What about the O-line?

[....lybob]

I don't disagree. Wasn't saying I think Wrotto is the answer, just saying I find it surprising there are claims that Pears is when Wrotto was the starter for a larger portion of the season.

 

I would love to see a Marshal Yanda signing.

That would be a good signing, Yanda can play RT/OG so we could put him wherever we were weakest.

[CookieG]

 

That mindset is deeply ingrained since the failure of LT Mike Williams in 02, I think they are afraid to select a tackle early because they were burned by Williams. Yet, they think nothing of all the other positions they have been burned on, like DE-DB et al

 

That's part of it. Mike Williams was 9 years ago. We haven't come close to drafting a tackle that high since then.

 

So he wasn't an immediate impact player. I see. O Linemen never develop. His first years sounds a bit like this guy's.

 

After graduating from Wake Forest and going undrafted, he bounced around the league before landing a starting sport and achieving Pro Bowl status last season.

 

He was originally signed by Denver as an undrafted rookie free agent in 2004. He was waived by the Broncos and signed with the New York Giants and was on their practice squad.

 

The Giants released him and he was signed by the San Diego Chargers.

 

He was released by the Chargers and signed by the Broncos, where he was inactive for the final two games of the season.

 

He then went to NFL Europa and played for the Hamburg Sea Devils. He made the all-NFL Europa team, but was again waived by the Broncos.

 

The Falcons signed him to the practice squad on Sept. 21, 2005.

 

 

 

Oh, sure they're definitely similar.

 

One has started 48 games in the last 3 years, the other ... 5, due to injuries of starters.

One was named to the Pro Bowl last season, the other...cut by 2 teams, couldn't hold a job as a back up on either team.

 

You're right, the career paths parallel each other.

 

 

They're both over 6'5" and over 300 lbs, too.

[Cash]

I don't think RT is a position that Buddy & Co value all that highly. Wrotto was resigned and started 7 games at RT before being injured. My assumption is that between Wrotto, Pears, Wang and Hairston their RT is already on their roster.

 

+1. Nix has talked up his waiver-wire pickups on the O-line a heck of a lot. Sounds like he thinks Urbik and Pears are the real deal, and we have our top 6 or 7 linemen set going forward. I wouldn't be hugely shocked if we sign an OT to be the unquestioned starter, but I would be surprised. Adding a Cornell Green/Langston Walker type (or maybe a notch cheaper) to "compete for the job" wouldn't surprise me as much.

[Spiderweb]

Bell Levitre wood urbik pears

 

Good enough

 

Bell Levitre wood urbik pears

 

Good enough

 

Pears has consistently been spoken of by Gailey as a capable player. From what I saw, I wasn't as convinced though. Urbick looked solid, and even Rinehart had his moments. We look fairly solid at Guard now, yet RT should still be a concern. That is, unless Hairston turns out to be a steal.

[Doc]

Pears has consistently been spoken of by Gailey as a capable player. From what I saw, I wasn't as convinced though. Urbick looked solid, and even Rinehart had his moments. We look fairly solid at Guard now, yet RT should still be a concern. That is, unless Hairston turns out to be a steal.

IMHO, Hairston has missed too much valuable minicamp and OTA time. Hopefully he's a quick study. The other positions I'm not worried about, except for injury, which no one has control over.

[thewildrabbit]

The pessimism gets me. Again if you're so miserable, why put yourself through it?

 

And at worst, Hangartner replaces Wood. Removing snapping duties should only help him.

I'm not miserable at all, just annoyed by couch coaches that believe they think they know what they are talking about when discussing player performance. posters here are kidding themselves if they don't think that competing with the Patriots- Jets- Dolphins isn't the highest priority, and most of the O linemen currently on the roster might be good enough for a minor league team, just not nearly good enough to compete against some of the best teams in the NFL ...that reside in the AFC East.

 

Perhaps many posters here enjoyed last years 4-12 season, and can only see this team getting better. I hate losing and I can only see this team repeating last seasons ugly performance with the very same players

 

One would have to be delusional to think that this college coaching staff is going to suddenly be good enough to develop top players out of trash found on the waiver wire.... or that players plagued with constant injuries year after year and play lousy with those injuries will suddenly play better.

