This is Fitz's Team

[Rockinon]

Fitz has the chance to put edwards in the past this season. I think we'll find out quickly whether he can build on last season's growth.

Or not. Have to wait for a season.

[xsoldier54]

You keep replying and you keep calling me troll and you keep making yourself look foolish. Fitz apologists love to "leave out that one game". If you want to do that then leave out the Bengals game where the Bills were dreadful, down 31-7 at the half, then the Bengals had their starting CB, both starting safeties (one who had 2 INTs in the first half) and nickel corner all not play for just about the whole 2nd half. 3 of them never came back out of the tunnel. You are wasting your time because you have shown to be poor in debating and only good at name calling.

 

Edwards and Losman actually won more games and both have more 4th quarter comeback wins and game winning drives then Fitz and both have less starts. Fitz might be the least clutch performer as a QB in the NFL ever for the number of starts he has. Go check out the website pro football reference and see his stats on 4th quarter comebacks. That is a mark of a winner, and Fitz is not.

I won't call you any names, I will just respectfully disagree with your opinion. I agree with some of what you say however. Where we disagree is that I believe Fitz runs the offense better than either Edwards or Losman. I do think he has his limitations. He tends to make bad decisions under pressure, but that can be worked on. I don't think he is the long term answer by any means, but I believe he is serviceable and can run this offense well enough to win. The problem with this team last year was not the offense. The defense was horrible. The offense represented itself well in most games. There were a couple of clunkers in there, but in a 16 game season, that is to be expected. With an improved defense and last year's exact same offensive output, this team could make the playoffs. Again, just my opinion and I respect yours, I just disagree.

[paintmyhouse]

That's truly an idiotic statement. In Edwards' best season he had a measly 11 touchdown passes. Fitzpatrick had 23 last year. Yet you dare to compare the two? Are you dumb? Am I the only one here laughing at these "bold" and idiotic statements being made in this thread? Comparing Edwards to Fitzpatrick? Seriously? WOW, you guys seriously need to stop sniffing the paint thinner brother.

 

It's a good thing that Jim Kelly never played during the modern internet era. In his 11 seasons, Kelly "only" passed the "magical" 60% completion rate 4 times. Dan Marino's career completion percentage is 59%.

 

Ryan Fitzpatrick puts the flippin' ball into the flippin' end zone. If you guys can't see that or don't appreciate that then fine, but don't think you can get away with wildly stupid statements like that one that you made here and not get called out for it.

 

Fitz does not put the ball into the end zone. That is a lie. Bills had 17.7 points a game. That is 28th in the NFL. I am sick of people only using Fitz's 13 games he played. The 3 games he missed were Phins, Jets, and Packers, he would not have done anything against them either, I have explained this already. Complete lie that he puts the ball into the end zone, he puts the ball mostly into the other team's QBS hands by turning the ball over and leading the Bills to a huge number of 3 and outs.

 

You do realize that when Kelly played the no touch on receivers after 5 yards was not in place. This is just in the last 10 year, maybe sooner. This is a huge rule and there are new rules implemented all the time that help increase QB completion percentage and boost the profile of QBs. There is no way you can compare stats from even 10 years ago really, you compare stats to those of your counterparts and Fitz was just about the lowest rated starting QB in the NFL. Bottom 2 or 3.

[Orton's Arm]

That's truly an idiotic statement. In Edwards' best season he had a measly 11 touchdown passes. Fitzpatrick had 23 last year. Yet you dare to compare the two? Are you dumb? Am I the only one here laughing at these "bold" and idiotic statements being made in this thread? Comparing Edwards to Fitzpatrick? Seriously? WOW, you guys seriously need to stop sniffing the paint thinner brother.

 

It's a good thing that Jim Kelly never played during the modern internet era. In his 11 seasons, Kelly "only" passed the "magical" 60% completion rate 4 times. Dan Marino's career completion percentage is 59%.

 

Ryan Fitzpatrick puts the flippin' ball into the flippin' end zone. If you guys can't see that or don't appreciate that then fine, but don't think you can get away with wildly stupid statements like that one that you made here and not get called out for it.

