How the heck does Modrak still have a job?

[Red]

I'm sorry I didn't know Modrak suits up and plays on Sunday or coaches the team during the week.

 

People are calling for Modrak's head because we are 2-10? Yes the Bills have been a failure for 10 years.

Modrak's job appears to be managing the talent evaluation of individual players, including the individual talent evaluators (He doesn't do it all by himself.)

On an individual by individual player basis the Bills have gotten good talent in rounds 3-7 as well as undrafted free agents. The Bills have gotten very little value on an individual player by player basis from rounds 1 and 2.

 

The point is we hear rumors that coaches, GMs and owners have been meddling with the High Round draft picks, IF Modrak's scouting has lead to the quality late round picks and undrafted free agents then his scouting is actually doing a good job on an individual by individual basis. Which is Modrak's job, scout quality football players.

 

It is the GMs' responsibility to draft and sign the scouted players, the Coaches' responsibility to coach the players, and the players' individual responsibility to play well.

 

IF Modrak is responsible for the decade of early draft futility then yes there needs to be accountability.

 

Either way Firing Modrak is going to have little effect on the Bills record.

If you want to make him a likely scapegoat for GM, coaching, and owner meddling go ahead. If that happens and picks 3-7 go south too, then the mystery is finally solved.

 

 

OK. I don't know why Modrak keep escaping unharmed. What, John Guy was not responsible for the quality of free agents we signed?

 

C'mon!

 

But, let's play your thinking out.

 

So it's draft day, and the new coaching staff comes in and states that they want a "waterbug" RB. Or they want the best Defensive lineman available. Or safety. Or QB. The coaches and GM take everything into account: contracts, current roster status, available and soon to be available free agents. Another factor: rookies. A plan is compiled. We will keep players A, B, & C on our roster. We will trade with Team 1 for player D. But we will then need to draft a player for position __________ to fill the gaps.

 

The team then refers to its scouting staff for advice on who to pick.

 

The team decides the direction, BUT THE SCOUTING STAFF COMPILES THE RECOMMENDATIONS ON THE COLLEGE PLAYERS SO THAT THE POWERS THAT BE CAN MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION.

 

Sure, I don't doubt that Mauron wanted Maybin. Or Levy wanted Whitner. But somebody compiled the information and said that Maybin was a better player than Orakpo. That Mike Williams was the best Tackle available. That Losman was worthy of a #1 pick, and that McCargo was worth trading back into the 1st round for.

 

Somebody is scouting these players and giving their stamp of approval to the decision-makers.

 

This information passes right through the hands of one Tom Modrak.

 

These players are all getting his stamp of approval, regardless of who makes the decision.

[NC Bills Brigade]

go back and look at the Patriots drafts the last 5-6 years and see how many misses they had.. a bunch!

[Red]

go back and look at the Patriots drafts the last 5-6 years and see how many misses they had.. a bunch!

 

When did Scott Pioli bolt for KC again?

[Gabe Northern]

Modrak just scouts and makes reports and recommendations based on what he has seen. Two years ago he was very high on Cushing, but DJ and Co. pushed for Maybin.

 

There is only so much Modrak can do. He isnt in charge of making the actual picks.

 

He also had Maybin rated as best pass rusher.

 

Oh, and Cushing isn't the same guy since he's been off the juice.

 

How you people defend this guy is beyond me. It's battered wife syndrome.

[Sisyphean Bills]

go back and look at the Patriots drafts the last 5-6 years and see how many misses they had.. a bunch!

Most of their top picks are contributing, actually. Chung, Vollmer, Mayo, Meriweather, Mankins, Wilfork, Warren...

 

The flaw in looking at just the body count is that the Patriots are already a good team. They don't need to keep every draft pick. They only need to keep the ones that are better than the good players they already have.

[1B4IDie]

 

 

His title is DIRECTOR OF SCOUTING.

 

What does a scout do, if not compile reports on players at the college level?

 

As DIRECTOR of scouting, he should be completely aware of all players coming out of college that have been assembled by his scouting team. He should be reviewing and having final approval on ALL players the scouts compile in their travels.

 

And when "DJ and Co.", or Mularkey, or Levy, or Williams/ Donahoe made choices, THEY HAD TO GET THEIR INFORMATION ON WHO TO DRAFT FROM THEIR SCOUTING STAFF!!!!!!

 

What don't you get about that?

 

The information on whom to select has to come from somewhere!!!!

 

That someone is the DIRECTOR OF FREAKIN SCOUTING!!!!

 

 

 

This is a pretty compelling case.

 

OK. I don't know why Modrak keep escaping unharmed. What, John Guy was not responsible for the quality of free agents we signed?

 

C'mon!

 

But, let's play your thinking out.

 

So it's draft day, and the new coaching staff comes in and states that they want a "waterbug" RB. Or they want the best Defensive lineman available. Or safety. Or QB. The coaches and GM take everything into account: contracts, current roster status, available and soon to be available free agents. Another factor: rookies. A plan is compiled. We will keep players A, B, & C on our roster. We will trade with Team 1 for player D. But we will then need to draft a player for position __________ to fill the gaps.

