DC Tom Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 First, don't bring up the "educating our children" crappola. If it was about the children then giving back a few percentages from your paycheck wouldn't be made into such a catostrophic issue. Has anyone ever used the "But think of the children!" argument in a debate and not been completely full of ****? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/02/17/teacher.budget.crisis/index.html?hpt=T2 "We think our wages and benefits should not be the ceiling for working people in the country. It should be the floor," Henry said, adding that the only weapon the middle class has left against wealthy corporations is the union. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/02/17/teacher.budget.crisis/index.html?hpt=T2 "We think our wages and benefits should not be the ceiling for working people in the country. It should be the floor," Henry said, adding that the only weapon the middle class has left against wealthy corporations is the union. I wish there was evidence, and I hope it to be true, that her kids go to private schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whateverdude Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Has anyone ever used the "But think of the children!" argument in a debate and not been completely full of ****? I use it all the time....but of course I'm mostly full of **** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Has anyone ever used the "But think of the children!" argument in a debate and not been completely full of ****? One of the first things that sprung up like a wart when I began this effort to pay closer attention to politics is what the progressives must consider the holy trinity of arguments any time someone wants to cut costs: police, teachers and firefighters. You can talk about cutting bloated adminstrative staff of 18 guys standing around filling a pothole, and as long as they're union, the first thing progressives cry about is how this is going to affect police, teachers and firefighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zulu Cthulhu Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I understand the governor's need to restructure the pension funds, etc. in order to try to get the state solvent again. But why package those provisions with one taking away the union's collective bargaining rights? How does that save any money? Of course, there are a few unions, the local police, firefighters, and state trooper labor organizations, who are exempt from the law and whose bargaining rights will be unaffected. Those unions just happen to be the ones that supported Walker in his campaign last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The dems fled the state because there needs to be a quorum of 20 to vote. There are 19 Republicans and 16 dems. One of the dems has to be in the sate (the governor can get the cops to haul them into the capitol) to get a quorum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/02/17/teacher.budget.crisis/index.html?hpt=T2 "We think our wages and benefits should not be the ceiling for working people in the country. It should be the floor," Henry said, adding that the only weapon the middle class has left against wealthy corporations is the union. These state public workers are so off the reservation it's not even funny. They act as if the State of Wisconsin has this "magical" ATM machine that just prints out money just like the federal government has. The ATM machine (taxpayers) are out of money. The economic collapse exposed the ponzi scheme and the proverbial can no longer can be kicked down the road. California is 100 billion dollars in debt. I heard that, last year, "Arnold the Governator" sent his financial man to the library to research a way to declare the state a territory so that the taxpayers in the other 49 states could be given the tab for that debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 So now the teacher's strike has trickled into my city. Err, sorry, it's not a strike, everyone just happened to get sick on the same day. It would be fitting if they were all fired today, since they're not allowed to strike. Let them all reapply for their jobs if they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) So now the teacher's strike has trickled into my city. Err, sorry, it's not a strike, everyone just happened to get sick on the same day. It would be fitting if they were all fired today, since they're not allowed to strike. Let them all reapply for their jobs if they want. I would LOVE to see teachers across the country call in sick in a show of support. Absolutely LOVE it. The idea that schools across the country would have to shut down because of this, at a time when 9% of the US is unemployed and any person with a heartbeat knows that this country is heading for a financial trainwreck, will do WONDERS for the country's opinion of unions. The gig is up, unions. So go ahead. Join the strike. Please. And while you're skipping work, we'll make sure we look for the union label. Edited February 18, 2011 by LABillzFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary M Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I would LOVE to see teachers across the country call in sick in a show of support. Absolutely LOVE it. The idea that schools across the country would have to shut down because of this, at a time when 9% of the US is unemployed and any person with a heartbeat knows that this country is heading for a financial trainwreck, will do WONDERS