All Newton all the time

[The Senator]

This was so entirely predictable - Andrew Luck stays in school, and all of a sudden Luck is no longer the ONLY qb that's worth drafting that high. As previously stated, if Newton got hit by a bus tomorrow (God forbid), TSW would be pining for someone else by Tuesday.

 

Fitz is our guy. Draft for a stronger D and O-line. There'll be another QB to fall in love with next year. (Stanford will suck - maybe Luck's stock will even fall a bit.)

[DrDawkinstein]

This was so entirely predictable - Andrew Luck stays in school, and all of a sudden Luck is no longer the ONLY qb that's worth drafting that high. As previously stated, if Newton got hit by a bus tomorrow (God forbid), TSW would be pining for someone else by Tuesday.

 

Fitz is our guy. Draft for a stronger D and O-line. There'll be another QB to fall in love with next year. (Stanford will suck - maybe Luck's stock will even fall a bit.)

 

There are a few of us here that dont simply regurgitate what they hear from the "experts". I never agreed that Luck was the "only" QB worth taking that high, or the only QB that can/will succeed in the NFL. Throughout most of the year, I was looking at this class as more of a Rivers/Manning/Roethlisberger year, than a one-and-done group.

 

Luck staying in school just meant everyone bumped up. Newton is still amazing. Mallett is still good at what he does. I dont know much about Gabbert because he did just pop up at the end of the year, and Im not sold on him at all.

 

But to dismiss Newton and the rest of the class because Luck stayed in school is ridiculous.

[BADOLBILZ]

Without my benefit of hindsight, If we take Newton at #3 this year, we will be talking about how we could drafted (insert player name here) to disrupt Tom Brady while Newton sat on the bench as Fitz had another solid season.

 

I like how you say this like the Bills are actually competing with the Patriots at this point. If they just get that one pass rusher the division will be flipped upside down for the next decade.

 

Wise-up Bills fans. The objective isn't to win one game against the Patriots. It is to build a winning organization that can string together a decade where they are competing for the division title and hopefully a Super Bowl.

 

This team is still in the bottom quarter of the league offensively and arguably the worst team in the league defensively. If you want to see where they really stand, just check out how they finished against the Pats and Jets. Blown out.

 

Additionally, finding a 3-4 DE with the teams highest draft pick in a quarter century doesn't strike me as a potentially franchise changing moment.

 

Nor does drafting a 3-4 OLB with the #3 overall pick. One of the great things about the 3-4 is that it allows you to stock your defense with big players who aren't expected to rush the passer and tweeners who are. These types can be found in any round of the draft.

 

Now if there were a Jake Long type OL prospect, I can buy that at #3. Ten years of pro bowl caliber play protecting the most important player on the team(QB)......that makes sense.

 

If we were playing a 4-3, I could buy gambling on a Peppers/Freeney/Abraham type of talent, because you can't run a good 4-3 without one of them and they are as rare as a franchise QB. If they switch to a 4-3 or employ a "multiple front" they aren't playing to the strengths of Troup, Carrington or perhaps their most impressive draft pick last year, Arthur Moats.

 

But they aren't. The Bills play a 3-4 defense and haven't had consistently good QB play in 15 years. The systems this team plans to employ and the history of futility at the QB position...IMO....dictate the Bills taking a chance on a potentially great QB if he is there at #3.

[NewEra]

I like how you say this like the Bills are actually competing with the Patriots at this point. If they just get that one pass rusher the division will be flipped upside down for the next decade.

 

Wise-up Bills fans. The objective isn't to win one game against the Patriots. It is to build a winning organization that can string together a decade where they are competing for the division title and hopefully a Super Bowl.

 

This team is still in the bottom quarter of the league offensively and arguably the worst team in the league defensively. If you want to see where they really stand, just check out how they finished against the Pats and Jets. Blown out.

 

Additionally, finding a 3-4 DE with the teams highest draft pick in a quarter century doesn't strike me as a potentially franchise changing moment.

