Ralph Wilson Stadium to be Smoke Free

[Offside Number 76]

 

 

I hope this question doesn't seem naive, but is it possible to use a nicotine patch as a sort of temporary substitute? If having frequent cigarette breaks is a 100, and if going for four hours without smoking is a zero, what number would a nicotine patch be?

 

It's not naive. I think there are a lot of people who don't understand how this particular addiction works.

 

For me, it's a 95, unless I'm having drinks, in which case it drops to about a 50. That, combined with the losses of inhibition and willpower that result from having even two drinks, makes it really difficult to "stay good." But I made it through an entire Sabres season without making one single trip out to "the corral," so I know it's possible.

 

The problem, as I said early in the thread, is going to be the people who have many drinks (and there are a LOT of them at Bills games and a LOT of them smoke), who need their cigarette to calm down, and who get surly. I do see a short-term rise in idiocy and violence as a result of this policy, and I don't see why the designated smoking areas weren't a good compromise.

 

But ultimately, I don't care that much.

[TheMadCap]

The tobacco plant is native to the Americas, but not to the Old World. From the Wikipedia article you cited: "Frenchman Jean Nicot (from whose name the word nicotine is derived) introduced tobacco to France in 1560, and tobacco then spread to England. The first report of a smoking Englishman is of a sailor in Bristol in 1556. . . . Soon after its introduction to the Old World, tobacco came under frequent criticism from state and religious leaders." From the Wikipedia article about cigarettes: "The widespread smoking of cigarettes in the Western world is largely a 20th century phenomenon – at the start of the century the per capita annual consumption in the USA was 54 cigarettes (with less than 0.5% of the population smoking more than 100 cigarettes per year)." Prior to the 20th century, most tobacco consumption took the form of cigars, pipes, and other non-cigarette methods.

 

I think people would be better off if the tobacco plant didn't exist. But since it does, and since there are smokers, I think there should be a reasonable balance between the right to breathe clean air on the one hand and smokers' cravings on the other. In the past that balance was tilted too heavily towards smokers. I ran track back when I was in high school, and I remember several parents would smoke while at track meets. When you're running the mile and the two mile, you get really, really out of breath. To have the air you're breathing mixed with carbon monoxide-laced secondhand smoke makes a big difference, especially when you need every last oxygen molecule you can possibly acquire. I was also displeased by the fact that there were no physical barriers to prevent the smoke from the smoking sections of restaurants from drifting into non-smoking sections.

 

But to eliminate smoking areas from Ralph Wilson Stadium seems to go too far in the other direction. If the problem is smoke drifting from the smoking area into the rest of the stadium, then maybe put the smoking area a little farther away.

 

It saddens me that people such as Bill from NYC will no longer be attending Bills games because of this. He's been a loyal follower of the Bills through the 15+ years of post-Polian ineptitude. He's seen the Bills throw tons of early picks at RBs, only to throw more early picks at the RB position a few years later in an effort to upgrade/replace the early pick in question. He's seen the Bills throw tons of early picks at DBs, only to watch those DBs go first-contract-and-out. Considering he's endured all that, it would be nice to have him there, in person, to see the Bills finally get turned around. I think this most recent draft is a solid step in that direction.

 

I hope this question doesn't seem naive, but is it possible to use a nicotine patch as a sort of temporary substitute? If having frequent cigarette breaks is a 100, and if going for four hours without smoking is a zero, what number would a nicotine patch be?

 

 

The nic patches are extrememly expensive. It is much more likely to see a rise in smokeless tobacco useage at games such as MST, snuff, and snus products (spitless pouch)since the ban is on SMOKING and doesn't ban TOBACCO PRODUCTS as a whole.

