If Poz leaves, will you be upset??

[Defend Greece]

All of the plays Poz was involved in against Cincinnati. I think this video speaks pretty accurately to his abilities. He makes some great plays, he gets blocked on some plays. Overall ok/solid. Not great, not horrible. Decent starter.

 

It's imperative to re-sign draft picks that turn into "decent starters". Not doing so has kept us in a rebuild mode for over a decade. Keep him and add better talent around him, until we are to a point where we can upgrade his spot as well. I think he'll benefit greatly from having talent added to the DLine.

 

Take 5 minutes and check it out...

 

youtube.com/watch?v=CRP-1ijvmyQ

Well to me poz looked real good, they had an offensive lineman get out on him every play and he fought through it most times. I did notice kelsay getting beat a few times though

For being a "below average lb" (scrappy who could be a patriots fan) the bengals sure did gameplan for him

[/dev/null]

Why do people hate on Poz?

 

Dude's a good solid LB. He's part of the solution not part of the problem.

[Nanker]

We're

at MLB and the pompom brigade is out in force to make us thinner! Brilliant!

 

 

Pos on the Jints would be like the second coming of Gary Reasons, IMHO.

[billsfreak]

Why do people hate on Poz?

 

Dude's a good solid LB. He's part of the solution not part of the problem.

Because they are either clueless when it comes to football or they are a bunch of idiots.

[billsfreak]

Right...That's the reason The Bills have not made The Playoffs...Because they kept Players like Poz...

1st off, who said Poz won't get better? And what makes you think any of these Kids will be better than Poz any time soon? Just a guess? Because otherwise you're risking putting us back a few more years at ILB... AND you do realize the Bills have to start 2 ILB's right? No one is saying Poz is all that...But...Ugh!

If the Bills had more players like Poz they might have a slight chance at the playoffs. They haven't made the playoffs in over a decade because they have an owner like Ralph, have had coaches Jauron, Mularkey, Greg Willams and the other Bozos that have been here, poor front offices and the fact that they have kept players like Hangartner, Cordaro Howard, McCargo, Wrotto, have had QB's like Edwards, Losman and Fitz, got rid of players like Winfield, Clements, Williams, Lynch, etc. and have sucked at the draft using high or fairly high picks on the likes of Spiller, Mike Williams, Maybin, etc. To actually say with a straight face that be Bills have sucked because they have kept players like Poz, means that the person who said that has either not seen a Bills game in a couple decades, has reality issues that need to be taken care of, or just lacks severely in common sense. I know you were referring to another post, so this isn't directed at you, I agree with you whole heartedly.

Edited July 16, 2011 by billsfreak

[Nanker]

Because they are either clueless when it comes to football or they are a bunch of idiots.

 

 

!

 

 

[DrDawkinstein]

Well to me poz looked real good, they had an offensive lineman get out on him every play and he fought through it most times. I did notice kelsay getting beat a few times though

For being a "below average lb" (scrappy who could be a patriots fan) the bengals sure did gameplan for him

 

Thank you, this was a major point I meant to include in my post and forgot. You are correct, as the tape doesnt lie. And this backs up what most of us more level-headed posters have been saying about his performance and injuries.

 

You simply CANT have OLs making clean runs at your main MLB like that. Having a Guard (or TWO) take a 5 yard sprint at you every play is going to wear you down, and result in injury sooner or later.

 

The easiest and fastest way to improve Poz's play is to add talent to the DLine. Hopefully, with the addition of Dareus, and Troupe/Carrington coming into their 2nd year, they can tie up some blockers here and there and allow Poz to play cleaner.

 

 

Edit: Reposting Video on this page as well...

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRP-1ijvmyQ

Edited July 16, 2011 by DrDareustein

[BADOLBILZ]

Poz is not as good as London Fletcher. If I were to rate on a 1 to 10 scale with 10 being great, then Poz is a 5 and Fletcher a 7. Fletcher has shown he can cover TE's & RB's out of the backfield -- Poz never will. Fletcher moves all over the fleid much better than Poz.

 

Actually, there is not much comparison at all. Fletcher has also been incredibly durable, got the turnovers and played a rough brand of football. He wasn't stout against the run, but he is also 5'9" in cleats.

