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Posted

OMG! if ralph said this i would die! i would also ask who spiked his pudding. i like the approach. he sounds like a guy who is a fan first, who just happened to stumble upon a couple billion dollars. though this is what i expect when jimbo takes over ownership of the bills. though it sounds like financial suicide is a better ticket seller than bringing in a washed up player to sell tickets. i also noticed there was not a this is going to take ANOTHER 2-3 years. dude wants to win now. ralph and the bills FO should be taking notes.

Posted

It has been mentioned publicly that Golisano would have a "heavy interest" in the Buffalo Bills, with strong emphasis on keeping the team in Buffalo. I don't have a link, but it was in an article related to his sale of the Sabres. His concerns were rooted in his other business ventures in WNY, as he benefits greatly on the Bills franchise being in the area.

Posted

Just published on the Buffalo News website by John Vogl.

 

"He has no interest in purchasing the Buffalo Bills.

 

"Nope," he said. "I've got too much going right here, right now to get this running the way we want, to inject the attitude we want into the organization, to think or worry about football teams."

 

 

Maybe he would consider becoming a minority investor?

 

Still this is a great time to be a Sabres Fan!!!

 

If you look at the public records of New York State here:

 

http://appext9.dos.state.ny.us/corp_public/CORPSEARCH.ENTITY_INFORMATION?p_nameid=415485&p_corpid=355631&p_entity_name=%42%75%66%66%61%6C%6F%20%42%69%6C%6C%73&p_name_type=%41&p_search_type=%42%45%47%49%4E%53&p_srch_results_page=0

 

it seems likely that Ralph Wilson "owns" the Bills because he is the (a) Chairman of the Board or CEO and (b) either the sole OR majority owner of the shares of Buffalo Bills, Inc. - - - a New York State corporation. I say "likely" because although you would expect any successful business man to shield his other personal assets from liability by using a corprate form of team ownership, I have no information one way or the other about whether this particular corporation is being used by Ralph Wilson to own the Bills football team. Given the corporate name, it would seem logical, but that's no guarantee. Ralph could be using this corporation for some Bills-related purpose other than actually owning the team.

 

I don't know for certain, but it also seems logical to me that if anybody out there on the information superhighway could confirm that "Buffalo Bills, Inc." is the name on the checks the team uses to pay expenses controlled by the league (e.g. player salaries?), that would be a pretty strong indication that this really is the corporation that Ralph Wilson uses to "own" the Bills. Any bank tellers out there that could confirm one way or the other what name is on such checks?

 

I follow this board when I have time, but I only see a small fraction of the posts. I can't recall ever seeing any discussion of the fact that Ralph Wilson could already have sold a minority interest in the Bills without making that fact public. Closely held private corporations aren't required to make the same type of public disclosures that widely held public ones must make. I don't have any expertise about New York state law as it applies to privately held corporations, but I am not aware of anything that would prevent Ralph Wilson from (1) selling a minority stake in Buffalo Bills , Inc. (2) telling potential minority stake buyers that he would only sell to them if they agreed to keep their mouths shut while he was alive, (3) avoiding public disclosure of such a sale, and (4) continuing to truthfully represent to the public that he is the owner of the Bills (because he still owns a majority of the company's shares). I am NOT saying this has happened - - I'm just saying that it could have happened without the public being aware of it.

 

I keep reading second hand accounts about how Ralph has said the team will be sold upon his death. Assuming that's true, it would not be inconsistent with a pre-existing sale of a minority interest to a silent investor. Upon Ralph's death, his estate could sell the shares of the corporation Ralph still owned, which could be considered to be selling the team because it would still be a majority stake.

 

Just thought I'd give everybody some new facts to chew on.

 

And by the way, for those who think that the league prevents corporate ownership of teams, I think you're misinformed. The league now prevents ownership of teams by non-profit corporations (other than Green Bay, which got grandfathered in because they were already owned that way before the league passed the rule), but closely held private for-profit corporations are a different animal.

 

Upon previewing this post I'm not sure the link I pasted in works because it's so long, so I cut and pasted the full text of the New York State corporate record below:

 

NYS Department of State

Division of Corporations

Entity Information

The information contained in this database is current through February 22, 2011.