[McBeane]

The tobacco plant is native to the Americas, but not to the Old World. From the Wikipedia article you cited: "Frenchman Jean Nicot (from whose name the word nicotine is derived) introduced tobacco to France in 1560, and tobacco then spread to England. The first report of a smoking Englishman is of a sailor in Bristol in 1556. . . . Soon after its introduction to the Old World, tobacco came under frequent criticism from state and religious leaders." From the Wikipedia article about cigarettes: "The widespread smoking of cigarettes in the Western world is largely a 20th century phenomenon – at the start of the century the per capita annual consumption in the USA was 54 cigarettes (with less than 0.5% of the population smoking more than 100 cigarettes per year)." Prior to the 20th century, most tobacco consumption took the form of cigars, pipes, and other non-cigarette methods.

 

I think people would be better off if the tobacco plant didn't exist. But since it does, and since there are smokers, I think there should be a reasonable balance between the right to breathe clean air on the one hand and smokers' cravings on the other. In the past that balance was tilted too heavily towards smokers. I ran track back when I was in high school, and I remember several parents would smoke while at track meets. When you're running the mile and the two mile, you get really, really out of breath. To have the air you're breathing mixed with carbon monoxide-laced secondhand smoke makes a big difference, especially when you need every last oxygen molecule you can possibly acquire. I was also displeased by the fact that there were no physical barriers to prevent the smoke from the smoking sections of restaurants from drifting into non-smoking sections.

 

But to eliminate smoking areas from Ralph Wilson Stadium seems to go too far in the other direction. If the problem is smoke drifting from the smoking area into the rest of the stadium, then maybe put the smoking area a little farther away.

 

It saddens me that people such as Bill from NYC will no longer be attending Bills games because of this. He's been a loyal follower of the Bills through the 15+ years of post-Polian ineptitude. He's seen the Bills throw tons of early picks at RBs, only to throw more early picks at the RB position a few years later in an effort to upgrade/replace the early pick in question. He's seen the Bills throw tons of early picks at DBs, only to watch those DBs go first-contract-and-out. Considering he's endured all that, it would be nice to have him there, in person, to see the Bills finally get turned around. I think this most recent draft is a solid step in that direction.

 

I hope this question doesn't seem naive, but is it possible to use a nicotine patch as a sort of temporary substitute? If having frequent cigarette breaks is a 100, and if going for four hours without smoking is a zero, what number would a nicotine patch be?

 

Well said. I agree with everything that you just said regarding the bias that has shifted recently. Sure, a nicotine patch can be a substitute, but for a smoker, it won't ever be adequate for a cigarette. On your scale, I'd probably give it 20-30.

[todd]

I'm going to a funeral this weekend for a favorite uncle who was a lifelong smoker who died from cancer. His death was painful, slow and horrible. !@#$ing horrid. In addition, the pain his family has gone through has been very difficult for me to watch.

 

I would hate to lose ONE Bills fan because of this stupid habit, but based on this thread there are a few of you. I'm sorry you ever started.

 

There is no other legal drug that has such a drastic and obvious correlation to severe, long-term health problems, not to mention the pain it puts family members through when they see the awful time these people have dying. So forgive me if I call you out for being dumbasses. Forgive me for not wanting to watch or smell people killing themselves, because right now that's all I can see.

 

Listening to all you people arguing about "rights" and "respect" makes me want to !@#$ing puke. This **** will KILL you, and it sucks. You are going to die, and it will be awful. Makes me upset that people are stupid enough to argue for it.

[NoSaint]

I'm going to a funeral this weekend for a favorite uncle who was a lifelong smoker who died from cancer. His death was painful, slow and horrible. !@#$ing horrid. In addition, the pain his family has gone through has been very difficult for me to watch.

 

I would hate to lose ONE Bills fan because of this stupid habit, but based on this thread there are a few of you. I'm sorry you ever started.

 

There is no other legal drug that has such a drastic and obvious correlation to severe, long-term health problems, not to mention the pain it puts family members through when they see the awful time these people have dying. So forgive me if I call you out for being dumbasses. Forgive me for not wanting to watch or smell people killing themselves, because right now that's all I can see.

 

Listening to all you people arguing about "rights" and "respect" makes me want to !@#$ing puke. This **** will KILL you, and it sucks. You are going to die, and it will be awful. Makes me upset that people are stupid enough to argue for it.

