Leaner Meaner Government

[Gene Frenkle]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

This is a sad example of why Libertarian "dream" is the most idealistic and unrealistic of all. Hopefully this baby somehow gets some of that western medicine that we're rationing. I'm sure that eventually some fine upstanding Conservatives will altruistically throw him a proverbial "bone" (if he's white that is). In fact, with all of their willing and continual generosity, it must be some strange anomaly that leads to this baby not getting the care he needs. Obama must be taxing them too much. Ron Paul, Ayn Rand eat your heart out!

[IDBillzFan]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

As opposed to what? Oh, yeah, the progressive mantra of "America: the worst country that god ever gave to man because when we heard 'home of the free' we thought that 'free' referred to everything."

[Magox]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

This is a sad example of why Libertarian "dream" is the most idealistic and unrealistic of all. Hopefully this baby somehow gets some of that western medicine that we're rationing. I'm sure that eventually some fine upstanding Conservatives will altruistically throw him a proverbial "bone" (if he's white that is). In fact, with all of their willing and continual generosity, it must be some strange anomaly that leads to this baby not getting the care he needs. Obama must be taxing them too much. Ron Paul, Ayn Rand eat your heart out!

You would have a point, if anything you said was true.

 

First off, the underlined part above is incorrect. There are many many people who are receiving either free or just about free health care.

 

Second, even people who don't have health care insurance RARELY get denied health care.

 

Third, this "rationing" that you are talking about is provided by the idealogy you support. You remember the whole "Death Panel" thingy from Palin? This is pretty much what she was talking about. Even Krugman admits that this is what the U.S Health Care system will eventually turn into if he had it his way, in regards to end-of-life care. Remember, this was a government panel that decided this. Keep that in mind.

 

 

Fourth, yes it is true, contrary to popular belief conservatives are much more generous when it comes to volutarily donating to the needy. Shocking isn't it? Why don't you just google it and find out yourself.

 

So until you actually bring up something that is factually correct, it will be hard to take you seriously regarding this topic.

 

Now if you wish, you can dispute some of the four points I've made.

Edited December 10, 2010 by Magox

[Gary M]

You would have a point, if anything you said was true.

 

First off, the underlined part above is incorrect. There are many many people who are receiving either free or just about free health care.

 

Second, even people who don't have health care insurance RARELY get denied health care.

 

Third, this "rationing" that you are talking about is provided by the idealogy you support. You remember the whole "Death Panel" thingy from Palin? This is pretty much what she was talking about. Even Krugman admits that this is what the U.S Health Care system will eventually turn into if he had it his way, in regards to end-of-life care. Remember, this was a government panel that decided this. Keep that in mind.

 

 

Fourth, yes it is true, contrary to popular belief conservatives are much more generous when it comes to volutarily donating to the needy. Shocking isn't it? Why don't you just google it and find out yourself.

 

So until you actually bring up something that is factually correct, it will be hard to take you seriously regarding this topic.

 

Now if you wish, you can dispute some of the four points I've made.

[Peace]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

This is a sad example of why Libertarian "dream" is the most idealistic and unrealistic of all. Hopefully this baby somehow gets some of that western medicine that we're rationing. I'm sure that eventually some fine upstanding Conservatives will altruistically throw him a proverbial "bone" (if he's white that is). In fact, with all of their willing and continual generosity, it must be some strange anomaly that leads to this baby not getting the care he needs. Obama must be taxing them too much. Ron Paul, Ayn Rand eat your heart out!

 

I don't have a car. Give me yours.

[/dev/null]

I don't have a car. Give me yours.

 

Reminds me of a T-Shirt I almost bought.

[Peace]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

This is a sad example of why Libertarian "dream" is the most idealistic and unrealistic of all. Hopefully this baby somehow gets some of that western medicine that we're rationing. I'm sure that eventually some fine upstanding Conservatives will altruistically throw him a proverbial "bone" (if he's white that is). In fact, with all of their willing and continual generosity, it must be some strange anomaly that leads to this baby not getting the care he needs. Obama must be taxing them too much. Ron Paul, Ayn Rand eat your heart out!

 

I don't have a house. Give me yours.

 

I don't have a bed. Give me yours.

 

I don't have a website. Give me yours.

 

Is your fridge full. Mine's not. Empty it out.

 

What's your job? I don't have one. Give it to me.

 

I don't want to pay you what others pay. Work for me for less.

 

Imagine the gun to your head as I say it and then you visualize the stick up you're advocating.

Edited December 10, 2010 by Peace

[Magox]

Reminds me of a T-Shirt I almost bought.

 

 

That is great! I just ordered one

[DC Tom]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

Exactly as it should be. Health care is a market commodity, not a right.

 

(And before you even begin to think of accusing me of hyprocisy...I don't just say it, I live that way.)

[RkFast]

America: the best country that god ever gave to man where nobody gets health care unless they can pay for it.

 

This is a sad example of why Libertarian "dream" is the most idealistic and unrealistic of all. Hopefully this baby somehow gets some of that western medicine that we're rationing. I'm sure that eventually some fine upstanding Conservatives will altruistically throw him a proverbial "bone" (if he's white that is). In fact, with all of their willing and continual generosity, it must be some strange anomaly that leads to this baby not getting the care he needs. Obama must be taxing them too much. Ron Paul, Ayn Rand eat your heart out!

 

This is below even you.

[Peace]

Exactly as it should be. Health care is a market commodity, not a right.

 

 

Bullcrap. My friends who are surgeons need to work more hours for less pay because people NEED health care.

 

Health care services are, of course, available in unlimited quantity and thus everyone should be able to get them.

[....lybob]

I don't have a house. Give me yours.

 

I don't have a bed. Give me yours.

 

I don't have a website. Give me yours.