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Selected Entity Status Information Current Entity Name: BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

Initial DOS Filing Date: NOVEMBER 08, 1974

County: ERIE

Jurisdiction: NEW YORK

Entity Type: DOMESTIC BUSINESS CORPORATION

Current Entity Status: ACTIVE

 

Selected Entity Address Information DOS Process (Address to which DOS will mail process if accepted on behalf of the entity)

BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

ONE BILLS DRIVE

ORCHARD PARK, NEW YORK, 14127

 

Chairman or Chief Executive Officer

RALPH C. WILSON JR

99 KERCHEVAL AVE

GROSSE POINTE PARK, MICHIGAN, 48236

 

Principal Executive Office

BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

99 KERCHEVAL AVE

GROSSE POINTE PARK, MICHIGAN, 48236

 

Registered Agent

NONE

 

This office does not record information regarding the names and addresses of officers, shareholders or directors of nonprofessional corporations except the chief executive officer, if provided, which would be listed above. Professional corporations must include the name(s) and address(es) of the initial officers, directors, and shareholders in the initial certificate of incorporation, however this information is not recorded and only available by viewing the certificate.

*Stock Information# of Shares Type of Stock $ Value per Share

200 Par Value 1

*Stock information is applicable to domestic business corporations.

Name HistoryFiling Date Name Type Entity Name

NOV 08, 1974 Actual BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

 

A Fictitious name must be used when the Actual name of a foreign entity is unavailable for use in New York State. The entity must use the fictitious name when conducting its activities or business in New York State.

NOTE: New York State does not issue organizational identification numbers.

Posted (edited)

Detroit = Hockeytown

 

Buffalo = Hockey Heaven -Pegula

 

Received a few phone calls from family & friends after the presser 'All Shook Up!' "Ya goota see this! Greatest day in Buffalo sports history!!'

 

I watched it and here's my take. For a self made billionaire, he has serious problems speaking! Comes across as a Dolt! Crying seeing Perrault? IDK, perhaps it was real but I don't think so and here's why.

 

I'm a bigger fan of the Sabres than he is. I and many my age and older were fans for life in '69 with the news we'd be getting an expansion NHL team. He said he became a fan in '75. '75?!? He's just a freakin' bandwagon jumper! '75 was our first Cup year. He's from Pittsburgh -where his true loyalties rest- and we were playing the defending Champs from -wait for it- Philly. To know PA is to know there's no love lost between the 2 city's. It's likely he has no idea the roulette wheel spin that gave us 1st overall from Vancover landed on 11, not 1 as previously reported. That #11 became Gilbert Perrault. He wasn't here to see Eddie the Enteratiner -though he eventually found himself in Pittsburgh in a trade for Robert. He didn't feel the horror and grief we all did when Tim Horton crashed and died on the QE. He likely knows nothing of Jim Schoenfeld's double album featuring the best brawl in Sabres history. He jumped on the Sabre bandwagon cuz we were playing Philly..

Not everyone can be a dyed-in-wool Sabres fan. Pegula has plenty of time to catch up on Sabres history. The issues you raise really don't concern me at all.

 

I still haven't watched the presser video…but all I hope for is that his comments are sincere.

 

I'm thrilled that he bought the team. Pegula is a "white knight" at a time when Buffalo's professional sports teams continue to face a shrinking market and uncertain economic times. After the ownership of the Rigas family and the mixed bag of the Golisano era, I couldn't be happier with our new owner, regardless of his knowledge of events in team history that occurred 40 years ago.

Edited by San Jose Bills Fan
Posted

Not everyone can be a dyed-in-wool Sabres fan. Pegula has plenty of time to catch up on Sabres history. The issues you raise really don't concern me at all.

 

I still haven't watched the presser video…but all I hope for is that his comments are sincere.

 

I'm thrilled that he bought the team. Pegula is a "white knight" at a time when Buffalo's professional sports teams continue to face a shrinking market and uncertain economic times. After the ownership of the Rigas family and the mixed bag of the Golisano era, I couldn't be happier with our new owner, regardless of his knowledge of events in team history that occurred 40 years ago.