for the country's opinion of unions. The gig is up, unions. So go ahead. Join the strike. Please. And while you're skipping work, we'll make sure we look for the union label. Does Walker have any recourse against the unions if it is proved that they organized a "sick day" strike? I would love to see him win a multimillion dollar suit against the union with a presidential election coming up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share Posted February 18, 2011 Copycats, they got that from the Republicans who were complaining about the health insurance reform bill. The fact that he wants to trim back collective bargaining rights for public employees is the worst part. Asking the teachers to give back benefits that were already negotiated and approved of by the state is one thing, but this attempt at busting the unions is too much. Time for the unions to push back and fight for the bargaining rights that people fought and died for in the 20th century. Conservatives claim to be for the workers and families, yet their emphasis is on busting unions and deregulating industry. Sounds like they're the ones who want to make the U.S. into China. I'm still waiting for the job creation they promised would be their top priority. Yet the first thing my new Republican congresswoman did when she got to Washington was push anti-abortion legislation. I suppose you don't see the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Does Walker have any recourse against the unions if it is proved that they organized a "sick day" strike? Personally, his best recourse is to get the vote taken today, then on Monday look at the Rasmussen poll that shows 70% of Wisconsin and 66% of the US supports what Walker is doing, and fire up the engines full steam ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Personally, his best recourse is to get the vote taken today, then on Monday look at the Rasmussen poll that shows 70% of Wisconsin and 66% of the US supports what Walker is doing, and fire up the engines full steam ahead. Link? It'd be nice to share that with some people I know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Link? It'd be nice to share that with some people I know... I was prognasticating. Whatever the results, Rasmussen will do a poll that'll be released by Monday, if not sooner. Look for it here. As pollsters go, they tend to be more accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) I saw a female Wisconsin teacher CRYING on the news this morning, literally CRYING that she might have to contribute...TO HER OWN EFFING PENSION!! "How will I ever replace that 13% of my income?!?!? *sniff, cry* I won't be able to make my mortgage payment!" THIS is why I despise public service unions. Hey lady...try getting a job in the private sector...where there are NO pensions, and ANY retirement is 100% on your own back! OOOOOOOR, try working a job that has more than 180 working days a year! Novel. I hate unions. What is this? Greece? France? Get to flipping work, you're under contract. Edited February 18, 2011 by joesixpack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I was prognasticating. Whatever the results, Rasmussen will do a poll that'll be released by Monday, if not sooner. Look for it here. As pollsters go, they tend to be more accurate. Really? I thought you were just pulling numbers out of your ass to make a point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) Really? I thought you were just pulling numbers out of your ass to make a point? Not much of a difference, really. But I see this going the way of SB1070 in Arizona. All the purple people beaters got bussed in to start protesting, all the "sanctuary" people were crying about civil rights because we're calling illegal people "illegal," all these liberal states were actively boycotting Arizona, but at the end of the day -- in spite of all that noise -- MOST Arizonans and, in fact, most Americans support SB1070. While I don't profess to be right as often as you, I don't think I'm going out on a limb to suggest that when Rasmussen finishes polling this, you'll likely see high local and national support for the Governor of Wisconsin...or at the very least, low support for a bunch of people (who, on average, earn over $100K per year in salaries and benefits) crying because they're being asked to chip in a bit for the good of the state. Edited February 18, 2011 by LABillzFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Not much of a difference, really. I was aware of that. I wasn't criticizing, really, since you did make your point. While I don't profess to be right as often as you, You're not right as often, or you don't profess it as often? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fezmid Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Union is willing to concede benefits but want to keep collective bargaining. http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/116470423.html Can anyone here explain what that actually means? What are the pros/cons of collective bargaining both from the state and from the employee/union perspective? I don't really know enough about it. Although this quote really pisses me off: "but we will not be denied our God-given right to join a real union . . . we will not - I repeat we will not - be denied our rights to collectively bargain," Beil said in a statement." Since when is joining a union a God given right...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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