Buffalo Barbarian Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 Vince Young. I hope you're kidding, he turns into a diva when things don't go his way, not what we want for the leader of our team who should tough as nails and rally the troops when times are hard.
Beerball Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 Vince Young? Really? Why? Because he looked good at Texas? And dont give me his winning precent in the NFL. That because Tennesse always has had a great D. You play to WIN the game.
offyourocker Posted June 25, 2011 Author Posted June 25, 2011 aside from dockery and TO, the bills never were the type to "catering" to fans that buy merchandise, or whatever you were trying to point out. The problem with the bills is that they fail at both free agency, the draft, and coaching. This new regime has a lot left to prove..... but since the bills had the 3rd worst record last year, I don't think there is anything to diminish. They hit rock bottem last year. There is no "clear direction" in a positive sense that you claim. There is some positive potential with newly drafted players. But other than that, this team is just a huge questionmark that has proven nothing. And until it proves otherwise, it is a team that has failed at the draft and free agency a lot the past 10 years. You don't build through just the draft. You use free agency as well, and even Buddy has said the same thing. Thank you. While I agree that building through the draft is critical, it is not the only piece to the puzzle. Most players drafted take 3 or 4 years before they have a significant impact so that leaves you with very little payback if you are not willing to resign them in FA. The whole "building through the draft" poise from the Bills front office is much more of a ploy to justify not being willing to pay for the right components to make a team sucessful. I am happy with our coaching staff this year as we now have a DC that has proven abilities. But our defense regressed significantly last year because the front office went the cheap way with getting a completely unproven DC.
billsfan89 Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 Resign Poz and Florence, sign a backup QB and add some depth at LB and I will be OK that's what I expect them to do. If they go out and get a Boss, Miller or Calbo that's awesome but not likely.
EastRochBillsfan Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 (edited) Nah, they'll just give increase Chris Kelsay's contract to 10 years and 50M because he gives great quotes after losses. What makes you so sure the current regime knows what it's doing? The 4-12 season? The high profile coaching staff? Last year's draft? The rose colored glasses? Ooops. sorry. just thinking out loud. As for the topic. I'm with the crowd that would like to see a tight end brought in. Maybe we'll be surprised and the'll grab a few free agents like last year. Edited June 25, 2011 by Beerball
NoSaint Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 What about the new CBA? won't that force the bills to spend more? You say that like we are not in the middle of the pack in money spent each year. It's not that we aren't spending, it's that our biggest contracts are the likes of maybin, spiller, Kelsey, mckelvin... When we get high picks or big free agents we have not gotten impact.... Go back a few years and we should have our first round qb in losman and our big FA in dockery... More wasted FA dollars and high picks. Of the teams not spending on a franchise qb, we are actually high on the list. I'd love to see RT, TE and depth in the back 8 on defense as the goals. The first two you can get highend players without killing the cap.
White Linen Posted June 25, 2011 Posted June 25, 2011 What makes you so sure the current regime knows what it's doing? The 4-12 season? The high profile coaching staff? Last year's draft? The rose colored glasses? You make a good point, I should have been more clear that it's my opinion that they know what they are doing. In saying that I'll defend my position. I completely agree with the Nix statement of not being active in free agency. This team needs to concentrate on buiding a core group of players, getting better, and building through the draft. The timing to add components through free agency isn’t now. You’ll always be in rebuild mode if you draft terribly and don’t develop players, always. So it has to start with getting your front office squared away with great leadership and then have him hire people with the ability to do their jobs. Nix is that leader and even better he’s grooming his replacement. If you’ll indulge me, I’ll use fantasy football as an analogy. You draft your team, then you make trades later in the year to strengthen it. The trick is to not do it too soon and give up on a player, etc. But the guy that drafts the best wins every year. It’s the guy that has his 4th round pick explode that wins. Same in real football. The teams that draft the best win. The only caveat to this theory is you MUST find your franshise QB. If the Bills keep up with the build through the draft, sign free agents for depth, and they find they’re franchise QB, then and only then will they become a perennial playoff team. I personally feel that we are in the build through the draft part of this process and therefore think it’s the wrong time to sign big ticket free agents.
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 Vince Young? Really? Why? Because he looked good at Texas? And dont give me his winning precent in the NFL. That because Tennesse always has had a great D. You're incorrect on your claim that Vince Young's record is a function of Tennessee's defense. In the last two seasons, Vince Young's record as a starter is 12-6. During that same time with the same team, Kerry Collins' record is 2-11.
