Dexter Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 If indeed, the "rumors" are true and CAR will sign Cam Newton, the question then becomes whether someone trades up for Gabbert at 2... Almost half the NFL teams have a "QB need." Palmer and Kolb are either not really available or available at a ridiculous Jay Cutler type price. After Cam, Mallett, and Gabbert, the Draft class lacks a QB who is really "starter ready" except possibly for somewhat brittle Ponder for West Coast short throw type schemes... Teams with QB need and unpredictable owners include the Skins and the Boys, the Bengals, the Cards, SF etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 If indeed, the "rumors" are true and CAR will sign Cam Newton, the question then becomes whether someone trades up for Gabbert at 2... Almost half the NFL teams have a "QB need." Palmer and Kolb are either not really available or available at a ridiculous Jay Cutler type price. After Cam, Mallett, and Gabbert, the Draft class lacks a QB who is really "starter ready" except possibly for somewhat brittle Ponder for West Coast short throw type schemes... Teams with QB need and unpredictable owners include the Skins and the Boys, the Bengals, the Cards, SF etc... Mallett "Starter ready"? I don't think so, but maybe some of the scouts do. He already got an Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 If indeed, the "rumors" are true and CAR will sign Cam Newton, the question then becomes whether someone trades up for Gabbert at 2... Almost half the NFL teams have a "QB need." Palmer and Kolb are either not really available or available at a ridiculous Jay Cutler type price. After Cam, Mallett, and Gabbert, the Draft class lacks a QB who is really "starter ready" except possibly for somewhat brittle Ponder for West Coast short throw type schemes... Teams with QB need and unpredictable owners include the Skins and the Boys, the Bengals, the Cards, SF etc... Two QBs are first round material Newton and Gabbert- CIN will almost certainly take one if Available- is Denver interest in a QB? maybe, Tebow may not be any better than Clausen but is better liked by the fans. Will people trade up with Denver? Maybe but it will cost them the equivalent of an extra mid 2nd round pick as compared to Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted March 19, 2011 Share Posted March 19, 2011 If indeed, the "rumors" are true and CAR will sign Cam Newton, the question then becomes whether someone trades up for Gabbert at 2... Almost half the NFL teams have a "QB need." Palmer and Kolb are either not really available or available at a ridiculous Jay Cutler type price. After Cam, Mallett, and Gabbert, the Draft class lacks a QB who is really "starter ready" except possibly for somewhat brittle Ponder for West Coast short throw type schemes... Teams with QB need and unpredictable owners include the Skins and the Boys, the Bengals, the Cards, SF etc... I don't think it really matters who is throwing the ball for the Bills, when your run D is giving up 170 yards a game. The draft is deep on D-linemen, and Bufflao needs help there EVEN if the draft picks from last year step: they are really horrible and aren't going anywhere soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrFishfinder Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 I don't think it really matters who is throwing the ball for the Bills, when your run D is giving up 170 yards a game. The draft is deep on D-linemen, and Bufflao needs help there EVEN if the draft picks from last year step: they are really horrible and aren't going anywhere soon. The QB does matter, but your point regarding 170ypg is spot on. Tomdrew Manningrivers wouldn't be able to overcome that. The Bills do not have enough weapons on offense to make up for the lack of defense, top-tier QB or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 NFL analysts make Gabbert comparisons to qbs in the league. Very interesting. Why would you trade a high pick to another team for a qb when you also have a need for one? Satisfy your need and then work on filling out the rest of your limited roster. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-path-to-the-draft/09000d5d81ed2dda/Which-NFL-QB-does-Gabbert-compare-to?module=HP_video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hplarrm Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 The QB does matter, but your point regarding 170ypg is spot on. Tomdrew Manningrivers wouldn't be able to overcome that. The Bills do not have enough weapons on offense to make up for the lack of defense, top-tier QB or not. Its worse than the simple "mere" fact that without acquiring two quality starters on D this off-season (OLB and DE)its going to be a very difficult environment for any alleged franchise QB taken with the third pick. It also appears to be likely we need to acquire an RT starter on the OL and also arguably we are this pick-up and