gumby Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 I am actually changing my first round prediction to Newton...... - QB is a need.....we dont have a backup I even want to put on the field. - My biggest fear of Cam Newton is putting him on the field too soon and ruining him......but I think we are in a good position here to have him sit for a year and learn or possibly putting him in wildcat situations. Fitz is the perfect QB to run this team right now. - Use EVERY other pick on defense, get a OT and TE in free agency. Cam's potential is incredible.....as long as we dont rush him along too quickly. I don't agree with all of this. If the Bills do take Newton 3rd he will be starting before the end of the season. Teams don't draft a QB that high to sit him for a year. Last time I can remember that happening was with Carson Palmer in 2003. I can't see that happening here. If Newton's the pick he may begin the year as the back-up but he will be the starter sooner rather than later.
The Senator Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) What I see is a guy who got thrown out of Florida for academic laziness, cheating, and theft, then went on to be a dominant QB for one year in a small-time junior college environment, then enabled his dad to earn a nice bit of $$scratch$$ by choosing Auburn - where a superior program, excellent coaching, and a stellar supporting cast allowed him to shine for one season on real NCAA (Div 1-A FBS) team, after which he instantly abandoned his team and the program and hired a team of agents, lawyers, and PR consultants to enable him to 'cash in' quickly for the maximum financial gain... So what's not to like? Who wouldn't burn a high first round pick and knock over anyone in their way to hand a $50M contract to a kid like that?? Edited February 22, 2011 by The Senator
Phlegm Alley Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 Not saying that I am an ardent supporter of Newton, but the one year that he started in D1, he won the Heisman Trophy, lead his team to a National Championship, and dominated the competition to have one of the greatest seasons a college football player has ever had. Maybin, OTOH, didn't dominate nearly as thoroughly as Newton did. There were some games he was completely ineffective.
Homey D. Clown Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 First off, I believe your understanding of what Buddy Nix meant by "one year wonder" might be a little off. He never mentioned "one year starters", he specifically said "one year wonders". I find it hard to accept that Nix and Co. only want to draft guys that have started more than 1 year. In college football, that happens ALL THE TIME with great players who are stuck behind other great players. Most players don't get much time until their junior year, and then head for the pros the following year. The difference between them and Maybin is hard to define in a single post, but it is there. Maybin was a red shirted sophomore so he had very little actual time in college football, let alone on the field. He "came out of nowhere" and got playing time due to injuries. He did not have much of a history on the team and was sort of a flash-in-the-pan anomaly. Players like Newton, and Fairley, while only having started for Auburn for 1 year were well known and established players before they hit the field. People down south were talking about Fairley finally getting more playing time. Same thing with Dareus in Alabama, who had been buried behind a talented DLine and only saw very limited playing time prior to this season. While it may only be JUCO, there is a full season of tape on Newton... and that tape shows him carrying that team to a dominant year and a JUCO National Championship. Posters can say "I dont want to hear about JUCO, it doesnt count", well tell that to Freddie Jackson. Before that Newton was a backup at Florida. Say what you will about how that situation ended up off-field, but the point is that he was a HEAVILY recruited and sought after player by major college programs across the best Conference in college football. As a matter of fact, back then the worry about Newton was that he was TOO MUCH of a pocket passer and people questioned whether he could scramble and run the ball in Florida's offense. Can you imagine?!? So in conclusion, the difference is their short history. Maybin was the pure definition of a "one year WONDER", as in "I wonder who the heck this kid is or where he came from??". Newton (and others) are known commodities, even if they only have 1 year of starting. These are very good points, and things I haven't been looking at when evaluating him. My opinion of him as a player are based on some things I see in his game. I actually wasn't really referring to Buddy's statements of a one year wonder. I actually didn't even read what he said, this was more my take on his starting time, I will have to see what he meant now that you bring it up.