 

 

Fair enough, SJBF. I'll always be guarded about outsiders buying our Sports teams -think Snyder. That Pegula brought the hierarchy from Pittsburgh with him is kinda re-assuring that -for the near future- they're committed to building ANOTHER Cup winner.

 

But the presser was embarrassing to me -both for his terrible orating and his supposed gushing love for a franchise he otherwise viewed as an enemy for all those years. Heck, at 90+ years, Ralph's public speaking skills make him seem like Shakespeare by comparison..

Posted

Fair enough, SJBF. I'll always be guarded about outsiders buying our Sports teams -think Snyder. That Pegula brought the hierarchy from Pittsburgh with him is kinda re-assuring that -for the near future- they're committed to building ANOTHER Cup winner.

 

But the presser was embarrassing to me -both for his terrible orating and his supposed gushing love for a franchise he otherwise viewed as an enemy for all those years. Heck, at 90+ years, Ralph's public speaking skills make him seem like Shakespeare by comparison..

Like I mentioned. I haven't watched the press conference so I will take a look.

 

I know Buffalo sports fans ask for so little that when we get anything, we tend to be overly-grateful. That's partly in play here, no doubt.

 

Hopefully he's a man of his word and he'll be the type of owner that he professes he will be…that a championship is more important than the financials.

 

I'm a bit disappointed that the NHL trade deadline is so close at hand. I'm not sure much can be done in terms of roster upgrading with what's left of this season. Pegula might not be able to deliver much after such a bold-talking press conference.

 

 

Posted

Like I mentioned. I haven't watched the press conference so I will take a look.

 

I know Buffalo sports fans ask for so little that when we get anything, we tend to be overly-grateful. That's partly in play here, no doubt.

 

Hopefully he's a man of his word and he'll be the type of owner that he professes he will be…that a championship is more important than the financials.

 

 

it is much more than that. He appeared very sincere and all the right things were said. Someone asked him about ticket prices and he was genuinely taken off guard as he hadnt even thought of that yet (through thoughts of building the best organization possible).

Heard him on WGR today and again, hit it out of the park. He was even quoting Jim Dellavano's book (VP of the Red Wings). He also admits he doesnt have all the answers.

His goal is to make the Sabres into the top or one of the top class organizations, where players are going to want to go to win the Stanley Cup. It doesnt seem like he is embellishing and I dont see any motivation for him to lie. If anything, setting the bar high does him a disservice.

There is not one bone in my body that feels nervous or bad about this. In fact, this is probably top day for me as a Buffalo sports fan in my 32 years.

He also defended Connolly and Niedermayer on the radio today which I really liked. That is going to go a long way to earn players' respect, and word spreads.

 

And already they have waived Rivet. A move that 2 days ago would be unheard of and non-permissible.

Posted

The next owner of the Bills will be a weathy Arabian or Chinamen - laugh if you wish, but as they seek ways to deploy their monies and gain familiarity with Western culture, they will realize that the NFL is the wealthiest gentlemen's club in the planet. The next closest league would be the English Premier league, and there are already a handful of Arabian and Russian owners and the Chinese just missed on their recent attempt at Liverpool.

 

It may not be the Bills, but foreign ownership will start to creep up in the NFL - there is no issue with cash (satisfying the Jerry Jones' of the world) and it will satisfy the NFL's want to expand globally. I target the Bills for this reality as our ownership is amongst the leagues most precarious given RW's age...

Posted

Fair enough, SJBF. I'll always be guarded about outsiders buying our Sports teams -think Snyder. That Pegula brought the hierarchy from Pittsburgh with him is kinda re-assuring that -for the near future- they're committed to building ANOTHER Cup winner.

 

But the presser was embarrassing to me -both for his terrible orating and his supposed gushing love for a franchise he otherwise viewed as an enemy for all those years. Heck, at 90+ years, Ralph's public speaking skills make him seem like Shakespeare by comparison..

 

I'm not sure if he was a Penguins fan. He was a Sabres sth from '80-'98. Doubt you would have seasons if that wasn't your team.

Posted

I'm not sure if he was a Penguins fan. He was a Sabres sth from '80-'98. Doubt you would have seasons if that wasn't your team.

