The Kansas City Chiefs

[San Jose Bills Fan]

And the reason I bring this up is because for quite a long time after Chan Gailey was hired, it was quite common for those opposed to his hiring to point out that he had been fired by Chiefs coach Todd Haley just months into his tenure with KC. Haley was a first-time Head Coach who had never played organized football in his life (he was, however, on his college golf team).

 

Many people cited Gailey's firing in Kansas City as proof that he wasn't a good coach.

 

To recap:

 

In 2008, Gailey was hired by then Chiefs coach Herm Edwards inheriting a horrible offense which ranked 31st in yardage and 31st points the season before. By most accounts Gailey did a good job with what he had on hand, getting a surprisingly productive season out of quarterback Tyler Thigpen and improving the offensive rankings marginally to 26th in points and 24th in yardage. Besides Thigpen, quarterbacks Damon Huard, Brodie Croyle, and Quinn Gray all saw action that season.

 

In 2009, Todd Haley was named Chiefs Head Coach. Probably because it was suggested to the rookie head coach by GM Scott Pioli, Haley retained Chan Gailey as his offensive coordinator but fired him during the preseason. Gailey was out of football for the remainder of the year. Haley acted as his own OC and the Chiefs didn't improve offensively, ranking 23rd in points and 25th in yardage.

 

In 2010 after a 4-12 season, General Manager Scott Pioli (formerly of New England) hired former Belichick assistant Charlie Weis to be Haley's Offensive Coordinator. (Romeo Crennel was also named as the DC).

 

Weis did an excellent job with the Chiefs offense this past season but there were rumblings of an uneasy relationship between himself and Haley. In fact there were rumors that Haley stripped Weis of his playcalling duties in the playoff loss to Baltimore. Oddly enough, Weis left the Chiefs about one month ago to take a job as Offensive Coordinator…at the University of Florida. Now Florida is certainly a prestigious program but many were struck by how odd it was that Weis would leave an NFL OC job for a college OC job. There's a good chance that Weis wanted out of KC but was not allowed to take an NFL job so he had to go the college route in order to leave Kansas City.

 

Now that Weis is gone, Haley has promoted offensive line coach Bill Muir to be the Chiefs newest Offensive Coordinator…their third OC in 3 seasons.

 

Haley has a lot of proving to do, although a nice foundation has been laid by Weis and Muir is a respected coach.

 

Meanwhile, criticism of the Gailey hiring seems to have subsided. As a supporter and fan of Coach Gailey, I thought with the hiring of yet another OC in Kansas City, that this would be a good time to revisit this subject.

Edited February 5, 2011 by San Jose Bills Fan

[DC Grid]

Anyone who spends one minute looking into Haley's record should know he has problems with everyone and he is almost always to blame. He is an awful coach and a horrible boss. List of people Haley has openly fought with during his tenure in KC.

 

Chan Gailey

Dwayne Bowe

Tyler Thigpen

Charlie Wiess

 

 

Haley is a moron who has only had success through the hard work of others. There is no way he lasts more than a year or two more. He is the worst coach in the NFL.

Edited February 5, 2011 by DC Grid

[BADOLBILZ]

And the reason I bring this up is because for quite a long time after Chan Gailey was hired, it was quite common for those opposed to his hiring to point out that he had been fired by Chiefs coach Todd Haley just months into his tenure with KC. Haley was a first-time Head Coach who had never played organized football in his life (he was, however, on his college golf team).

 

Many people cited Gailey's firing in Kansas City as proof that he wasn't a good coach.

 

To recap:

 

In 2008, Gailey was hired by then Chiefs coach Herm Edwards inheriting a horrible offense which ranked 31st in yardage and 31st points the season before. By most accounts Gailey did a good job with what he had on hand, getting a surprisingly productive season out of quarterback Tyler Thigpen and improving the offensive rankings marginally to 26th in points and 24th in yardage. Besides Thigpen, quarterbacks Damon Huard, Brodie Croyle, and Quinn Gray all saw action that season.

 

In 2009, Todd Haley was named Chiefs Head Coach. Probably because it was suggested to the rookie head coach by GM Scott Pioli, Haley retained Chan Gailey as his offensive coordinator but fired him during the preseason. Gailey was out of football for the remainder of the year. Haley acted as his own OC and the Chiefs didn't improve offensively, ranking 23rd in points and 25th in yardage.

 

In 2010 after a 4-12 season, General Manager Scott Pioli (formerly of New England) hired former Belichick assistant Charlie Weis to be Haley's Offensive Coordinator. (Romeo Crennel was also named as the DC).

