All Newton all the time

[Captain Hindsight]

This kid needs alot of work. Like major polishing

 

I wasnt in favor before but after seeing him perform and speak this week with a prepared statement and back tracking and having to explain everything in his past. Just so many red flags about him and then his workout, passing wise just wasnt that impressive and he says its the recievers fault? Take some ownership!

[DrDawkinstein]

This kid needs alot of work. Like major polishing

 

I wasnt in favor before but after seeing him perform and speak this week with a prepared statement and back tracking and having to explain everything in his past. Just so many red flags about him and then his workout, passing wise just wasnt that impressive and he says its the recievers fault? Take some ownership!

 

He never said it was the WRs fault. In the interview with Eisen and Mayock he took it on himself and said he "underestimated how much the timing would change". Seemed pretty on the level to me.

[Captain Hindsight]

"It was a pop quiz, and he didn't ace it," Newton's QB coach, George Whitfield, Jr. told USA TODAY's Jim Corbett. "But his final exam is in a week and a half.

 

A pop quiz? He had a month to prepare for a pop quiz? Wish my professors gave me that much warning

[boyst]

He never said it was the WRs fault. In the interview with Eisen and Mayock he took it on himself and said he "underestimated how much the timing would change". Seemed pretty on the level to me.

Doesn't that strike you, though? You are the biggest supporter of him on here that is able to provide good arguements and counter arguments, and I find it interesting you do not see the worry here.

 

The speed of the NFL will be much different then those WR's were in the drills, the game will change every play and the WR's will likely be testing his abilities. That he cannot adapt his game to suit a practice situation - where there is no pass rush or defenders concerns me. Then again, it would truly not surprise me if he needs the defenders to look good.

 

I'm sorry, I was starting to find comfort with Newton as a pro, possibly in Buffalo, but after today I am done. Maybe his pro day will let him shine, but I doubt it. As far as I am concerned Cam Newton just sold the farm.

[bobobonators]

It was discussed a lot on Sirius NFL today. One of the guys ran in to Jim Kelly at the Buffalo airport. He said that Jimbo is not in favor of Newton. Also, that they had a writer on who analyzed the 11 minutes Cam spoke and many are looking at it as a guy who clearly is not on the cusp of understanding etiquitte of NFL behavior. Described as a guy who was not sincere and meaningful in the things he said and that was cause for great concern with the huge entourage he is running with up there. Either way, Cam Newton is looking more and more like he will a project QB but someone will take him in the first.

 

At least Vince Young looked good in the combine.

 

They also went on to say that Mallet was doing wonderful in team meetings to their sources, for what it is worth.

 

I agree. Also, at least Vince Young had two full seasons at Texas..he was raw as it was...imagine Newton with only one full season? Not only that, Newton had a full season in an offense where his only responsibility was to make one read, and if that WR wasn't open..run with the ball. That crap won't work in the NFL.

 

Listen, if you're a team with the 15th or 20th pick, and are in desperate need of a QB..go knock yourself out and role the dice. But we're at #3 this year, and IMO, it would be absolutely criminal to take a QB with so little playing time under his belt at that spot...then, add on the minor integrity/personality question marks into the equation, and to me it's a no-brainer - no thanks.

Edited February 28, 2011 by bobobonators

[1B4IDie]

Doesn't that strike you, though? You are the biggest supporter of him on here that is able to provide good arguements and counter arguments, and I find it interesting you do not see the worry here.

 

The speed of the NFL will be much different then those WR's were in the drills, the game will change every play and the WR's will likely be testing his abilities. That he cannot adapt his game to suit a practice situation - where there is no pass rush or defenders concerns me. Then again, it would truly not surprise me if he needs the defenders to look good.

 

I'm sorry, I was starting to find comfort with Newton as a pro, possibly in Buffalo, but after today I am done. Maybe his pro day will let him shine, but I doubt it. As far as I am concerned Cam Newton just sold the farm.

You realize that many of the same exact WRs in the drills will be the WRs in the NFL, right?

 

You also realize that his WRs in Carolina will be the same WRs in the game as in practice?

 

You also realize no one cares if the passes are connected they're looking at footwork and realease?

 

You're really stretching on your concern.