 

Nor does drafting a 3-4 OLB with the #3 overall pick. One of the great things about the 3-4 is that it allows you to stock your defense with big players who aren't expected to rush the passer and tweeners who are. These types can be found in any round of the draft.

 

Now if there were a Jake Long type OL prospect, I can buy that at #3. Ten years of pro bowl caliber play protecting the most important player on the team(QB)......that makes sense.

 

If we were playing a 4-3, I could buy gambling on a Peppers/Freeney/Abraham type of talent, because you can't run a good 4-3 without one of them and they are as rare as a franchise QB. If they switch to a 4-3 or employ a "multiple front" they aren't playing to the strengths of Troup, Carrington or perhaps their most impressive draft pick last year, Arthur Moats.

 

But they aren't. The Bills play a 3-4 defense and haven't had consistently good QB play in 15 years. The systems this team plans to employ and the history of futility at the QB position...IMO....dictate the Bills taking a chance on a potentially great QB if he is there at #3.

 

Also very well said. If Suh or peppers is the pick at 3, I can understand it, but I don't see any of these guys in their league.

[JohnC]

I like how you say this like the Bills are actually competing with the Patriots at this point. If they just get that one pass rusher the division will be flipped upside down for the next decade.

 

Wise-up Bills fans. The objective isn't to win one game against the Patriots. It is to build a winning organization that can string together a decade where they are competing for the division title and hopefully a Super Bowl.

 

This team is still in the bottom quarter of the league offensively and arguably the worst team in the league defensively. If you want to see where they really stand, just check out how they finished against the Pats and Jets. Blown out.

 

Additionally, finding a 3-4 DE with the teams highest draft pick in a quarter century doesn't strike me as a potentially franchise changing moment.

 

Nor does drafting a 3-4 OLB with the #3 overall pick. One of the great things about the 3-4 is that it allows you to stock your defense with big players who aren't expected to rush the passer and tweeners who are. These types can be found in any round of the draft.

 

Now if there were a Jake Long type OL prospect, I can buy that at #3. Ten years of pro bowl caliber play protecting the most important player on the team(QB)......that makes sense.

 

If we were playing a 4-3, I could buy gambling on a Peppers/Freeney/Abraham type of talent, because you can't run a good 4-3 without one of them and they are as rare as a franchise QB. If they switch to a 4-3 or employ a "multiple front" they aren't playing to the strengths of Troup, Carrington or perhaps their most impressive draft pick last year, Arthur Moats.

 

But they aren't. The Bills play a 3-4 defense and haven't had consistently good QB play in 15 years. The systems this team plans to employ and the history of futility at the QB position...IMO....dictate the Bills taking a chance on a potentially great QB if he is there at #3.

 

Excellent post.

 

I will go a little farther than you. In hindsight, if Miami had it to do over, even knowing that LOT Jake Long was going to be a perennial all-pro, they would have instead drafted Matt Ryan. Right from the start Matt Ryan took the reigns at qb for a Vick shattered franchise and has led them to the playoffs. Now Ryan is considered one of the best young qbs in the game. At the time of the draft Jake Long was considered the safer pick compared to Matt Ryan. Is there any doubt which player has proven to be more impactful and has dramatically changed the course of a franchise?

 

Now it is reported by many NFL analysts that the Phins are looking for another qb to replace the inconsistent Henne. Does anyone believe that the Packers regret taking Rodgers when they already had a HOF qb on the roster? When you have an opportunity to get a very talented franchise qb you need to seize the opportunity.

Edited February 21, 2011 by JohnC

[The Senator]

There are a few of us here that dont simply regurgitate what they hear from the "experts". I never agreed that Luck was the "only" QB worth taking that high, or the only QB that can/will succeed in the NFL. Throughout most of the year, I was looking at this class as more of a Rivers/Manning/Roethlisberger year, than a one-and-done group.

 

Luck staying in school just meant everyone bumped up. Newton is still amazing. Mallett is still good at what he does. I dont know much about Gabbert because he did just pop up at the end of the year, and Im not sold on him at all.

