Whitner gone?

[dayman]

Feel better now?

 

 

Kind of haha. I mean...I've always thought he'd be a solid guy who cares about a winning and stuck with us through the hard times. I've always thought he'd be a solid guy on the hypothetical "future Bills," that are good. If he's holding us up for money, or acting like we aren't giving him enough love in the negotiations...then I'm ready to bail. As someone who has defended him in the past...well it makes me very bitter.

Edited December 16, 2010 by dayman

[Doc]

Jairus Byrd has been far and away the worst defensive back on the team this season. As good as his rookie year was (and he's wasn't good, it was a mirage of him being the benefactor of lucky bounces), thats how bad he's been this season.

You don't get lucky that many times. It's a combo of NO pass rush and being injured.

 

As for Witner, likely he's using his rookie contract as a starting point. If he is, see ya! It's also a red flag when a guy has the best season of his career in a contract year.

[Fixxxer]

Until Whitner does something for this defense that actually means something, then he's not worth the money. Theres TONS of good young safeties that look much more promising than he ever has. Nate Allen, Eric Berry, Earl Thomas, and even George Wilson and Jarius Byrd. He's not worth the money and he is EASILY replaceable. George Wilson, a converted WR is way ahead of Whitner in my eyes.

 

Later Whitner. Enjoy riding the bench for some other team.

 

Well, he does kind of defend against the pass and the run simultaneously better than Wilson and Scott. Is he a Polamalu clone on that matter? Far from it, but I have this hunch, that the coaching staff would rather not mess with the continuity in the defensive backfield and keep Scott and Wilson as situatinal players.

 

If you have to overpay a little, I would think about it and maybe reach Whitner's demand. Knowing what Whitner wants is key.

[John from Riverside]

Jarius Byrd is a cover 2 safety

 

We need to put the cover 2 back in and you will see his production pick up

[DreReed83]

Well, he does kind of defend against the pass and the run simultaneously better than Wilson and Scott. Is he a Polamalu clone on that matter? Far from it, but I have this hunch, that the coaching staff would rather not mess with the continuity in the defensive backfield and keep Scott and Wilson as situatinal players.

 

If you have to overpay a little, I would think about it and maybe reach Whitner's demand. Knowing what Whitner wants is key.

 

You'd overpay Whitner a little to keep him? WOW...

 

What's he done for this team? Does he do anything besides tackling down field? He's not worth it dude. I wouldn't even think twice about signing him. You can get another safety that brings the same amount of production to this team or even better. If you think he's irreplaceable, then i dont know what else to tell you.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Kind of haha. I mean...I've always thought he'd be a solid guy who cares about a winning and stuck with us through the hard times. I've always thought he'd be a solid guy on the hypothetical "future Bills," that are good. If he's holding us up for money, or acting like we aren't giving him enough love in the negotiations...then I'm ready to bail. As someone who has defended him in the past...well it makes me very bitter.

I hear yah. But there's a long road ahead of us still. I guess Donte was hoping to get something done before season's end.

 

That doesn't mean a deal won't get struck down the road. Seems to me (and I could be missing something) that this isn't a time sensitive matter.

 

The most interesting thing is the sense that Whitner and the Bills have such widely different views of his value. That's the part I wasn't expecting when all this extension talk cropped up.

[Coach Tuesday]

Jairus Byrd has been far and away the worst defensive back on the team this season. As good as his rookie year was (and he's wasn't good, it was a mirage of him being the benefactor of lucky bounces), thats how bad he's been this season.

 

Right you are. But the armchair GMs on this Board want to pay Whitner according to the number of INTs he has recorded. So by their screwy logic, Byrd would be in line for a huge payday based solely on last year's production.

[T master]

I don't think there is any question about the fact that he has not lived up to the #8 overall selection...He has barely lived up to the #88 overall...And even though he has not necessarily been outplayed by the other two safeties, he has not exactly outplayed both of them either...

 

You need to check out George Wilsons stat line from last year & then compare it to any year including this one with Whitner and i think you will recant your reply . Wilson had more tackles last year than Whitner had in his 3 previous separately or combined that maybe partially the reason why the Bills don't want to talk big money with him .

 

Plus Wilson had to go from being a WR to a safety & still does better than Whitner . I couldn't figure out why Wilson wasn't the starter this year after his play last year . Whitner is a good back up or depth player because he can play so many different positions & maybe that's why he figures he's worth more , but like Lee Evans he is not a #1 (IMHO !!!!) .