In my earlier post, I wrote that Fitz's stats from 2010 were not markedly different than Edwards' career stats.

 

When evaluating QBs in general, I typically focus on yards per attempt. If QB A is in a West Coast offense and goes 3-3 for 30 yards, and QB B is in a Bradshaw-style offense and goes 1-3 for 30 yards, they'll both have the same yards per attempt. Unlike completion percentage, yards per attempt is a reasonably fair way of comparing West Coast QBs with their non-West Coast counterparts. Importantly, it's also a fair way of comparing QBs whose offensive coordinators call a lot of running plays in the red zone against QBs whose offensive coordinators rely heavily on the passing game when inside the 20. The same cannot be said about TD passes.

 

I have repeatedly acknowledged that Fitz is a better QB than Edwards in some respects. Edwards is too cautious. Sometimes you have to take chances if you're going to have success. Fitz does that, which is part of the reason why he throws more TD passes. (I also suspect Gailey is more likely to call passing plays inside the 20 than Edwards' offensive coordinators were.)

 

But in the all-important yards per attempt stat, Fitz in 2010 failed to materially distinguish himself from Edwards. Fitz's average from 2010 was 6.8 yards per attempt, as compared to 6.5 yards per attempt for Edwards' career average. To put those numbers into perspective, Matt Schaub has averaged 7.8 yards per attempt over the course of his career. That's what a real QB looks like! I'll grant that Schaub has one of the highest yards per attempt stats in the league. Typically, if a QB averages 7.2 yards per attempt, I think he's generally a borderline franchise QB (depending on other factors), with a career average of 7.4 yards per attempt being good enough to distinguish him as a bona fide franchise QB almost regardless of those other factors.

[K Gun Special]

Or not. Have to wait for a season.

 

indeed, although i think its likely there is a season, even if shortenend.

 

In the meantime can someone compare Fitz to billy joe hobert........

[Orton's Arm]

Ya know, everyone looks at the QB and how many games he won, how about we look at the 2008 OC for the Chiefs, 2-14 and the QB slinging the ball all over in losing efforts much the same way Fitz did last year. That same 08 KC team seems so eerily similar to last years Buffalo Bills, with a really bad defense, no running game to speak of and the only bright spot was the QB play in running a spread offense.

 

Now go back and look at the 2010 Chiefs team, only 2 years removed from 2-14 and they make the playoffs, have a top tier QB they are developing and about the best running attack in the NFL now....WHAT HAPPENED!

 

 

in 09 the Chiefs team president Carl Peterson resigned (it was resign or get fired) the Chiefs then steal the NE Patriots VP of player personnel Scott Pioli and he fires the HC in Herm Edwards and hires OC Todd Haley away away from Arizona. Haley tries to make it work with Gailey but then in pre season when he see's so much difference between they way he wants plays called and the offense run, he fires Gailey 2 weeks before the season starts. Todd Haley set up the Chiefs offense and called the plays himself the team improved from 2-14 to 4-12.

 

Then In the 2010 off season GM Pioli and Haley hire ex-patriots coaches in Romeo Crennel as DC, and Charlie Weis as the OC to run the offense. In one year the team went from 4-12 to 10-6, to #14 in offense and #11 in defense. With Thomas Jones as the lead RB and Jamaal Charles who was the #2 RB in the NFL in rushing last year with 1467 yards on 230 attempts, a 6.4 YPC avg. So to those who say 3 yards and a cloud of dust no longer works had better take a long look at last years Chiefs.

 

 

 

The Bottom line in all this is....while everyone is lamenting over the play of the QB.... most are missing the bigger picture. The Chiefs hire some top assistants and get better, way better. The Buffalo Bills hire a bunch of unknown college assistants and get worse. What sucks in my view is that the Bills have an almost viable QB in Fitz who was clearly head and shoulders above anyone the Bills have had at QB in years.(The guy threw for 3000 yards on a totally crap team with both starting WR's on IR) and this GM/HC didn't upgrade his protection. The problem in my view is his OC, his HC, his GM and the defense.

Good post.