 

Is your fridge full. Mine's not. Empty it out.

 

What's your job? I don't have one. Give it to me.

 

I don't want to pay you what others pay. Work for me for less.

 

Imagine the gun to your head as I say it and then you visualize the stick up you're advocating.

You don't want to pay to help the homeless

 

I don't want to pay for a global military empire

 

you don't want to feed the hungry

 

I don't want to bailout the banks and subsidize businesses

 

you don't want to pay for healthcare

 

I don't want to pay for a police state

 

you say why should those making 250,000+ pay a higher rate

 

I say why should wages and regular interest be taxed at a higher rate than dividends and capital gains

 

you say corporations should have the right to pollute without government interference

 

I say the people affected by that pollution should have a right to protect themselves and their property using any means necessary without government interference

 

But mostly I say get the @#$% over yourself you are not the only one who pays taxes and I have just as many places I don't want my taxes going as you do.

Edited December 10, 2010 by ....lybob

[drnykterstein]

the progressive mantra of "America: the worst country that god ever gave to man because when we heard 'home of the free' we thought that 'free' referred to everything."

That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If progressives think American is the worst country in the world, then conservatives eat babies and drink their blood.

 

 

Exactly as it should be. Health care is a market commodity, not a right.

!@#$ that. America is one of the greatest countries in the world. We are strong and powerful and a great nation. If this country has the capacity to help its poor and helpless (as it most certainly does), then we should do such a thing. Healthcare is not a right, but when you live in such a great country as ours, we can indeed afford to help the less fortunate.

 

Or are you saying we are not a great nation, and should not help out our poor?

Edited December 10, 2010 by conner

[....lybob]

That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If progressives think American is the worst country in the world, then conservatives eat babies and drink their blood.

only if their starving mothers sell them freely- free market baby.

[DC Tom]

Or are you saying we are not a great nation, and should not help out our poor?

 

I'm saying it's not government's job, you idiot. In as much as we live in a "great nation", it was made great by people helping each other, not by people waiting for the government to do something.

 

And even so, that doesn't make health care a right. It's still a market commodity.

Edited December 10, 2010 by DC Tom

[Peace]

You don't want to pay to help the homeless

 

I don't want to pay for a global military empire

 

you don't want to feed the hungry

 

I don't want to bailout the banks and subsidize businesses

 

you don't want to pay for healthcare

 

I don't want to pay for a police state

 

you say why should those making 250,000+ pay a higher rate

 

I say why should wages and regular interest be taxed at a higher rate than dividends and capital gains

 

you say corporations should have the right to pollute without government interference

 

I say the people affected by that pollution should have a right to protect themselves and their property using any means necessary without government interference

 

But mostly I say get the @#$% over yourself you are not the only one who pays taxes and I have just as many places I don't want my taxes going as you do.

 

You got me. I feed pollution to homeless people and laugh while I live off my capital gains.

[....lybob]

You got me. I feed pollution to homeless people and laugh while I live off my capital gains.

It took you long enough to admit it.

Edited December 10, 2010 by ....lybob

[drnykterstein]

I'm saying it's not government's job, you idiot. In as much as we live in a "great nation", it was made great by people helping each other, not by people waiting for the government to do something.

Hahahahahahaha. Nope, NASA, WWI, WWII, the A-Bomb, Declaration of Independence, electricity .. none of these things involved the government.

 

And even so, that doesn't make health care a right. It's still a market commodity.

I agree, but it's one we can afford to give to those in need.

[Gene Frenkle]

You would have a point, if anything you said was true.

 

First off, the underlined part above is incorrect. There are many many people who are receiving either free or just about free health care.

 

 

Second, even people who don't have health care insurance RARELY get denied health care.

 

Both true, because of government sponsored healthcare. I'm was taking a shot at the idealism inherent in Libertarianism, which in its true form would take away government sponsored healthcare.

 

Third, this "rationing" that you are talking about is provided by the idealogy you support. You remember the whole "Death Panel" thingy from Palin? This is pretty much what she was talking about. Even Krugman admits that this is what the U.S Health Care system will eventually turn into if he had it his way, in regards to end-of-life care. Remember, this was a government panel that decided this. Keep that in mind.

 

 

It's a sticky situation, agreed, and the system needs a complete over-hall. There will be rationing in any system, of course, which is why the 'death panel' thing is so ridiculous. I believe that we should do everything possible to maximize the efficiency of the system and keep costs as low as possible. Health care is one of those things that should be a basic right for all people, IMO, and is not something that should be profited from. A centralized decision-making body within the system can standardize protocols and standards within the system, making it easier for all entities within the system to work together and communicate.

Fourth, yes it is true, contrary to popular belief conservatives are much more generous when it comes to volutarily donating to the needy. Shocking isn't it? Why don't you just google it and find out yourself.

 

That's all fine and well, but it misses the point which is that while Conservatives may be more generous, charity alone is not enough. Charity is fine for a lot of things, but again, I think healthcare should be a right.

 

So until you actually bring up something that is factually correct, it will be hard to take you seriously regarding this topic.

 

Now if you wish, you can dispute some of the four points I've made.

 

You're too kind.

 

[Adam]

Much like many other things, there is no magic bullet that will provide perfect health care to everyone. If there was, we would have found it a long time ago.

 

Death panels have existed for a long time- they just aren't called that. Whether the decision to withhold care comes from the government or the private sector, it is still the same thing.

 

If it weren't for the deficit, I think providing health care would be a great thing. Eliminate the deficit, raise the age for social security and retirement about 10 years and it might be feasible.

 

By the way- the continued "America is the best on earth" is a bunch of nonsense. True or not, it doesn't mean anything. If we can make it better, then why wouldn't we. If there is something wrong, why should we keep quiet about it- I find that very unpatriotic!