomugha or Cromartie? Though the Bills' secondary has turned out some very good players, we've never seen a shut down corner on this team.

 

Because it is dumb for a team to devote most of its resources to the secondary. It results in losing football games. If you disagree, look at the Bills drafts and free agent signings, then look at their records.

 

This is a great opportunity for the Bills to get bigger and stronger. As opposed to the secondary, the Bills have devoted next to nothing on OTs and TEs, and there appears to be some good ones out there. This is the route they need to go imo.