 

Here is something to consider, every NFL player suffers thru injuries every year, its how they cope and play with those injuries that defines them. An example was Thurman Thomas who was always in pain with two bad ankles, from college to the pro's, it didn't stop him from having a HoF career.

 

 

 

What transpires in free agency when it opens will show if this team is determined to win in this division this season. RT-G or C for the line should be the priorities, if they ignore the line or bring in more Cornell Greens, then don't expect much improvement from last seasons 4-12 record.

Edited July 18, 2011 by Harvey lives

[Defend Greece]

I'm not miserable at all, just annoyed by couch coaches that believe they think they know what they are talking about when discussing player performance. posters here are kidding themselves if they don't think that competing with the Patriots- Jets- Dolphins isn't the highest priority, and most of the O linemen currently on the roster might be good enough for a minor league team, just not nearly good enough to compete against some of the best teams in the NFL ...that reside in the AFC East.

 

Perhaps many posters here enjoyed last years 4-12 season, and can only see this team getting better. I hate losing and I can only see this team repeating last seasons ugly performance with the very same players

 

One would have to be delusional to think that this college coaching staff is going to suddenly be good enough to develop top players out of trash found on the waiver wire.... or that players plagued with constant injuries year after year and play lousy with those injuries will suddenly play better.

 

Here is something to consider, every NFL player suffers thru injuries every year, its how they cope and play with those injuries that defines them. An example was Thurman Thomas who was always in pain with two bad ankles, from college to the pro's, it didn't stop him from having a HoF career.

 

 

 

What transpires in free agency when it opens will show if this team is determined to win in this division this season. RT-G or C for the line should be the priorities, if they ignore the line or bring in more Cornell Greens, then don't expect much improvement from last seasons 4-12 record.

You are so smart wow you should be the coach

[Doc]

I'm not miserable at all, just annoyed by couch coaches that believe they think they know what they are talking about when discussing player performance. posters here are kidding themselves if they don't think that competing with the Patriots- Jets- Dolphins isn't the highest priority, and most of the O linemen currently on the roster might be good enough for a minor league team, just not nearly good enough to compete against some of the best teams in the NFL ...that reside in the AFC East.

 

Perhaps many posters here enjoyed last years 4-12 season, and can only see this team getting better. I hate losing and I can only see this team repeating last seasons ugly performance with the very same players

 

One would have to be delusional to think that this college coaching staff is going to suddenly be good enough to develop top players out of trash found on the waiver wire.... or that players plagued with constant injuries year after year and play lousy with those injuries will suddenly play better.

 

Here is something to consider, every NFL player suffers thru injuries every year, its how they cope and play with those injuries that defines them. An example was Thurman Thomas who was always in pain with two bad ankles, from college to the pro's, it didn't stop him from having a HoF career.

 

 

 

What transpires in free agency when it opens will show if this team is determined to win in this division this season. RT-G or C for the line should be the priorities, if they ignore the line or bring in more Cornell Greens, then don't expect much improvement from last seasons 4-12 record.

Yes, "couch coaches" can be annoying.

[atlbillsfan1975]

RT is an issue.

The Bills are going to be forced to spend the money, either on purchasing quality talent or redistributing the money among players already on the team(due to new CBA). So why not go and sign a Clabo? I mean seriously, he is proven over a player like Pears. This would allow Pears to develope more, and also offer quality depth, if Gailey and Nix think he is solid.

I am sorry, but the oline is a solid RT away from being good. Bell is the big question once you solidify RT with Clabo. But wouldn't it be nice to have only one tackle position you are hoping steps up instead of both?

[Nanker]

That's part of it. Mike Williams was 9 years ago. We haven't come close to drafting a tackle that high since then.

 

 

 

Oh, sure they're definitely similar.

 

One has started 48 games in the last 3 years, the other ... 5, due to injuries of starters.

One was named to the Pro Bowl last season, the other...cut by 2 teams, couldn't hold a job as a back up on either team.

 

You're right, the career paths parallel each other.