Thoner7 Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 I was thinking about this the other day. My opinion is that Tebow will be very good in the NFL, but I don’t have the same confidence for Newton. I think that mobility and arm strength wise there isn’t much more you could ask for with these two. Newton has displayed more short and mid range accuracy but Tebow throws the fade and seem route with the best of them. What separates them, IMO, is intelligence and dedication. I have no question about either with Tebow, but there are serious red flags with Newton. Considering the massive strides Tebow made from college through his rookie year, that’s a good indication that he will succeed. Newton that’s still a huge ? He could get his paycheck and give up like J Russel or M Lienart. IMO, trading the #3 overall pick for Tebow would be a better move than taking Newton with that pick. It makes perfect sense if you agree that Tebow>Newton, and you were ok with taking Newton at 3 anyways. Considering the new regime in Denver (reportedly) isn’t too high on Tebow, I bet they would take that trade, maybe giving up one of their 2nd rounders too. Also, were did this false notion of Tebow having an average arm come from? I’ve seen the guy throw 70 yarders on the run with a low trajectory. Honestly throws that only Vick and a young Farve could make. Newton has a strong arm too, but Tebows is not weaker that’s for sure.
TH3 Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 One would think that if the Bills draft him #3 they will have done a good job of interviewing him and removing any risk associated with him being mentally and mature enough to succeed. They probably also would have gotten a handle on his ability to handle the pro offense. As far as being a one year wonder - in today's world, that is what you get. I beleive the same label could have been put on AL - but noone here would have had a problem drafting him. To go to your point - I think a one year wonder at QB is more difficult to pull off than what Maybin did. CN went undefeated in the toughest league, made the biggest plays passing and running, won big, won from behind, won it all. If you have only one year to prove it - what else can you do? I think - as usual - people have polarized on him and either are 100 percent for or against. What I see is a guy who got thrown out of Florida for academic laziness, cheating, and theft, then went on to be a dominant QB for one year in a small-time junior college environment, then enabled his dad to earn a nice bit of $$scratch$$ by choosing Auburn - where a superior program, excellent coaching, and a stellar supporting cast allowed him to shine for one season on real NCAA (Div 1-A FBS) team... So what's not to like? Who wouldn't burn a high first round pick and knock over anyone in their way to hand a $50M contract to a kid like that?? As far as his "transgressions" - I am of the opinion - who cares...for better or worse CN has been a pro QB for years. He was always going to be either a NFL QB or a landscaper. He was never going to be a good student - or even a student. I think in the SEC - the football players probably aren't really asked to be students anyway - they are their to play football - and historically - they have been "pros" - although I am not quite sure how much of that actually goes on anymore...
Maddog69 Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 What I see is a guy who got thrown out of Florida for academic laziness, cheating, and theft, then went on to be a dominant QB for one year in a small-time junior college environment, then enabled his dad to earn a nice bit of $$scratch$$ by choosing Auburn - where a superior program, excellent coaching, and a stellar supporting cast allowed him to shine for one season on real NCAA (Div 1-A FBS) team... So what's not to like? Who wouldn't burn a high first round pick and knock over anyone in their way to hand a $50M contract to a kid like that?? Wow. Way to make things up. 1.) UF did not throw him out. He transfered when Tebow made his decision to stay for another year 2.) He did not steal anything. He purchased a stolen laptop and as far as I know, there is no proof that he knew it was stolen 3.) No proof has been found that Auburn paid Cam or his father any money. 4.) Superior program? Auburn has not been a superior program since Bo Jackson left almost 20 years ago. Get real. There are plenty of questions marks surrounding Newton and plenty of reasons not to want the Bills to take him at 3, but you shouldn't just make things up.
DrDawkinstein Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) Totally agree with both Ditka and baskin's posts. (Didnt want to copy and paste both into a long post just to say I agree) Ditka makes great points about the level of play during that one year. And Im with baskin in the "who cares?" camp. I could post of list of stupid crap I did as a 19 year old in college that is way worse the Newton. I bet so could most posters here. Yet, I was recruited straight from college into higher level Networking/IT positions, and have always been a professional. People grow up. Especially from 19 to 23 years old and going forward. I dont pin the actions of his scumbag father on him. That's on his father for trying to pimp out his son. Cam was trying to play football either way. If we're going to start holding kids responsible for their parent's behavior, that's a whole other discussion, and a ridiculous one at that. With regards to the Senator, Im not even going to respond to such nonsense. I get it, you want to be a slightly provoking, slightly funny poster. Some of us want to talk football and facts and have a discussion. (Thank you Maddog) Edited February 22, 2011 by DrDankenstein
KD in CA Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 What I see is a guy who got thrown out of Florida for academic laziness, cheating, and theft, then went on to be a dominant QB for one year in a small-time junior college environment, then enabled his dad to earn a nice bit of $$scratch$$ by choosing Auburn - where a superior program, excellent coaching, and a stellar supporting cast allowed him to shine for one season on real NCAA (Div 1-A FBS) team, after which he instantly abandoned his team and the program and hired a team of agents, lawyers, and PR consultants to enable him to 'cash in' quickly for the maximum financial gain... So what's not to like? Who wouldn't burn a high first round pick and knock over anyone in their way to hand a $50M contract to a kid like that?? but...but...but....he's the most amazing talent since Tim Tebow EVER!!!! He will revolutionize the QB position!!!
