Mr. WEO Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Yes, the same Mike Mayock who predicted the Bills would take Donte Whitner, the same Mike Mayock who predicted the Jags would take Tyson Alualo(sp) when most fans had no idea who he was. So, yes, I think he is a little connected. Mayock says he's not convinced carolina takes Newton. Interestingly enough, he doesnt even mention buffalo as a potential landing spot. I disagree, but who knows. It should be interesting. http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81f62749/article/panthers-in-tough-spot-dealing-with-top-pick-newton-hoopla?module=HP_cp2 Mayock is "not convinced" Cam goes #1? Wow, he MUST be super connected!
PromoTheRobot Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 If Newton is our pick, I will worry that Ralph butted in to the draft process. If Gailey wants Newton, then I have to believe he feels he can coach him. But if Ralph pulls rank then l will be very disappointed. Of course we will never know which it is for sure. Someone needs to slip Ralph a roofie into his warm milk. PTR
bigdogtim Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 This is the first time since Polian left that I feel somewhat comfortable with the draft room braintrust. Although I have nothing tangible to back this thought up, I believe that Buddy Nix is at the point in his career where he can afford the luxury of disagreeing with Ralph if he feels Ralph is steering him in a bad direction and is saavy enough to convince Ralph why.
Gordio Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) I just laugh at how people predict which one of these guys is going to bust......did it ever occur to anyone that there might end up being SEVERAL solid QB's that come out of this draft..... Someone above me said Newton is a 2nd round talent (if I am saying this wrong I apologize) well....so what? WHOEVER THE BILLS DRAFT IS GOING TO RIDE THE BENCH THE FIRST YEAR..... What matters is what they will look like AFTER a year of sitting the bench learning the offense...... Newton - Fine Gabbert - Fine Mallett - Fine Ponder - Fine Dalton - Fine Keaepernick - Fine Lets just get one because we need a guy as the back up and to groom Exactly, these people that are just certain Newton is going to be a bust need to get off their high horse & actually watch the games. So what he had a simplistic offense. Does not mean the guy can not sit on the bench for a year(a luxury we have with Fitz being the starter) & be a quick study. All I know is Newton dominated & I mean dominated the best conference in the country last year. No other qb in the draft can say that. If your still unconvinced about newton's abilities watch the 2nd half of the Alabama game last year. Kid was flawless. Best qb display I seen all year. A previous poster mentioned that he does not want to shoot for greatness at the 3rd pick but a steady starter. What a horrible line of thinking. At the #3 pick in the draft you better go in expecting to get a great player or your in the wrong business. I would not have a problem drafting Newton although I would not mind to see Darius or Miller either. Edited April 22, 2011 by Gordio
Mister Defense Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) amen Did anyone watch Jon Gruden talk with Cam Newton on ESPN, and ask him questions about his play calling as QB at Auburn? Gruden asked him to call a play they ran at Auburn, he couldn't! because he never called the plays! They never huddled...he states their method was "simplistic = fast" all he did was look to the sideline where they held up a card with one number on it....that was the play call. The entire team would read the play and then run it. So when people say he was a one read and run QB ....they aren't kidding. This kid is so far removed from ready to run a pro style offense in the NFL its not funny, he doesn't know the verbiage, he doesn't know how to call a play in the huddle, he doesn't know how to set protections, formations, routes, alerts! He doesn't even know the fundamentals of NFL play calling, never mind reading the different defensive reads 'Red right, A right stop, 322 scat, y stick line... a rip or ram call ...forget about it The only way this kid plays right away is running a wildcat or pistol shotgun, I see him easily slipping to the Redskins at the 10th pick, even then I kind of doubt Shanny will draft a player that needs so much developmental work. If I'm the Redskins I'd take Ryan Mallett before Newton, at least he played in a pro style offense and has much less to learn, just get