[tennesseeboy]

Thank you, this was a major point I meant to include in my post and forgot. You are correct, as the tape doesnt lie. And this backs up what most of us more level-headed posters have been saying about his performance and injuries.

 

You simply CANT have OLs making clean runs at your main MLB like that. Having a Guard (or TWO) take a 5 yard sprint at you every play is going to wear you down, and result in injury sooner or later.

 

The easiest and fastest way to improve Poz's play is to add talent to the DLine. Hopefully, with the addition of Dareus, and Troupe/Carrington coming into their 2nd year, they can tie up some blockers here and there and allow Poz to play cleaner.

 

 

Edit: Reposting Video on this page as well...

EXCELLENT POINT....I think having the new defensive line will greatly improve the linebacking corps performance. It all goes to the philosophy that you build a team (defense and offense) from the trenches back. Good defensive line and the linebackers and corners are free to be linebackers and corners...godd offensive line and the quarterback spends less time on his ass, and the backs get up a head of speed and the receivers find time to get open. Simple as can be...

 

youtube.com/watch?v=CRP-1ijvmyQ

[1billsfan]

When there's a eight page thread of fans debating whether they'd be upset if one of their starting inside linebackers leaves or not, that doesn't seem like a very good indictment of the linebacker in question. Back in the day, would there ever have been a thread like this regarding Bennett or Talley?

[DrDawkinstein]

When there's a eight page thread of fans debating whether they'd be upset if one of their starting inside linebackers leaves or not, that doesn't seem like a very good indictment of the linebacker in question. Back in the day, would there ever have been a thread like this regarding Bennett or Talley?

 

Id say its more of an indictment of Bills fans no longer being the "smartest fans in the league".

 

Things arent nearly as obvious and cut&dry as in the 90s when the entire team was good/great. It leaves every player, every position, and every play call open to debate.

 

No need to discuss when we were winning because there was nothing to argue, everything was working. It was easy being a fan. When asked about football, you just refer to how the Bills were doing it. Now we're stuck trying to figure out where the fault lies, and how to improve.

 

There are a lot of criticisms in this thread that are "kinda true" but not nearly the entire story.

 

Also, with no internet, and no anonymous tough-guy posters back then, you dont know what would have been or not been discussed here. Message boards bring out the worst of the worst. Trolls exist even on the boards of solid teams nowadays.

 

Not to aim this at you, but your post is another one of those baseless criticisms. "If it has to be debated, he must not be good". What type of logic is that?

 

Lets stick to facts, and analyzing actual tape, instead of making comments like Scrappy's that are based on the way he sort of remembers the games.

 

Watch the entire clip I posted, with an open mind and a football mind, and then let's discuss....

Edited July 16, 2011 by DrDareustein

[NoSaint]

When there's a eight page thread of fans debating whether they'd be upset if one of their starting inside linebackers leaves or not, that doesn't seem like a very good indictment of the linebacker in question. Back in the day, would there ever have been a thread like this regarding Bennett or Talley?

 

It's not much of a debate. Everyone seems to say he's a good starter but probably won't set the world on fire (minus 1-2 ppl). I think it's more an indictment on how the boards lost a lot of x's and o's people and is left with a high percentage of the "omg I can't believe anyone would disagree with me" posters.

[Billsguy]

Poz's reputation has been bigger than his play IMO, so I wouldn't be sorry to see him walk. I can't remember a big play & his stats are average, so he can help us make 8-8 ball a reality, if we're lucky.

 

The Bills can do better. He's not an impact player or a difference maker. He'd be a very good college linebacker where everybody is a little slower. Let's face it, Poz is not fast enough or good enough. It doesn't mean he's bad, but just not good enough.

[DrDawkinstein]

The Bills can do better. He's not an impact player or a difference maker. He'd be a very good college linebacker where everybody is a little slower. Let's face it, Poz is not fast enough or good enough. It doesn't mean he's bad, but just not good enough.

 

 

Like who? Please give us any examples that we can bring in to play this year that would do better than Poz. Andra Davis was a "name" 3-4 LB that we brought in last year, and he didnt even play as well as Poz. Considering Poz is being talked about as one of the top LB Free Agents, who is this magical upgrade?

 

I dont disagree that his position could/should eventually be upgraded, but Im only dealing with the reality that is this season, and where we are in Buddy's re-build.

