OldTimer1960 Posted March 20, 2011 Posted March 20, 2011 fixing a faulty pump when you have a bad engine doesn't make sense either. How about doing both. Upgrade the QB position and upgrade the OL, DL, LB, etc. You can't do all that this offseason without spending huge money in free agency, if you can even do it then. You CAN find good players in any round of the draft with some skill and more luck, but obviously you count more on high picks to be your better players that can upgrade your team. I think this team DOES need a better QB candidate than Fitzgerald. That doesn't mean that Fitz is currently the weakest link on this team (he isn't), but he will likely be a limiting factor as the talent around him is upgraded. You GENERALLY don't find good QBs after round 1 (I know, I know, Tom Brady was a 6th rnd pick and Kurt Warner wasn't even drafted, but look at the good starting QBs in the league and most were #1 picks - a good percentage of them high number 1s.) Does that mean that picking a QB high in round 1 guarantees success? Of course not, but if any team thinks that a QB has "it", he will most likely be gone in round 1.
NewEra Posted March 20, 2011 Posted March 20, 2011 Newton has a lot of question marks that are just too glaring. The guy is very physically gifted but he screams Vince Young to me. Gabbert once again seems like a nice QB but not an elite guy. I say find a defensive difference maker with pick 3 and then help out the rest of the team with the rest of the picks. If you put James, Harrison, Clark, and Wayne on team with a bad QB yeah they won't be that good BUT if you put them with a competent QB like lets say Chad Pennington (Throw in that good O-line that the Colts had too) you would see very good results and if you want proof look at the Seahawks in 05 when they made it to the Super Bowl they put one of the best O-lines ever and a great RB (Shaun Alexander) behind Hasselbeck a good but not elite QB and they almost won a SB. Name a sure fire superstar in this draft. It looks as if Dareus is the safest bet to be a good player, but not many are talking about him being a superstar. You say Newton has glaring questions abou him...who doesn't? Suh isnt in this draft. Fairley (character, strength), miller (size, strength), Quinn (never played OLB, missed a year, coverage), bowers (injury, can he play 3-4 end, #1 hs player that was ineffective til he was about to get paid), Peterson (get beat by double moves A LOT, labeled not smart, better fit at safety). They ALL have questions mang. Nice example with Seattle, but they were good one year. There's also TB,Baltimore, NY, etc. Sure teams can win without a franchise QBs, but you have a MUCH better chance if you have one. If you're in a position to draft someone you think can be one, youre stupid to pass, imo
DanInUticaTampa Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Also, who in the hell is talking about using our 3rd overall pick on Mallett, Ponder, or Locker? Everyone about a year ago when they were talking about locker going number one if he came out last year. Then people said we would take locker at number next year. Crazy stuff.
DreReed83 Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 A lot of mock drafts by draft experts and a lot of posters here seem to think that the Bills need to pick a QB in the first 2-3 rounds. I don't get this obsession. Didn't Fitz just have a pretty good season in terrible circumstances? The guy had no ground game, inconsistent O-line play (A very bad right side of the line), no tightend to throw to, and a defense that consitantly put him in situations where he had to be one dimensional. The team has too many holes to waste a pick on a QB especially when there isn't really a franchise QB at pick 3. Newton screams bust and Gabbert to me isn't that much better than Fitz could be. Why is there this consistent feeling to use top 3 picks on project QB's like Mallet, Ponder, and Locker and a good amount of posters feel that Newton or Gabbert should be the pick at 3? Are there more people who think that Fitz should be given a chance in 2011? The point of drafting a QB now is to develop the young QB BEHIND Fitz. It's really not that hard of a concept to grasp. Fitz's contract is up after this season. You really wanna give a career back up QB, a franchise QB type money? Chan's gained my trust that he can mentor pretty much any QB that he sees fit. If not, he doesn't beat around the bush like Jauron did. You draft a QB now, sit him for a year or 2, and then plug him into the starting lineup.
John from Riverside Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 I don't get this point of drafting a QB for depth. Fitz isn't that old and he hasn't started a lot of game in his career. But injuries happen so you need a backup BUT aren't there a lot of solid QB's you could sign in free agency. Free agency is also absolutely a way you could go.....because I actually am a big Fitz fan.....this team just has to be careful to cover itself with a back up QB who doesn't hurt the team. I agree we meed a QB to groom, but virtually completely doubt that a 1st round QB choice is going to properly groomed here. This is because: 1. The CW is that a first round pick should be an immediate (or at least first year) starter for the team that picked him. Any QB we picked almost for sure should be sitting and groomed his first year, but in the continual search for a new Jimbo which is why this team often failed is gonna happen again with a highly picked QB. From rushing TC to start before he was ready, tu the Hobert overeachto creating the RJ/DF debacle in search of a franchise QB and so on drafting a QB in the first (or in fact before our fourth pick is like;y destined for disaster. 2. I think taking a friggen 1st rounder is a bigger problem than picking a friggen 6th rounder. Neither likely works but the later pick probably does less damage to this team, I think that this is true in general but if you hava specific name let us know. 3. Those who claim we must draft a franchise QB early in the draft simply choose to ignore the fact that one can acquire a 1st round or high draft pick QB who has been a bust in his first stop and then develop into an SB winner and even HOF worthy QB in his second stop. Start at Drew Brees and work your way back to Steve Young and Brett Favre (with stops in Balt where 1st round pick Dilfer proved capable of QBing a great Ravens D because they focused on D first or two time cuttee Brad Johnson. The key is not to take any highly regarded QB you can get but instead to build the team strategically and pick the right guy without regard to picking a QB high simply to save face. I will tell you why....lets use the QB we took in the 6th round this past year.....if he was have been drafted in say.....the SECOND OR THIRD round....and I am not saying he should have been....then the team would have stuck with him as a grooming prospect a little longer rather then cutting him and bringing him back. The financial obligation a team makes towards a particular player will give them more chances to succeed. That is why when you take a QB late....his chances of becoming your starter are so minute....and I know there is the Tom Brady thing.....but that is lightning striking.