a wall of good blockers in front of him http://sports.yahoo....scouting_report ""Negatives: Played in a simplified, run-first, dive-option read offense with very basic high-low reads. Worked exclusively out of the gun and was very quick to run at the first flash of coverage. Limited field vision — does not process the passing game. Inconsistent throwing mechanics with a flick delivery — generates all of his power from his upper-body strength and too often arms the ball. Streaky passer with spotty accuracy."" ""Was arrested in late November and charged with felony charges of burglary, larceny and intimidating a witness, informant or victim after stealing a laptop computer from a student's dorm room and throwing it out the window when police arrived at Newton's for questioning. Charges were dropped upon his completion of a pretrial diversion program. Reportedly transferred rather than face possible expulsion stemming from three incidents of academic cheating, including two as a sophomore when he put his name on someone else's paper and purchased a paper online, attempting to pass it off as his own work."" Yea sure, draft him at #3 and give him 20 million dollars guaranteed...he can sit on the bench with McCargo, Maybin and Spiller Those negatives are pretty intimidating--it takes a lot to be successful in the NFL and he has some major obstacles in front of him. And the multiple examples of cheating show very poor character and the inability to learn from his own bad behavior. Fitzpatrick will be a much better quarterback than Newton, so let's stick with him and get players to STOP THE RUN, same as I was saying last year at this time, but with (big mistake)Edwards the likely starter. Nothing is more deflating than watching teams run at will on your defense. Edited April 22, 2011 by Mister Defense
KOKBILLS Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Fitzpatrick will be a much better quarterback than Newton Are we talking next year only? I'm not the biggest Newton Fan around...I'd rather have Gabbert...But I would not bet that Ryan Fitzpatrick with a Career Passer Rating of 73.0, and his career 12-23 Record as a Starter is going to be better than Newton just yet...We'll see in a few years...But Fitz is no guarantee right now and Newton is absolutely full of talent...Albeit RAW talent... It's a bit early to make that call is all I'm saying...
yungmack Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 In Mayock's latest rankings, he has Gabbert as the 5th best player overall, and Cam Newton at 14th. Here's the link: http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81f19e10/article/defense-still-rules-top-32-but-with-a-few-fresh-faces-included BTW, Dareus now is #1 overall, followed by Miller and Peterson. Most interesting change is Cameron Jordan moved up to #11, followed immediately by J. J. Watt. Nick Fairley is at 8.
Pete Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Let's all pray and hope that Carolina takes him amen. I want nothing to do with Newton. I really want to see us build up our defense this draft, and maybe a TE and RT. If we select Gabbert I am alright with that, though he is nowhere near my first choice. Newton would be a cancer to this team IMO and he has Aaron Maybin bust potential and if Carolina selects Newton- that guarantees either Dareus or Miller is there for us. Let Carolina draft Newton
LabattBlue Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 If Newton is our pick, I will worry that Ralph butted in to the draft process. If Gailey wants Newton, then I have to believe he feels he can coach him. But if Ralph pulls rank then l will be very disappointed. Of course we will never know which it is for sure. Someone needs to slip Ralph a roofie into his warm milk. PTR I worry that Ralph is butting in regardless of who we pick and what round of the draft it is.
PS 56 Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see Newton fall to number 10 Maybe even lower. His intangibles are so questionable. Very few teams could take the chance.
Astrobot Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Nope, let them pass and us too. He ain't worth it. DraftTek's Michael Shottey was just asked where someone should start taking a shot at Newton. He tweeted, "In a dimly-lit parking lot". Best draft comment of 2011.
BillsVet Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 I worry that Ralph is butting in regardless of who we pick and what round of the draft it is. Clearly you're a conspiracy theorist. There's little to no evidence that's ever been the case.