 

But there's more that can be added to it. Back when Gailey was the offensive coordinator, the Chiefs had Tyler Thigpen as their QB. His career average is a Trent Edwards-like 6.4 yards per attempt. Going into the 2009 season, they traded for Matt Cassel. Cassel got off to a very rough start with the Chiefs, averaging a mere 5.9 yards per attempt in 2009. (Which is a big reason why the Chiefs went 4-12 that year.) But in 2010, Cassel averaged 6.9 yards per attempt. That dramatic improvement in QB play is a big reason why the Chiefs improved to 10-6.

 

You could point out that Cassel's 6.9 yards per attempt average for 2010 wasn't all that much different than Fitz's average of 6.8 during 2010. And I'll grant that if the Bills managed to create a Chiefs-like OL and running game (with a 6.4 YPC average for the starting RB), and a Chiefs-like defense, they could probably attain a Chiefs-like record of 10-6. If you're building your team with the goal of 10-6, a Fitzpatrick or a Cassel is good enough. But if you're building to win the Super Bowl, you're going to need a lot more than that at QB.

 

I also disagree with the implication that Gailey is part of the problem. He's a guy who's been handed a lot of lemons, and has made lemonade. (That previous statement should be taken figuratively, because Gailey has not, to my knowledge, ever coached Cleo Lemon. But he's still been handed a lot of other lemons at QB!)

[eball]

In my earlier post, I wrote that Fitz's stats from 2010 were not markedly different than Edwards' career stats.

 

When evaluating QBs in general, I typically focus on yards per attempt. If QB A is in a West Coast offense and goes 3-3 for 30 yards, and QB B is in a Bradshaw-style offense and goes 1-3 for 30 yards, they'll both have the same yards per attempt. Unlike completion percentage, yards per attempt is a reasonably fair way of comparing West Coast QBs with their non-West Coast counterparts. Importantly, it's also a fair way of comparing QBs whose offensive coordinators call a lot of running plays in the red zone against QBs whose offensive coordinators rely heavily on the passing game when inside the 20. The same cannot be said about TD passes.

 

I have repeatedly acknowledged that Fitz is a better QB than Edwards in some respects. Edwards is too cautious. Sometimes you have to take chances if you're going to have success. Fitz does that, which is part of the reason why he throws more TD passes. (I also suspect Gailey is more likely to call passing plays inside the 20 than Edwards' offensive coordinators were.)

 

But in the all-important yards per attempt stat, Fitz in 2010 failed to materially distinguish himself from Edwards. Fitz's average from 2010 was 6.8 yards per attempt, as compared to 6.5 yards per attempt for Edwards' career average. To put those numbers into perspective, Matt Schaub has averaged 7.8 yards per attempt over the course of his career. That's what a real QB looks like! I'll grant that Schaub has one of the highest yards per attempt stats in the league. Typically, if a QB averages 7.2 yards per attempt, I think he's generally a borderline franchise QB (depending on other factors), with a career average of 7.4 yards per attempt being good enough to distinguish him as a bona fide franchise QB almost regardless of those other factors.

Hate to call you out on this, EA, but you're kinda backtracking. Your posts #87 and #91 in this thread focus almost exclusively on "accuracy" as your basis for downgrading Fitz. Now, the only thing you look at is YPA? I guess that's because a closer look at the accuracy statistics reveals Fitz isn't really that far off.

 

(and by the way, Fitz has improved his YPA each year -- why so certain that doesn't happen again in 2011?)

[yungmack]

I won't call you any names, I will just respectfully disagree with your opinion. I agree with some of what you say however. Where we disagree is that I believe Fitz runs the offense better than either Edwards or Losman. I do think he has his limitations. He tends to make bad decisions under pressure, but that can be worked on. I don't think he is the long term answer by any means, but I believe he is serviceable and can run this offense well enough to win. The problem with this team last year was not the offense. The defense was horrible. The offense represented itself well in most games. There were a couple of clunkers in there, but in a 16 game season, that is to be expected. With an improved defense and last year's exact same offensive output, this team could make the playoffs. Again, just my opinion and I respect yours, I just disagree.

I find your post to be level-headed and accurate.