 

But to dismiss Newton and the rest of the class because Luck stayed in school is ridiculous.

There are myriad opinions, my good dank doctor - including those who insist we're better off losing every game this year so we can still draft Luck

 

I'm not high on Newton, and I guess that's pretty obvious. But it's JMO. In the end, Buddy Nix's opinion trumps all others.

[JohnC]

I'm not high on Newton, and I guess that's pretty obvious.

 

Yes it is. LOL

 

In the end, Buddy Nix's opinion trumps all others.

 

Wouldn't we all like to know how this funny talking southerner is setting up his draft board?

[DrDawkinstein]

In the end, Buddy Nix's opinion trumps all others.

 

For sure.

 

 

Wouldn't we all like to know how this funny talking southerner is setting up his draft board?

 

YES! I think thats the most frustrating part of being a fan. When we're discussing prospects, we never really know how well we match up to the Pros. And when grading the draft, we never know who they really wanted.

[Captain Hindsight]

I like how you say this like the Bills are actually competing with the Patriots at this point. If they just get that one pass rusher the division will be flipped upside down for the next decade.

 

Wise-up Bills fans. The objective isn't to win one game against the Patriots. It is to build a winning organization that can string together a decade where they are competing for the division title and hopefully a Super Bowl. This team is still in the bottom quarter of the league offensively and arguably the worst team in the league defensively. If you want to see where they really stand, just check out how they finished against the Pats and Jets. Blown out.

 

Additionally, finding a 3-4 DE with the teams highest draft pick in a quarter century doesn't strike me as a potentially franchise changing moment.

 

Nor does drafting a 3-4 OLB with the #3 overall pick. One of the great things about the 3-4 is that it allows you to stock your defense with big players who aren't expected to rush the passer and tweeners who are. These types can be found in any round of the draft.

 

Now if there were a Jake Long type OL prospect, I can buy that at #3. Ten years of pro bowl caliber play protecting the most important player on the team(QB)......that makes sense.

 

If we were playing a 4-3, I could buy gambling on a Peppers/Freeney/Abraham type of talent, because you can't run a good 4-3 without one of them and they are as rare as a franchise QB. If they switch to a 4-3 or employ a "multiple front" they aren't playing to the strengths of Troup, Carrington or perhaps their most impressive draft pick last year, Arthur Moats.

 

But they aren't. The Bills play a 3-4 defense and haven't had consistently good QB play in 15 years. The systems this team plans to employ and the history of futility at the QB position...IMO....dictate the Bills taking a chance on a potentially great QB if he is there at #3.

I agree with your whole post but i think you missed my point. That we need an impact player tht is going to be on the field day 1. With the uncertainty of the CBA i think pro ready players become that much more valuable

 

 

And Levi Brown is our developmental guy

[BADOLBILZ]

Excellent post.

 

I will go a little farther than you. In hindsight, if Miami had it to do over, even knowing that LOT Jake Long was going to be a perennial all-pro, they would have instead drafted Matt Ryan. Right from the start Matt Ryan took the reigns at qb for a Vick shattered franchise and has led them to the playoffs. Now Ryan is considered one of the best young qbs in the game. At the time of the draft Jake Long was considered the safer pick compared to Matt Ryan. Is there any doubt which player has proven to be more impactful and has dramatically changed the course of a franchise?

 

Now it is reported by many NFL analysts that the Phins are looking for another qb to replace the inconsistent Henne. Does anyone believe that the Packers regret taking Rodgers when they already had a HOF qb on the roster? When you have an opportunity to get a very talented franchise qb you need to seize the opportunity.

 

Absolutely. The future value of a pick needs to be considered. I mean, was there any question that the "ceiling of impact" for a guy like Haloti Ngata, a giant sized, athletic and aggressive DT would be higher than Lil' Donte, and undersized SS? Clearly a franchise QB is worth more than even an Anthony Munoz OT.