 

What amazes me is how many people can't fathom going without for a mere 3 hours. I dont mean that as a knock on them but testimony for the strength of the addiction. The fact that telling people "no" for 3 hours will be starting fights, cause people to cancel trips, stop buying tickets....for christs sake - you'll sit through those Cleveland games, new England games, snow, rain and awful teams.... But don't you take away my cigs.

[Orton's Arm]

I'm going to a funeral this weekend for a favorite uncle who was a lifelong smoker who died from cancer. His death was painful, slow and horrible. !@#$ing horrid. In addition, the pain his family has gone through has been very difficult for me to watch.

 

I would hate to lose ONE Bills fan because of this stupid habit, but based on this thread there are a few of you. I'm sorry you ever started.

 

There is no other legal drug that has such a drastic and obvious correlation to severe, long-term health problems, not to mention the pain it puts family members through when they see the awful time these people have dying. So forgive me if I call you out for being dumbasses. Forgive me for not wanting to watch or smell people killing themselves, because right now that's all I can see.

 

Listening to all you people arguing about "rights" and "respect" makes me want to !@#$ing puke. This **** will KILL you, and it sucks. You are going to die, and it will be awful. Makes me upset that people are stupid enough to argue for it.

I hear where you're coming from. One of my grandmothers was a longtime smoker. One day she noticed she had trouble breathing. She bought a carbon monoxide detector for her house, thinking that might be the problem. Then doctors told her she had lung cancer. Her ability to breathe slowly diminished. They put her on oxygen. But the lung cancer continued taking away her lungs. Breathing became progressively harder. While there aren't very many great ways to die, the idea of having your ability to breathe taken away from you, little by little, over the course of months, is among the most terrifying. To know that each week it's noticeably harder to breathe than the week before, and that this process will continue to get worse until you're dead. My hope is that the smokers on this board will quit long before such a day comes for them.

 

In the meantime, my concern is that the removal of the designated smoking areas might make smokers feel unwelcome. I don't think that's the message the Bills were intending to send, and I hope that's not how people take it. But I can understand why some might see it in that light.

[Bill from NYC]

That's not a retort that makes any sense. Smoking bothers the **** out of the people around you.

 

But my friend, yours makes little sense imo.

 

A designated smoking are "bothers" people. Everything bothers people in our intolerant society. Two men wearing dresses getting married bothers the s--t out of some people. Are you about keeping laws to ban gay marriages because some people are "bothered" by this?

 

I know, I know, RWS is not a government entity. And in all honesty, this does make the ban easier to tolerate from a political standpoint.

That said, I am calling for Russ Brandon to be fired for this policy, and because he has not done 1 thing to make this team win football games. Now I suppose he will have some supporters due to this ban. People who fiddle while Rome burns.

[Peace]

But my friend, yours makes little sense imo.

 

A designated smoking are "bothers" people. Everything bothers people in our intolerant society. Two men wearing dresses getting married bothers the s--t out of some people. Are you about keeping laws to ban gay marriages because some people are "bothered" by this?

 

I know, I know, RWS is not a government entity. And in all honesty, this does make the ban easier to tolerate from a political standpoint.

That said, I am calling for Russ Brandon to be fired for this policy, and because he has not done 1 thing to make this team win football games. Now I suppose he will have some supporters due to this ban. People who fiddle while Rome burns.

 

Gay marriage, Bills winning, etc. still don't have anything to do with smoking.

 

They don't want the awful smoke stench cloud so they push it off the grounds. I'd love it if they banned it in the parking lots too. It's not a matter of tolerance of something that doesn't press into your personal space--again, they didn't ban fart/skunk spray but you'd want people who sprayed that kicked out. This is really no different. Cigarette smoke reeks and gets in your clothes even after 15 seconds of passing through the cloud so they banned it. Because it's gross.

[eball]

In the meantime, my concern is that the removal of the designated smoking areas might make smokers feel unwelcome. I don't think that's the message the Bills were intending to send, and I hope that's not how people take it. But I can understand why some might see it in that light.