 

As to those who stress stats to show that there isn't really that much difference between Edwards and Fitz, this shows the limitation of reliance on stats. I would suggest you rely on your eyes instead. What I saw with Fitz last season was a guy whose focus was downfield, a guy who'd risk putting the ball into tight coverage, a guy who took off running only when it was the last option and made sense. All the statistical comparisons in the world can not cover up Edwards's inability to accomplish any of those things.

 

Many of the problems the offense had last year were caused by a horrible defense not being able to get the opponent's offense off the field, which let them score more, which forced the offense to play from behind too often. When you're in that one-dimensional situation, the opponent knows you're going to have to go to the air and so adjusts, heavily covering your receivers and sending the blitz. So naturally the offensive stats go down. An improved D this year should mean less scoring by the opponents, more opportunities for scoring by the Bills (along with less desperation to catch up) and a more balanced attack. If that situation comes to pass, which it should, then Fitz's passes (or any QB's) will be less risky/desperate and more "high percentage." That alone should improve his stats.

 

Is Fitz the greatest QB in NFL history? Of course not. Is he the best in the league right now? No he is not. Could he become a top ten QB? Probably not but who really knows. But the comparison that matters is not with the rest of the league but with the Bills QBs of recent vintage. And there the difference between Fitz and Edwards/Losman is day-and-night. Until the Bills find that mythical "franchise QB," Fitz gives the offense the best chance its had for success in this past decade.

[john]

I am so excited about this upcoming season and this debate is really getting my blood flowing. I've very much enjoyed reading this post over the last several days and I thank everyone who has contributed in a respectful and courteous manner.

Regardless of whether or not Fitz is the answer and regardless of whether or not he takes a big jump in his overall game this season, I do believe the Bills will show a much better product on the field because of these two basic reasons:

1.) The defense was addressed in the draft and can only get better this season.

2.) Year 2 in Gailey's system for the entire offense will only make them more confident, comfortable, and efficient.

 

I know these are very basic and 'thanks for stating the obvious' reasons, but on the surface, they should both seriously translate to many more wins this year. Avoiding injuries to key players is, as always, huge.

Go Buffalo!!

[eball]

I am so excited about this upcoming season and this debate is really getting my blood flowing. I've very much enjoyed reading this post over the last several days and I thank everyone who has contributed in a respectful and courteous manner.

Regardless of whether or not Fitz is the answer and regardless of whether or not he takes a big jump in his overall game this season, I do believe the Bills will show a much better product on the field because of these two basic reasons:

1.) The defense was addressed in the draft and can only get better this season.

2.) Year 2 in Gailey's system for the entire offense will only make them more confident, comfortable, and efficient.

 

I know these are very basic and 'thanks for stating the obvious' reasons, but on the surface, they should both seriously translate to many more wins this year. Avoiding injuries to key players is, as always, huge.

Go Buffalo!!

Many of us are excited for these reasons as well. Any discourteous-ness that came out in my responses is out of frustration with people who claim to KNOW all of the answers without giving things a chance to play out.

[Orton's Arm]

Hate to call you out on this, EA, but you're kinda backtracking. Your posts #87 and #91 in this thread focus almost exclusively on "accuracy" as your basis for downgrading Fitz. Now, the only thing you look at is YPA? I guess that's because a closer look at the accuracy statistics reveals Fitz isn't really that far off.

 

(and by the way, Fitz has improved his YPA each year -- why so certain that doesn't happen again in 2011?)

Fitz is not a particularly accurate QB. That lack of accuracy is why his yards per attempt stat from 2010 isn't that much better than Edwards' career average. His lack of accuracy is also why his yards per attempt is so far away from the best QBs in the league.

[Adam]

Fitz has many of the same problems as his predecesors- a terrible OL, weak offensive weapons and a bad defense. We need to invest more draft picks in the QB position while the rest of the roster continues to rot away......

[paintmyhouse]

Game 1 versus Miami --> defense was good, offense sucked, 6 total 3 and outs.

Game 2 versus Green Bay --> champs, offense was not terrible in first half, but they did not have the ball much at all. 13-7 at half, defense held but was truly tired, especially after the WRs messed up in the 2nd half and had two passes stripped from them on plays that should have been completions. Bills gave up on offense and ran the ball. Defense was not terrible even though Green Bay had over 30. Defense kept Bills in the game for a while.