 

 

They're both over 6'5" and over 300 lbs, too.

 

Whifffff!!!!!

Way to miss the point.

The Pro Bowler was undrafted seven years ago and was cut by four NFL teams and went to Europe to improve.

Of course player improvement and development doesn't seem to be a possibility in your world view.

 

One of the better RTs in The Bills history was sent back to school (still amazed how that happened), and yet Kelly called him out two years later as the weak link in the line.

Of course Thurman attempting to put Jim in his place told a TV announcer that the team had a shortage of talent - at QB, and "the Bickering Bills" became a hot topic for years.

 

I posted a link with all the available FA Linemen. Which do you want Nix to pursue?

[CookieG]

Whifffff!!!!!

Way to miss the point.

The Pro Bowler was undrafted seven years ago and was cut by four NFL teams and went to Europe to improve.

Of course player improvement and development doesn't seem to be a possibility in your world view.

 

 

The Pro Bowler has been starting with his team for the last 5 years.

 

The other..was playing behind people the Bills ended up cutting.

 

Pears has been in the league for 5 years, not 2. He's 29, not 24.

 

One showed improvement, the other didn't.

 

I'm sorry if you can't see the difference.

 

Yeah, there's always that chance. A James Harrison pops up. A Tom Brady is drafted. You hit the jackpot on a scratch and sniff card. Do you rely on your scratch card to cover your mortgage payment?

 

One of the better RTs in The Bills history was sent back to school (still amazed how that happened), and yet Kelly called him out two years later as the weak link in the line.

Of course Thurman attempting to put Jim in his place told a TV announcer that the team had a shortage of talent - at QB, and "the Bickering Bills" became a hot topic for years.

 

Cool, a guy drafted 25 years ago is your justification. I wonder if there is a 250 lb. fullback we can nab out of the CFL who can become our leading rusher.

 

So how many times have we hit on these late round picks since then? Once, in 2004, with a UDFA named Jason Peters. That's once since 1987, 24 years.

 

What are Terrance Pennington, Ben Sobieski, Aaron Mertz, Kyle Calloway, Jamie Nails, and that long, long list of others doing these days? Throw in the list of the scrub free agents over the last decade and this list gets substantially longer.

 

I posted a link with all the available FA Linemen. Which do you want Nix to pursue?

 

Clabo, of course. God forbid the Bills actually make Oline a priority and lose their reputation as the team that cares the least about its blocking.

 

Think a decade of neglecting the Oline together with a decade without playoff appearances is a coincidence?

 

Ozzie Newsome wouldn't think so.

[BillsVet]

Clabo, of course. God forbid the Bills actually make Oline a priority and lose their reputation as the team that cares the least about its blocking.

 

Think a decade of neglecting the Oline together with a decade without playoff appearances is a coincidence?

 

Ozzie Newsome wouldn't think so.

 

Thank goodness the Bills took a RB with their first pick for their second rebuild in 5 seasons. The HC himself said he'd make the line look better. Truth is, his blocking does make the line look half-way decent.

[DanInUticaTampa]

The HC himself said he'd make the line look better. Truth is, his blocking does make the line look half-way decent.

 

hahahahaha

 

but in all seriousness, his blocking really is terrible.

[thewildrabbit]

Thank goodness the Bills took a RB with their first pick for their second rebuild in 5 seasons. The HC himself said he'd make the line look better. Truth is, his blocking does make the line look half-way decent.

In actuality, Gailey stated that Spiller would make the O line block better. I'd laugh, but its just sad how poorly the rookie performed in his first year.

 

I gotta think that when a player doesn't know his assignments its the coaches, particularly when he was named the starting RB for opening day, and then benched because the he couldn't perform his job in any aspect, and the fact that the HC didn't even know the limited ability of the player he named starter.Then the team was forced to play a guy with his hand in a cast and the other RB still hampered by a leg injury.

 

A comedy of errors for the first 8 games, but its ok...the Bills will make the playoffs this year ...right?

[bowery4]

Man Harvey you are really a let down, I wonder why do you bother? I can't imagine being a fan is much fun with no optimism.

