Our o-line is really bad; Fitz's play made it better

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

Our O-line has looked pretty bad the last couple of weeks since injuries too a couple of started down. For the first ten weeks of the year, we had pretty much the same line every week, one exception being RT, we hade one change. Last month or so have gone through what six different starters??

[BuffaloBillsMagic1]

Not making up for anything but we were missing two starters and its hard to look good with Brohm behind center. Our defensive front seven is what everyone should be fed up about.

Dude, The Jets were playiong their third stringers including gholston who has 0 sacks in 3 years and theor Center and about 7 other starters did not play.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

There's a an awful lot of people calling Brohm's performance horrible, but unable to back up their "opinions" with any evidence.

 

I see that. I also see people offering what seems like evidence (or at least specifics of why they hold the opinion they do). Any evidence that is offered, seems to be subject to peremptory dismissal with insult from you. Your right, I guess, does discourage folks from putting time into backing up their views.

 

I didn't think he was that horrible today

 

You're entitled to your opinion.

I don't think he's a horrible quarterback, he didn't look ready to play in the NFL today.

 

Just pointing out that when Saint Fitzpatrick played against this same scheme he threw for a similar completion % and yardage, and that was at home. As for those 2 TD's, at least one, and probably both, came on drives where the Jets were deployed in a prevent defense.

 

See, there you go. What's the point of the "Saint Fitzpatrick" gibe?

It's a valid point that one of the two earlier-game TDs was in the 4th quarter while the game was out of reach.

It's also a point that the Bills earlier game against the Jets was a bad game for the Bills.

 

Neither of these points nor the sneer about "Saint Fitzpatrick" refute the seemingly valid point that Fitz played better against the Jets starters than Brohm was able to against Jets backups (3 fewer INTs, 2 more TD, contributed by rushing 74 yrs). My point being anyone who thinks Fitz isn't good enough, and would like to see Brohm, should be answered.

 

while Brohm didn't do much today, I think he's being unfairly ripped for a relatively neutral performance.

 

I disagree that it was a neutral performance. I think it was bad. There may be extenuating reasons why it was bad, but it was bad, independent of the horrid line play and the backup WR.

 

If Brohm wants to stay on the roster as an NFL backup, he needs to show that he's ready to come in and execute the offense at the drop of a dime, much less after taking all of the snaps in practice all week. That's the backup's job.

 

At this point, if Brohm wants to start in the NFL, his only path is to 'deliver the goods' as a backup.

[Mr_Blizzard]

...Lets face it we have to hit on a bunch of picks in the draft and bring in at least 2-3 good free agents just to get to average next year.

 

I agree. The Bills are two years from being a playoff caliber team in this division, and that's assuming that they have two very good drafts and effective FA signings.

[RealityCheck]

There's a an awful lot of people calling Brohm's performance horrible, but unable to back up their "opinions" with any evidence. I didn't think he was that horrible today, particularly when you consider he hasn't really played all year and didn't get a single bit of support from the rest of his unit. It was sort of reminiscent of his start late last year when he was unfairly ragged on for not lighting it up with no help.

Just pointing out that when Saint Fitzpatrick played against this same scheme he threw for a similar completion % and yardage, and that was at home. As for those 2 TD's, at least one, and probably both, came on drives where the Jets were deployed in a prevent defense.

A quote from a recap of that game:

"Buffalo was so awful it managed 30 yards on its first four possessions, failed to register a first down on eight of 13 drives, and went 0 of 10 on third down. The Bills were thoroughly dominated in every phase of the game. Ryan Fitzpatrick didn't complete a pass until there was just under seven minutes left in the first half, and it didn't get much better after that."

It's a difficult scheme to play against (unless your NE) and while Brohm didn't do much today, I think he's being unfairly ripped for a relatively neutral performance.

Are you Brohm's agent? The Jets played their bench on defense and your boy threw 3 picks. In what way is this a neutral performance?