Game 3 versus New England --> Bills kicked FGs, Pats scored TDs. Bills had 4 FG attempts and could not score red zone TDs. No shame in letting up points to New England, they scored almost 33 freaking points a game! Not to mention Fitz was outplayed by Brady, Fitz 2 picks, Brady had 0. I can't kill the defense on this game. Bills were in this game.

Game 4 versus Jets --> Can't kill the defense here either. Offense sucked. 4 of the first 6 drives were 3 and outs, and 1 of the other we got a first down on first down and then 3 and out, basically 5 of the first 6 drives were 3 and out. If your offense makes your defense play the whole time, they will break down in the 2nd half, and the early second half fumble by Lynch set it over. Bills were in the game at the half, just 17-7 despite the offense sucking horribly, defense was good in the first half.

Game 5 versus Jacksonville --> Fitz outplayed again by Garrard. Bills defense and ST gave the Bills 2 early turnovers that the offense turned into a 29 and 22 yard FG. Offense blew a chance to turn Jags into one dimensional passing team but that didn't happen. Bills were up early, they blew it. They had 4 total 3 and outs, and 3 of those in the 2nd half. Bills offense once again puts defense in a bad spot against a run heavy ball control team. This was a joint effort in failure, Bills did not turn the ball over, but had 4 total 3 and outs and scored just 6 points off of 2 turnovers deep in Jags territory and the defense could not stop them, but did get worn down.

Edited May 27, 2011 by paintmyhouse

[Rockinon]

Game 1 versus Miami --> defense was good, offense sucked, 6 total 3 and outs.

Game 2 versus Green Bay --> champs, offense was not terrible in first half, but they did not have the ball much at all. 13-7 at half, defense held but was truly tired, especially after the WRs messed up in the 2nd half and had two passes stripped from them on plays that should have been completions. Bills gave up on offense and ran the ball. Defense was not terrible even though Green Bay had over 30. Defense kept Bills in the game for a while.

Game 3 versus New England --> Bills kicked FGs, Pats scored TDs. Bills had 4 FG attempts and could not score red zone TDs. No shame in letting up points to New England, they scored almost 33 freaking points a game! Not to mention Fitz was outplayed by Brady, Fitz 2 picks, Brady had 0. I can't kill the defense on this game. Bills were in this game.

Game 4 versus Jets --> Can't kill the defense here either. Offense sucked. 4 of the first 6 drives were 3 and outs, and 1 of the other we got a first down on first down and then 3 and out, basically 5 of the first 6 drives were 3 and out. If your offense makes your defense play the whole time, they will break down in the 2nd half, and the early second half fumble by Lynch set it over. Bills were in the game at the half, just 17-7 despite the offense sucking horribly, defense was good in the first half.

Game 5 versus Jacksonville --> Fitz outplayed again by Garrard. Bills defense and ST gave the Bills 2 early turnovers that the offense turned into a 29 and 22 yard FG. Offense blew a chance to turn Jags into one dimensional passing team but that didn't happen. Bills were up early, they blew it. They had 4 total 3 and outs, and 3 of those in the 2nd half. Bills offense once again puts defense in a bad spot against a run heavy ball control team. This was a joint effort in failure, Bills did not turn the ball over, but had 4 total 3 and outs and scored just 6 points off of 2 turnovers deep in Jags territory and the defense could not stop them, but did get worn down.

2 of the 5 games you just listed, Fitz did not play in. Yea, that's not relevant .

Edited May 27, 2011 by Rockinon

[paintmyhouse]

2 of the 5 games you just listed, Fitz did not play in. Yea, that's not relevant .

 

I can go on....besides, I said the offense let the team down. Bills played Ravens the next game and Fitz once again was outplayed. In that Ravens game Fitz had 2 big INTs, and Bills lost 2 fumbles and Gailey had Fitz in shotgun on a 4th and 1 yard line when the Bills were down a field goal at the Ravens 34 and Fitz took a sack. Bills were up at the half 24-13 and first play of the 2nd half Fitz was in shotgun and threw a dumb INT and the next play Ravens got a touchdown, bad Bills QB play and bad Gailey calls on offense. Flacco had 0 INTS. You get ouplayed at QB you typically lose.