DrDawkinstein Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 but...but...but....he's the most amazing talent since Tim Tebow EVER!!!! He will revolutionize the QB position!!! That's probably more right than you mean it to be.
section122 Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 Each player is his own entity. Cam newton whether he is good or not has nothing to do with aaron maybin. Maybin was undersized for his position and a one trick pony (speed rush). Cam newton has excellent size with no concern over his accuracy, arm strength, or throwing motion. There was a great write up on here a couple of days ago by a dolphins writer all about cam newton. In it they interviewed several teammates who all raved about his leadership. Also mentioned was how he was instrumental in getting his receivers together during the offseason to prqactice. Also how he was first in and last out and he knew where every player was supposed to be and when. These are all intagibles your looking for in a qb. So I'm left looking at a qb who appears to have great leadership skills and an excellent commitment to getting better and making his team better. Add to that his physical skills that you can see on tape and you've got pretty much everything your looking for in a qb. That's why I want cam newton!
Turbosrrgood Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 The comparison of Newton's situation to Maybin's is a little ridiculous. Maybin did exactly 1 thing well in college for 1 year, speed rush. Maybin was also fairly undersized for his position. Newton proved through the course of the year that he had many talents, obviously his running and mobility, but also accurate smart throws both short and long (far more accurate than Tebow). Newton also has terrific size for his position and abilities, something Maybin did not. Newton was the unquestioned leader of his team, which he took to, and won, the national championship (these weren't even a thought with Maybin). Don't get me wrong there are some questions about Newton (can he read defenses, was it the scheme?), but he has the most talent and ability of any of the other WAY OVERRATED QB's in this draft. He proved in his 1 year he has NFL talent far beyond Maybin did. Would he (or any other QB) be able to succeed in Buffalo though, that is the question. With his mobility, at least he has a shot...
DrDawkinstein Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) There was a great write up on here a couple of days ago by a dolphins writer all about cam newton. In it they interviewed several teammates who all raved about his leadership. Also mentioned was how he was instrumental in getting his receivers together during the offseason to prqactice. Also how he was first in and last out and he knew where every player was supposed to be and when. These are all intagibles your looking for in a qb. So I'm left looking at a qb who appears to have great leadership skills and an excellent commitment to getting better and making his team better. Add to that his physical skills that you can see on tape and you've got pretty much everything your looking for in a qb. That's why I want cam newton! YES! Ive been searching for it since I first posted in this thread. I think its a great read and would be perfect to link again in here. FOUND IT!! McCurse, and all others, please read this. It is pretty long, and you can skip the part about his off-field issues, since it basically recaps them and says "These arent major issues, this is just a college kid". And get down to the real on-field football player analysis. http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports/columnists/hyde/blog/2011/02/draft_winds_a_thorough_breakdo.html The natural and undeniable conclusion is that nobody should accuse Cameron Newton of being a ‘run-first’ quarterback, or a glorified running back, or anything of the kind. The fact of the matter is we have isolated every single snap (both pass and run) of Cam Newton’s over his final six games against Ole Miss, Chattanooga, Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina and Oregon. What we found is that Newton only scrambled for yardage on a total of 15 of 169 pass snaps. The other 80 or so runs were called as run plays from the sidelines. The rate (just under 9%) at which Newton pulled down the ball and ran for yardage rather than continuing to try and pass the ball, was comparable with the rate at which Aaron Rodgers did the same (just under 8%) for the Green Bay Packers during the 2010 regular season, according to Pro Football Focus.... ...The reality is that when Cam Newton was being recruited out of Westlake High School, he had to dispel scouts of the complete opposite notion, that he was just a pure pocket passer that didn’t use his feet to hurt teams. Here is a quote dated March 22nd, 2006 in a report about Newton’s recruiting prospects: Some have labeled Newton as a pure pocket passer but he is quick to discard that assessment. “I used to just sit back in the pocket but now with defensive ends running 4.6 forty’s you have to be able to move around and make plays with your feet," he said. “Now, I consider myself a guy who can run and pass. I really like to sit back and throw the ball but if you give me some space I’ll tuck it and run.” Edited February 22, 2011 by DrDankenstein