I think the message is that smokING is unwelcome.

 

It is extremely difficult for me to give credence to the complaints of smokers in this matter. The only real explanation is that they're addicts -- and addicts are by nature unreasonable. If it wasn't for the unbelievable wealth and power of the tobacco lobby, these death sticks would have been completely banned decades ago.

 

Look at the freaking new warning labels -- and STILL they are allowed to sell these things. It is mind boggling.

[plenzmd1]

I'm going to a funeral this weekend for a favorite uncle who was a lifelong smoker who died from cancer. His death was painful, slow and horrible. !@#$ing horrid. In addition, the pain his family has gone through has been very difficult for me to watch.

 

I would hate to lose ONE Bills fan because of this stupid habit, but based on this thread there are a few of you. I'm sorry you ever started.

 

There is no other legal drug that has such a drastic and obvious correlation to severe, long-term health problems, not to mention the pain it puts family members through when they see the awful time these people have dying. So forgive me if I call you out for being dumbasses. Forgive me for not wanting to watch or smell people killing themselves, because right now that's all I can see.

 

Listening to all you people arguing about "rights" and "respect" makes me want to !@#$ing puke. This **** will KILL you, and it sucks. You are going to die, and it will be awful. Makes me upset that people are stupid enough to argue for it.

Todd, I am sorry for your loss, I truly am. I doubt there is one person on this board who has not been affected by smoking. Having said that, I have had way more relatives and friends die early early cause of booze , and i see no outcry on this board over banning booze anywhere.Booze kills people,obesity kills people, in short lots of things we do as a modern society kills people. Make the argument all day that smoking should be banned cause you don't like the smell etc....not that it kills people. Dumb argumnet in my mind.

 

And don't go the economic route...that dog don't hunt either.

 

Now in terms of the patches question..be careful out there you smokers. Wore a patch on a plane ride once, got off the plane and had a couple of smokes..heart went into A-Fib. Docs never said it directly related to to much nicotene..but never happened befor or since.

[Bill from NYC]

Gay marriage, Bills winning, etc. still don't have anything to do with smoking.

 

They don't want the awful smoke stench cloud so they push it off the grounds. I'd love it if they banned it in the parking lots too. It's not a matter of tolerance of something that doesn't press into your personal space--again, they didn't ban fart/skunk spray but you'd want people who sprayed that kicked out. This is really no different. Cigarette smoke reeks and gets in your clothes even after 15 seconds of passing through the cloud so they banned it. Because it's gross.

 

Believe it or not, I understand this. However, lots of things are considered gross by lots of people. Some view looking at obese people as gross. How gross is it to see people puke from the booze they consumed at games? I see it all the time; I have been to a game every year since 1994. You know what I do when I see drunks puking, fighting, etc.? I avoid them. Non-smokers were free to avoid smoke by not going out on the ramp. It's not really that hard.

In terms of the game day experience, I dare say that me smoking outside, away from seats, concessions, bathrooms, etc. really isn't the problem at a football game. The true problem (assuming there is one) is alcohol in terms of bringing your wife and children to a game.

 

And Bro, do you have any suggestions about bbqs? There are cars around with gasoline tanks, and people throwing footballs, frisbees, etc. They are a serious injury waiting to happen, not to mention the toxic fumes. And, animal flesh is being cooked. Many are offended by this.

 

I am obviously doing a poor job of making my point, which is that human behavior is not perfect. Imo we are far too judgemental as a society, which is driven by the absolute need to be PC. It has driven us to the point where we are intolerant, unless dealing with a "trendy" issue.

[NoSaint]

Believe it or not, I understand this. However, lots of things are considered gross by lots of people. Some view looking at obese people as gross. How gross is it to see people puke from the booze they consumed at games? I see it all the time; I have been to a game every year since 1994. You know what I do when I see drunks puking, fighting, etc.? I avoid them. Non-smokers were free to avoid smoke by not going out on the ramp. It's not really that hard.