DanInUticaTampa Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 I completely agree with the Nix statement of not being active in free agency. Except he never said he wanted to be inactive during free agency, and his track record doesn't say that either. Last year, 3 of players he signed during FA were in the starting lineup in week one (Edwards, Davis, Green). To say Nix believes in not being active during free agency is completly false. Especially when you consider all the castoffs he grabbed to build the oline depth. Nix believes you use both the draft and free agency to build a team. I don't know why you think otherwise. because he said he doesn't like to sign the big name players? That doesn't mean he is going to be inactive during free agency at all. He even said he is going to sign another tackle in free agency. His words, not mine. I really don't know where you heard that he is going to be inactive during free agency.... and clabo seems like a type of guy they would sign. Though they would probably overpay him, because I am sure that meaningless probowl status is going to let him demand more cash. I really don't think he is out of the realm. But he doesn't excite me that much, except I would consider him better than a stop gap player.
White Linen Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) Except he never said he wanted to be inactive during free agency, and his track record doesn't say that either. Last year, 3 of players he signed during FA were in the starting lineup in week one (Edwards, Davis, Green). To say Nix believes in not being active during free agency is completly false. Especially when you consider all the castoffs he grabbed to build the oline depth. Nix believes you use both the draft and free agency to build a team. I don't know why you think otherwise. because he said he doesn't like to sign the big name players? That doesn't mean he is going to be inactive during free agency at all. He even said he is going to sign another tackle in free agency. His words, not mine. I really don't know where you heard that he is going to be inactive during free agency.... and clabo seems like a type of guy they would sign. Though they would probably overpay him, because I am sure that meaningless probowl status is going to let him demand more cash. I really don't think he is out of the realm. But he doesn't excite me that much, except I would consider him better than a stop gap player. "Nix believes you use both the draft and free agency to build a team." No he doesn't. He believes in building through the draft. How many times does he have to say it? You haven't been paying attention. Two things that are coming out of the Nix camp are, signing Poz is a priority and to not expect the Bills to be actively involved in free agency. Most recently the Pat Moran article http://www.buffalosportsdaily.com/paul-posluszny-far-and-away-bills-top-priority/. But I guess you know. I think your definition of active and mine are different. I think they'll be active to find depth, but not big ticket free agents. Why do I think that? The GM of the team keeps saying it over and over. And then he acts out precisely what he says. Edited June 26, 2011 by Triple Threat
Spiderweb Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) I would love a solid TE also but I am affraid those are not allowed in Buffalo anymore I am kind of going on the assumption that Poz and Florence are coming back. Although Florence might be longer shot Would go with Drayton being the more likely signing than Poz at this point. Poz, good or bad, will likely want more $$ than Dryaton since he already had his big FA signing before he came to the Bills. The Bills got him because he bombed witth Jacksonville. He's also already 30. Edited June 26, 2011 by Spiderweb
DanInUticaTampa Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 "Nix believes you use both the draft and free agency to build a team." No he doesn't. He believes in building through the draft. How many times does he have to say it? Yeah, he says that. But he doesn't say "we aren't going to attack the FA market" like you suggest. If he doesn't believe in signing free agents, then how do you explain signing edwards, davis, green, pears, wrotto, etc? Unless for some reason, you think we drafted all those players....... yeah, nix doesn't believe in free agency, yet he signs plenty of players, not only for depth, but to also be starters. Yeah, that makes sense. really, nix has already said a million times that they are going to sign a QB AND a tackle, at least, when free agency starts. And if nix doesn't sign free agents, how do you explain: Andre Davis Dwan Edwards Reggie Torbor Wrotto Pears Green Etc You just ignore him signing players, and say he builds through the draft? Yeah, he says he builds through the draft. What you don't understand is, building through the draft doesn't mean you ignore free agency. Nix has explained this. What he never said was "ignore free agency." He hasn't said that, at all. On adding a QB via FA: "We're still going to try and do that," Nix said. "We're going to get one. Obviously we're not going into the season with two quarterbacks, so we'll have another one." http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2011/5/2/2148930/ryan-fitzpatrick-buffalo-bills-nfl-draft-2011 Yeah, he isn't going to touch free agency, yet he says they need to sign players via free agency. Do you ever listen to the guy?
White Linen Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 Yeah, he says that. But he doesn't say "we aren't going to attack the FA market" like you suggest. If he doesn't believe in signing free agents, then how do you explain signing edwards, davis, green, pears, wrotto, etc? Unless for some reason, you think we drafted all those players....... yeah, nix doesn't believe in free agency, yet he signs plenty of players, not only for depth, but to also be starters. Yeah, that makes sense. really, nix has already said a million times that they are going to sign a QB AND a tackle, at least, when free agency starts. And if nix doesn't sign free agents, how do you explain: Andre Davis Dwan Edwards Reggie Torbor Wrotto Pears Green Etc You just ignore him signing players, and say he builds through the draft? Yeah, he says he builds through the draft. What you don't understand is, building through the draft doesn't mean you ignore free agency. Nix has explained this. What he never said was "ignore free agency." He hasn't said that, at all. On adding a QB via FA: http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2011/5/2/2148930/ryan-fitzpatrick-buffalo-bills-nfl-draft-2011 Yeah, he isn't going to touch free agency, yet he says they need to sign players via free agency. Do you ever listen to the guy? Once again you don't take the time to read the post. Here it is for the second time. "I think your definition of active and mine are different. I think they'll be active to find depth, but not big ticket free agents." Do you think the free agents you've listed above are building our team? Do you? Or are you going to get caught up in semantics with me again? "Well they are on the team so it is building the team" then I have to say well by build I mean the core players or in other words the best players. This team is going to be built by the draft, it amazes me that you are getting caught up with not being active in Free Agency because we signed Pears.