[Defend Greece]

Man Harvey you are really a let down, I wonder why do you bother? I can't imagine being a fan is much fun with no optimism.

+1

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Man Harvey you are really a let down, I wonder why do you bother? I can't imagine being a fan is much fun with no optimism.

 

+1

Yep. He (and a few others) are like that guy who's always complaining about his wife.

 

Or his job.

 

Or his kids.

 

Or the government.

Or the neighbors.

 

Or…

 

But remember, these people aren't being negative.

 

They're "realists" and they'd be the first ones to tell you that.

 

[CookieG]

Thank goodness the Bills took a RB with their first pick for their second rebuild in 5 seasons. The HC himself said he'd make the line look better. Truth is, his blocking does make the line look half-way decent.

 

I can actually forgive them for the Spiller pick...but you'd think you would want to get some people around him to protect the investment.

 

But it goes well be the first round pick(s). Until this draft, the Bills hadn't taken a tackle before the 5th round since 2002. That has to be a record. And they broke that dubious record by taking a guy at the bottom of the 4th. Someone elsewhere pointed out that around 105 tackles were taken in the top 4 rounds during that time frame. Out of all of those guys, we had "other needs" or "they didn't represent value", or "there are only so many picks"

 

If this had been an Indy or Baltimore type line over the last decade, it would be one thing, but damn, it isn't like our line has been considered solid.

 

Personally, it has got beyond the point of any reason or logic. I think they're refusing to upgrade the line out of spite.

[Jauronimo]

In actuality, Gailey stated that Spiller would make the O line block better. I'd laugh, but its just sad how poorly the rookie performed in his first year.

 

I gotta think that when a player doesn't know his assignments its the coaches, particularly when he was named the starting RB for opening day, and then benched because the he couldn't perform his job in any aspect, and the fact that the HC didn't even know the limited ability of the player he named starter.Then the team was forced to play a guy with his hand in a cast and the other RB still hampered by a leg injury.

 

A comedy of errors for the first 8 games, but its ok...the Bills will make the playoffs this year ...right?

Agreed. Terrible coaching job starting Spiller, even if the other two RBs were injured and Spiller was the only choice. Gailey should have abandoned the running game and forced a one dimensional passing attack which would fool our opponents somehow. Passing every play would be and advantage for the O line since they wouldn't have to worry about complicated run blocking schemes.

 

Spiller obviously is terrible too. What kind of rookie makes mistakes and has difficulty adjusting to new responsibilities and the faster play at the NFL level?

 

Gotta go now. My dog isn't going to kick itself.

Edited July 19, 2011 by Jauronimo

[BillsVet]

I can actually forgive them for the Spiller pick...but you'd think you would want to get some people around him to protect the investment.

 

But it goes well be the first round pick(s). Until this draft, the Bills hadn't taken a tackle before the 5th round since 2002. That has to be a record. And they broke that dubious record by taking a guy at the bottom of the 4th. Someone elsewhere pointed out that around 105 tackles were taken in the top 4 rounds during that time frame. Out of all of those guys, we had "other needs" or "they didn't represent value", or "there are only so many picks"

 

If this had been an Indy or Baltimore type line over the last decade, it would be one thing, but damn, it isn't like our line has been considered solid.

 

Personally, it has got beyond the point of any reason or logic. I think they're refusing to upgrade the line out of spite.

 

The Bills are at odds with every team in the NFL re: OT's. While most clubs are drafting OT's high, they outright refuse to and cite other needs. Well, what's more important than protecting your QB from edge rushers? In the pass happy NFL, it's all about getting pressure and the easiest way to do it is with 43DE's or 34OLB's. It also would help if whomever plays QB has more than 2 seconds to throw before getting hit, which obviously means the HC has to plan more 3 step drops therefore limiting his playbook.

 

Every team in the NFL has prioritized the OT position. Every one except Buffalo that is. But, they still have free agency to obtain someone more proven than what they have. Then again, Nix has worked for franchises that didn't prioritize the position either. They didn't draft 1 OT in rounds 1-2 in Buffalo from 93-00 and only 1 (Marcus McNeill) from 01-08. How's that for a track record?