In terms of the game day experience, I dare say that me smoking outside, away from seats, concessions, bathrooms, etc. really isn't the problem at a football game. The true problem (assuming there is one) is alcohol in terms of bringing your wife and children to a game.

 

And Bro, do you have any suggestions about bbqs? There are cars around with gasoline tanks, and people throwing footballs, frisbees, etc. They are a serious injury waiting to happen, not to mention the toxic fumes. And, animal flesh is being cooked. Many are offended by this.

 

I am obviously doing a poor job of making my point, which is that human behavior is not perfect. Imo we are far too judgemental as a society, which is driven by the absolute need to be PC. It has driven us to the point where we are intolerant, unless dealing with a "trendy" issue.

 

 

I didn't know throwing up from alcohol was a-okay. I imagine that might get you in trouble, no?

[TheMadCap]

I think the message is that smokING is unwelcome.

 

It is extremely difficult for me to give credence to the complaints of smokers in this matter. The only real explanation is that they're addicts -- and addicts are by nature unreasonable. If it wasn't for the unbelievable wealth and power of the tobacco lobby, these death sticks would have been completely banned decades ago.

 

Look at the freaking new warning labels -- and STILL they are allowed to sell these things. It is mind boggling.

 

Guess who makes more $$$ on these: The State Governments or Tobacco Companies?

[todd]

Here's what is happening. Smokers have no !@#$ing argument to refute their stupidity and wrongness, so they try to change the subject to booze. It doesn't work.

 

And in the same paragraph, you note how you suspect your addiction and efforts to cope with it cause you to go into A-Fib. Can you see how crazy your arguments are?

 

Todd, I am sorry for your loss, I truly am. I doubt there is one person on this board who has not been affected by smoking. Having said that, I have had way more relatives and friends die early early cause of booze , and i see no outcry on this board over banning booze anywhere.Booze kills people,obesity kills people, in short lots of things we do as a modern society kills people. Make the argument all day that smoking should be banned cause you don't like the smell etc....not that it kills people. Dumb argumnet in my mind.

 

And don't go the economic route...that dog don't hunt either.

 

Now in terms of the patches question..be careful out there you smokers. Wore a patch on a plane ride once, got off the plane and had a couple of smokes..heart went into A-Fib. Docs never said it directly related to to much nicotene..but never happened befor or since.

 

Keep typing, Bill. You're digging yourself a hole made of stupid arguments to support your addiction. None of them work. The issue is smoking, not alcohol or anything else. Smoking, how disgusting it is, how horrible it is for you, how it isn't a right, and how much it bothers and harms others. Not to mention the discourtesy of people who smoke breaking the rules by smoking in the stands. Ban it in the stadium, and now there are no excuses.

 

The fact is, it is a fantastic rule that only has an upside. There's no downside to it at all, other than having a few people who can't stand to be without a cig for 3 hours not go to a game. Maybe they can use that time to re-evaluate priorities.

 

 

 

Believe it or not, I understand this. However, lots of things are considered gross by lots of people. Some view looking at obese people as gross. How gross is it to see people puke from the booze they consumed at games? I see it all the time; I have been to a game every year since 1994. You know what I do when I see drunks puking, fighting, etc.? I avoid them. Non-smokers were free to avoid smoke by not going out on the ramp. It's not really that hard.

In terms of the game day experience, I dare say that me smoking outside, away from seats, concessions, bathrooms, etc. really isn't the problem at a football game. The true problem (assuming there is one) is alcohol in terms of bringing your wife and children to a game.

 

And Bro, do you have any suggestions about bbqs? There are cars around with gasoline tanks, and people throwing footballs, frisbees, etc. They are a serious injury waiting to happen, not to mention the toxic fumes. And, animal flesh is being cooked. Many are offended by this.

 

I am obviously doing a poor job of making my point, which is that human behavior is not perfect. Imo we are far too judgemental as a society, which is driven by the absolute need to be PC. It has driven us to the point where we are intolerant, unless dealing with a "trendy" issue.