 

Weis did an excellent job with the Chiefs offense this past season but there were rumblings of an uneasy relationship between himself and Haley. In fact there were rumors that Haley stripped Weis of his playcalling duties in the playoff loss to Baltimore. Oddly enough, Weis left the Chiefs about one month ago to take a job as Offensive Coordinator…at the University of Florida. Now Florida is certainly a prestigious program but many were struck by how odd it was that Weis would leave an NFL OC job for a college OC job. There's a good chance that Weis wanted out of KC but was not allowed to take an NFL job so he had to go the college route in order to leave Kansas City.

 

Now that Weis is gone, Haley has promoted offensive line coach Bill Muir to be the Chiefs newest Offensive Coordinator…their third OC in 3 seasons.

 

Haley has a lot of proving to do, although a nice foundation has been laid by Weis and Muir is a respected coach.

 

Meanwhile, criticism of the Gailey hiring seems to have subsided. As a supporter and fan of Coach Gailey, I thought with the hiring of yet another OC in Kansas City, that this would be a good time to revisit this subject.

 

The criticism of Gailey has definitely subsided. He is very different than Jauron, and he came in and provided an interesting and semi-productive offense.

 

That's all it took to quell fans tired of the boring, play-not-to lose style the Bills employed for the previous 4 seasons.

 

The perception is that things were better, even though results on the field were actually a bit worse.

 

Very reminiscent of when Jauron took over, and cleaned up the loose ship of Mularkey and had Bills fans looking to a bright future.

 

Or when Mularkey took over for Gregg Williams and had the Bills on the verge of the playoffs as a rookie HC.

 

Sometimes it's easy to make a good first impression.

 

My concern with Gailey is what happens the second year. A lot of people are assuming that his offense is just going to get better. To me, that's VERY questionable.

 

I am of the belief that the easiest time to be an OC is the first time opposing defenses see his team run his new offense. He has a big advantage, as teams don't have tendencies on his new offense. I know Gailey is well traveled and there is a lot of tape on his offenses, but there was no tape of this team with his offense this year.

 

And it showed. After a dreadful start, they went on a very productive offensive run for much of the season.

 

I don't think it's a big coincidence that at the end of the year, when the Pats and Jets got a second look........the offense looked HORRIBLE.

 

That's the way it goes. Take the Pats games every year. Practically every time the Bills have a new OC, they play well in their first meeting with Belichick. Gilbride, Fairchild, Turk...even Alex Van Pelt. All showed well in their first effort against NE.

 

This is Gailey's challenge. Adapt. Improve. Win. Until he does that, he's done nothing.

 

The truth of the matter is, he was a big disappointment at Georgia Tech. That trumps his firing in KC. As football programs go, Georgia Tech is a good one in a good recruiting area and they play in a conference that is not as hard to compete in as the SEC. His failure there is an indictment.

 

Not saying that means he can't succeed. What it means is he has failed at an easier task and has never had any real success in this capacity, as a HC, before.

[CookieG]

Anyone who spends one minute looking into Haley's record should know he has problems with everyone and he is almost always to blame. He is an awful coach and a horrible boss. List of people Haley has openly fought with during his tenure in KC.

 

Chan Gailey

Dwayne Bowe

Tyler Thigpen

Charlie Wiess

 

 

Haley is a moron who has only had success through the hard work of others. There is no way he lasts more than a year or two more. He is the worst coach in the NFL.

 

You can add Brian Waters to that list. When Haley first came on, Waters asked for a meeting to see where the team was headed. Haley blew him off. Waters asked some of the Cards vets what they thought of him and they hated him. he begged for a trade, but Pioli wouldn't allow it.

 

His defense sucked until he brought in Crennel, probably his second smartest move after bringing in Weis. Like a good owner, he really needs to bring in good assistants and stay out of their way.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

The criticism of Gailey has definitely subsided. He is very different than Jauron, and he came in and provided an interesting and semi-productive offense.

 

That's all it took to quell fans tired of the boring, play-not-to lose style the Bills employed for the previous 4 seasons.

My concern with Gailey is what happens the second year. A lot of people are assuming that his offense is just going to get better. To me, that's VERY questionable.

 

I am of the belief that the easiest time to be an OC is the first time opposing defenses see his team run his new offense. He has a big advantage, as teams don't have tendencies on his new offense. I know Gailey is well traveled and there is a lot of tape on his offenses, but there was no tape of this team with his offense this year.