 

He showed great throwing motion, but raw footwork.

Good thing footwork is probably the easiest to coach up and usually an issue with every college QB.

 

There's really very little cause for concern. Not really much of any new information either.

 

Cam Newton needs to work on a 3, 5, and 7 step drop we already knew that.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Why So Serious?

[DreReed83]

You realize that many of the same exact WRs in the drills will be the WRs in the NFL, right?

 

You also realize that his WRs will be the same WRs in the game as in practice?

 

You also realize know cares if the passes are connected they're looking at footwork and realease?

 

You're really stretching on your concern.

 

He showed great throwing motion, but raw footwork.

Good thing footwork is probably the easiest to coach up and usually an issue with every college QB.

 

There's really very little cause for concern. Not really much of any new information either.

 

Cam Newton needs to work on a 3, 5, and 7 step drop we already knew that.

 

Outside his 40, vertical and broad jump, he failed to deliver. His deep ball was great but thats all he does. Chuck it up in the air. I'm surprised he just didn't take off and run with the ball in some occasions.

[Captain Hindsight]

Outside his 40, vertical and broad jump, he failed to deliver. His deep ball was great but thats all he does. Chuck it up in the air. I'm surprised he just didn't take off and run with the ball in some occasions.

Now that would have gotton some press haha

[DreReed83]

I agree. Also, at least Vince Young had two full seasons at Texas..he was raw as it was...imagine Newton with only one full season? Not only that, Newton had a full season in an offense where his only responsibility was to make one read, and if that WR wasn't open..run with the ball. That crap won't work in the NFL.

 

Listen, if you're a team with the 15th or 20th pick, and are in desperate need of a QB..go knock yourself out and role the dice. But we're at #3 this year, and IMO, it would be absolutely criminal to take a QB with so little playing time under his belt at that spot...then, add on the minor integrity/personality question marks into the equation, and to me it's a no-brainer - no thanks.

 

I agree. Don't bother trying to convince the Newton lovers. They got suckered and bought into the hype. Probably the same people who fell in love with Jamarcus Russell and Kyle Boller.

[1B4IDie]

Outside his 40, vertical and broad jump, he failed to deliver. His deep ball was great but thats all he does. Chuck it up in the air. I'm surprised he just didn't take off and run with the ball in some occasions.

You're suprised because you have no idea how Cam Newton actually plays the game.

[DreReed83]

You're suprised because you have no idea how Cam Newton actually plays the game.

 

Yes I do. One read down the field. Not there? Run it !! Maybe if he were throwing to WRs who are 6'10" tall and a 40" vertical, they'd be able to catch some of his overthrown balls at the combine.

[truth on hold]

What do you think Vick's 40 time is?

[1B4IDie]

Yes I do. One read down the field. Not there? Run it !! Maybe if he were throwing to WRs who are 6'10" tall and a 40" vertical, they'd be able to catch some of his overthrown balls at the combine.

That is 1. An exaggeration and 2. A result of coaching.

If his coaches want him to extend the play in the pocket instead of run down the field I don't see any reason why he couldn't do that.

 

I guess You also dont realize no one cares if the passes are connected. They're looking at footwork and release.

 

No one is tracking completion percentage at the combine.

He has a 66% competition percentage on game tape, which is a thousand times more important than combine drills.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Why So Serious?

[boyst]

[All of what you said...]

Well said!

 

You realize that many of the same exact WRs in the drills will be the WRs in the NFL, right?

 

You also realize that his WRs in Carolina will be the same WRs in the game as in practice?

 

You also realize no one cares if the passes are connected they're looking at footwork and realease?

 

You're really stretching on your concern.

 

He showed great throwing motion, but raw footwork.

Good thing footwork is probably the easiest to coach up and usually an issue with every college QB.

 

There's really very little cause for concern. Not really much of any new information either.

 

Cam Newton needs to work on a 3, 5, and 7 step drop we already knew that.