[Offside Number 76]

Todd, I am sorry for your loss, I truly am. I doubt there is one person on this board who has not been affected by smoking. Having said that, I have had way more relatives and friends die early early cause of booze , and i see no outcry on this board over banning booze anywhere.Booze kills people,obesity kills people, in short lots of things we do as a modern society kills people. Make the argument all day that smoking should be banned cause you don't like the smell etc....not that it kills people. Dumb argumnet in my mind.

 

And don't go the economic route...that dog don't hunt either.

 

Now in terms of the patches question..be careful out there you smokers. Wore a patch on a plane ride once, got off the plane and had a couple of smokes..heart went into A-Fib. Docs never said it directly related to to much nicotene..but never happened befor or since.

 

You definitely have to commit to not smoking for a while after you remove the patch. You can't just rip it off and light up. And it's very dangerous to smoke with one on. That's why I've found patches to be the best way for me to avoid cigarettes; unlike gum, smokeless tobacco, etc., I am forced to plan ahead if I want to cheat. And that discourages the cheating.

 

As to your other point: of course it's just the smell. Walking past a few smokers in open air is no more dangerous than walking by an idling car or truck, which I'm sure most people do every day without giving it a second thought.

[Gordio]

Here's what is happening. Smokers have no !@#$ing argument to refute their stupidity and wrongness, so they try to change the subject to booze. It doesn't work.

 

And in the same paragraph, you note how you suspect your addiction and efforts to cope with it cause you to go into A-Fib. Can you see how crazy your arguments are?

 

 

 

Keep typing, Bill. You're digging yourself a hole made of stupid arguments to support your addiction. None of them work. The issue is smoking, not alcohol or anything else. Smoking, how disgusting it is, how horrible it is for you, how it isn't a right, and how much it bothers and harms others. Not to mention the discourtesy of people who smoke breaking the rules by smoking in the stands. Ban it in the stadium, and now there are no excuses.

 

The fact is, it is a fantastic rule that only has an upside. There's no downside to it at all, other than having a few people who can't stand to be without a cig for 3 hours not go to a game. Maybe they can use that time to re-evaluate priorities.

Your coming off pretty self righteuos aren't you? I do not smoke either but I did not see the problem with having a designated smoking area. You do not want to smell it here is an idea, avoid the area. Problem solved. The Bills could came out & said if we see anybody smoking outside this area, you kicked out of the game & if your a season ticket holder your banned for the season. My guess is that would detour the crowd that likes to light up inside the stadium. But for you to say noone should do it & it is wrong & it is either your way of thinking & calling people stupid for not thinking like you. Your painting the morality brush pretty thick.

 

One more thing like I said I do not smoke but if they came out and banned drinking on stadium grounds, I would stop going to the games too.

[thebandit27]

Your coming off pretty self righteuos aren't you? I do not smoke either but I did not see the problem with having a designated smoking area. You do not want to smell it here is an idea, avoid the area. Problem solved. The Bills could came out & said if we see anybody smoking outside this area, you kicked out of the game & if your a season ticket holder your banned for the season. My guess is that would detour the crowd that likes to light up inside the stadium. But for you to say noone should do it & it is wrong & it is either your way of thinking & calling people stupid for not thinking like you. Your painting the morality brush pretty thick.

 

One more thing like I said I do not smoke but if they came out and banned drinking on stadium grounds, I would stop going to the games too.

 

And that would be your right, just as it is the right of those that cannot go 3.5 hours without a cigarette to excuse themselves from the games now. I really can't believe this is such a big deal. As I said, even when I was a pack-a-day smoker, I didn't smoke during games, and I hardly consider myself a hero for doing so.

 

To me it was just like working a job where you have to go 3-4 hours without a break, or going to see a long movie, or taking a cross-country flight. You don't shrivel up and die without a smoke. Worst-case scenario is that the game goes to overtime and ends up a tie, which means you go 4 hours without your nicotine fix...I'm sure you've done it before, and you're still here.