 

And it showed. After a dreadful start, they went on a very productive offensive run for much of the season.

 

I don't think it's a big coincidence that at the end of the year, when the Pats and Jets got a second look........the offense looked HORRIBLE.

 

Interesting points, Bad'ol

 

I see a correlation between the horrible last two games and the number of Bills out with injuries or playing hurt. We were playing our 2nd and 3rd string OL and LB while our 1st string is arguably 2nd string anywhere else. And we might have been beat no matter what, but we kicked our own asses with all the turnovers.

 

My opinion, worth what anyone here pays for it: If the defense stays as it is, the offense will not get better. That might be seen as a paradox, but Gailey said it himself about the QB on the 4 top NFL teams: don't overlook that they all have strong defense, it's a huge help to a QB not to feel that he has to score every time he gets the ball and to know that if he makes a mistake he'll get the ball back and get a chance to get it right. Plus, sheer TOP is helpful.

 

I am very concerned about so much of the assistant coaching staff being from Georgia Tech, not accustomed to a winning program and inexperienced in the NFL. I view the hiring of Wannstache as a positive move and am hoping for 1-2 more quiet rearrangements in the coaching staff.

 

All that said, fundamentally I agree with you that Gailey and the Nix/Gailey program are unproven and while I see good things, I also see inexplicable moves or things that look like mistakes from here.

Edited February 5, 2011 by Hopeful

[San Jose Bills Fan]

With regard to Todd Haley, I admit I never liked the guy. I remember seeing his heated exchanges with Kurt Warner when he was OC for the Cardinals and even then he seemed like a narcissistic and egotistical jerk.

 

But really he has to be judged on his record as a head coach and supposed offensive mastermind. The jury is pretty much out on that still.

 

His career is quite fascinating because he never played organized football on any level. However his father was Dick Haley who remains a longtime personnel man in the NFL and is credited with being the main architect of the great Steelers dynasty of the 70s.. So on some level, Haley knows his stuff. But I believe it is without precedent for an NFL Head Coach to have never played organized football.

 

Haley's certainly in a good situation. The Hunt family is one of the great ownership groups in the NFL. As for his boss, Scott Pioli collaborated for many years with Belichick and it can be argued that Haley, in some regards, is Pioli's puppet. The hiring of Weis and Crennel certainly suggest this.

 

Point being, Haley is in a position to succeed because the organization he is in is rock solid.

 

With regard to Chan Gailey, the jury is out on him as well. I like what I've seen so far and I'm not sure he got a fair shake when he was the Cowboys Head Coach. As far as Georgia Tech goes, I rationalize that Gailey is more suited to be a pro coach than a college coach. Charlie Weis failed miserably as Notre Dame coach. Some coaches are more compatible to the pro context than the college context. In fact very few coaches have been highly successful as head coaches at both levels. Typically they're better at one than the other.

 

Anyways I'm still optimistic about Gailey and hope like hell there's not an NFL work stoppage in 2011.

[Tcali]

And the reason I bring this up is because for quite a long time after Chan Gailey was hired, it was quite common for those opposed to his hiring to point out that he had been fired by Chiefs coach Todd Haley just months into his tenure with KC. Haley was a first-time Head Coach who had never played organized football in his life (he was, however, on his college golf team).

 

Many people cited Gailey's firing in Kansas City as proof that he wasn't a good coach.

 

To recap:

 

In 2008, Gailey was hired by then Chiefs coach Herm Edwards inheriting a horrible offense which ranked 31st in yardage and 31st points the season before. By most accounts Gailey did a good job with what he had on hand, getting a surprisingly productive season out of quarterback Tyler Thigpen and improving the offensive rankings marginally to 26th in points and 24th in yardage. Besides Thigpen, quarterbacks Damon Huard, Brodie Croyle, and Quinn Gray all saw action that season.

 

In 2009, Todd Haley was named Chiefs Head Coach. Probably because it was suggested to the rookie head coach by GM Scott Pioli, Haley retained Chan Gailey as his offensive coordinator but fired him during the preseason. Gailey was out of football for the remainder of the year. Haley acted as his own OC and the Chiefs didn't improve offensively, ranking 23rd in points and 25th in yardage.

 

In 2010 after a 4-12 season, General Manager Scott Pioli (formerly of New England) hired former Belichick assistant Charlie Weis to be Haley's Offensive Coordinator. (Romeo Crennel was also named as the DC).