a swing guy on OL who allows for an injury or failure to develop by the other youngsters on OL (Bell, Wood, Levitre, the new RT) plus a year to develop chemistry before this alleged franchise QB has an adequate OL in front of him. The math is that we are really looking for 3 quality players from the first three picks. If we devote the #3 to a QB this team then is looking to get 3 quality player from 2 picks. The math does not work flat out if you devote the #3 to QB. Even worse beyond the "new" math of trying to make this work, while the CW that a #3 pick should be a quality player (though glaring examples like Harrington seem to happen every year), the statistical likelihood of a player picked in the 2nd round much less the 3rd drops below 50/50. Just think about it, not only does picking a QB at #3 likely condemn this team to another year of bad run D, but also pushes down by another round simply saving this #3 drafted QB for having to run for his life all the time behind an OL which does not have a player available to be considered for a Bills #3 or even a top 10 pick. It may well not get done as it is necessary to have two teams if you want to make a deal. However, I hope that Carolina grabs Newton or Gabbert as the word the Bills have spread that QB is what they want heightens the potential that someone offers them a trade for extra early picks in exchange for the #3. My dream scenario is that either Newt or Gabby comes off the board wit the first pick and one of the teams with a 4th-10th pick gets do afraid the Bills will take the other QB that they trade us the lower first rounder and a supplemental 2nd rounder and whatever is needed to make the trade value work. We then grab a starting OLB like Miller with the first we traded our #3 pick for, we get a DL player early in the second in a very deep DL draft and we either trade again for more picks or pick up the best RT candidate available with our third choice. I do not see any QB (Ponder, Kampernick, or whomever) being worth more than a more critical pick-up before the 4th. I hope there is a run on QBs which begins quick as we simply have too many holes to fill without multiple early picks. A QB at #3 just makes the math worse and likely guarantees that when this rookie QB is forced into the starting line-up without the year on the bench all QBs besides Luck likely need this year its gonna be bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrFishfinder Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 Its worse than the simple "mere" fact that without acquiring two quality starters on D this off-season (OLB and DE)its going to be a very difficult environment for any alleged franchise QB taken with the third pick. It also appears to be likely we need to acquire an RT starter on the OL and also arguably we are this pick-up and a swing guy on OL who allows for an injury or failure to develop by the other youngsters on OL (Bell, Wood, Levitre, the new RT) plus a year to develop chemistry before this alleged franchise QB has an adequate OL in front of him. The math is that we are really looking for 3 quality players from the first three picks. If we devote the #3 to a QB this team then is looking to get 3 quality player from 2 picks. The math does not work flat out if you devote the #3 to QB. Even worse beyond the "new" math of trying to make this work, while the CW that a #3 pick should be a quality player (though glaring examples like Harrington seem to happen every year), the statistical likelihood of a player picked in the 2nd round much less the 3rd drops below 50/50. Just think about it, not only does picking a QB at #3 likely condemn this team to another year of bad run D, but also pushes down by another round simply saving this #3 drafted QB for having to run for his life all the time behind an OL which does not have a player available to be considered for a Bills #3 or even a top 10 pick. It may well not get done as it is necessary to have two teams if you want to make a deal. However, I hope that Carolina grabs Newton or Gabbert as the word the Bills have spread that QB is what they want heightens the potential that someone offers them a trade for extra early picks in exchange for the #3. My dream scenario is that either Newt or Gabby comes off the board wit the first pick and one of the teams with a 4th-10th pick gets do afraid the Bills will take the other QB that they trade us the lower first rounder and a supplemental 2nd rounder and whatever is needed to make the trade value work. We then grab a starting OLB like Miller with the first we traded our #3 pick for, we get a DL player early in the second in a very deep DL draft and we either trade again for more picks or pick up the best RT candidate available with our third choice. I do not see any QB (Ponder, Kampernick, or whomever) being worth more than a more critical pick-up before the 4th. I hope there is a run on QBs which begins quick as we