[Gordio]

And that would be your right, just as it is the right of those that cannot go 3.5 hours without a cigarette to excuse themselves from the games now. I really can't believe this is such a big deal. As I said, even when I was a pack-a-day smoker, I didn't smoke during games, and I hardly consider myself a hero for doing so.

 

To me it was just like working a job where you have to go 3-4 hours without a break, or going to see a long movie, or taking a cross-country flight. You don't shrivel up and die without a smoke. Worst-case scenario is that the game goes to overtime and ends up a tie, which means you go 4 hours without your nicotine fix...I'm sure you've done it before, and you're still here.

My point is I just do not see what the problem was with the way they had it set up. Let them come out with a zero tolerance policy about if your caught smoking outside this area your kicked out of the game. No exceptions. I do not smoke but far be it for me to tell someone else they can not smoke in a designated area where they are really not affecting anybody. This is going to hurt the Bills bottomline also. Poor decision all the way around imo.

[Rob's House]

And that would be your right, just as it is the right of those that cannot go 3.5 hours without a cigarette to excuse themselves from the games now. I really can't believe this is such a big deal. As I said, even when I was a pack-a-day smoker, I didn't smoke during games, and I hardly consider myself a hero for doing so.

 

To me it was just like working a job where you have to go 3-4 hours without a break, or going to see a long movie, or taking a cross-country flight. You don't shrivel up and die without a smoke. Worst-case scenario is that the game goes to overtime and ends up a tie, which means you go 4 hours without your nicotine fix...I'm sure you've done it before, and you're still here.

It's really not that complicated, and you're pretty obtuse to not get it. People go to work because they have to to earn money. People take a plane because they need to get somewhere. People pay to get into a Bills game to have fun. Because a couple of needlers like you and Todd don't see the big deal tells me nothing about the people who enjoy drinking and smoking at the game. It tells me a great deal about the petty self-righteous types that want "zero-tolerance".

[plenzmd1]

Here's what is happening. Smokers have no !@#$ing argument to refute their stupidity and wrongness, so they try to change the subject to booze. It doesn't work.

 

And in the same paragraph, you note how you suspect your addiction and efforts to cope with it cause you to go into A-Fib. Can you see how crazy your arguments are?

 

 

 

Keep typing, Bill. You're digging yourself a hole made of stupid arguments to support your addiction. None of them work. The issue is smoking, not alcohol or anything else. Smoking, how disgusting it is, how horrible it is for you, how it isn't a right, and how much it bothers and harms others. Not to mention the discourtesy of people who smoke breaking the rules by smoking in the stands. Ban it in the stadium, and now there are no excuses.

 

The fact is, it is a fantastic rule that only has an upside. There's no downside to it at all, other than having a few people who can't stand to be without a cig for 3 hours not go to a game. Maybe they can use that time to re-evaluate priorities.

 

You don't want to use the booze analogy, but your only retort is that smoking is stupid and it kills you. Alcohol alcohol is responsible for as many deaths per year as tobacco (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,146346,00.html) , so I will say then that drinking is stupid and kills you..your an idiot if you ever have more than two beers. Talk about a disgusting habit??? How disgusting it is when I see people peeing in the sinks cause they drank too many beers, how disgusting it is when someone vomits in the seats, how disgusting is the language coming out of people at the game when they are all liquored up...how absolutely CRIMINAL it is when someone kills or injures another human being after a Bills game because they drank to much ,and i would wager dollars to donuts that number is way higher then any link to illness caused by second hand smoke from someone standing outside getting a whiff of smoke 8 days a year.

 

You don't like the smell right next to you..I get it. Make your argument on that..Enforce the friggen rules already there..I am pretty sure every smoker on this board says "throw em out" if they light one in the seats. Banning all smoking cause three people light up in the stands is like banning all alcohol sales cause 3 people got a DUI after the game.

 

 

I hate the smell as well(I got the added bonus of cause it might get me started again), so I got a lot more at risk than you..

Edited June 22, 2011 by plenzmd1