offyourocker Posted June 26, 2011 Author Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) Once again you don't take the time to read the post. Here it is for the second time. "I think your definition of active and mine are different. I think they'll be active to find depth, but not big ticket free agents." Do you think the free agents you've listed above are building our team? Do you? Or are you going to get caught up in semantics with me again? "Well they are on the team so it is building the team" then I have to say well by build I mean the core players or in other words the best players. This team is going to be built by the draft, it amazes me that you are getting caught up with not being active in Free Agency because we signed Pears. You are pretty poor at substantiating your arguments. Pears is one of 6 guys DanInUticaTampa mentioned. 3 of those were starters at the beginning of the season. Crappy ones but starters. Edited June 26, 2011 by offyourocker
Thoner7 Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) They talked about it on ESPN yesterday. Which means it will never happen. It would be a perfect fit. He is a very good RT and the Bills are in desperate need of one. I am afraid though that with the OT pick out of Clemson (Harriston) the Bills wont spend big money on Clabo. Clabo will be 30 years old this October. has been relatively healthy. The Falcons like him, But think it will be a numbers issue. Vince Young? Really? Why? Because he looked good at Texas? And dont give me his winning precent in the NFL. That because Tennesse always has had a great D. All things equal I believe the Titans w/l % was about 20% better with VY at QB. Id like to see a TE personally. They are key to having a good O, yet the Bills never seem to have one. Edited June 26, 2011 by Thoner7
San Jose Bills Fan Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 Vince Young? Really? Why? Because he looked good at Texas? And dont give me his winning precent in the NFL. That because Tennesse always has had a great D. You're incorrect on your claim that Vince Young's record is a function of Tennessee's defense. In the last two seasons, Vince Young's record as a starter is 12-6. During that same time with the same team, Kerry Collins' record is 2-11. All things equal I believe the Titans w/l % was about 20% better with VY at QB. Looking at just the last two years, the Titans were enormously better with VY at quarterback.
DanInUticaTampa Posted June 26, 2011 Posted June 26, 2011 You are pretty poor at substantiating your arguments. Pears is one of 6 guys DanInUticaTampa. 3 of those were starters at the beginning of the season. Crappy ones but starters. And Dwan Edwards was considered to be a top ten free agent last year by a lot of people. I guess signing starters and signing a top 10 free agent is "staying out of the market" by his definition. It is obvious they are going to sign at least one or two guys to be a starter, or compete to be a starter. Clabo, like people have mentioned, is the type they would sign. He is starting material, but not too flashy. Once again you don't take the time to read the post. Here it is for the second time. "I think your definition of active and mine are different. I think they'll be active to find depth, but not big ticket free agents." Do you think the free agents you've listed above are building our team? Do you? Or are you going to get caught up in semantics with me again? "Well they are on the team so it is building the team" then I have to say well by build I mean the core players or in other words the best players. This team is going to be built by the draft, it amazes me that you are getting caught up with not being active in Free Agency because we signed Pears. I really don't know what you are getting at anymore. If you really think signing starters to longterm contracts means those players aren't going to be a part of this team's future, then you must not know where the team is going. I don't even know what you consider a "big ticket free agent." You think clabo is a big ticket free agent but you think dwan edwards isn't? Clabo is a lesser talent, and the only reason Edwards would be cheaper is because people were worried about his injury. But if you think that clabo is a big ticket free agent, and edwards is small stuff, then you have a pretty odd way to evaluate free agents.
BillsVet Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 I think the key point to take from Nix' comments about building through the draft is that it doesn't mean a team is made exclusively by the draft. And while there are extreme examples of teams who tried to build through free agency (Washington) there are others where it helped them considerably. Chicago has made some major moves in the past two seasons and it vaulted them to the NFC Championship game. It is still critical to have a team that does personnel well, both in the draft and during free agency. Teams without top notch personnel people keep swinging with little to show for it like Buffalo's done for the better part of a decade.
Homey D. Clown Posted June 27, 2011 Posted June 27, 2011 Vince Young. This has to be sarcasm. No-one with any football sense would want this guy even living near their team.
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