James Hardy was a WR, many others are, too. These guys are NFL WR's, just like 3rd or 4th guy on any roster is, he is not working with an accurate portrayal of an NFL WR. How many rookies come out and make an impact like Stevie Johnson, Austin Collie, Miles Austin, Reggie Wayne, Larry Fitzgerald or Anquan Boldin with the same abilities? Also, he was working without a defense. His WR's anywhere he goes will never be NFL WR's until he is in the NFL with NFL WR's! Until then, these are draft prospects, with only Green, Jernigan, Jones and Smith being potential players to impact an NFL roster - and of those only two are highly graded.

 

His footwork was hideous, his release is average. The talk has been how he was stiff legged, tense, and not fluid in all of his movements. Are you serious to say he did good for himself today? He should have sat out. Footwork is very hard to coach, I do not know how you say that. Newton does not appear coachable (flame away at that with some crap about him being in JuCo). Footwork is not throwing motion.

 

There is not any new information because all of those who called it out and said he's a raw talent are right. I wish you would listen to the Sirius NFL chan, they've been doing a good job talking about him, surprisingly honest.

 

Outside his 40, vertical and broad jump, he failed to deliver. His deep ball was great but thats all he does. Chuck it up in the air. I'm surprised he just didn't take off and run with the ball in some occasions.

Now that is some funny bleep

 

You're suprised because you have no idea how Cam Newton actually plays the game.

What is it that you know that we don't? Because, if you do, please contact most NFL personel and tell them, because the media, former players - even Jim Kelly, do not want him. Owners and coaches will remain mum - playing the game. You see nothing different then any of us do, you just draw your own conclussions.

 

That is 1. An exaggeration and 2. A result of coaching.

If his coaches want him to extend the play in the pocket instead of run down the field I don't see any reason why he couldn't do that.

 

I guess You also dont realize no one cares if the passes are connected. They're looking at footwork and release.

 

No one is tracking completion percentage at the combine.

He has a 66% competition percentage on game tape, which is a thousand times more important than combine drills.

Exaggeration, that's likely but still it's not without some validity... A result of coaching? The biggest defense of this guy is that he's so adaptable and wins everywhere. So, you're saying he does all of that inspite of his coaches?! That he won ONE [mythical] national champsionship without his coaches having an influence? Because, what I saw, along with many, was not that impressive in the championship game, the same can be said for many other games. You're right, it's a result of his coaching - because they probably can't coach the guy! He is getting by on sheer talent that won't stand up in the NFL. So, you're right, his coaches have not done anything to improve the guy, it is clear. I would bet he is much the same as he was in High School. After being with all of those SEC coaches and top notch advisors - how is the NFL going to do what they couldn't?!

 

66% is not a top level completion rating you'd want in a NFL QB. Go look at Bruce Gradkowski's % at Toledo. You'll see much better numbers - what exactly is he doing? The guy is a brick, and he proved that today. He has potential, yes, but I cannot believe that he is coachable.

[1B4IDie]

Well said!

 

 

James Hardy was a WR, many others are, too. These guys are NFL WR's, just like 3rd or 4th guy on any roster is, he is not working with an accurate portrayal of an NFL WR. How many rookies come out and make an impact like Stevie Johnson, Austin Collie, Miles Austin, Reggie Wayne, Larry Fitzgerald or Anquan Boldin with the same abilities? Also, he was working without a defense. His WR's anywhere he goes will never be NFL WR's until he is in the NFL with NFL WR's! Until then, these are draft prospects, with only Green, Jernigan, Jones and Smith being potential players to impact an NFL roster - and of those only two are highly graded.

 

His footwork was hideous, his release is average. The talk has been how he was stiff legged, tense, and not fluid in all of his movements. Are you serious to say he did good for himself today? He should have sat out. Footwork is very hard to coach, I do not know how you say that. Newton does not appear coachable (flame away at that with some crap about him being in JuCo). Footwork is not throwing motion.

 

There is not any new information because all of those who called it out and said he's a raw talent are right. I wish you would listen to the Sirius NFL chan, they've been doing a good job talking about him, surprisingly honest.

 

 

Now that is some funny bleep

 

 

What is it that you know that we don't? Because, if you do, please contact most NFL personel and tell them, because the media, former players - even Jim Kelly, do not want him. Owners and coaches will remain mum - playing the game. You see nothing different then any of us do, you just draw your own conclussions.