 

And I would take Newton over a Jake Long type prospect this year, but the decision to select an OL over a potential franchise QB would at least be debatable considering the Bills history. I don't even consider the choices of DE or LB even close. It could all be academic, Newton may go sooner.

 

I agree with your whole post but i think you missed my point. That we need an impact player tht is going to be on the field day 1. With the uncertainty of the CBA i think pro ready players become that much more valuable

 

 

And Levi Brown is our developmental guy

 

I think I got your point, you are focused on next year. You want a player who is ready to play so the Bills get an edge next year. Next year shouldn't be the organizational focus, the next 10 years should be. Lil' Donte was ready to go. Marshawn Lynch was ready to go. Poz was ready to go. Sometimes ready to go is actually just the low hanging fruit.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

OK, HemetJohn - what's your record on draft predictions? Mine is near perfect - wrong every single time!

 

Therefore, since I absolutely do not want the Bills to draft Kim Newton in ANY round, I will make the following prediction:

 

It is an incontrovertible, metaphysical certainty that the Buffalo Bills will draft Cam Newton!

 

GO BILLSSS!!!!

 

PosLUSZny!!!!!

.

I love and respect you Senator…but I was looking at that Polynesian guy from Stanford that you like, and I wasn't feeling it at all. He didn't look anywhere as good as I was expecting.

 

But my draft predictions are probably somewhere on a par with yours.

 

 

[It's in My Blood]

The problem is that while the Bills may very well be the worst team in the NFL over the course of the last ten years, they're never the worst team during any individual season, so the "can't miss" QB prospects are gone by the time the Bills pick in the first round. (Yeah, yeah, we could have taken Brady, but so could every other NFL team. Nobody saw that coming.)

 

The "can't miss" guys are always gone after the first couple of picks and there will always be questions about any QB outside of a very small handful of prospects (maybe a few per decade). Take Newton or don't, take Gabbert or don't, but expect that improvement to the defense will likely result in a return to the sort of 6-10 to 8-8 record which ensures that the Bills will never get an elite QB until the NFL adopts a draft lottery and/or weighs long-term team performance into draft order.

ding ding ding...we have a winner!! 100% agree

[John from Riverside]

Also very well said. If Suh or peppers is the pick at 3, I can understand it, but I don't see any of these guys in their league.

 

 

Agreed on all counts

 

- I like D. Bell but if there was a franchise type left tackle in this draft then I could see that pick at 3

 

- If we ran a 4-3 then I would like Bowers at 3.....but it has already pretty much been said that we ar running a hybrid 3-4......and we drafted Carrington and Troupe in that regard last year

 

- I am actually a Fitz fan.....but I do NOT get the sense that Ralph Wilson is.......I am actually a Andy Dalton fan as well. But the question here is what is the ceiling of Cam Newton. There is no doubt that he is a physical freak as a QB.....so then you shift to the mental......if there were ANY questions about his mental make up then the choice becomes easy for us because he would be going number one overall.......so then the question becomes if you have someone with the POTENTIAL to be the number one pick.....and you had a chance to get him at 3......well?

 

There is something else to consider here.....Fitz is a risk taker.....and we dont have ANYONE on this team that I feel comfortable with besides him as either the backup OR the QB of the future.......the thought of Cam Newton....holding a clipboard this year and watching a QB like Fitz with no pressure of being "the man" just sounds really good to me.

 

I think its the way to go....if we can get him in a trade down so much the better......but I think we lose out on him if we do that (not that I would feel like it is a lost draft because that means a excellent defensive player would be there)

 

I agree with your whole post but i think you missed my point. That we need an impact player tht is going to be on the field day 1. With the uncertainty of the CBA i think pro ready players become that much more valuable

 

 

And Levi Brown is our developmental guy

 

 

The same Levi Brown that we took late in the draft.....cut....then brought back?

 

And let me tell you where Im going with this....I beleive Levi Brown has talent....but it is not just about that in the NFL.....it is about allowing a team to realize and SHOW OFF that talent....when you are the "developmental guy" you become G. Hamdan.....a guy who showed some skill but a guy the organization would NEVER hang their hat one.