Edited July 16, 2011 by DrDareustein

[KOKBILLS]

It's not much of a debate. Everyone seems to say he's a good starter but probably won't set the world on fire (minus 1-2 ppl). I think it's more an indictment on how the boards lost a lot of x's and o's people and is left with a high percentage of the "omg I can't believe anyone would disagree with me" posters.

 

A-freaking-men...

[Scrappy]

The Bills can do better. He's not an impact player or a difference maker. He'd be a very good college linebacker where everybody is a little slower. Let's face it, Poz is not fast enough or good enough. It doesn't mean he's bad, but just not good enough.

 

It's been painfully obvious for years now.

[DrDawkinstein]

It's been painfully obvious for years now.

 

Dude, you add absolutely nothing of substance to this discussion.

[Scrappy]

Dude, you add absolutely nothing of substance to this discussion.

 

 

Id say its more of an indictment of Bills fans no longer being the "smartest fans in the league".

 

Things arent nearly as obvious and cut&dry as in the 90s when the entire team was good/great. It leaves every player, every position, and every play call open to debate.

 

No need to discuss when we were winning because there was nothing to argue, everything was working. It was easy being a fan. When asked about football, you just refer to how the Bills were doing it. Now we're stuck trying to figure out where the fault lies, and how to improve.

 

There are a lot of criticisms in this thread that are "kinda true" but not nearly the entire story.

 

Also, with no internet, and no anonymous tough-guy posters back then, you dont know what would have been or not been discussed here. Message boards bring out the worst of the worst. Trolls exist even on the boards of solid teams nowadays.

 

Not to aim this at you, but your post is another one of those baseless criticisms. "If it has to be debated, he must not be good". What type of logic is that?

 

Lets stick to facts, and analyzing actual tape, instead of making comments like Scrappy's that are based on the way he sort of remembers the games.

 

Watch the entire clip I posted, with an open mind and a football mind, and then let's discuss....

 

 

Brother, I'm an X O kinda guy & Poz is not a starting NFL LB. His pass coverage is just horrible, he's lost. He looked good in college but his game never translated well in the NFL & he seems like a glass player, that's a guy that the Bills could do without. I predict if he does stay that within the first 4 games, he's on IR.

 

Like who? Please give us any examples that we can bring in to play this year that would do better than Poz. Andra Davis was a "name" 3-4 LB that we brought in last year, and he didnt even play as well as Poz. Considering Poz is being talked about as one of the top LB Free Agents, who is this magical upgrade?

 

I dont disagree that his position could/should eventually be upgraded, but Im only dealing with the reality that is this season, and where we are in Buddy's re-build.

 

If Ralph would possibly spend some money, we could get FA. Heaven forbid improving the team but here's a list of fella's:

 

 

A talented, versatile inside linebacker who is due for a big payday this offseason.

 

A.J. Hawk, ILB, Packers. Age: 27.

Re-signed with Packers (5 years)

 

A.J. Hawk wasn't worth a top-five pick, but he's a very good linebacker who played a key role in Green Bay's Super Bowl run. Hawk will probably return to the Packers for less money.

 

Kevin Burnett, ILB, Chargers. Age: 28.

After a few forgettable years in Dallas, Kevin Burnett has really come into his own in San Diego. Staying put would probably be best for his career.

 

 

Kirk Morrison, ILB, Jaguars. Age: 29.

Kirk Morrison is a decent middle linebacker who thrives in run support. He's not terrible in coverage, but could be better in that department.

 

 

Stewart Bradley, ILB, Eagles. Age: 27.

Stewart Bradley really struggled in coverage this past season, but that's understandable because he was only a year removed from ACL surgery. He'll move to strongside linebacker in 2011, assuming he re-signs with the team.

 

 

Stephen Cooper, ILB, Chargers. Age: 32.

Stephen Cooper turns 32 in June, but is coming off a very good year. Cooper played well throughout until suffering an MCL sprain in December.

 

 

 

D'Qwell Jackson missed all of last year after playing in just six games in 2009. Jackson's a good player, but is a major injury risk.

 

 

Barrett Ruud, ILB, Buccaneers. Age: 28.

I'm not sure what happened to Barrett Ruud, because he had an awful 2010 campaign after a couple of phenomenal seasons as Tampa Bay's middle linebacker. Ruud might be able to bounce back elsewhere - or he could be done.

