tonyjustbcuz Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) NFL Mock Drafts vary greatly, but some of the players that continually get mentioned as potential top 5 picks include: N.Fairley DT, D.Bowers DE, B. Gabbert QB, P. Peterson QB, A.J. Green WR, M. Dareus DT, and possibly a couple more....Quinn, Miller, My opinion is that Fairley and Bowers could easily go #1 & #2 in either order but Green or Peterson could sneak in either spot as well... If Fairley and Bowers go before the Bills pick at #3 there would obviously be a wide range of options at this pick...Some of the "so-called" mock draft experts are starting to prognosticate that the Bills would select M. Dareus at #3. I think that has the potential to be a devastating mistake! Not that there are guarantees of any pick every reaching expectations. Here is a few reasons to worry about selecting M. Dareus as provided by FFTOOLBOX.COM (You can select Mock Draft) and read all the draftnik mocks, all the user mock drafts, and also make up you own mock draft which people will leave comments about and rate! It's a lot of fun and it's free!!! So back to the topic...Here are some reasons why we should avoid selecting M. Dareus with our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft: #1. Marcell Dareus was really a one-year wonder at Alabama who only started 4 other games in his entire collegiate career prior to last season! Wasn't Aaron Maybin a one year wonder at his college position? #2. Marcell Dareus is entering the draft after his junior season..Did Aaron Maybin come out after his junior season? #3. Marcell Dareus also was suspended for 2 games last season for receiving improper benefits from agents...Just gives me red flags of the potential for other future criminal/moral impropriaties. #4. M. Dareus is ranked between the 2-4 best DT in the upcoming draft and will not be in the words of Buddy Nix (Best Player available at pick #3.) He is rated by fftoolbox.com as the #6 pick in the draft, and I believe that is a slight reach as I have him at #10. If the Bills feel like he is the pick, they could trade down to pick #8 or possibly lower and still get him while picking up some extra picks, but personally I don't want him as this has to be a sure pick! (as sure as one can be that is!). #5. M. Dareus is a little stocky and is 2" shorter than Fairley and at least 1" shorter than Bowers. Doesn't sound like much, but than often means a shorter wing span, possibly shorter arms etc. To be the best, size at the position of DE/DT counts! So what do you think is Marcell Dareus worth surrendering our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft? My answer is he has great upside, but is high-risk, therefore my answer is a resounding NO! A couple of years ago I was saying that Aaron Maybin was a high risk pick that I would not approve of because of some of the same reasons! I was devastated when the Bills passed on Bray Orakapo. History often repeats itself...(especially in the Bills organization!!!) The pick I fear the most is the pick I believe the Bills will make..Mark my word!!! Tell me what you think as I'd love to get your prospective on Dareus and the Players I mentioned at the beginning of this post. NFL Mock Drafts vary greatly, but some of the players that continually get mentioned as potential top 5 picks include: N.Fairley DT, D.Bowers DE, B. Gabbert QB, P. Peterson QB, A.J. Green WR, M. Dareus DT, and possibly a couple more....Quinn, Miller, My opinion is that Fairley and Bowers could easily go #1 & #2 in either order but Green or Peterson could sneak in either spot as well... If Fairley and Bowers go before the Bills pick at #3 there would obviously be a wide range of options at this pick...Some of the "so-called" mock draft experts are starting to prognosticate that the Bills would select M. Dareus at #3. I think that has the potential to be a devastating mistake! Not that there are guarantees of any pick every reaching expectations. Here is a few reasons to worry about selecting M. Dareus as provided by FFTOOLBOX.COM (You can select Mock Draft) and read all the draftnik mocks, all the user mock drafts, and also make up you own mock draft which people will leave comments about and rate! It's a lot of fun and it's free!!! So back to the topic...Here are some reasons why we should avoid selecting M. Dareus with our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft: #1. Marcell Dareus was really a one-year wonder at Alabama who only started 4 other games in his entire collegiate career prior to last season! Wasn't Aaron Maybin a one year wonder at his college position? #2. Marcell Dareus is entering the draft after his junior season..Did Aaron Maybin come out after his junior season? #3. Marcell Dareus also was suspended for 2 games last season for receiving improper benefits from agents...Just gives me red flags of the potential for other future criminal/moral impropriaties. #4. M. Dareus is ranked between the 2-4 best DT in the upcoming draft and will not be in the words of Buddy Nix (Best Player available at pick #3.) He is rated by fftoolbox.com as the #6 pick in the draft, and I believe that is a slight reach as I have him at #10. If the Bills feel like he is the pick, they could trade down to pick #8 or possibly lower and still get him while picking up some extra picks, but personally I don't want him as this has to be a sure pick! (as sure as one can be that is!). #5. M. Dareus is a little stocky and is 2" shorter than Fairley and at least 1" shorter than Bowers. Doesn't sound like much, but than often means a shorter wing span, possibly shorter arms etc. To be the best, size at the position of DE/DT counts! So what do you think is Marcell Dareus worth surrendering our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft? My answer is he has great upside, but is high-risk, therefore my answer is a resounding NO! A couple of years ago I was saying that Aaron Maybin was a high risk pick that I would not approve of because of some of the same reasons! I was devastated when the Bills passed on Bray Orakapo. History often repeats itself...