 

 

Exaggeration, that's likely but still it's not without some validity... A result of coaching? The biggest defense of this guy is that he's so adaptable and wins everywhere. So, you're saying he does all of that inspite of his coaches?! That he won ONE [mythical] national champsionship without his coaches having an influence? Because, what I saw, along with many, was not that impressive in the championship game, the same can be said for many other games. You're right, it's a result of his coaching - because they probably can't coach the guy! He is getting by on sheer talent that won't stand up in the NFL. So, you're right, his coaches have not done anything to improve the guy, it is clear. I would bet he is much the same as he was in High School. After being with all of those SEC coaches and top notch advisors - how is the NFL going to do what they couldn't?!

 

66% is not a top level completion rating you'd want in a NFL QB. Go look at Bruce Gradkowski's % at Toledo. You'll see much better numbers - what exactly is he doing? The guy is a brick, and he proved that today. He has potential, yes, but I cannot believe that he is coachable.

They can put this post in the dictionary under strawman argument.

If you made any comments on anything that I actually said and not masterfully debating with your self about things I never said I would respond.

Is Ron Rivera in the NFL? Is Jim Kelly in the NFL today? 66% isn't a good competition percentage? You might want to fact check your post.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Why So Serious?

[DrDawkinstein]

Doesn't that strike you, though? You are the biggest supporter of him on here that is able to provide good arguements and counter arguments, and I find it interesting you do not see the worry here.

 

The speed of the NFL will be much different then those WR's were in the drills, the game will change every play and the WR's will likely be testing his abilities. That he cannot adapt his game to suit a practice situation - where there is no pass rush or defenders concerns me. Then again, it would truly not surprise me if he needs the defenders to look good.

 

I'm sorry, I was starting to find comfort with Newton as a pro, possibly in Buffalo, but after today I am done. Maybe his pro day will let him shine, but I doubt it. As far as I am concerned Cam Newton just sold the farm.

 

 

You realize that many of the same exact WRs in the drills will be the WRs in the NFL, right?

 

You also realize that his WRs in Carolina will be the same WRs in the game as in practice?

 

You also realize no one cares if the passes are connected they're looking at footwork and realease?

 

You're really stretching on your concern.

 

He showed great throwing motion, but raw footwork.

Good thing footwork is probably the easiest to coach up and usually an issue with every college QB.

 

There's really very little cause for concern. Not really much of any new information either.

 

Cam Newton needs to work on a 3, 5, and 7 step drop we already knew that.

 

 

jboyst, most of what I wouldve responded with has been said in WSS? first response.

 

None of the QBs showed us anything different (for better or worse) than what we already knew about them. Even if Newton had completed every pass thrown today, it would not have been a big deal to me. He has a great motion and release and thats mostly what scouts want to see today. The footwork can be worked on, we all know Newton is a bit of a project (but not even as much as a Tebow).

 

Now, as usual the "Hype or Hate Train" has to swing to one extreme or the other. It's either "The kid is the next savior!" or "He's an immature thug running QB". When the reality is, he had an average day like everyone else, and like everyone wants to have at the combine.

 

I have the Combine coverage on now and Mayock just said "Im going to have to go do a press conference after this show, and the biggest shame is that Im going to have to answer and defend a bunch of questions about Cam Newton not performing well when that just isnt the case."

Edited February 28, 2011 by DrDankenstein

[boyst]

jboyst, most of what I wouldve responded with has been said in WSS? first response.

 

None of the QBs showed us anything different (for better or worse) than what we already knew about them. Even if Newton had completed every pass thrown today, it would not have been unexpected. Now, as usual the "Hype or Hate Train" has to swing to one extreme or the other. It's either "The kid is the next savior!" or "He's an immature thug running QB". When the reality is, he had an average day like everyone else, and like everyone wants to have at the combine.

I think it goes along with my thoughts, though. The draft seems very weak this year. That we expected Newton to standout higher then anyone, including Mallet, says something. An average day for him is well under what the hype has offered us so far. It is a lot like Obama. There is hype all of the time and where the production comes from is hard to tell.

 

I have the Combine coverage on now and Mayock just said "Im going to have to go do a press conference after this show, and the biggest shame is that Im going to have to answer and defend a bunch of questions about Cam Newton not performing well when that just isnt the case."