I go to SF Giants, Oakland A's, Golden State Warriors, Niners, and Raiders games. And I'm not a fan of any of those teams. I like watching pro sports and that's why I go. He might be an ardent Sabres fan, or the Sabres might be "one of his favorite teams." It's possible even that he's a big NHL fan more than a devotee of any one team.

 

To that point, didn't Pegula live in Orchard Park for many years? Could be he's just a big hockey fan.

 

I'm not saying he isn't a Sabres fan…but it's possible that there's a hockey team closer to his heart than the Sabres (Penguins?).

 

Pegula would have nothing to gain by admitting it of course. Anyways, it's all speculation.

 

Just thinking out loud.

 

 

Posted

If you look at the public records of New York State here:

 

http://appext9.dos.state.ny.us/corp_public/CORPSEARCH.ENTITY_INFORMATION?p_nameid=415485&p_corpid=355631&p_entity_name=%42%75%66%66%61%6C%6F%20%42%69%6C%6C%73&p_name_type=%41&p_search_type=%42%45%47%49%4E%53&p_srch_results_page=0

 

it seems likely that Ralph Wilson "owns" the Bills because he is the (a) Chairman of the Board or CEO and (b) either the sole OR majority owner of the shares of Buffalo Bills, Inc. - - - a New York State corporation. I say "likely" because although you would expect any successful business man to shield his other personal assets from liability by using a corprate form of team ownership, I have no information one way or the other about whether this particular corporation is being used by Ralph Wilson to own the Bills football team. Given the corporate name, it would seem logical, but that's no guarantee. Ralph could be using this corporation for some Bills-related purpose other than actually owning the team.

 

I don't know for certain, but it also seems logical to me that if anybody out there on the information superhighway could confirm that "Buffalo Bills, Inc." is the name on the checks the team uses to pay expenses controlled by the league (e.g. player salaries?), that would be a pretty strong indication that this really is the corporation that Ralph Wilson uses to "own" the Bills. Any bank tellers out there that could confirm one way or the other what name is on such checks?

 

I follow this board when I have time, but I only see a small fraction of the posts. I can't recall ever seeing any discussion of the fact that Ralph Wilson could already have sold a minority interest in the Bills without making that fact public. Closely held private corporations aren't required to make the same type of public disclosures that widely held public ones must make. I don't have any expertise about New York state law as it applies to privately held corporations, but I am not aware of anything that would prevent Ralph Wilson from (1) selling a minority stake in Buffalo Bills , Inc. (2) telling potential minority stake buyers that he would only sell to them if they agreed to keep their mouths shut while he was alive, (3) avoiding public disclosure of such a sale, and (4) continuing to truthfully represent to the public that he is the owner of the Bills (because he still owns a majority of the company's shares). I am NOT saying this has happened - - I'm just saying that it could have happened without the public being aware of it.

 

I keep reading second hand accounts about how Ralph has said the team will be sold upon his death. Assuming that's true, it would not be inconsistent with a pre-existing sale of a minority interest to a silent investor. Upon Ralph's death, his estate could sell the shares of the corporation Ralph still owned, which could be considered to be selling the team because it would still be a majority stake.

 

Just thought I'd give everybody some new facts to chew on.

 

And by the way, for those who think that the league prevents corporate ownership of teams, I think you're misinformed. The league now prevents ownership of teams by non-profit corporations (other than Green Bay, which got grandfathered in because they were already owned that way before the league passed the rule), but closely held private for-profit corporations are a different animal.

 

Upon previewing this post I'm not sure the link I pasted in works because it's so long, so I cut and pasted the full text of the New York State corporate record below:

 

NYS Department of State

Division of Corporations

Entity Information

The information contained in this database is current through February 22, 2011.

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Selected Entity Status Information Current Entity Name: BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

Initial DOS Filing Date: NOVEMBER 08, 1974

County: ERIE

Jurisdiction: NEW YORK

Entity Type: DOMESTIC BUSINESS CORPORATION

Current Entity Status: ACTIVE

 

Selected Entity Address Information DOS Process (Address to which DOS will mail process if accepted on behalf of the entity)

BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

ONE BILLS DRIVE

ORCHARD PARK, NEW YORK, 14127

 

Chairman or Chief Executive Officer

RALPH C. WILSON JR

99 KERCHEVAL AVE

GROSSE POINTE PARK, MICHIGAN, 48236

 

Principal Executive Office

BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

99 KERCHEVAL AVE

GROSSE POINTE PARK, MICHIGAN, 48236

 

Registered Agent

NONE

 

This office does not record information regarding the names and addresses of officers, shareholders or directors of nonprofessional corporations except the chief executive officer, if provided, which would be listed above. Professional corporations must include the name(s) and address(es) of the initial officers, directors, and shareholders in the initial certificate of incorporation, however this information is not recorded and only available by viewing the certificate.