[Simon]

Are you Brohm's agent? The Jets played their bench on defense and your boy threw 3 picks. In what way is this a neutral performance?

I couldn't care less if we're talking about Brohm, Brown, Brady or Bill Brasky.

While you limit your player "evaluation" to what you see in the game stats, I'll observe that he was hit mid-delivery by an unblocked pass rusher on every one of those picks.

 

Any evidence that is offered, seems to be subject to peremptory dismissal with insult from you.

Aside from calling out Promo for his repeated hypocrisy in the game thread, I don't recall slinging about a lot of insults today.

[spartacus]

There's a an awful lot of people calling Brohm's performance horrible, but unable to back up their "opinions" with any evidence. I didn't think he was that horrible today, particularly when you consider he hasn't really played all year and didn't get a single bit of support from the rest of his unit. It was sort of reminiscent of his start late last year when he was unfairly ragged on for not lighting it up with no help.

Just pointing out that when Saint Fitzpatrick played against this same scheme he threw for a similar completion % and yardage, and that was at home. As for those 2 TD's, at least one, and probably both, came on drives where the Jets were deployed in a prevent defense.

A quote from a recap of that game:

"Buffalo was so awful it managed 30 yards on its first four possessions, failed to register a first down on eight of 13 drives, and went 0 of 10 on third down. The Bills were thoroughly dominated in every phase of the game. Ryan Fitzpatrick didn't complete a pass until there was just under seven minutes left in the first half, and it didn't get much better after that."

It's a difficult scheme to play against (unless your NE) and while Brohm didn't do much today, I think he's being unfairly ripped for a relatively neutral performance.

 

gotta agree

 

 

Brohm got absolutely drilled on most every pass he attempted

 

The OL is a complete joke - including everyone's favorite stud - Bell

 

 

 

 

 

[3rdand12]

no Fitz may well have exposed the O line. I agree. Brohm accomplished two things today. Better draft pick maybe, and made Fitzpatrick look very good.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Aside from calling out Promo for his repeated hypocrisy in the game thread, I don't recall slinging about a lot of insults today.

 

Thanks for the link to your content. I'd be happy to be mistaken; I don't feel strongly enough to search through all of that to make a point. I believe it's your "aside" (ie your manner of "calling out Promo for hypocrisy") which may have formed my impression.

 

It's just one poster's impression, take it for what it's worth

 

I couldn't care less if we're talking about Brohm, Brown, Brady or Bill Brasky.

While you limit your player "evaluation" to what you see in the game stats, I'll observe that he was hit mid-delivery by an unblocked pass rusher on every one of those picks.

 

Everyone I've seen acknowledges that Brohm was drilled like a trip to the dentist today.

The point others have made, that you don't seem willing to acknowledge or accept, is that he appeared to contribute to the drilling he got by:

1. poor pocket presence/mobility in the pocket

2. holding the ball too long in the face of pressure

3. poor or slow decisions about when to throw it away or eat it vs. trying to make the play

 

In the face of that, your response to Realtycheck implying that he limited his player evaluation to stats doesn't seem to be acknowledging any evidence or valid points anyone makes.

 

Lack of success in the passing game is a natural result of being drilled every throw.

A certain number and type of INTs are also a natural result of heavy pressure (eg if the QB is hit while throwing, or the pass is tipped by a charging lineman). The pick Brown threw was likely a miscue between QB and WR IMO.

The picks Brohm threw appear to be the result of point #3, above, and not the natural result of being drilled every throw.

[Simon]

 

The point others have made, that you don't seem willing to acknowledge or accept, is that he appeared to contribute to the drilling he got by:

1. poor pocket presence/mobility in the pocket

What pocket are you referring to?

2. holding the ball too long in the face of pressure

I acknowledged that criticism as potentially being accurate when 34-78-83 raised it after the game

3. poor or slow decisions about when to throw it away or eat it vs. trying to make the play

I also question the criticism of being "slow" to make decisions when you frequently have less than 2-3 seconds to do so

 

In the face of that, your response to Realtycheck implying that he limited his player evaluation to stats doesn't seem to be acknowledging any evidence or valid points anyone makes.