 

Weis did an excellent job with the Chiefs offense this past season but there were rumblings of an uneasy relationship between himself and Haley. In fact there were rumors that Haley stripped Weis of his playcalling duties in the playoff loss to Baltimore. Oddly enough, Weis left the Chiefs about one month ago to take a job as Offensive Coordinator…at the University of Florida. Now Florida is certainly a prestigious program but many were struck by how odd it was that Weis would leave an NFL OC job for a college OC job. There's a good chance that Weis wanted out of KC but was not allowed to take an NFL job so he had to go the college route in order to leave Kansas City.

 

Now that Weis is gone, Haley has promoted offensive line coach Bill Muir to be the Chiefs newest Offensive Coordinator…their third OC in 3 seasons.

 

Haley has a lot of proving to do, although a nice foundation has been laid by Weis and Muir is a respected coach.

 

Meanwhile, criticism of the Gailey hiring seems to have subsided. As a supporter and fan of Coach Gailey, I thought with the hiring of yet another OC in Kansas City, that this would be a good time to revisit this subject.

good points..but anyone could see (after a few games and with an unbraindead QB) that gailey has a terrific offensive mind.we have yet to see whether haley is just a dope or whether he is one of those guys where every single aspect of the game has to be under his control.

[jr1]

Haley has severe OCD

[CardinalScotts]

Anyone who spends one minute looking into Haley's record should know he has problems with everyone and he is almost always to blame. He is an awful coach and a horrible boss. List of people Haley has openly fought with during his tenure in KC.

 

Chan Gailey

Dwayne Bowe

Tyler Thigpen

Charlie Wiess

 

 

Haley is a moron who has only had success through the hard work of others. There is no way he lasts more than a year or two more. He is the worst coach in the NFL.

 

add OG Brian Waters and LB Derrick Johnson to the list......check their schedule last year if you wonder how they jumped up this year. The Bills played nine playoff teams while the chiefs played two and one of them was Seattle.

Edited February 5, 2011 by CardinalScotts

[Sisyphean Bills]

...

 

The truth of the matter is, he was a big disappointment at Georgia Tech. That trumps his firing in KC. As football programs go, Georgia Tech is a good one in a good recruiting area and they play in a conference that is not as hard to compete in as the SEC. His failure there is an indictment.

 

Not saying that means he can't succeed. What it means is he has failed at an easier task and has never had any real success in this capacity, as a HC, before.

The facts are that they recruited pretty darn well at Tech. It just didn't translate on the field, especially with Mark Richt's total domination of the in-state rivalry.

[NoSaint]

The criticism of Gailey has definitely subsided. He is very different than Jauron, and he came in and provided an interesting and semi-productive offense.

 

That's all it took to quell fans tired of the boring, play-not-to lose style the Bills employed for the previous 4 seasons.

 

The perception is that things were better, even though results on the field were actually a bit worse.

 

Very reminiscent of when Jauron took over, and cleaned up the loose ship of Mularkey and had Bills fans looking to a bright future.

 

Or when Mularkey took over for Gregg Williams and had the Bills on the verge of the playoffs as a rookie HC.

 

Sometimes it's easy to make a good first impression.

 

My concern with Gailey is what happens the second year. A lot of people are assuming that his offense is just going to get better. To me, that's VERY questionable.

 

I am of the belief that the easiest time to be an OC is the first time opposing defenses see his team run his new offense. He has a big advantage, as teams don't have tendencies on his new offense. I know Gailey is well traveled and there is a lot of tape on his offenses, but there was no tape of this team with his offense this year.

 

And it showed. After a dreadful start, they went on a very productive offensive run for much of the season.

 

I don't think it's a big coincidence that at the end of the year, when the Pats and Jets got a second look........the offense looked HORRIBLE.

 

That's the way it goes. Take the Pats games every year. Practically every time the Bills have a new OC, they play well in their first meeting with Belichick. Gilbride, Fairchild, Turk...even Alex Van Pelt. All showed well in their first effort against NE.

 

This is Gailey's challenge. Adapt. Improve. Win. Until he does that, he's done nothing.

 

The truth of the matter is, he was a big disappointment at Georgia Tech. That trumps his firing in KC. As football programs go, Georgia Tech is a good one in a good recruiting area and they play in a conference that is not as hard to compete in as the SEC. His failure there is an indictment.

 

Not saying that means he can't succeed. What it means is he has failed at an easier task and has never had any real success in this capacity, as a HC, before.

