For Those Of You Who Don't Want QB In 1st or 2nd

[InDaZone]

We don't need a QB, we need the right QB. But that goes for any position.

I do believe Nix and Gailey NEED to get a QB. They are picking #3 and basically have the opportunity to pick any QB they want. A 2nd year HC and GM need to identify and find their franchise QB. That's normally how you rebuild. Not sure how long their contracts are or how long Ralph will wait for a QB ... after he said multiple times last season they need to find a QB.

[pBills]

My only problem with not drafting Gabbert this year is that we then have to wait to next to MAYBE have the opportunity to get Luck. Then wait a year or so for him to start. Drafting Gabbert gives us at least one year for him to get ready behind Fitz.

[robertpaul49]

I agree with Buddy Nix that if the Bills select based solely on need then they will have two holes to fill. My major concern is that there is a lot of hype about quarterbacks in this draft, not because there are a lot of quarterbacks available, but because so many teams seem to need quarterbacks.

 

I really hope the Bills stop giving up so much to get marginal quarterback talent. I was happier with how the team dealt with Trent than J.P. in that they did not reach for him nor did they give up a lot to get him. He looked good there for a little while, but they had to move on.

 

I think that Pittsburg and the Jets handled the quarterback position the best, which is why I hope the Bills pass on a quarterback this year. Both teams made sure to have quality players around them before drafting a quarterback, which increases the odds the quarterback will be successful. Even Indi did that with Payton Manning. They drafted offensive tackles in the first two rounds the year before they drafted a quarterback. Sure, they were bad for an additional year, but they have been good for a lot longer than the Bills.

[PS 56]

Why do we need to draft a QB this year? Will Ponder or Mallett or any other 2nd/3rd round draft choice be as good or better than Fitzy? Lets use all of our picks on the D and the Offensive Line. Sign Volek or Thigpen as our backup and look to next yrs 2012 draft for the QB of the future. Can we trade up for Luck next yr, when all the teams needing QB's drafted one in this years draft?

 

Teams needing QB's: Buffalo, Carolina, Cincy, Arz, Tenn, Minny, SF, WASH, Miami, Denver

 

At least 7 teams will take their Qb's this yr...

 

I agree with you. We don't NEED to make a quaterback selection, however long term we do need to go down that path. If a good selection is available in this draft I say we take it. I just want to be sure that regardless of position, we take the best available player....

[Thoner7]

The same people who claim that the Bills don't need a QB in the draft will be the same ones who will be crying for a QB next winter, if Fitz turns in a medicore season in 2011.

 

I dont see a problem with that at all. I know this has been discussed a thousand times but do we need a franchise QB? Yes, everyone agrees. Is there a Franchise QB in this draft? I say no, others say yes. So, while I want a QB, I dont want us to "waste" a pick on one. Id rather have a starting LB or DE or RT.

 

I would rather take one next year. we have a better than 1/32 chance at Luck, and there may be a couple other top QBs. The guys in this draft just strick me a 2nd rounders. Thes best QB available is Kolb IMO, and no I dont want to trade for him.

Edited April 28, 2011 by Thoner7

[Albany,n.y.]

I predict the Bills will get the right guy at QB when they have a draft where the right guy is available where they're picking. Personally, I don't think there is a right guy available in this year's draft. It has happened before, when no QB in the entire draft was worth anything yet teams still reached based on the logic that they had to draft a QB. It's the same logic that had (some) people screaming for Clausen at #9 last year, when Bradford was the only 1st round QB out there (sorry Tebow/Denver reaching for him fans).

 

Most times a team reaches out of desperation, it ends badly.

 

If you think we'll find gold at QB in the 2nd round, we've never found QB gold in the 2nd round of the NFL draft. These are the fab 4 we've taken in the 2nd, and these guys were taken when there were fewer teams and 2nd rounders were closer to the top than today: Todd Collins, Matt Kofler, Gene Bradley, Dennis Shaw.