xsoldier54 Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 Since we have outstanding evidence on our own roster about 1 year college starters(See Aaron Maybin) why do so many people think Cam Newton can excel at the most difficult of positions with the same amount of experience? Nevermind all the other glaring red flags about the guy. Please don't take this as a personal attack on your opinion of him, but I do welcome your answers if you'd like to discuss with the focus around your logic, and what you see in him. Thanks! McCurse Of course none of us can predict exactly what kind of NFL player Cam Newton will be. We only have our opinions and none is worth more than another. IMHO Cam Newton shows signs of being a very good NFL quarterback. He is the prototype for what NFL teams are currently looking for in a QB. Coaches want that mobility as well as the ability to throw the ball. Newton has demonstrated both. I think he is better than Tebow. If drafted, you could start him off in Wildcat packages, just to get his feet wet. He would bring a new element to the offense while understudying Fitz. Once he gets his feet wet a bit, plug him in there and I believe he will be a star. Just my opinion, based on watching him play this year. If you disagree, I respect your opinion, but again, none of us really knows until we see what he can do.
DrDawkinstein Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 Posting this again in this thread just for organizing. I appreciate the merge and pin, but now its hard to find anything from previous discussions and a lot of good stuff has been posted. http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports/columnists/hyde/blog/2011/02/draft_winds_a_thorough_breakdo.html
The Senator Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 but...but...but....he's the most amazing talent since Tim Tebow EVER!!!! He will revolutionize the QB position!!! True, but Kim Newton only became all that after January 15th, when Luck announced he would stay at Stanford - leaving a huge void of QB-draft-hype that someone had to fill!
DrDawkinstein Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 True, but Kim Newton only became all that after January 15th, when Luck announced he would stay at Stanford - leaving a huge void of QB-draft-hype that someone had to fill! NO. HE. DID. NOT. only to a few dummies. a lot of us, and experts, had him on our radar all year. he only jumped up to the TOP qb prospect after Luck dropped out, but he should have always been up there as a close 2nd. I wish Luck wouldve come out this year so Carolina would have grabbed him and we could have had a clear shot at Newton. This also probably would have sparked a QB run which allowed some DL talent to fall to us in the 2nd. I blame Luck for the Bills defensive problems next year
The Senator Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 (edited) Wow. Way to make things up. 1.) UF did not throw him out. He transfered when Tebow made his decision to stay for another year 2.) He did not steal anything. He purchased a stolen laptop and as far as I know, there is no proof that he knew it was stolen 3.) No proof has been found that Auburn paid Cam or his father any money. 4.) Superior program? Auburn has not been a superior program since Bo Jackson left almost 20 years ago. Get real. There are plenty of questions marks surrounding Newton and plenty of reasons not to want the Bills to take him at 3, but you shouldn't just make things up. Well, you're probably right about the Auburn program - I am guilty of hyperbole there - but Newton's as guilty as they come regarding the rest of it. He left Florida because he was about to be expelled, not because of Tebow. (If he stayed, wouldn't he he have been 'the guy' this season anyway?) No one throws a laptop out their dorm window when the campus police come knocking unless they know it's a stolen laptop - he either stole it hmself, or certainly knew it was stolen. Regarding the rest of the scandals... Source: Newton left Florida after cheating scandal Scandal offers no escape for Auburn or Cam Newton Edited February 22, 2011 by The Senator
N.Y. Orangeman Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 True, but Kim Newton only became all that after January 15th, when Luck announced he would stay at Stanford - leaving a huge void of QB-draft-hype that someone had to fill! You provide some great comedy in slagging every QB prospect. Need I remind you that the savior you annointed last year, Graham Harrell, got released 2-3x (including by a CFL team) and is now the 4th QB/tackling dummy on GB?
Donald Duck Posted February 22, 2011 Posted February 22, 2011 True, but Kim Newton only became all that after January 15th, when Luck announced he would stay at Stanford - leaving a huge void of QB-draft-hype that someone had to fill! I've just got one thing to say to you on the QB front Senator Graham Harrell Hope all is well my friend
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