Mickey Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Nope, let them pass and us too. He ain't worth it. The only way to be sure we don't take him is if someone else does so I hope Carolina takes him. That would slide everyone else down a pick and maybe even bring Dareus within our reach.
dpberr Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) I believe in Mayock's analysis. I personally believe that Carolina would love to get out of #1, but probably won't due to lack of willing trade partners, especially given that players under contract can't be in the mix in any deal. I think Carolina's weaknesses at CB, DT or WR are worse than having Clausen at QB for a year. If they get their OL healthy, with that running attack, it'd take some pressure off him. They need somebody opposite Steve Smith. Edited April 22, 2011 by dpberr
Spiderweb Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 If somehow Newton is a Bill at the end of draft day......I will support it and get behind it..... Its just not my first choice I'll still be a BIlls fan first and foremost, but I will hate the pick and will curse the Bills brass for taking that mental midget.
thewildrabbit Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 Exactly, these people that are just certain Newton is going to be a bust need to get off their high horse & actually watch the games. So what he had a simplistic offense. Does not mean the guy can not sit on the bench for a year(a luxury we have with Fitz being the starter) & be a quick study. All I know is Newton dominated & I mean dominated the best conference in the country last year. No other qb in the draft can say that. If your still unconvinced about newton's abilities watch the 2nd half of the Alabama game last year. Kid was flawless. Best qb display I seen all year. A previous poster mentioned that he does not want to shoot for greatness at the 3rd pick but a steady starter. What a horrible line of thinking. At the #3 pick in the draft you better go in expecting to get a great player or your in the wrong business. I would not have a problem drafting Newton although I would not mind to see Darius or Miller either. If the kid is soooo great then why is he the #2 rated QB in the draft this year? I watched the kid play, he is a 6'5'' 250 lb QB who ran more then he threw because that was the way they setup that Auburn offense. He was bigger, stronger faster then most of the players he played against in college, that won't be the case in the NFL He won't have a great career in the NFL running the ball, he will get killed if he doesn't learn to throw from the pocket. Looking at his history how can you be 100% positive this guy can even learn an NFL offense when he tried to cheat on his exams in college. The amount of college QB's that win national championships and then go on to great success in the NFL are few and far between, meaning that just because a guy plays great at the college level doesn't mean that skill and ability will translate to the NFL level. The 10 last NC QB's before newton Josh Heupel, Oklahoma, 2000-2001 Ken Dorsey, Miami, FLA 2001-2002 Craig Krenzel, Ohio State, 2002-2003 Matt Mauck, LSU, 2003-2004 Matt Leinart, USC, 2004-2005* Vince Young, Texas, 2005-2006* Chris Leak, Florida, 2006-2007 Matt Flynn, LSU, 2007-2008 Tim Tebow, Florida, 2008-2009* Greg McElroy, Alabama, 2009-2010 There is a reason as to why Blane Gabbert is rated ahead of Cam Newton on most everyone's draft boards, and the guy would be the 3rd rated QB if Andrew Luck chose to declare. This Buffalo Bills team needs some immediate help on defense in both pass rush, and run stopping more then they need another first round draft pick sitting on the bench ....a player that may or may not ever develop into a decent NFL starter PS as to that line about a horrible way of thinking, my take on what that poster was trying to say is, wouldn't it be great if the Bills could just get an actual starter with that #3 and not some developmental player or a scrub who rides the bench because he stinks, like McCargo-Maybin
Pete Posted April 22, 2011 Posted April 22, 2011 If the kid is soooo great then why is he the #2 rated QB in the draft this year? I watched the kid play, he is a 6'5'' 250 lb QB who ran more then he threw because that was the way they setup that Auburn offense. He was bigger, stronger faster then most of the players he played against in college, that won't be the case in the NFL He won't have a great career in the NFL running the ball, he will get killed if he doesn't learn to throw from the pocket. Looking at his history how can you be 100% positive this guy can even learn an NFL offense when he tried to cheat on his exams in college. The amount of college QB's that win national championships and then go on to great success in the NFL are few and far between, meaning that just because a guy plays great at the college level doesn't mean that skill and ability will translate to the NFL level. The 10 last NC QB's before newton Josh Heupel, Oklahoma, 2000-2001 Ken Dorsey, Miami, FLA 2001-2002 Craig Krenzel, Ohio State, 2002-2003 Matt Mauck, LSU, 2003-2004 Matt Leinart, USC, 2004-2005* Vince Young, Texas, 2005-2006* Chris Leak, Florida, 2006-2007 Matt Flynn, LSU, 2007-2008 Tim Tebow, Florida, 2008-2009* Greg McElroy, Alabama, 2009-2010 There is a reason as to why Blane Gabbert is rated ahead of Cam Newton on most everyone's draft boards, and the guy would be the 3rd rated QB if Andrew Luck chose to declare. This Buffalo Bills team needs some immediate help on defense in both pass rush, and run stopping more then they need another first round draft pick sitting on the bench ....a player that may or may not ever develop into a decent NFL starter PS as to that line about a horrible way of thinking, my take on what that poster was trying to say is, wouldn't it be great if the Bills could just get an actual starter with that #3 and not some developmental player or a scrub who rides the bench because he stinks, like McCargo-Maybin great post. My guess is down the road, people will compare taking Newton over Gabbert(if that indeed does occur) to the debate between Ryan Leaf and Peyton Manning. I am not saying Gabbert will be Manning, but I am guessing Gabbert will be a starter in the league for many years and Newton is a colossal bust of Leaf proportions
Dragonborn10 Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Nope, let them pass and us too. He ain't worth it. Let them pass and let someone trade with us for him. Can you say Minnnesota is on the clock at # 3 ???