(especially in the Bills organization!!!) The pick I fear the most is the pick I believe the Bills will make..Mark my word!!! Tell me what you think as I'd love to get your prospective on Dareus and the Players I mentioned at the beginning of this post. Edited February 2, 2011 by tonyjustbcuz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 i see that you like the maybin comparisons, but i dont see them myself. as a one year wonder, i must point to that sophomore season where he only started 4 games but had 6.5 sacks playing in a 3-4 D-line, which put him 8th in the SEC. Not bad for a backup in a 3-4 scheme. Also a huge performance in the BCS championship. maybin was terribly undersized, dareus is big enough to play inside or out. i also know its high school, but dareus put up more sacks in his senior year then maybin did in his junior and senior combined. i wouldnt normally bring that up but you are correct, maybin otherwise only has one year of comparison before being drafted. just some stuff to think of for the other side of the argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Rob Johnson Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 #1. Marcell Dareus was really a one-year wonder at Alabama who only started 4 other games in his entire collegiate career prior to last season! Wasn't Aaron Maybin a one year wonder at his college position? #2. Marcell Dareus is entering the draft after his junior season..Did Aaron Maybin come out after his junior season? #3. Marcell Dareus also was suspended for 2 games last season for receiving improper benefits from agents...Just gives me red flags of the potential for other future criminal/moral impropriaties. #4. M. Dareus is ranked between the 2-4 best DT in the upcoming draft and will not be in the words of Buddy Nix (Best Player available at pick #3.) He is rated by fftoolbox.com as the #6 pick in the draft, and I believe that is a slight reach as I have him at #10. If the Bills feel like he is the pick, they could trade down to pick #8 or possibly lower and still get him while picking up some extra picks, but personally I don't want him as this has to be a sure pick! (as sure as one can be that is!). #5. M. Dareus is a little stocky and is 2" shorter than Fairley and at least 1" shorter than Bowers. Doesn't sound like much, but than often means a shorter wing span, possibly shorter arms etc. To be the best, size at the position of DE/DT counts! Many of your criteria apply to some of the other prospects you listed: #1. Fairley and Bowers could both be considered one year wonders. Fairley started only 2 games at Auburn before his senior season. Bowers had only 4 career sacks going into his senior season. Quinn put up big numbers his sophomore season but was suspended his entire junior year. #2. All of them are juniors except for Miller #3. Green was suspended 4 games for selling a jersey to an agent and Quinn suspended for the entire season after it was found that he had accepted benefits from an agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Are we going to compare EVERY player in the 1st round to Maybin from now till eternity? Just asking.... If you want to make comparisons between Maybin and Von Miller? Well I can see that line of thinking.... Darius is productive.....makes the players around him better......is country strong all day....makes plays....noone questions his ability as a run stopper....everyone can see that he gets pressure as a DT or a DE.....and he actually PLAYS IN A 3-4 Oh wait...this thread was about reasons as to WHY NOT to draft Darius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 IMO Dareus will just be "a guy" at the next level. Not a star, but a solid "guy" on the defensive line. That is NOT what you want with the 3rd pick overall. Draft Miller, Green or Bowers since these are the playmaker/impact types rated high in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvermike Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Aaron Maybin is the new reason why every draft pick we make will be wrong. He inherits this role from Mike Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) #1. Marcell Dareus was really a one-year wonder at Alabama who only started 4 other games in his entire collegiate career prior to last season! Wasn't Aaron Maybin a one year wonder at his college position? He has more than one year of productive college football (especially in the SEC and in Bowl games where he shows up for the big games). It's not like he came out of nowhere this season (Fairley) and started producing. His numbers from his sophomore season are basically identical to his junior season. #2. Marcell Dareus is entering the draft after his junior season..Did Aaron Maybin come out after his junior season? Are