 

 

college can be an indicator, but it is a different beast in a lot of ways. recruiting guys to play for free for four years(or less), and keeping guys who make more then you focused are totally different. the game play is at different speeds too as far as game planning, and disparity in talent can be huge. being a leader of 18 year olds vs being a leader of men that have wives and children. i wouldnt say its a matter of easier vs harder as a head coach, moreso its just different. some personalities, schemes, etc.... dont work in one and do in the other.

[Captain Hindsight]

Anyone who spends one minute looking into Haley's record should know he has problems with everyone and he is almost always to blame. He is an awful coach and a horrible boss. List of people Haley has openly fought with during his tenure in KC.

 

Chan Gailey

Dwayne Bowe

Tyler Thigpen

Charlie Wiess

 

 

Haley is a moron who has only had success through the hard work of others. There is no way he lasts more than a year or two more. He is the worst coach in the NFL.

I dont think he is the worst coach in the NFL but he might be the hardest to work with

[Hapless Bills Fan]

With regard to Todd Haley, I admit I never liked the guy. I remember seeing his heated exchanges with Kurt Warner when he was OC for the Cardinals and even then he seemed like a narcissistic and egotistical jerk.

 

He would not be alone in the NFL coaching fraternity for that.

Someone I know was friends with the Martz family. What he has to say about Martz' wife and kids is highly complimentary.

What he has to say about Martz I won't repeat under the "can't say something nice, keep quiet" clause.

 

His career is quite fascinating because he never played organized football on any level.

 

Really interesting point. I had thought Levy had not played football, I thought wrong.

 

I hope your optimism re: Gailey is justified. I think Jerry Jones has openly said he made a mistake to fire Gailey when he did, and I agree with you about college/NFL coaching not necessarily translating. I would like to think Nix is our Buddy and Chan is the Man. I am encouraged by the Wannstache hiring. I will even give them a pass on Spiller: to draft a guy who evaluated as a top talent (but not a need), and spend a year coaching up/evaluating the players in house before making decisions on what we really need, is not a stupid or short-sited thing to do.

 

Then there is Cornell Green and Kelsay and all the Dolphin cast-offs as LBs which make me ..... nervous:unsure:

[BuffaloBill]

 

Then there is Cornell Green and Kelsay and all the Dolphin cast-offs as LBs which make me ..... nervous:unsure:

 

 

The LB'ing situation is a mystery to me. Nix and gailey had to know what they had was a very bad unit. They did little in FA to improve the situation. We will see what this offseason brings but until the D front seven is nailed down it will be hard for Gailey to make any meaningful progress.

[BillsFanInLV]

A year or so ago, I commented on a post in regards to how the coaching staff of KC made some drastic changes which led the team to where it is today. Chan Gailey was part of that KC decision making at the time. ---KC traded off 'franchise-esque' players such as Jared Allen for additional draft picks. They accumulated dozens of picks in what was the coming draft at the time.

 

KC also cut ties with players such as RB Larry Johnson and replaced them with young 'up and coming' talent like Jamaal Charles and veterans like Thomas Jones. At least in the RB category, one can draw parallels to the Thomas Jones/Jamaal Charles combo and the Fred Jackson/CJ Spiller duo(although it may be too early to tell)

 

I think the template that KC used could be used for the Bills in the coming years, even though KC already had a HOF Tight End and a Big physical Receiver.

 

If Buffalo drafts Defense and drafts well, they could solidify the Def side of the ball for the next five to 8 years. Hopefully this will allow us to address the TE position, possibly through free agency and allow our already productive receivers to develope more this year. I don't see any dropoff between Matt Cassel and Ryan Fitzpatrick on the QB side of the ball, I simply think we need our running game to evolve to what Kansas City has been able to accomplish.

 

Just my 2 cents on the issue.

[Captain Hindsight]

The LB'ing situation is a mystery to me. Nix and gailey had to know what they had was a very bad unit. They did little in FA to improve the situation. We will see what this offseason brings but until the D front seven is nailed down it will be hard for Gailey to make any meaningful progress.

They did bring in Andre Davis who was an experienced 3-4 guy and Shawn Merriman halfway thru the season. Drafted Moats and Batten. Losing Mitchell in the Preseason was a bigger loss than most think IMO. And we had schobel on the roster til TC before we basically told him to report or retire. I think they did a decent job trying to address it as there are only 4 LB positions and we brought in 4 guys

[C.Biscuit97]

Todd Haley is a richard and probably sucks to work with. But hey, he was a college golfer.