simply have too many holes to fill without multiple early picks. A QB at #3 just makes the math worse and likely guarantees that when this rookie QB is forced into the starting line-up without the year on the bench all QBs besides Luck likely need this year its gonna be bad. I would rather see the Bills get help on pass rush than OLB. I'm not sold on Miller at 6'3" for that position, regardless of the stats and hype. Doesn't feel right. The Bills haven't had a pass rush since Al Gore invented the internet. Newton doesn't feel right, either and if the Bills ARE going to go after a QB with their first pick, I would rather see Gabbert or Mallett although neither of them is going to have the potential immediate impact that Bowers, Dareus or Fairley would have. That being said, if the Bills are going to wait until the Ponders, Kaepernicks and Pumpernicks are available, they are really not serious about addressing the QB issue because that's just Brohm & Levi Part II. Good post, though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexter Posted March 20, 2011 Author Share Posted March 20, 2011 From the reports and quotes etc. I read... the only person in CAR who still likes Clausen is the GM who selected him. Beason went public with his support for Cam. That's not a good sign for Clausen. Tebow may flop, but he didn't get enough chances to flop, and did much less relative flopping than Jimmy last year, a few times even looking pretty good. My personal take is that Tebow "might" work out as an NFL QB, but that was never possible with Jimmy... Tebow is also a first, Jimmy is a second, so it is much easier to "let go" and declare your prior pick a waste... I doubt Denver is trying to land one of the three top passers. I would expect Denver to exploit the situation to the max, dangling #2 in front of Danny Boy and others... If Arkansas receivers don't drop about 6 passes on the hands, Arkansas routes Ohio State in the Sugar and finishes top 5. Mallett has flags for sure, but right now, for throwing one pass 40 yards down the field, he has the best arm in the Draft. Think of it this way. You are Danny Boy. Your team needs a QB. The Eagles snaked you last year for a high second for a washed up waste in McNabb. So you aren't going after Kolb... but... If you don't upgrade QB beyond Grossman... yeah. 5-11. If you could get a QB, you'd get the fans excited, sell jerseys etc... "Hello, Mr. Bowlen, this is Dan Snyder..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted March 20, 2011 Share Posted March 20, 2011 The math is that we are really looking for 3 quality players from the first three picks. If we devote the #3 to a QB this team then is looking to get 3 quality player from 2 picks. The math does not work flat out if you devote the #3 to QB. Even worse beyond the "new" math of trying to make this work, while the CW that a #3 pick should be a quality player (though glaring examples like Harrington seem to happen every year), the statistical likelihood of a player picked in the 2nd round much less the 3rd drops below 50/50. Just think about it, not only does picking a QB at #3 likely condemn this team to another year of bad run D, but also pushes down by another round simply saving this #3 drafted QB for having to run for his life all the time behind an OL which does not have a player available to be considered for a Bills #3 or even a top 10 pick. You are inflating the baseline status of this team. You can't reasonably say that this year's draft, no matter how outstanding, is going to dramatically change where this team ranks. The Bills are at least another two to three drafts away from competing against the upper echelon teams in the AFC. That is not going to happen, under any circumstances, unless a top tier talent is behind the center. Taking a qb with our first pick doesn't mean that with the next two picks you can't get good defensive prospects. Last year's most effective rookie defensive player was Moats, a fifth round pick. Free agency is another avenue to be used to add some legitimate defensive players, assuming the CBA is resolved on time. The Bills are not going to be a playoff team next year. Not even close. If they win 6 games next year that will be a major achievement. What is most important is building and developing a roster that in a few years will allow the Bills to be a serious team. That is not going to happen next year, and it will never happen unless they get a legitimate franchise qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexter Posted March 20, 2011 Author Share Posted March 20, 2011 If someone trades up to #2 for Gabbert, the Bills should trade down if possible. Gabbert is a good fit here because he is mobile and experienced in cold weather. None of the other top prospects is enough of a difference maker to justify not trading down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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