*Stock Information# of Shares Type of Stock $ Value per Share

200 Par Value 1

*Stock information is applicable to domestic business corporations.

Name HistoryFiling Date Name Type Entity Name

NOV 08, 1974 Actual BUFFALO BILLS, INC.

 

A Fictitious name must be used when the Actual name of a foreign entity is unavailable for use in New York State. The entity must use the fictitious name when conducting its activities or business in New York State.

NOTE: New York State does not issue organizational identification numbers.

 

 

Thanks very much for this info....I wonder what motives there might be for Ralph to do it this way. If it were me, I would let it be known, and instead of being viewed upon more negatively than positively lately, he could be alive while he is adored by this whole region.

 

I go to SF Giants, Oakland A's, Golden State Warriors, Niners, and Raiders games. And I'm not a fan of any of those teams. I like watching pro sports and that's why I go. He might be an ardent Sabres fan, or the Sabres might be "one of his favorite teams." It's possible even that he's a big NHL fan more than a devotee of any one team.

 

To that point, didn't Pegula live in Orchard Park for many years? Could be he's just a big hockey fan.

 

I'm not saying he isn't a Sabres fan…but it's possible that there's a hockey team closer to his heart than the Sabres (Penguins?).

 

Pegula would have nothing to gain by admitting it of course. Anyways, it's all speculation.

 

Just thinking out loud.

 

Do you break down in tears at he sight of Mitch Richmond?

Posted

Do you break down in tears at he sight of Mitch Richmond?

As a person who's not a true Warriors fan (I do like them but I was raised with the Braves so any team will be a distant second), NO.

 

Although I have met him. He was a scout for the Warriors (might still be) and seems like a pretty cool guy. No tears though. I reserve those for The Chroise.

 

 

Posted (edited)

Detroit = Hockeytown

 

Buffalo = Hockey Heaven -Pegula

 

Received a few phone calls from family & friends after the presser 'All Shook Up!' "Ya goota see this! Greatest day in Buffalo sports history!!'

 

I watched it and here's my take. For a self made billionaire, he has serious problems speaking! Comes across as a Dolt! Crying seeing Perrault? IDK, perhaps it was real but I don't think so and here's why.

 

I'm a bigger fan of the Sabres than he is. I and many my age and older were fans for life in '69 with the news we'd be getting an expansion NHL team. He said he became a fan in '75. '75?!? He's just a freakin' bandwagon jumper! '75 was our first Cup year. He's from Pittsburgh -where his true loyalties rest- and we were playing the defending Champs from -wait for it- Philly. To know PA is to know there's no love lost between the 2 city's. It's likely he has no idea the roulette wheel spin that gave us 1st overall from Vancover landed on 11, not 1 as previously reported. That #11 became Gilbert Perrault. He wasn't here to see Eddie the Enteratiner -though he eventually found himself in Pittsburgh in a trade for Robert. He didn't feel the horror and grief we all did when Tim Horton crashed and died on the QE. He likely knows nothing of Jim Schoenfeld's double album featuring the best brawl in Sabres history. He jumped on the Sabre bandwagon cuz we were playing Philly..

 

 

WOW! Chandler, I almost always agree with you (one of few people on the board I can say that about) but your cynical outlook on Pegula just strikes me as odd...like I thought you were joking at first.

 

I kind of liked the fact that he wasn't a great speaker. From what I have read of him, his roots are very blue collar, and working class. Everything, as sports fans anyways, we Buffalonians normally cherish. I don't know how anyone couldn't be happy about this. I realize, buying the team, and building a winner are two far differnt things, but this should be a hell of a ride, if Pegula (T-Pegs!) is a man of his word. I like what someone here said, it was refreshing to hear "Buffalo" as a word of pride, rather than being used as an excuse or apology.