 

When you draft a guy like Cam Newton the organization is going to put him on the field because of the financial investment sooner or later.....when you draft a 6th round QB then he is most likely going to be a emergency only guy unless things go REALLY WRONG and you take a bunch of injurys.

 

Absolutely. The future value of a pick needs to be considered. I mean, was there any question that the "ceiling of impact" for a guy like Haloti Ngata, a giant sized, athletic and aggressive DT would be higher than Lil' Donte, and undersized SS? Clearly a franchise QB is worth more than even an Anthony Munoz OT.

 

And I would take Newton over a Jake Long type prospect this year, but the decision to select an OL over a potential franchise QB would at least be debatable considering the Bills history. I don't even consider the choices of DE or LB even close. It could all be academic, Newton may go sooner.

 

 

 

I think I got your point, you are focused on next year. You want a player who is ready to play so the Bills get an edge next year. Next year shouldn't be the organizational focus, the next 10 years should be. Lil' Donte was ready to go. Marshawn Lynch was ready to go. Poz was ready to go. Sometimes ready to go is actually just the low hanging fruit.

 

 

Also lets keep in mind that we are suffering form like a decade of mediocrity......not bad enough to get into the blue chip "biuld your team around" guys and not high enough to make playoffs.....

 

I am SICK of being in the middle of the road.....and this team is LOADED with defensive talent...lets use that 1st pick on a guy that in a year might be a player that we can get to the pro bowl.

[The Senator]

I love and respect you Senator…but I was looking at that Polynesian guy from Stanford that you like, and I wasn't feeling it at all. He didn't look anywhere as good as I was expecting.

 

But my draft predictions are probably somewhere on a par with yours.

No

??? Not even with our 2nd fourth-round pick ????

 

Well, if you don't like him, you don't like him. I can respect that. I think Wannstache is gonna want Greg Romeus somewhere around then anyway.

 

How 'bout the other Stanford guy I like - the Croatian guy, Owen Marecic, in round 4...

 

 

 

And...

 

.

Edited February 21, 2011 by The Senator

[Captain Hindsight]

 

 

 

 

I think I got your point, you are focused on next year. You want a player who is ready to play so the Bills get an edge next year. Next year shouldn't be the organizational focus, the next 10 years should be. Lil' Donte was ready to go. Marshawn Lynch was ready to go. Poz was ready to go. Sometimes ready to go is actually just the low hanging fruit.

Fairley doesnt have upside? Darius? Quinn?

 

Remember that last game breaker we drafted real high in the first round? All of sudden he wasnt the best player on the field and he looked pretty average and largely ineffective. How is the one read QB going to walk in here and make our team better? Sell some jerseys?

 

There are many ways to build a team. The steelers had their whole team buitl and plugged in Big Ben and have appeared in 3 super bowls since.

 

There are two many red flags on Newton. I dont trust his maturity, i dont trust his family influences and i dont like the system he came from. He is too big a risk for our franchise. If we select him and were wrong, that sets this team back another ten years. Its not like we have no QB capable of starting a whole season on our roster. Fitz isnt the best QB to put on a uniform but we could do alot worse. If our defense would have stopped some people and made a few turnovers we would look alot better.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

No Sione Fua ??? Not even with our 2nd fourth-round pick ????

 

Well, if you don't like him, you don't like him. I can respect that. I think Wannstache is gonna want Greg Romeus somewhere around then anyway.

 

How 'bout the other Stanford guy I like - the Croatian guy, Owen Marecic, in round 4...

 

youtube.com/watch?v=c6yDDMbW32A

 

 

And...

 

More Marecic

.

Wow!!!

 

I know you (mostly) and maybe someone else has posted the YouTube links but this is the first I've watched.

 

He definitely has a pro body. I mean he's very thickly built, arms, shoulders, chest, hips, thighs, calves are all well developed and yet he moves very well. I also liked the way he plucked the pass out of the air before the de-helmeting (or is it de-hemetting?).