It is not that he performed poor as much as he performed so ... average.

 

I am not going to debate WSS, because we obviously don't see eye-to-eye; and we do not have to, but I just do not get the hype on Newton. In 5 years I hope I am wrong.

[ReturnoftheBuffaloBeast23]

So because of the combine he sucks? Not real football but shorts and a t-shirt? if you wanna pick on something yes his footwork was bad but you can teach that you can't teach accuracy. He's accurate in games combines aren't made to look at completions they look at the spot they put the ball in. But if he sucks because of the combine so be it, what I saw was bad footwork anybody watching would notice that hell even the announcers said his motion and arm looked good his footwork was just questionable.

 

oh and for a 6'5 - 248 guy running a 4.57 with 9.3 G-FORCES (thanks under Armour) WILL RUN A LB over... To call that slow but call Locker fast when they ran the same time is crazy..

[DrDawkinstein]

I think it goes along with my thoughts, though. The draft seems very weak this year. That we expected Newton to standout higher then anyone, including Mallet, says something. An average day for him is well under what the hype has offered us so far. It is a lot like Obama. There is hype all of the time and where the production comes from is hard to tell.

 

 

It is not that he performed poor as much as he performed so ... average.

 

I am not going to debate WSS, because we obviously don't see eye-to-eye; and we do not have to, but I just do not get the hype on Newton. In 5 years I hope I am wrong.

 

 

ok dude, i get it. i think youre just wanting to be disappointed so go right ahead. not sure what you were expecting out of him today when you say "we expected Newton to standout"...

 

Did you watch the drills and combine coverage at all? Its not much of a competition. Its not much of a practice even. Couple turns throwing the ball, next.

 

Mallet is getting a lot of praise from today, but that shouldnt be surprising for anyone either. Standing still and throwing the ball is what Mallet does best. Big whoop, put some pressure on him.

 

Very little of the stuff at the Combine translates to Sundays. You shouldnt let anything today sway you up or down. A lot of GMs have already said as much themselves.

 

Get some sleep, you got manure to spread

[boyst]

Newton fans...jeesh, like he's your mother or something

So because of the combine he sucks? Not real football but shorts and a t-shirt? if you wanna pick on something yes his footwork was bad but you can teach that you can't teach accuracy. He's accurate in games combines aren't made to look at completions they look at the spot they put the ball in. But if he sucks because of the combine so be it, what I saw was bad footwork anybody watching would notice that hell even the announcers said his motion and arm looked good his footwork was just questionable.

 

oh and for a 6'5 - 248 guy running a 4.57 with 9.3 G-FORCES (thanks under Armour) WILL RUN A LB over... To call that slow but call Locker fast when they ran the same time is crazy..

I did not say he sucks. I have said that prior I was not sold on him and now there is no chance I am comfortable with him as the #3 pick in the draft. Give me a pick between 15 and 25 and a decent starter for a few years and I'd take a chance on him if my team was a step out from going anywhere.

 

And like I have said numerous times. This guy was in the SEC. That is the top, cream of the crop, and they couldn't coach him out of the bad habits? I guess it does say something he was only there for 1 year and a half season in Florida. He is raw, but that he's got this far on his raw talents doesn't impress me. Look at Lief Larson, the best raw talent in the last 15 years. That he is a Heisman winner, the best player in the NCAA, the guy who is going to be the best QB on many boards...his accuracy should be over 66%. [edited in] Ok, to make sure it is understood, when you're in the offense that he was in, where you find your primary target and have to hit him, then it needs to be above 70% He makes 1 read on the average play, sometimes 2, and then he is coached to run. Manning in college is a great example of a QB who made choices, and even in his career when he was young he threw a lot of INT's. Of course, he's above Vick, who didn't even crack 60% but look how long it took him to develop in to a passer.

 

I never said Locker was fast, but in comparision to Newton, he is faster. I bet if I would have asked before the run many of you folks would have said he'd be around 4.4, maybe 4.3. And the G-Force? Really? I do not think he is going to be track spikes running full steam in to a LB with 9.3 g's. Of course, we've all seem him plow over defenders, but to think he could copy what he did in that time trial is a bit silly.

Edited February 28, 2011 by jboyst62