[Hplarrm]

Or we can blow a number one pick and trade for Rob Johnson. Or we can blow a number one pick and draft JP. Or we can blow a number one pick and trade for Bledsoe. I am sick of wasting first round picks on mediocre/****ty QB's

Or we can blow a number one pick and trade for Rob Johnson. Or we can blow a number one pick and draft JP. Or we can blow a number one pick and trade for Bledsoe. I am sick of wasting first round picks on mediocre/****ty QB's

My sense from paying too much attention to the NFL over the years (at least according what my wife says) is that the Bills did not make a critical error in spending a 1st round pick on either Bledsoe or RJ. They paid the market rate of a 1st round pick for both a vet who had shown potential in RJ leading Jax to some wins and Bledsoe in being a QB who had led a team to the SB in his younger days and as recently as the previous season had thrown the winning TD in a must win game for the Pats.

 

I had no problem with them giving up a first since as we have seen time and again with picks like Mike Williams or Marshawn Lynch (or AT giving us a 1st rounder for nothing in their trade for Peerless, 1st round picks are not a certainty at all to be that valuable that it is foolish to trade them.

 

Instead, I think the Bills made other decisions once they had these two failed QBs which were the critical errors. Specifically:

 

1. A 1st round pick was the market value for RJ, but the mistake was giving him a guaranteed salary through a huge bonus which he had in his pocket without regard to how well he played or whether he was injury prone as he turned out to be.

 

RJ had demonstrated two things in his Jax stint: A. He could play NFL ball. B. he had suffered an injury which knocked him out of his starting QB role after he led the team to victory.

 

The simple fact was that there was no QB available in the draft who had demonstrated for sure he could play NFL football. A 1st round pick for a QB who had demonstrated he could do that was a reasonable price to pay. The mistake was guaranteeing the deal without a demonstration that RJ was not injury prone. He turned out to be injury prone which I define as losing playing time 3 times in 2 seasons to different types of injuries. Jim Kelly for example likely lost a similar amount of PT at various points in his career. However, it was almost always the bursa sack. RJ on the other hand was anytime he got hit, one day it was a concussion, the next time it was a collarbone, once it was his chest as he fell on the pointy end of the football.

 

Even worse, the Bills had signed Doug Flutie to a small investment make good contract. When RJ turned out to be injury prone and DF played like we hoped he would, by rule all of his obtained bonueses rolled into his base contract. Even tougher for the cap all of his obtained bonuses paid rolled into the next cap calculation. The Bills had no choice but to extend the DF contract to spread his base pay and obtained bonuses cap hit over a longer contract.

 

RJ and his agent correctly threatened the Bills that unless they signed him long term before the season they would not negotiate during the season. Smart move on their part.

 

However, if the Bills had simply made him play and then when he proved himself to not be injury prone, at worse they may had to pay RJ a premium to get him to sign. It was stupid not to trade the going market rate of a 1st round pick for a demonstrated NFL QB. What was stupid was guaranteeing the deal without evidence he could be relatively injury free.

 

2. Likewise with Bledsoe. A first round pick was actually a small price to pay for a proven SB reaching QB. In fact, the results of this deal was in fact a wash for the Bills as he played extraordinarily well his first year (he deserved his Pro Bowl nod and if you disagree then simply name the QBs who you insist were good that year). However, Belicheat was willing to depart company with Bledsoe because he saw what he had in Brady and also concluded correctly he could beat Bledsoe twice the next year and when he showed how to do it Bledsoe would be toast.

 

This happened.

 

The mistake the Bills made was not in paying what was easily the market rate for a QB withe Bledsoe's proven weaknesses and proven strengths. The problem was extending his deal when he was clearly on the downhill side of production for the Bills.

 

In general I think the conventional wisdom over-values the draft. Wishful thinking dubs every QB a Peyton manning and the Ryan Leaf. Akili Smith. Joey harringtons, JaMarcus Russells are quickly forgotten.

 

My sense is that while good players tend to get drafted and good players have to come from somewhere, that in general trading draft picks for demonstrated value of vets is not a bad deal.

 

The stupid moves at least in these two cases came afterwards in lousy contract management and decision-making by the Bills FO.

[bearc012]

Fitz isn't the long term answer, but he's serviceable. We won't win a super bowl with him, but I don't think a return to the playoffs is out of the question if we can build up the defense and OL with some good, young talent.

 

This year's QB class is awful. There's not a single guy that gets me excited about the future. Newton played a simple one read offense and his maturity sucks. Gabbert has tools but has lacked accuracy and has no experience in a pro system. Ponder has no arm strength. Dalton does a lot of things well for a college QB but nothing well enough to be more than a pro backup. Kaepernick is a tremendous athlete with a strong arm but his mechanics are shite and he's very inaccurate.