 

I'm not sure if he was a Penguins fan. He was a Sabres sth from '80-'98. Doubt you would have seasons if that wasn't your team.

 

I may be mistaken, but he did say that his son was a Penguins fan. Sure if I was a teenage hockey fan, growing up in town that had a perennial contending team, it would be hard not to be a fan...I believe Pegula when he says he is a Sabres fan. From all reports Terry Pegula was a Sabres season ticket holder for 18 years. Is this now being disputed?

Edited by Buftex
Posted

WOW! Chandler, I almost always agree with you (one of few people on the board I can say that about) but your cynical outlook on Pegula just strikes me as odd...like I thought you were joking at first.

 

I kind of liked the fact that he wasn't a great speaker. From what I have read of him, his roots are very blue collar, and working class. Everything, as sports fans anyways, we Buffalonians normally cherish. I don't know how anyone couldn't be happy about this. I realize, buying the team, and building a winner are two far differnt things, but this should be a hell of a ride, if Pegula (T-Pegs!) is a man of his word. I like what someone here said, it was refreshing to hear "Buffalo" as a word of pride, rather than being used as an excuse or apology.

 

 

 

I may be mistaken, but he did say that his son was a Penguins fan. Sure if I was a teenage hockey fan, growing up in town that had a perennial contending team, it would be hard not to be a fan...I believe Pegula when he says he is a Sabres fan. From all reports Terry Pegula was a Sabres season ticket holder for 18 years. Is this now being disputed?

 

 

I'm not disputing it. Keep in mind, the guy's a Billionaire -not that I know what that really means.. If I were wealthy and bought a house near my wife's family and was a hockey fan, I'd have me a box with whatever team I lived by.

 

I'm not anti-Pegula -5th grade speaking skills notwithstanding. My wariness comes from all my friends & family in WNY flipping out over a few words a new owner says on his first day. We have a profound history of wrapping ourselves wildly into our teams' hopes with very little history of happy end results. We measure success by whether we still have a team. Lost the Braves, lost an MLB bid, sharing the Bills with Canada and nearly lost the Sabres to a greedy owner -albeit a local boy.. I AM happy the Penguins are currently solvent. Otherwise, this could have been the worst day in Sabres history.

Posted (edited)

I'm not disputing it. Keep in mind, the guy's a Billionaire -not that I know what that really means.. If I were wealthy and bought a house near my wife's family and was a hockey fan, I'd have me a box with whatever team I lived by.

 

I'm not anti-Pegula -5th grade speaking skills notwithstanding. My wariness comes from all my friends & family in WNY flipping out over a few words a new owner says on his first day. We have a profound history of wrapping ourselves wildly into our teams' hopes with very little history of happy end results. We measure success by whether we still have a team. Lost the Braves, lost an MLB bid, sharing the Bills with Canada and nearly lost the Sabres to a greedy owner -albeit a local boy.. I AM happy the Penguins are currently solvent. Otherwise, this could have been the worst day in Sabres history.

 

I can understand your trepidation, as you said, we have been burned countless times. But, you have to remember, Pegula, to my knowledge, hasn't been a wealthy man his whole life. His wealth is a relatively recent phenomenon. I listened to most of his press conference yesterday, and I wasn't nearly as offended by his speaking abilities as you seem to be. He wasn't illiterate, just not a smooth speaker...I thought it was a great showing, and seemed sincere.

 

Not to prey on your fears, but it seems like every few months, Mario Lemeux makes some comment about getting out of the NHL. Usually just petulant BS, when things don't go his way, on the ice.

 

Eh, I guess maybe it is that loser mentality settling in, but I am going to wrap myself wildly in my teams hopes, every year, no matter what their history is. I root for the Bills, Sabres and Celtics, in that order...up until three years ago, none had won a damn thing, in almost 25 years. The Celtics were coming off 20 years of being one of the worst teams in the league, years, year after year...but they did something bold that changed their fortunes, won a championship, while playing in the finals 2 out of 3 years. Call me naive (and maybe we are fools to buy what Pegula is selling, sight unseen), but I am hoping this is the bold move that will change the Sabres fortunes as well...

Edited by Buftex
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