 

In games after that, the defense really did not play that bad all season after that. It was an inept offense with lots of turnovers and 3 and outs that contributed big time to losing. It is undeniable, Bills just did not do nearly enough on offense. I think the defense played better in the last 10 games, but the offense just crapped on the defense the whole time with poor play, much of it on Fitz stinking and bad play calling.

Edited May 27, 2011 by paintmyhouse

[thewildrabbit]

Good post.

 

But there's more that can be added to it. Back when Gailey was the offensive coordinator, the Chiefs had Tyler Thigpen as their QB. His career average is a Trent Edwards-like 6.4 yards per attempt. Going into the 2009 season, they traded for Matt Cassel. Cassel got off to a very rough start with the Chiefs, averaging a mere 5.9 yards per attempt in 2009. (Which is a big reason why the Chiefs went 4-12 that year.) But in 2010, Cassel averaged 6.9 yards per attempt. That dramatic improvement in QB play is a big reason why the Chiefs improved to 10-6.

 

You could point out that Cassel's 6.9 yards per attempt average for 2010 wasn't all that much different than Fitz's average of 6.8 during 2010. And I'll grant that if the Bills managed to create a Chiefs-like OL and running game (with a 6.4 YPC average for the starting RB), and a Chiefs-like defense, they could probably attain a Chiefs-like record of 10-6. If you're building your team with the goal of 10-6, a Fitzpatrick or a Cassel is good enough. But if you're building to win the Super Bowl, you're going to need a lot more than that at QB.

I also disagree with the implication that Gailey is part of the problem. He's a guy who's been handed a lot of lemons, and has made lemonade. (That previous statement should be taken figuratively, because Gailey has not, to my knowledge, ever coached Cleo Lemon. But he's still been handed a lot of other lemons at QB!)

So far that Lemonade is very bitter right now as the team got worse last season and not better!

 

Clearly the difference between Todd Haley and Chan Gailey have been the asistants they chose to hire, or perhaps it was at Scott Pioli's insistence. Nevertheless the turn around from a very bad 2-14 team in 08 to 4-12 in 09, then to 10-6 last year is a very dramatic change. Plus the new GM brought in players thru free agency and the draft that have made an impact.

 

The Bills are still waiting for any of last years drafted players to make a significant impact. -GM failure

 

 

You think Gailey was the entire reason Fitz played as well as he did last year, I disagree as Fitz was already the chosen starter over Edwards the previous season by Perry Fewell. All Chan Gailey managed to do is waste and entire off season grooming a QB he would cut two weeks into the season. C'mon, tell me that doesn't sound like a complete boneheaded Jauron type move. Edwards cut, Brohm released, looks to me like Gailey already failed on 2 of 3 young QB's so far. Isn't this man supposed to be a QB guru?- coaching failure

 

Gailey names CJ Spiller the starter for the season opener, and he only had 7 attempts for 6 yards, this was the very same RB that Gailey Boldly stated would make the O line block better. This RB didn't know the playbook, he didn't know how to block, couldn't find the hole or run his routes, how does this player even get named starter? Fred Jackson had to enter the game with an injured hand in a cast because the starter didn't have a clue. (Just an interesting side note Spiller has not been practicing with the Bills players this off season that I have heard of, I don't see how he will improve his lot as a RB) - coaching failure

 

Cornell Green, how on gods green earth does this player get signed by the new GM for 3 million a year or more importantly how does he make it to even become a starter at RT, was nobody watching him play in preseason? This player was so bad that he couldn't even step in front of the opposing defender to slow them down for a millisecond - he was benched over some mysterious injury and then quietly released- GM & coaching failure

 

The defense, Perry Fewell had that defense playing better for him then it did with Jauron still they were the 16 ranked defense and the secondary was in the top 5 in 09. Then Gailey took over and the team switched to a 3-4 when they didn't have the personnel for it, the result was a disaster a being the worst defense against the run the Buffalo Bills ever fielded, they ranked 32 in the league against the run.- GM & HC failure

 

The Bills ranked 28th in offense and 28th in defense in 2010

 

My opinion on Chan Gailey is nothing more then a dick Jauron clone only for the offense. Every area of this team got worse rather then better with one exception, the passing offense and I think that had more to do with Fitz himself as a player then Gailey calling the plays. remember Gailey spent most of the pre season grooming Edwards.