My response to Realitycheck was to Realitycheck only, as his sole point was a statistic with no analysis whatsoever of any mitigating factors (in addition to a couple shots at me)

 

Lack of success in the passing game is a natural result of being drilled every throw.

A certain number and type of INTs are also a natural result of heavy pressure (eg if the QB is hit while throwing, or the pass is tipped by a charging lineman). The pick Brown threw was likely a miscue between QB and WR IMO.

The picks Brohm threw appear to be the result of point #3, above, and not the natural result of being drilled every throw.

If you get hit by unblocked rushers on every pick, I find it odd to suggest those picks are somehow the result of slow decision making.

[Sisyphean Bills]

If you get hit by unblocked rushers on every pick, I find it odd to suggest those picks are somehow the result of slow decision making.

It seems more likely that he is a pocket QB who lacks slippery elusiveness. Trying to stand in the non-pocket and throw to the hot receiver (he certainly didn't have time on some of those picks to look anywhere else and who knows if the 8th string WR was on the right page) is exactly what he is supposed to do, in fact. It obviously didn't work out.

[3rdand12]

Good call. Pocket qb. Had some good looking passes early. Lead them nicely and looked fairly accurate.

I think this was one game you had to see. But i mentioned somewhere he was hit often and very hard, waiting too long. The ints were tips (3) , And levi throws one georgeous ball and the next is a timing pattern though Johnson broke off for easy int.

Jets threw so many blitzes and a kitchen sink at him. I dont know if anyone could have had a good start yesterday with all the bad play on offense.

He had some time early on because he did stand upright and was reading. I just dont think the kids (WRs) realized that they needed to start to come back.

The Jets saw it! i felt bad for the kid.

[Bob in STL]

It seems more likely that he is a pocket QB who lacks slippery elusiveness. Trying to stand in the non-pocket and throw to the hot receiver (he certainly didn't have time on some of those picks to look anywhere else and who knows if the 8th string WR was on the right page) is exactly what he is supposed to do, in fact. It obviously didn't work out.

 

 

Coach Gailey said that the game was too fast for him. Another way of saying he lacks experience. It was his second start in two years.

 

That all said Brohm still does not show much IMO

 

I think the Bills will draft a QB. If not early then expect them to try to find a developmental project (ala Levi Brown) in the later rounds.

 

Right now the team has no viable backup to Fitz.

[flmike]

I watched that horror show yesterday and noticed a couple of things about Brohm. He gave the D a fixed target all day. He never stepped up in the pocket (and yes, there plenty of times it was there). He constantly threw off his back foot and underthrew his guy. I believe Fitz came in after the Trent collapse and found a way to make things work. Brohm knew this was his chance and failed to make it work with backups all around him. If he were and NFL quality starter, he would have been the best guy on the field.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Coach Gailey said that the game was too fast for him. Another way of saying he lacks experience. It was his second start in two years.

 

That all said Brohm still does not show much IMO

 

I think the Bills will draft a QB. If not early then expect them to try to find a developmental project (ala Levi Brown) in the later rounds.

 

Right now the team has no viable backup to Fitz.

I agree with Gailey. Brohm struggled with the speed of the game a bit. The majority of his career to date, he has done little more than run the scout team. Gailey also said that Brohm knew what he was doing, which is a very good thing. That means he was operating in the offense as designed, and has the football IQ to be capable of doing the job. It may be a wee bit premature to give up on him after 1 game.

[BuffaloBud]

One thing that was clear today is that Fitz's quick decision making, pocket awareness, and mobility have masked the problems on our o-line. RT is a disaster and needs upgrading. I know many have praised Bell's play this year, but I am still not convinced that he is a starting caliber LT.

 

The o-line needs to be addressed this offseason.

 

They were playing fairly well when everyone was healthy. But, consider that the patches had patches the past 2 weeks.