flmike Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Name the last team to make the playoffs with arguably the worst defense in the NFL? Teams can win with an average QB...win the super bowl even (Yes, I know it's the exception to the rule), but teams cannot be successful with a horrible defense. I don't agree with the OP in that I think we need to address the QB position at some point during this draft. Reason being...if Fitz goes down, our back-ups are Brohm and Brown. That is really scary to me. Drafting a "second-tier" QB in rounds 2 or 3 not only gives us some depth behind Fitz, but there is a chance that that player could be our long-term answer at QB. St Louis Rams in 2000.
ReturnoftheBuffaloBeast23 Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Newton and Gabbert are the top QB's in this draft is either one of them a game changer? Newton is the product of hype and Gabbert isn't really a game changer. Its a QB driven league but you don't take a QB just to take a QB either. When Manning won a Super Bowl he had a super cast his O-line was superb (Tarik Glenn and Jeff Saturday were routinely pro-bowlers) and his weapons were all world (Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Eggerrin James, Dallas Clark). We saw this season just how much Peyton Manning needs help from his O-line. Even Big Ben has the help of a good ground game and a great defense that is a staple of his winning. Big Ben isn't forced to be one dimensional and can play more conservatively at times due to the quality of his D. Backup QB is a need but I think you can find a decent vet in free agency (which there will eventually be). The draft isn't the only way to add to the roster even though it seems like it a this point thanks to the lockout. Hell the Bills found Fitz in free agency a few years ago. Wow seriously Newton is hype? All he did was take 2 teams to championships in 2 years, win a heisman and become the face of college football last year. If thats hype what's reality? Fitz is a journeyman QB of course they found him in free agency, the bills are what his 3rd team? St Louis Rams in 2000. Good point...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 St Louis Rams in 2000. Congrats...you found an exception to the rule. They were ranked dead last in overall defense, but 13th in overall rush defense. They also had an undrafted free agent, former Arena League player for a QB.
Dennis in NC Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Has anyone noticed that Fitz is only signed for one more season? That would be the 2011 season. What happens after that?
KOKBILLS Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 - Fitz ranked 22nd in QB rating. - Fitz ranked 22nd in the league in passing yards. - Fitz ranked 27th in completion percentage. - Fitz ranked 21st in yards per attempt. - Fitz ranked 16h in passing yards per game. - Fitz ranked 9th in interceptions. In sum, Fitz was mostly a below average QB while being in the top 10 in the league in pass attempts per game. That's not having a good season. That's being easily impressed because of all the crap we've had at QB over the years. Also, who in the hell is talking about using our 3rd overall pick on Mallett, Ponder, or Locker? You're sure to get blasted by some around here for actually bringing facts into this conversation... But thanks anyway...
billsfan89 Posted March 21, 2011 Author Posted March 21, 2011 Wow seriously Newton is hype? All he did was take 2 teams to championships in 2 years, win a heisman and become the face of college football last year. If thats hype what's reality? Fitz is a journeyman QB of course they found him in free agency, the bills are what his 3rd team? Good point... Newton was billed going into the draft process as a mid-late 1st round pick. Now suddenly he is the next Michael Vick and worthy of the 1st overall selection? The guy is the next Vince Young his throwing mechanics are very similar to Youngs and he doesn't have the best field vision and pocket presence either. Fitz is a solid professional QB who played above his supporting cast. You also don't have to spend a huge draft asset to stick with him. I would rather take a player on D (Even with possible flaws) than take a QB just because QB's are what you need to win.