 

I say wait til next year or the year after. Fitz is relatively young and made some real strides last year despite getting knocked around every game. Let's build up his supporting cast and see what he can do.

[LabattBlue]

I say wait til next year or the year after. Fitz is relatively young and made some real strides last year despite getting knocked around every game. Let's build up his supporting cast and see what he can do.

So who are the "can't miss" QB's in the 2012 and 2013 drafts that are so much better than Gabbert. Forget about Luck. The Bills will finish 5-11 or 6-10 and nowhere near the top pick in the draft.

[MikeSpeed]

I'm as QB hungry as anyone. I don't think you can win in the NFL without one, and I think if you find a long term answer at Qb, you set yourself up for the next 10 years of making playoff runs and competing for championships.

 

And, to that end, I am of the belief that we have already seen the best Ryan Fitzpatrick has to offer, and that with him at the helm we are limited.

 

With that being said, I absolutely despise this QB class. Sometimes things don't fall your way, and as Bills fans it seems like those times happen a lot, but in the year we pick 3rd in the draft, the QB class is as unproven and weak as any class in recent memory. Taking Blaine Gabbert 3rd overall doesn't make him any better than what he is. He was an average college football player, who like Losman, may test well athletically, but didn't look like an athlete on the field.

 

Buffalo HAS to address QB, but my analogy is......they just won a $10,000 shopping spree (having the 3rd pick), but the only place they are allowed to go is Wal-Mart.

+1000000

Pre-draft post of the year!

[Albany,n.y.]

Here's my reply to Hplarrm:

There was ample evidence that Rob Johnson had a fatal flaw in his game-he held on to the ball too long. That evidence was available BEFORE the Bills traded for him. While I was eventually swayed by the company line, my 1st impression of RJ was it was a bad deal. All I had to do was look at his pro stats & college scouting reports to post my 1st reaction to the proposed trade. I put up a post titled "Rob Johnson-The Sacked Man" The sack to pass ratio he had was too glaring to ignore. He was not "injury prone" per se, he held on to the ball too long & got sacked too much. Anyone, no matter how durable cannot survive in the NFL playing QB the way he did without getting injured sooner or later.

The Bills scouts blew it by ignoring his fatal flaw & while paying a market value, the market value was too high for a prudent team. Unfortunately, looking at all the squandered 1st rounders since the glory days, it is quite evident the Bills do not rank among the smarter scouting departments and front offices in the NFL.

If a rank amateur like me could spot the flaw in Johnson's game before the trade, the Bills management was beyond incompetent to trade a 1 & 4 for Johnson.

It wasn't bad luck, it was lack of due diligence.

 

I have a lot less criticism for the Bledsoe trade because he had had success with NE before the trade and it was done to give Gregg Williams a fighting chance to make it as a head coach in the league.

[BuffaloBaumer]

Why do we need to draft a QB this year? Will Ponder or Mallett or any other 2nd/3rd round draft choice be as good or better than Fitzy? Lets use all of our picks on the D and the Offensive Line. Sign Volek or Thigpen as our backup and look to next yrs 2012 draft for the QB of the future. Can we trade up for Luck next yr, when all the teams needing QB's drafted one in this years draft?

 

Teams needing QB's: Buffalo, Carolina, Cincy, Arz, Tenn, Minny, SF, WASH, Miami, Denver

 

At least 7 teams will take their Qb's this yr...

 

If Luck's stock continues to rise (if that is possible), any one of those teams would pick Luck for BPA possibility. They would either play him or trade him....It would not matter if they spent a previous first rounder on a ?? QB the year before

[markgbe]

defense , the end.

Edited April 28, 2011 by markgbe

[jumbalaya]

Why do we need to draft a QB this year? Will Ponder or Mallett or any other 2nd/3rd round draft choice be as good or better than Fitzy? Lets use all of our picks on the D and the Offensive Line. Sign Volek or Thigpen as our backup and look to next yrs 2012 draft for the QB of the future. Can we trade up for Luck next yr, when all the teams needing QB's drafted one in this years draft?

 

Teams needing QB's: Buffalo, Carolina, Cincy, Arz, Tenn, Minny, SF, WASH, Miami, Denver

 

At least 7 teams will take their Qb's this yr...