 

The team then refers to its scouting staff for advice on who to pick.

 

The team decides the direction, BUT THE SCOUTING STAFF COMPILES THE RECOMMENDATIONS ON THE COLLEGE PLAYERS SO THAT THE POWERS THAT BE CAN MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION.

 

Sure, I don't doubt that Mauron wanted Maybin. Or Levy wanted Whitner. But somebody compiled the information and said that Maybin was a better player than Orakpo. That Mike Williams was the best Tackle available. That Losman was worthy of a #1 pick, and that McCargo was worth trading back into the 1st round for.

 

Somebody is scouting these players and giving their stamp of approval to the decision-makers.

 

This information passes right through the hands of one Tom Modrak.

 

These players are all getting his stamp of approval, regardless of who makes the decision.

 

Again good points.

 

You can kind of make excuses for McCargo, or Lynch, or Donte, or McKelvin, even Mike Williams, or JP Lossman but when you add them all up and then on top you add Maybin, which should have had a "Do Not Draft" grade, all the bodies do point to the quality of scouting information.

 

What explains the higher hit ratio later in the draft?

Edited December 7, 2010 by Why So Serious?

[Red]

This is a pretty compelling case.

 

 

 

Again good points.

 

You can kind of make excuses for McCargo, or Lynch, or Donte, or McKelvin, even Mike Williams, or JP Lossman but when you add them all up and then on top you add Maybin, which should have had a "Do Not Draft" grade, all the bodies do point to the quality of scouting information.

 

What explains the higher hit ratio later in the draft?

 

That, my friend, has me baffled.

 

How we can consistently strike out on high value, high dollar, impact players at the Top 3 rounds and obtain success and find solid players in the later rounds or even as college free agents does not seem to make sense.

 

Shouldn't the same scouts who find those undrafted rookies (Jabari Greer, Jason Peters, Moorman, Jackson) also find gold in the first picks?

 

I mean, I understand that not every 1st rounder will be gold. Remember J.D. Williams? He was terrible. But the Bills were going to Super Bowls, so his pick did not hurt. Besides, we were striking home runs on most of our 1st rounders, that an occasional lapse like a J.D. Williams did not hurt. John Fina, Ruben Brown...wasn't Moulds a 1st round pick? Now, Fina was no Wolford, but he steadied the LT position for several years. Ruben Brown was a solid LG, arguably better than Ritcher. Moulds was an awesome player.

 

So, I don't know what is going wrong with those 1st couple of rounds.

 

Maybe the higher picks have too many hands in the cookie jar? As the later rounds progress the scouting actually takes over?

 

I don't know.

 

All I see, is that in any other position, in any other industry or team, Modrak would have been shown the door a long, long time ago. He should have been forced to vacate OBD (oh wait, he lives in Jacksonville and phones it in) when Donahoe left. Or at worst, when Guy was finally relieved of his duties.

 

I don't know why our "regime change" stopped short of losing Modrak.

 

As far as I can tell, the Director of Scouting has had as much a hand in the decade of ineptitude as anyone else that has already been fired or quit.

[spartacus]

why cant you rock heads get it thru your thick skulls it was not his call it was always jurons.

 

its common knowledge that Modrak wanted Cushing,DJ overruled him and wanted Maybin.

 

the guy is director of scouting he could not force DJ or Marv to take the player he recommended what part of that dont you idi-ts get?

 

Pretty convenient that Modrak himself planted the story he wanted Cushing- but only after the season was over and Dick was gone. 

 

 

Modrak never went on record at draft time that he opposed the Maybin pick

 

only after the season and after the scapegoat was fired.

 

Modrak is responsible for 10 years of futile talent evaluation  - and yet the lemmings still defend him.

 

 

[Sisyphean Bills]

Again good points.

 

You can kind of make excuses for McCargo, or Lynch, or Donte, or McKelvin, even Mike Williams, or JP Lossman but when you add them all up and then on top you add Maybin, which should have had a "Do Not Draft" grade, all the bodies do point to the quality of scouting information.

 

What explains the higher hit ratio later in the draft?

Again, I ask what hits? (I realize that there have been a few good players, but it just isn't true that the Bills are landing 3 or 4 7th round All-Pros a draft.)

 

Pretty convenient that Modrak himself planted the story he wanted Cushing- but only after the season was over and Dick was gone.

 

Modrak never went on record at draft time that he opposed the Maybin pick

 

only after the season and after the scapegoat was fired.

 

Modrak is responsible for 10 years of futile talent evaluation - and yet the lemmings still defend him.

This sounds like the opposite to me.

 

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/bills-take-pass-rusher-maybin/14658d98-47ca-4db6-9944-c260ae5e98e9

[1B4IDie]

Again, I ask what hits? (I realize that there have been a few good players, but it just isn't true that the Bills are landing 3 or 4 7th round All-Pros a draft.)

 

 

This sounds like the opposite to me.