 

All that being said i would hate to see him go because at least we know he's a good - dependable player !!!

[Dawgg]

Right you are. But the armchair GMs on this Board want to pay Whitner according to the number of INTs he has recorded. So by their screwy logic, Byrd would be in line for a huge payday based solely on last year's production.

When you blatantly drop 3-4 INTs in one season and you get fooled repeatedly by opposing running backs and your lone distinction is making tackles in the end zone after the opposition has already scored, you don't deserve a big-money deal. I'm sure the Bills are offering him some solid coin and a pay raise over what he's making now. Donte and his agent want more and that's perfectly reasonable -- let someone else give it to him. The money saved on the Whitner contract can be used to give raises to Stevie Johnson and Kyle Williams, two players who actually show up and make plays on Sundays.

[stony]

You'd overpay Whitner a little to keep him? WOW...

 

What's he done for this team? Does he do anything besides tackling down field? He's not worth it dude. I wouldn't even think twice about signing him. You can get another safety that brings the same amount of production to this team or even better. If you think he's irreplaceable, then i dont know what else to tell you.

 

I certainly would. One less hole to fill. Why create holes and fill them with less-talented players? Wilson and Scott are nice backups.

 

Well, in all three games we've won this year he's had a big play. 1) Deflects pass v Detroit that gets picked. 2) Lays out Shipley/ jarring out ball ending any comeback hope. 3) Stuffs Hillis on goal-line forcing FG.

 

Can you throw some names out there?

 

He never said he was not replaceable.Just was looking for some clarity into the negotiations.

[Magox]

When you blatantly drop 3-4 INTs in one season and you get fooled repeatedly by opposing running backs and your lone distinction is making tackles in the end zone after the opposition has already scored, you don't deserve a big-money deal. I'm sure the Bills are offering him some solid coin and a pay raise over what he's making now. Donte and his agent want more and that's perfectly reasonable -- let someone else give it to him. The money saved on the Whitner contract can be used to give raises to Stevie Johnson and Kyle Williams, two players who actually show up and make plays on Sundays.

Yeah, I remember you now, you are one of the louder anti Whitner Zealots. First, the description "blatantly" is not an accurate description, it implies an obvious intent to drop the ball. Having said that, if he hadn't of dropped the pass by Flacco earlier in the season we would of won, so I share you feelings to an extent, regarding missed opportunities.

 

"fooled repeatedly" is an overstatement to say the least. He has been very solid and above average when it comes to making tackles, sure there have been a few missed tackles and there have been a couple times that I have observed where he has taken a bad angle in which I could understand to some observers it appears that he was fooled, but this is not an area for any rational person to criticize him over. His play has stepped up as of late, he has been helping cause turnovers and he has put in some big hits that have stopped drives. What we have seen of Whitner over the past 6 games or so is the best he has played in his entire career. You can see the improvement.

 

Let's face it, he's not a big playmaker, he's just a solid SS that warrants an average to above average SS contract.

Edited December 16, 2010 by Magox

[Buftex]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5926682

[Dawgg]

Yeah, I remember you now, you are one of the louder anti Whitner Zealots. First, the description "blatantly" is not an accurate description, it implies an obvious intent to drop the ball. Having said that, if he hadn't of dropped the pass by Flacco earlier in the season we would of won, so I share you feelings to an extent, regarding missed opportunities.

Missed opportunities have been the story of his career. Sure, he hasn't had the benefit of a dominant pass rush, but when plays are there to be made, more often than not Whitner shies away from making them. He's whiffed on INT's -- not intentionally, but they are nevertheless plays an NFL-caliber safety should make -- and if you saw the onsides kick in the Dallas MNF meltdown, you'll see that Whitner stood there watching as the ball rolled by him. The larger the moment, the smaller Donte Whitner plays.

 

He's great at jumping onto a pile.

He's even better at tackling a tight end after he was beat in coverage.

 

That said, he's an average player. Whitner, however, thinks he's an elite player. Therein lies the problem. So I agree with you that he deserves an average contract. But average is not what he's looking for. He didn't hire Tom Condon in the offseason to get an average contract.