None of the QBs this year are no-misses. St Louis and Detroit got the last two and Stafford has durability issues. Half of the top 7 QBs this year won't make it. Of the ones that do only one maybe two will be franchise guys. The problem is that no one knows which one of the 7 will be that franchise guy. We drafted a developmental guy last year we won't know about him for 2 more years. Fitz is average. The only way t win with an average guy is to have an outstanding defense. The Colts, even with Peyton Manning, only won the SB when they had an outstanding defense. They key is very tough defense and a rock solid offensive line. Brady behind a shaky like looks average. Get the right linemen and the QBs and WRs and RBs can look like superstars.

Edited April 28, 2011 by jumbalaya

[freester]

So who are the "can't miss" QB's in the 2012 and 2013 drafts that are so much better than Gabbert. Forget about Luck. The Bills will finish 5-11 or 6-10 and nowhere near the top pick in the draft.

What makes you think we will be 6-10? Buddy took a 6-10 team and made it 4-12. He did virtually nothing to upgrade the mediocre talent. At this pace we will likely be 2-14. We will definitely be in the running for Luck.

[Cson76]

I am ok with Fitzgerald starting this year, and signing a veteran QB to back him up (plenty of them out there). Next year is where I would draft my QB of the future. What good is drafting a QB if the line is shot and the defense is amongst the worst in the NFL? Give the QB a chance to be successful

 

 

You assume that there is a franchise QB other than Luck next year. They don't come around that often. Not saying there is one here, I'm not qualified to make that call. But I do no that you can't assume there will be one there next year either.

[bearc012]

So who are the "can't miss" QB's in the 2012 and 2013 drafts that are so much better than Gabbert. Forget about Luck. The Bills will finish 5-11 or 6-10 and nowhere near the top pick in the draft.

 

 

I'm sorry, I didn't realize that everyone knew last year that the top 2 QBs in this year's draft would be Cam Newton and Blaine Gabbert. A lot happens in a year, guys develop into viable 1st round picks (Gabbert), guys don't develop the way they should and fall (Locker), and some guys surface out of the blue (Newton). That, at this time, there's one purportedly complete QB for next year's draft (Luck, who could still fall if he turns in a Locker-esque senior season), does not detract from the fact that this year's QB class is weak. Assuming next year is atleast a return to normalcy, there should be more options, and who knows, several strong prospects could emerge over the course of an ENTIRE college season.

[Pete]

You assume that there is a franchise QB other than Luck next year. They don't come around that often. Not saying there is one here, I'm not qualified to make that call. But I do no that you can't assume there will be one there next year either.

well you assume there is a franchise DT next year for us, and that there is a franchise QB this year. So if we go all D this year, and there is no QB, load up on more D and Oline

[KOKBILLS]

 

 

In general I think the conventional wisdom over-values the draft. Wishful thinking dubs every QB a Peyton manning and the Ryan Leaf. Akili Smith. Joey harringtons, JaMarcus Russells are quickly forgotten.

 

 

I completely disagree with that statement...It's really ridiculous seeing as though everyone and their Mother knows there is only one, and can be only one, Peyton Manning...Anyone who compares a College QB coming out to Manning is pretty dumb...Secondly it's the Ryan Leaf's and Jamarcus Russell's of the world that keep Teams like the Bills hoping a QB with career 12-23 record as a Starter and 73 Career QB Rating can be something more than servicable so they don't HAVE to take a kid like Gabbert who has every single box checked when your looking purely (and admittedly) at potential for the QB position in the NFL...If it were not for the Leaf's, Russell's, Harringtons, etc I can promise you 100% that Gabbert would be the pick tonight...Everyone knows the bust rate is great...It's not about conventional wisdom or wishful thinking...It's about the fact that every Team knows it's a QB's league and if you find the right one to build around you're going to be good for a long time...There is no question about that fact, and THAT is why Teams continue to reach...The risk may be great, but if you get it right, the reward is FAR greater...

[garchat80]

So who are the "can't miss" QB's in the 2012 and 2013 drafts that are so much better than Gabbert. Forget about Luck. The Bills will finish 5-11 or 6-10 and nowhere near the top pick in the draft.

 

Andrew Luck, Landry Jones, & Matt Barkley.. IF they decide to come out early..