thewildrabbit Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 Few comments relating to this thread and what might happen in 6 days. - I wonder how down people would be on Newton if he were not a JuCo transfer and if he didn't have the controversy surrounding his father. I'm not entirely sold on him, but he is NOT JaMarcus Russell and he is better than Vince Young. There hasn't been this athletic of a QB coming out of college since Mike Vick. Yea he is cocky, guess who else is? Every successful player in the NFL and probably most first round picks. He is just more outward with it (that is to me, the bigger issue. But its also a sign of confidence and I'd much prefer a confident cocky guy, than a guy who says all of the right things and gets his ass handed to him on ever snap...I'm looking at you Trent Edwards). - People were very wary of McNabb when he got drafted. And he is to me, fairly comparable to Newton. - Newton will probably go 1, so most of this conversation about him is moot, but I really wonder if the Bills will be able to pass on Gabbert at 3. I go back and forth on this and admittedly I made a post yesterday that said all of Nix's comments lead me to believe that defense will be addressed. But, lets say it goes Newton, Dareus and then we have a choice of Fairley/Gabbert/Miller. Can the Bills pass on another QB? I think they will, but I wouldn't be surprised if they don't. First of all, it was more then just his father, he cheated on his exams 3x , bought exam papers and tried to turn someone else s paper with his name on it, and got caught! Plus he was involved with a stolen laptop. This guy has so many red flags shooting off him its almost blinding. History shows that when it comes to player character you stay away from guys like this. How on gods green earth are you so convinced this guy is NOT another JaMarcus Russell, would you be willing to put up that 20 million guaranteed dollars to sign him? BTW, don't compare this kid Donovan McNabb, he had no shady past history like this guy does. If Newton didn't have the shady past and was clean as Gabbert he still wouldn't be rated higher simply because he is not as NFL ready. Any team that selects this kid is going to need to revamp their entire offense to suit him if they want to utilize him his first year. Whats curious is Chan Gailey has been noted for setting up the pistol offense, and perhaps this kid is Chan's dream QB. Anyway, I don't see Carolina as being stupid enough to draft Newton at #1 overall, so if Buffalo wants him, I think he will be there...I just hope they go defense. OTOH, Newton certainly would sell tickets, and that would have ole Ralphie grinning from ear to ear.
OldTimer1960 Posted April 23, 2011 Posted April 23, 2011 PS as to that line about a horrible way of thinking, my take on what that poster was trying to say is, wouldn't it be great if the Bills could just get an actual starter with that #3 and not some developmental player or a scrub who rides the bench because he stinks, like McCargo-Maybin Yes, that is exactly what I was saying. There are very good players that have a "higher floor" than Newton. Guys like Dareus and Miller come to mind. They have similar talent to Newton (at their respective positions), have a longer track record of success and have far fewer off-field questions than does Newton. Another guy that fits that description is AJ Green.
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