 

Perhaps Gailey and Nix both have this grand 5 year plan that will make everything better by 2015, because at the rate they are going it will take that long. I know I'm in the minority right now about Gailey, sok you guys will come around by next year.

[paintmyhouse]

I will agree with Harvey, Gailey out thinks himself on offense like Jauron on defense.

[1billsfan]

In my earlier post, I wrote that Fitz's stats from 2010 were not markedly different than Edwards' career stats.

 

When evaluating QBs in general, I typically focus on yards per attempt. If QB A is in a West Coast offense and goes 3-3 for 30 yards, and QB B is in a Bradshaw-style offense and goes 1-3 for 30 yards, they'll both have the same yards per attempt. Unlike completion percentage, yards per attempt is a reasonably fair way of comparing West Coast QBs with their non-West Coast counterparts. Importantly, it's also a fair way of comparing QBs whose offensive coordinators call a lot of running plays in the red zone against QBs whose offensive coordinators rely heavily on the passing game when inside the 20. The same cannot be said about TD passes.

 

I have repeatedly acknowledged that Fitz is a better QB than Edwards in some respects. Edwards is too cautious. Sometimes you have to take chances if you're going to have success. Fitz does that, which is part of the reason why he throws more TD passes. (I also suspect Gailey is more likely to call passing plays inside the 20 than Edwards' offensive coordinators were.)

 

But in the all-important yards per attempt stat, Fitz in 2010 failed to materially distinguish himself from Edwards. Fitz's average from 2010 was 6.8 yards per attempt, as compared to 6.5 yards per attempt for Edwards' career average. To put those numbers into perspective, Matt Schaub has averaged 7.8 yards per attempt over the course of his career. That's what a real QB looks like! I'll grant that Schaub has one of the highest yards per attempt stats in the league. Typically, if a QB averages 7.2 yards per attempt, I think he's generally a borderline franchise QB (depending on other factors), with a career average of 7.4 yards per attempt being good enough to distinguish him as a bona fide franchise QB almost regardless of those other factors.

 

 

Well that's your problem right there. I'd advise you to concentrate more on the touchdown pass stat when evaluating quarterbacks. That way you'll have a lower probability of making foolish statements like your comparison of Fitzpatrick to Edwards.

 

Fitzpatrick is a hundred times better than Edwards. Edwards couldn't find the flippin' endzone if Dakota Fanning was doing cartwheels in it.

[Rockinon]

I can go on....besides, I said the offense let the team down. Bills played Ravens the next game and Fitz once again was outplayed. In that Ravens game Fitz had 2 big INTs, and Bills lost 2 fumbles and Gailey had Fitz in shotgun on a 4th and 1 yard line when the Bills were down a field goal at the Ravens 34 and Fitz took a sack. Bills were up at the half 24-13 and first play of the 2nd half Fitz was in shotgun and threw a dumb INT and the next play Ravens got a touchdown, bad Bills QB play and bad Gailey calls on offense. Flacco had 0 INTS. You get ouplayed at QB you typically lose.

 

In games after that, the defense really did not play that bad all season after that. It was an inept offense with lots of turnovers and 3 and outs that contributed big time to losing. It is undeniable, Bills just did not do nearly enough on offense. I think the defense played better in the last 10 games, but the offense just crapped on the defense the whole time with poor play, much of it on Fitz stinking and bad play calling.

Once again? Man you have a serious case of tunnel vision.

[paintmyhouse]

Once again? Man you have a serious case of tunnel vision.

 

How so, please explain. I can debate just fine on this, however, you have no comebacks at all. Your last two rebuttals to me describing what actually happened were one liners that did not even try to show what I wrote is not true.