 

 

 

Jameel McClain (ERFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 26.

Jameel McClain is serviceable as Baltimore's two-down inside linebacker next to Ray Lewis, but can be upgraded.

 

 

 

Dhani Jones, ILB, Bengals. Age: 33.

Dhani Jones had a decent 2009, but regressed last season. The bow tie and Febreze salesman is on his last legs.

 

 

Eric Barton, ILB, Browns. Age: 33.

Eric Barton is a liability in coverage at this point in his career, but he can still be a quality two-down run-stopping inside linebacker for 3-4 teams.

 

 

Kevin Bentley, ILB, Texans. Age: 31.

Kevin Bentley did a decent job filling in for DeMeco Ryans in the second half of the season. He could be brought back as a reserve 3-4 inside linebacker.

 

 

Brandon Siler, ILB, Chargers. Age: 25.

Marvin Mitchell, ILB, Saints. Age: 26.

Dannell Ellerbe (ERFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 25.

Tavares Gooden (RFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 26.

H.B. Blades, ILB, Redskins. Age: 26.

Mark Herzlich, ILB, Boston College. Age: 24.

Hunter Hillenmeyer, ILB, Bears. Age: 31.

Scott Lutrus, ILB, Connecticut. Age: 23.

Nick Bellore, ILB, Central Michigan. Age: 22.

Jason Trusnik, ILB, Browns. Age: 27.

Reggie Walker, ILB, Cardinals. Age: 24.

Corey Mays, ILB, Chiefs. Age: 27.

Chase Blackburn, ILB, Giants. Age: 28.

Gerris Wilkinson, ILB, Giants. Age: 28.

Spencer Havner, ILB, Packers. Age: 28. -- Tendered by Packers

Omar Gaither, ILB, Eagles. Age: 27.

Vinny Ciurciu, ILB, Lions. Age: 31.

Erin Henderson (RFA), ILB, Vikings. Age: 25. -- Tendered by Vikings

Anthony Waters, ILB, Saints. Age: 27.

Niko Koutouvides, ILB, Buccaneers. Age: 30.

Blake Costanzo (RFA), ILB, Browns. Age: 27.

Keyaron Fox, ILB, Steelers. Age: 29.

Tracy White, ILB, Patriots. Age: 30.

Cory Greenwood (ERFA), ILB, Chiefs. Age: 28.

 

It's not much of a debate. Everyone seems to say he's a good starter but probably won't set the world on fire (minus 1-2 ppl). I think it's more an indictment on how the boards lost a lot of x's and o's people and is left with a high percentage of the "omg I can't believe anyone would disagree with me" posters.

 

Poz has been part of the problem on the defense for years now.

Edited July 16, 2011 by Scrappy

[Defend Greece]

Brother, I'm an X O kinda guy & Poz is not a starting NFL LB. His pass coverage is just horrible, he's lost. He looked good in college but his game never translated well in the NFL & he seems like a glass player, that's a guy that the Bills could do without. I predict if he does stay that within the first 4 games, he's on IR.

 

 

 

If Ralph would possibly spend some money, we could get FA. Heaven forbid improving the team but here's a list of fella's:

 

 

A talented, versatile inside linebacker who is due for a big payday this offseason.

 

A.J. Hawk, ILB, Packers. Age: 27.

Re-signed with Packers (5 years)

 

A.J. Hawk wasn't worth a top-five pick, but he's a very good linebacker who played a key role in Green Bay's Super Bowl run. Hawk will probably return to the Packers for less money.

 

Kevin Burnett, ILB, Chargers. Age: 28.

After a few forgettable years in Dallas, Kevin Burnett has really come into his own in San Diego. Staying put would probably be best for his career.

 

 

Kirk Morrison, ILB, Jaguars. Age: 29.

Kirk Morrison is a decent middle linebacker who thrives in run support. He's not terrible in coverage, but could be better in that department.

 

 

Stewart Bradley, ILB, Eagles. Age: 27.

Stewart Bradley really struggled in coverage this past season, but that's understandable because he was only a year removed from ACL surgery. He'll move to strongside linebacker in 2011, assuming he re-signs with the team.

 

 

Stephen Cooper, ILB, Chargers. Age: 32.

Stephen Cooper turns 32 in June, but is coming off a very good year. Cooper played well throughout until suffering an MCL sprain in December.