 

Anyways, looks like a pure football player, somewhat defying description except that he's the perfect size for a fullback and a linebacker. If he was bigger he'd be a pulling guard and a quick, penetrating 4-3 defensive tackle.

 

For reference, Peyton Hillis and Owen Schmitt were both drafted in the 7th round, but Marecic plays both ways and might be a better linebacker than he is a fullback. He looks like he could play both really well though.

 

Also, Marecic is one of those guys who would probably bring great temperament and attitude to a football team.

 

Just based on those two links, I love the guy.

 

As for Fua, yeah maybe in the mid, late rounds.

 

 

[spartacus]

I know what you mean about Fitz at clutch time - he seemed to throw the INT or fumble at just the most critical moments last season. But he also displayed signs of a guy who can lead us from behind to a victory - if only God would stop making Stevie Johnson drop Fitz's perfectly thrown passes.

 

I am very intrigued at the prospect of going into this season with Fitz as starting QB, and with Gailey & Co. operating under that knowledge going into OTAs and training camp. I think his progress this season will be phenomenal, and will amaze not only the doubters on this board, but the rest of the football world as well.

 

Say no to Kim Newton. JMO.

 

<font face="Comic Sans MS">GO BILLSSS!!!!

 

Reverse the Curse!!!!!

.

not sure why the hate on Newton

 

Mike Leach would be drooling all over him

 

Hew couldn't lock his own QB in an equipment shed fast enough to get Cam on the field

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NewEra]

I agree with your whole post but i think you missed my point. That we need an impact player tht is going to be on the field day 1. With the uncertainty of the CBA i think pro ready players become that much more valuable

 

 

And Levi Brown is our developmental guy

 

There we go again...."we need a player that's going to be on the field day 1"

 

That isn't what this bills team needs the most.

 

We need a face of the franchise. We need a franchise QB that can lead us to super bowl victories. Donte whitner has stepped in and played since day 1. We need difference makers.

[spartacus]

For sure.

 

 

 

YES! I think thats the most frustrating part of being a fan. When we're discussing prospects, we never really know how well we match up to the Pros. And when grading the draft, we never know who they really wanted.

 

well we do know that the Magnificient Modrak will proclaim after the season that he wanted the rookie of the year but was overuled in the draft room by the Mystery Man

 

 

what more info do you need?

Edited February 21, 2011 by spartacus

[spartacus]

Fairley doesnt have upside? Darius? Quinn?

 

Remember that last game breaker we drafted real high in the first round? All of sudden he wasnt the best player on the field and he looked pretty average and largely ineffective. How is the one read QB going to walk in here and make our team better? Sell some jerseys?

 

There are many ways to build a team. The steelers had their whole team buitl and plugged in Big Ben and have appeared in 3 super bowls since.

 

There are two many red flags on Newton. I dont trust his maturity, i dont trust his family influences and i dont like the system he came from. He is too big a risk for our franchise. If we select him and were wrong, that sets this team back another ten years. Its not like we have no QB capable of starting a whole season on our roster. Fitz isnt the best QB to put on a uniform but we could do alot worse. If our defense would have stopped some people and made a few turnovers we would look alot better.

The best way to fix the defense is to hire a top notch defensive coaching staff to replace the inept toads they had last year.

 

That would mean running a defense that was designed to be aggressive all over the field, playing press coverage and bringing pressure - whether it be 3-4 or 4-3.

 

Whatever the choice, the most important point is to hire a stellar coaching staff expert in implementing and running that defense.

 

 

yet the Bills keep the inept DC from last year.

 

Their idea to upgrade is to bring in a seemingly good defensive consultant - but one who has zero experience with the intricacies of the 3-4 - including the blitz packages, game planning and play calling.

 

The Bills need an identity of both sides of the ball - and then need to find the best and brightest to implement it.

 

Newton will do far more for the offense than any top flight defensive staff could do for the defense./