you seriously using this as part of your argument? #3. Marcell Dareus also was suspended for 2 games last season for receiving improper benefits from agents...Just gives me red flags of the potential for other future criminal/moral impropriaties. He received two trips to Miami totaling under $2,000 which he paid back to a charity. He mad a mistake, took the punishment and moved on. Does this mean that he'll get arrested for smuggling cocaine? For all we know, this is only hiccup on his record and he'll be a little angel for the rest of his career. I don't see it being that big of a deal. #4. M. Dareus is ranked between the 2-4 best DT in the upcoming draft and will not be in the words of Buddy Nix (Best Player available at pick #3.) He is rated by fftoolbox.com as the #6 pick in the draft, and I believe that is a slight reach as I have him at #10. If the Bills feel like he is the pick, they could trade down to pick #8 or possibly lower and still get him while picking up some extra picks, but personally I don't want him as this has to be a sure pick! (as sure as one can be that is!). For the record, Dareus was productive as DT and DE in Alabama's hybrid defense. It's also amazing how you know the grade Nix is going to give Dareus. For all we know he very well could be BPA at #3. Just because fftoolbox has him at #6 doesn't mean that's how every scout & GM will see him. And how often are there ever any sure picks in the draft? Any player can bust regardless of where they were taken. #5. M. Dareus is a little stocky and is 2" shorter than Fairley and at least 1" shorter than Bowers. Doesn't sound like much, but than often means a shorter wing span, possibly shorter arms etc. To be the best, size at the position of DE/DT counts! It counts to an extent. But there are plenty of players with prototypical size and measureables that fall flat on their face and don't produce. Being an inch or two shorter than Fairley or Bowers isn't a strong argument since neither of them have played a single down in the NFL. Possibly shorter arms? You're really grasping at straws aren't you? So what do you think is Marcell Dareus worth surrendering our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft? My answer is he has great upside, but is high-risk, therefore my answer is a resounding NO! News flash, guys like Fairley and Bowers are also high risk, high reward players as well... A couple of years ago I was saying that Aaron Maybin was a high risk pick that I would not approve of because of some of the same reasons! I was devastated when the Bills passed on Bray Orakapo. History often repeats itself...(especially in the Bills organization!!!) The pick I fear the most is the pick I believe the Bills will make..Mark my word!!! Good for you Tell me what you think as I'd love to get your prospective on Dareus and the Players I mentioned at the beginning of this post. I think this whole post is contradictory. You basically start off by discrediting the draft analysts that have us picking Dareus at 3, yet you use another draft analyst site to back up your argument? I wouldn't mind if we drafted Dareus at #3. He fits an immediate need and could be a Pro Bowler for years to come. His versatility also helps with the defense we'll be running until we have the personnel to fully be a 3-4 team. There are a few different options that we can go with the 3rd pick and he's certainly one of them. Edited February 3, 2011 by Bangarang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 He has more than one year of productive college football (especially in the SEC and in Bowl games where he shows up for the big games). It's not like he came out of nowhere this season (Fairley) and started producing. His numbers from his sophomore season are basically identical to his junior season. Are you seriously using this as part of your argument? He received two trips to Miami totaling under $2,000 which he paid back to a charity. He mad a mistake, took the punishment and moved on. Does this mean that he'll get arrested for smuggling cocaine? For all we know, this is only hiccup on his record and he'll be a little angel for the rest of his career. I don't see it being that big of a deal. For the record, Dareus was productive as DT and DE in Alabama's hybrid defense. It's also amazing how you know the grade Nix is going to give Dareus. For all we know he very well could be BPA at #3. Just because fftoolbox has him at #6 doesn't mean that's how every scout & GM will see him. And how often are there ever any sure picks in the draft? Any player can bust regardless of where they were taken. It counts to an extent. But there are plenty of players with prototypical size and measureables that fall flat on their face and don't produce. Being an inch or two shorter than Fairley or Bowers isn't a strong argument since neither of them have played a single down in the NFL. Possibly shorter arms? You're really grasping at straws aren't you? News flash, guys like Fairley and Bowers are also high risk, high reward players as well... Good for you I think this whole post is contradictory. You basically start off by discrediting the draft analysts that have us picking Dareus at 3, yet you use another draft analyst site to back up your argument? I wouldn't mind if we drafted Dareus at #3. He fits an immediate need and could be a Pro Bowler for years to come. His versatility also helps with the defense we'll be running until we have the personnel to fully be a 3-4 team. There are a few different options that we can go with the 3rd pick and he's certainly one of them. Ouch....but good job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beebe's Kid Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I just lose interest when I read posts filled with a ton of bull **** then see the old "I have him at #x." When you don't even have your facts straight, or present, how the !