 

This is a team that did him a huge favor. They picked him about 10 slots ahead of where he should have gone; they have kept him in the starting lineup despite his often times below average play and they have defended him amidst criticism. But from the moment we saw Donte's extended holdout before his rookie season, it became apparent that he has way too high an opinion of himself to justify the pay he's seeking. The man he replaced – Lawyer Milloy – is playing better than him in Seattle at the age of 37. If he wants average or slightly above average safety money, more power to him, extend him. If he wants, more, then don't let the doo hit you on the way out, Donte.

 

Let's face it, he's not a big playmaker, he's just a solid SS that warrants an average to above average SS contract.

I agree, though he doesn't deserve anything more than average safety money.

Edited December 16, 2010 by Dawgg

[Red]

He definitely hasn't been outplayed by the two, now has he lived up to his #8 overall selection? that is another question

 

 

Does this even need to be asked?

 

Answer: NO!

 

When Haloti Ngata was available...and the Bills select Donte Whitner...need I say more?

[Fixxxer]

You'd overpay Whitner a little to keep him? WOW...

 

What's he done for this team? Does he do anything besides tackling down field? He's not worth it dude. I wouldn't even think twice about signing him. You can get another safety that brings the same amount of production to this team or even better. If you think he's irreplaceable, then i dont know what else to tell you.

 

I told you what he does for this team, he's the most complete safety on the team, that is why Scott and Wilson don't start over him. He's the most consistent performer of the bunch. The team made a switch of system and he's having his better year as a pro. He's only 25 years old and I think he has room to improve his game. I would try to lock this position and forget about it for the next 5 or 6 years.

If the amount to overpay is not crazy money, I would chose to do it.

[cjatcreek07]

Honestly I won't miss Whitner that much if he does go...

[Ramius]

You need to check out George Wilsons stat line from last year & then compare it to any year including this one with Whitner and i think you will recant your reply . Wilson had more tackles last year than Whitner had in his 3 previous separately or combined that maybe partially the reason why the Bills don't want to talk big money with him .

 

Plus Wilson had to go from being a WR to a safety & still does better than Whitner . I couldn't figure out why Wilson wasn't the starter this year after his play last year . Whitner is a good back up or depth player because he can play so many different positions & maybe that's why he figures he's worth more , but like Lee Evans he is not a #1 (IMHO !!!!) .

 

All that being said i would hate to see him go because at least we know he's a good - dependable player !!!

 

Wilson doesn't start over Whitner because he's simply not as good. Whitner is by far the better player. Wilson is a good backup FS that can play center field and pick some passes. But thats about his limit.

 

Jarius Byrd is a cover 2 safety

 

We need to put the cover 2 back in and you will see his production pick up

 

So switching defenses is an acceptable excuse as to why Byrd is playing horrible, but switching defenses is not an acceptable excuse as to why Whitner is having the best season of his career?

[Magox]

Does this even need to be asked?

 

Answer: NO!

ummm

 

rhetorical question maybe?

[Geno Smith's Arm]

5 Ints in 5 years.

one year he had 2

 

 

Pretty much says it all. Not an impact player . Not worth any more than an very average contract for a veteran at his position. I don't blame him for being picked #8 though. Bad drafting.

[Beebe's Kid]

Few things are interesting...Byrd wash hurt, and since he has been able to play an entire game, he looks a lot better than last year. He doesn't have the picks, but he knows how to tackle, and has progressively gotten better in coverage. Funny to hear how big of a disappointment he is.

 

Whitner is not a top 3 Safety, but I think he is top 10. I don't know if anybody here ever had a situation where the more they did something the better they got at it, or if any of them didn't do all of their best work by the time they were 25, but Donte might be that kind of guy...you know, like all of the D-backs we have let walk.

 

"Don't mention him in the same sentence as..." Greer was a !@#$ing back up. Leonard was a special teamer. Clements was good and his production fell off when he took STUPID money to play in SF. Winfield was one of my favorites, and was good here, but go arguably better once he left...why? Because he developed as a player, physically and mentally. He played out the rookie contract and went on to enjoy his prime.

 

I defend Whitner, but that is probably because I watch all of the games, and I don't give a !@#$ if it is popular to like him or not. The guy is a damn good defender, and we are going to have a sizable hole to fill if he walks...ANOTHER sizable hole.

 

If we let Whitner go, we take 2 steps back.

 

I don't think anything is written in stone, he is just emotional and getting all upset over the first stage of negotiations. I bet Chan doesn't want to lose him, either, and the contract will get done, and all of you can scream and cry and mail in "fan cards," or whatever it is you do over the amount. Can't wait.

Edited December 16, 2010 by Beebe's Kid