 

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/bills-take-pass-rusher-maybin/14658d98-47ca-4db6-9944-c260ae5e98e9

Not defending Modrak or the Maybin pick but what about his assessment is incorrect? Besides "makes it good for us." Maybin does try he just is in an undersized body, and I am the driver of the Maybin hater brigade.

 

Mabin is fast and light.

 

That doesn't sound like a ringing endorsement more like an impartial assessment.

 

“He’s good on both sides of the ball, right or left defensive end which is not always the case for players,” said Modrak. “His quick first step is equally good on both sides of the ball. And he can run. When he gets in the open field he can chase you down. He’s a speed rusher and can get up the field. He plays very, very hard all the time. Talking to their people there he has the same mentality in practice. The combination of those things made it good for us.”

 

Here is the Bills draft history:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/draft.htm

 

And you're right there may be a myth about these late round picks.

 

I really only see Kyle Williams, Stevie Johnson, D. Bell, Mario Haggan, Sam Aiken (good special teamers)and Terrence McGee that were any kind of contributer that was drafted after the 4th round since 2000.

The entire 2002-2005 were complete garbage save for Lee Evans, Kelsay, Crowell, Roscoe Parrish and McGahee

Edited December 8, 2010 by Why So Serious?

[Sisyphean Bills]

Not defending Modrak or the Maybin pick but what about his assessment is incorrect? Besides "makes it good for us." Maybin does try he just is in an undersized body, and I am the driver of the Maybin hater brigade.

 

Mabin is fast and light.

 

That doesn't sound like a ringing endorsement more like an impartial assessment.

 

“He’s good on both sides of the ball, right or left defensive end which is not always the case for players,” said Modrak. “His quick first step is equally good on both sides of the ball. And he can run. When he gets in the open field he can chase you down. He’s a speed rusher and can get up the field. He plays very, very hard all the time. Talking to their people there he has the same mentality in practice. The combination of those things made it good for us.”

 

The point simply was that it certainly doesn't read like someone who was against the Maybin pick and thought it was a big mistake. For sure, Modrak's smart enough to play the company line and all, but the revisionist historians want it that he knew Maybin was a mistake. Yet, when the Bills drafted Maybin, he said point blank: "made it [a] good [pick] for us." Yet, the leak that he'd have rather drafted Cushing was after Cushing won rookie of the year.

 

I guess this just pegs my CYA hot air meter.

 

Here is the Bills draft history:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/draft.htm

 

And you're right there may be a myth about these late round picks.

 

I really only see Kyle Williams, Stevie Johnson, D. Bell, Mario Haggan, Sam Aiken (good special teamers)and Terrence McGee that were any kind of contributer that was drafted after the 4th round since 2000.

The entire 2002-2005 were complete garbage save for Lee Evans, Kelsay, Crowell, Roscoe Parrish and McGahee

 

Thanks. We're just talking ball here. Kyle Williams looks like he is developing into an excellent player. (I'd have put Jason Peters on your list, as he could've been a great one, though the Bills cut him at one point, so it's not like they knew what they had in the beginning and he eventually forced his way out.) Stevie Johnson, if he continues to develop, may be a real good one. The rest are JAGs. So, the numbers don't really support the idea that the Bills are finding better talent in the later rounds of the draft (and as UDFAs).

 

Rather, the 6th and 7th rounders are logging a lot of playing time because the Bills are bad and the top picks are largely non-contributing. It really speaks to just how bad their overall drafting and team building has been: they must play late round picks, UDFAs, and waiver wire cast-offs because they have so many holes and so many misses that there simply isn't anyone else.

[Lofton80]

Great take Red ! Enough is enough with this guy. No other team makes this spin argument to support a dud. Bottom line no playoffs during his tenure.

 

 

 

 

OK. I don't know why Modrak keep escaping unharmed. What, John Guy was not responsible for the quality of free agents we signed?

 

C'mon!

 

But, let's play your thinking out.

 

So it's draft day, and the new coaching staff comes in and states that they want a "waterbug" RB. Or they want the best Defensive lineman available. Or safety. Or QB. The coaches and GM take everything into account: contracts, current roster status, available and soon to be available free agents. Another factor: rookies. A plan is compiled. We will keep players A, B, & C on our roster. We will trade with Team 1 for player D. But we will then need to draft a player for position __________ to fill the gaps.

 

The team then refers to its scouting staff for advice on who to pick.

 

The team decides the direction, BUT THE SCOUTING STAFF COMPILES THE RECOMMENDATIONS ON THE COLLEGE PLAYERS SO THAT THE POWERS THAT BE CAN MAKE AN INFORMED DECISION.

 

Sure, I don't doubt that Mauron wanted Maybin. Or Levy wanted Whitner. But somebody compiled the information and said that Maybin was a better player than Orakpo. That Mike Williams was the best Tackle available. That Losman was worthy of a #1 pick, and that McCargo was worth trading back into the 1st round for.

 

Somebody is scouting these players and giving their stamp of approval to the decision-makers.

 

This information passes right through the hands of one Tom Modrak.

 

These players are all getting his stamp of approval, regardless of who makes the decision.