@#$ can your "big board" rankings mean anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 NFL Mock Drafts vary greatly, but some of the players that continually get mentioned as potential top 5 picks include: N.Fairley DT, D.Bowers DE, B. Gabbert QB, P. Peterson QB, A.J. Green WR, M. Dareus DT, and possibly a couple more....Quinn, Miller, My opinion is that Fairley and Bowers could easily go #1 & #2 in either order but Green or Peterson could sneak in either spot as well... If Fairley and Bowers go before the Bills pick at #3 there would obviously be a wide range of options at this pick...Some of the "so-called" mock draft experts are starting to prognosticate that the Bills would select M. Dareus at #3. I think that has the potential to be a devastating mistake! Not that there are guarantees of any pick every reaching expectations. Here is a few reasons to worry about selecting M. Dareus as provided by FFTOOLBOX.COM (You can select Mock Draft) and read all the draftnik mocks, all the user mock drafts, and also make up you own mock draft which people will leave comments about and rate! It's a lot of fun and it's free!!! So back to the topic...Here are some reasons why we should avoid selecting M. Dareus with our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft: #1. Marcell Dareus was really a one-year wonder at Alabama who only started 4 other games in his entire collegiate career prior to last season! Wasn't Aaron Maybin a one year wonder at his college position? #2. Marcell Dareus is entering the draft after his junior season..Did Aaron Maybin come out after his junior season? #3. Marcell Dareus also was suspended for 2 games last season for receiving improper benefits from agents...Just gives me red flags of the potential for other future criminal/moral impropriaties. #4. M. Dareus is ranked between the 2-4 best DT in the upcoming draft and will not be in the words of Buddy Nix (Best Player available at pick #3.) He is rated by fftoolbox.com as the #6 pick in the draft, and I believe that is a slight reach as I have him at #10. If the Bills feel like he is the pick, they could trade down to pick #8 or possibly lower and still get him while picking up some extra picks, but personally I don't want him as this has to be a sure pick! (as sure as one can be that is!). #5. M. Dareus is a little stocky and is 2" shorter than Fairley and at least 1" shorter than Bowers. Doesn't sound like much, but than often means a shorter wing span, possibly shorter arms etc. To be the best, size at the position of DE/DT counts! So what do you think is Marcell Dareus worth surrendering our 3rd pick in the 2011 NFL Draft? My answer is he has great upside, but is high-risk, therefore my answer is a resounding NO! A couple of years ago I was saying that Aaron Maybin was a high risk pick that I would not approve of because of some of the same reasons! I was devastated when the Bills passed on Bray Orakapo. History often repeats itself...(especially in the Bills organization!!!) The pick I fear the most is the pick I believe the Bills will make..Mark my word!!! Tell me what you think as I'd love to get your prospective on Dareus and the Players I mentioned at the beginning of this post. I understand your trepidity in selecting him this high, but saying he's a junior because Maybin was a junior won't help your cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sllib olaffub Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I judge players by looking at their games played, and afterward I look at measurables. Usually it is a "gut" feel for how a player might look in our scheme. Anyway, I get the impression that Dareus might be one of the safest picks in this draft. He doesn't seem to be in danger of not being at least decent. I'd say a failure for him would be not playing great. But, I think he is big enough, strong enough, consistent enough, and played on a very good team, so that you can judge his talent by those around him and by his competition. He might not have the "highest ceiling" of the bunch, but I'd be happy if the Bills picked him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayD Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Season Year GP GS Solo Asst TT TFL Sacks FF FR INTs PD QBH '08-'09 --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- '09-'10 12 12 19 14 33 5.5 6 --- --- 1 --- --- '10-'11 11 11 20 13 33 4.5 5 --- --- --- --- --- '11-'12 --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Those are his numbers yeah not one year wonder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 No matter how we look at it.... I believe Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey have decided to take a outstanding LB by the name of Von Miller...In a interview after the Senior Bowl Miller said, he is presently 233 lbs..He said his playing weight was 237 lbs during the season.... He also said he can easily go to 245 lbs... He spoke intelligently... Every article I have read says he is a very gifted athlete. He can cover running backs and TE's in passing situations or he can go get the QB with the best of them and stop the run. (Maybin was a one year wonder, but Miller is'nt... Mabin is a weak 232 lbs) Remember Schobel played at 240 lbs and was very strong. This is why I believe the Bills select Von Miller with their first pick..