 

 

 

D'Qwell Jackson missed all of last year after playing in just six games in 2009. Jackson's a good player, but is a major injury risk.

 

 

Barrett Ruud, ILB, Buccaneers. Age: 28.

I'm not sure what happened to Barrett Ruud, because he had an awful 2010 campaign after a couple of phenomenal seasons as Tampa Bay's middle linebacker. Ruud might be able to bounce back elsewhere - or he could be done.

 

 

 

Jameel McClain (ERFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 26.

Jameel McClain is serviceable as Baltimore's two-down inside linebacker next to Ray Lewis, but can be upgraded.

 

 

 

Dhani Jones, ILB, Bengals. Age: 33.

Dhani Jones had a decent 2009, but regressed last season. The bow tie and Febreze salesman is on his last legs.

 

 

Eric Barton, ILB, Browns. Age: 33.

Eric Barton is a liability in coverage at this point in his career, but he can still be a quality two-down run-stopping inside linebacker for 3-4 teams.

 

 

Kevin Bentley, ILB, Texans. Age: 31.

Kevin Bentley did a decent job filling in for DeMeco Ryans in the second half of the season. He could be brought back as a reserve 3-4 inside linebacker.

 

 

Brandon Siler, ILB, Chargers. Age: 25.

Marvin Mitchell, ILB, Saints. Age: 26.

Dannell Ellerbe (ERFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 25.

Tavares Gooden (RFA), ILB, Ravens. Age: 26.

H.B. Blades, ILB, Redskins. Age: 26.

Mark Herzlich, ILB, Boston College. Age: 24.

Hunter Hillenmeyer, ILB, Bears. Age: 31.

Scott Lutrus, ILB, Connecticut. Age: 23.

Nick Bellore, ILB, Central Michigan. Age: 22.

Jason Trusnik, ILB, Browns. Age: 27.

Reggie Walker, ILB, Cardinals. Age: 24.

Corey Mays, ILB, Chiefs. Age: 27.

Chase Blackburn, ILB, Giants. Age: 28.

Gerris Wilkinson, ILB, Giants. Age: 28.

Spencer Havner, ILB, Packers. Age: 28. -- Tendered by Packers

Omar Gaither, ILB, Eagles. Age: 27.

Vinny Ciurciu, ILB, Lions. Age: 31.

Erin Henderson (RFA), ILB, Vikings. Age: 25. -- Tendered by Vikings

Anthony Waters, ILB, Saints. Age: 27.

Niko Koutouvides, ILB, Buccaneers. Age: 30.

Blake Costanzo (RFA), ILB, Browns. Age: 27.

Keyaron Fox, ILB, Steelers. Age: 29.

Tracy White, ILB, Patriots. Age: 30.

Cory Greenwood (ERFA), ILB, Chiefs. Age: 28.

 

 

 

Poz has been part of the problem on the defense for years now.

Scrappy you are a non football knowing son of a Brady

For the love of marv you managed to name off 20 linebackers that are not as good as poz and one

(Ruud) who is his equall

Watch a game not just highlights

Man you are so clueless and have absolutely no idea what you are talking about

 

Poz is WAY above average and before we switched to a 3-4 he was talked about as becoming elite, now he has to learn that since there are only 3 down lineman he is going to have a o-lineman to beat every play

 

So move out of your moms basement and join the real world

[NoSaint]

Scrappy you are a non football knowing son of a Brady

For the love of marv you managed to name off 20 linebackers that are not as good as poz and one

(Ruud) who is his equall

Watch a game not just highlights

Man you are so clueless and have absolutely no idea what you are talking about

 

Poz is WAY above average and before we switched to a 3-4 he was talked about as becoming elite, now he has to learn that since there are only 3 down lineman he is going to have a o-lineman to beat every play

 

So move out of your moms basement and join the real world

 

Ugh. You are as bad as scrappy.... Elite?

 

Poz is a foundation guy. You want about about 7-8 guys like him and 3-4 real playmakers. Ilb in your 34 isn't going to be your superstar playmaker like a 43 MLB is.... He serves his role very well, and in a good defense you wouldn't be able to complain about him as he wouldn't have ol hitting him every play, wouldn't have to hold coverage as long etc...he also seems to be a decent qb for this defense and I like continuity in that role.