NewEra Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Newton was billed going into the draft process as a mid-late 1st round pick. Now suddenly he is the next Michael Vick and worthy of the 1st overall selection? The guy is the next Vince Young his throwing mechanics are very similar to Youngs and he doesn't have the best field vision and pocket presence either. Fitz is a solid professional QB who played above his supporting cast. You also don't have to spend a huge draft asset to stick with him. I would rather take a player on D (Even with possible flaws) than take a QB just because QB's are what you need to win. He IS the next Vince Young..... Thank you for enlightening us mr football guru. Now we are all as smart as you. Uuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhh duuuuuuhhhhhh
papazoid Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 what happens when Fitz gets injured.....Levi Brown to the rescue? in a perfect world, the bills use their 3rd round pick on a QB who falls in our lap (ie...ponder or kaepernick)
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Throwing high picks at QBs, RBs, and WRs when you have no Oline or Dline is like rebuilding your engine without replacing your faulty oil pump and driving with faulty brakes. Fixed
jumbalaya Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Based on the team he had around him the fact that he wasn't dead last in everything probably means he's probably at least dead average. You're right, it's been a long time since we've seen anything that approaches competency at QB. I think the next step is to improve the rest of the team and see what happens, not start over with a different QB. He needs a better line and a #1 and #2 wideout and a #1 & #2 TE. Having two number 3 receivers (Steve & Lee), one number 4 (roscoe) and a pile of UFA's doesn't help.
section122 Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Newton was billed going into the draft process as a mid-late 1st round pick. Now suddenly he is the next Michael Vick and worthy of the 1st overall selection? The guy is the next Vince Young his throwing mechanics are very similar to Youngs and he doesn't have the best field vision and pocket presence either. Fitz is a solid professional QB who played above his supporting cast. You also don't have to spend a huge draft asset to stick with him. I would rather take a player on D (Even with possible flaws) than take a QB just because QB's are what you need to win. Not one "expert" questions his mechanics and they are actually a strength. Secondly is it really suprising that a player moved where he was projected either up or down? Phillip rivers was projected to be a 3rd round pick at the end of the season and went 4th overall. Throwing high picks at QBs, RBs, and WRs when you have no Oline is like rebuilding your engine without replacing your faulty oil pump. There are so many holes its going to take this year and next to fix it. So if the qb can sit for a year to learn then be ready to play when the team is competitive, isn't that a good idea?
KOKBILLS Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 He needs a better line and a #1 and #2 wideout and a #1 & #2 TE. Having two number 3 receivers (Steve & Lee), one number 4 (roscoe) and a pile of UFA's doesn't help. Seriously? Did you just say SJ is a #3 WR? Really? Classic... Now don't get me wrong...I'm not saying Stevie is an unquestioned #1 WR...But he's MOST DEFINITELY a #2...As is Lee...Quit trying to make Fitz out to be some kind of Superman...There were Players on Offense stepping up all over the Field for him last season...Steve Johnson being first among them...Fitz was sacked less than twice per Game behind that patchwork O-Line...Those UFA WR's led by David Nelson and Donald Jones showed plenty of promise for Rookies...When was the last time the Bills had 3 (including Marques Easley) ROOKIE WR's with this much upside? NO question TE is a HUGE Need in Buffalo...But good grief...Exaggerate much? Fitz is what he is and he'll be fine as the Starter in 2011...But IF The Bills don't do something right now to solidify the future at QB we'll be looking at another decade of futility...Assuming they don't finish bad enough to win the Luck sweepstakes of coarse...I fully expect The Bills to Draft a QB somewhere in the first 3 Rounds of the 2011 Draft and they would be VERY wise to do so... If anyone believes Gailey and Nix when they say they know Fitz can get us to the Playoffs I've got some PRIME Real Estate for sale in Florida they should take a look at...Have we really forgotten what good Football looks like THAT much? Phillip Rivers was projected to be a 3rd round pick at the end of the season and went 4th overall. Who exactly was projecting Rivers to be a 3rd Round Pick? Because whoever it was I hope they are no longer covering the NFL Draft...I don't remember anything like that whatsoever...
Cynical Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 - Fitz ranked 22nd in QB rating. - Fitz ranked 22nd in the league in passing yards. - Fitz ranked 27th in completion percentage. - Fitz ranked 21st in yards per attempt. - Fitz ranked 16h in passing yards per game. - Fitz ranked 9th in interceptions. In sum, Fitz was mostly a below average QB while being in the top 10 in the league in pass attempts per game. That's not having a good season. That's being easily impressed because of all the crap we've had at QB over the years. Also, who in the hell is talking about using our 3rd overall pick on Mallett, Ponder, or Locker? You forgot one. - Fitz ranked 13th in TDs - Despite being ranked ranked 9th in INTS, Fitz still threw for more TDs than INTS (23/15) Does that make him elite? No. But IMHO, it does make him better than you claim him to be.
Rob's House Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 You're sure to get blasted by some around here for actually bringing facts into this conversation... But thanks anyway... There's nothing wrong with looking at statistics, but pretending they paint a full picture is foolish. Fitz's stats, relative to those of Brady, Roger, Manning, etc. is hardly an apples to apples comparison.
section122 Posted March 21, 2011 Posted March 21, 2011 Who exactly was projecting Rivers to be a 3rd Round Pick? Because whoever it was I hope they are no longer covering the NFL Draft...I don't realthough member anything like that whatsoever... [/quote Although I appreciate your use/overuse of emoticons at the end of the season yes he was projected as a 3rd rnd pick. I remember it specifically bc I thought he would be a stud and a steal and hoped by the time the draft rolled around he would be there for us @ our 1st pick. This was before the combine and rest of the pre draft process and was simply meant to illustrate that players move up and down during said process. Also that cam moving from mid first to top of first is not that big of a deal.
Recommended Posts