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 No matter how we look at it.... I believe Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey have decided to take a outstanding LB by the name of Von Miller...In a interview after the Senior Bowl Miller said, he is presently 233 lbs..He said his playing weight was 237 lbs during the season.... He also said he can easily go to 245 lbs... He spoke intelligently... Every article I have read says he is a very gifted athlete. He can cover running backs and TE's in passing situations or he can go get the QB with the best of them and stop the run. (Maybin was a one year wonder, but Miller is'nt... Mabin is a weak 232 lbs) Remember Schobel played at 240 lbs and was very strong. This is why I believe the Bills select Von Miller with their first pick..... I don't think putting on more weight would be a problem for Von Miller. The problem would be whether he can put on the weight and still keep his speed and explosiveness. If he shows up to the combine 10 pounds heavier and still shows that he has the same speed and explosiveness, then we may be on to something here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 My personal hope is that we pick Marcell Dareus with the sixth pick of the draft after we trade down with Cleveland for their 1st and 2nd and Cleveland sneaks ahead of Cincinnati to take AJ Green. Marcell Darius reminds me of a little bigger, a little more versatile Cullen Jenkins- He has long arms despite a stocky body and he can play NT as well as DE in a 3-4 and DT in a 4-3, he's not going to get you double digits sacks but I can't think of any 3-4 DEs that do off hand, what he is going to do is fix some of our run defense problems and force some fumbles. Drafting for a little positional versatility 1. Marcell Dareus DE/NT 2a Martez Wilson ILB/OLB 2b Mark Herzlich OLB/ILB 3. Mike Pouncey OG/OC RT in a pinch 4a Jarvis Jenkins DE 4b Joseph Barksdale OT 5. Kendrick Ellis NT/DE 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lightning Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Dareus is not a NT. DT and DE yes. NT no. I still want him however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typical TBD Guy Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Fairley, Bowers, and Quinn all have much greater upside than Dareus. With the #3 overall pick, I want a potential Hall of Famer. Not a safe above-average player. This team needs difference makers and game changers, not more Whitners and Poslusznys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Dareus is not a NT. DT and DE yes. NT no. I still want him however. Dareus is not a guy you'd get to play NT but he did play NT on passing downs and injury situations in college and could on a limited bases do so in the pros IMHO as he is extremely strong in the lower body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyjustbcuz Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 IMO Dareus will just be "a guy" at the next level. Not a star, but a solid "guy" on the defensive line. That is NOT what you want with the 3rd pick overall. Draft Miller, Green or Bowers since these are the playmaker/impact types rated high in the draft. That's exactly the point I am trying to make..You get it! Too bad some don't...I'm not trying to take away the accomplishments of Dareus the past season, and denying that he won't possibly be a star in the leaugue. I'm just inviting the arguement that I take the position that he is high risk due to lack of experience. The same may be said for Bowers or Fairley except just like Orakapo compared to Maybin..even though Maybin was excellent in his only productive season in college..I feel there is a seperation in talent and a slight downward leap from Bowers and Fairley compared to Dareus. He is a potential impact player, but I take the stance that the odds are better with AJ Green, Fairley, Bowers, or P. Peterson being impact players at the next level. Anyways, I like your take and am in agreement with you. Good reply! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I understand your trepidity in selecting him this high, but saying he's a junior because Maybin was a junior won't help your cause. Aren't many of 2011 top (or most talked-about) players Juniors, including: Fairley Bowers Dareus Bowers AJ Green Peterson Newton Gabbert Mallet Quinn (permanently barred) Guys who've completed their senior year, have more of a track record as far as durability and more opportunities to learn football b4 we start paying them. For that reason, I think they should be preferred other things being equal. But the lure of "coming out" while one's stock is high continues to increase, and the writing's on the wall: if we don't consider juniors, we're restricting our pool of talent unacceptably esp. when other things are not equal. There's a formal name for the logical fallacy "Maybin was a junior. Maybin is a bust. Therefore Juniors are busts" but I can't bring it to mind at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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