I am going to say it....Bills don't need a QB

[BuffOrange]

You do know that the rams lost to arizona, oakland, detroit, and san fran.. and they are 4-6 in the nfc west, and.. the bills could have easily been 4-6 or better in the AFC east, with a better D. Just saying....

 

We need a D and an o-line.

 

The Rams personnel is dreadful. Worse than ours. Probably worse than Carolina's. 4 wins with a last second loss @Tampa is quite an accomplishment for them and their rookie QB; and I admit I didn't think highly of Bradford.

[San-O]

Im at a loss for words.

 

Taking a player, assuming he's as good as Manning, is the worst thing a franchise can do to build a winning team????

 

The bills have tried to solidify their lines like Indy did, see Wood, levitre, wang, hangartner.

 

If a Manning type player is there you take him, its silly to argue otherwise. i mean cmon mannnnn

 

 

+ 1

 

I was SO dumbfounded when I read that, I started to reply, and then stopped.

[Van_phelaN1]

and I'm going to say it you dont know a damn thing about football.

 

who would you rather have fitz or,brady,either manning,brees,flacco,ryan,big ben,palmer,rivers,vick,mcnabb,rogers,bradford, get the point?

 

look i like fitz and he is the best we have by a mile however in the NFL like polian and brandt and all the GM's who know their sh-t all say the most important thing on a football team is QB then LT.

 

its not a coincidence that all the teams that have franchise QB's are in the playoffs every year. its because they have the ability to elevate every player on the offense and make them better.

 

that being said the object of this game is to always improve yourself so if we can draft a potential franchise QB any GM worth his salt will do it.

 

want a perfect example. look at what SD did they had brees yet they still went ahead and drafted rivers and instantly started him.want to know why it was because they knew he was a rare talent,or as Nix said a no brain er. its called common sense.

 

franchise QB's dont grow on trees and if you can get one you damn well better or your dead.

 

this draft has @ LEAST 3 OR 4 potential FRANCHAISE qb's with one all world sure fire star in Luck. if Nix does not take one of these guys this year he should be fired but mark my words he will.

 

unfortunately its our buffalo bad Luck that we will not have a shot @ Luck however there are @ least 3 other QB's who we will be able to get hopefully and there is no doubt in my mind Nix will take one.

 

do i want fitz cut no. what i want is for fitz to tutor our new QB and be our second string QB. if we dont get Luck or Mallett or Locker maybe fitz will have to be our starter one more year but then is back to the bench.

 

mark my words we will get our QB of the future in the first round this year or we will trade back into the first round if we are unable to land luck with our own first round pick.

 

fitz is a great competitor but he is not a QB that can win us a super bowl. he simply does not possess the physical tools namely arm strength and accuracy to be a franchise QB and anyone who does not understand that does not know football plain and simple.

 

so just stop with all this fitz is our guy for the future BS because as much as all you guys have a man crush on him he is what he is a great backup and will never be a franchise QB.

 

What is funny about this post is that you are the one who actually comes off looking like he knows nothing about football.

 

Bradford? Really? Yeah look at that amazing elite shuffle pass he made on Sunday. I am not saying Fitz is a franchise QB but I think people need to start admitting that he is better than they gave him credit for and he has more potential to improve even though everyone kept saying "no upside." People were wrong and now they want to start with this "oh but I love Fitz. I just don't think he is the guy, but i do like him and uh."

 

Keep back peddling guy.

 

Oh and if you want to talk about elevating the play of everyone on the field you only need to look back at how well Johnson and Parrish played with out previous QB.

 

I was down on Fitz and said all of this stuff from day one and how he was not the guy and was as good as he was going to get. Well guess what, I was WRONG. He might not be headed to the Hall of Fame but we were wrong when we assumed he was a career back up. At least I am man enough to admit it.

[BuffOrange]

What is funny about this post is that you are the one who actually comes off looking like he knows nothing about football.

 

Bradford? Really? Yeah look at that amazing elite shuffle pass he made on Sunday. I am not saying Fitz is a franchise QB but I think people need to start admitting that he is better than they gave him credit for and he has more potential to improve even though everyone kept saying "no upside." People were wrong and now they want to start with this "oh but I love Fitz. I just don't think he is the guy, but i do like him and uh."

 

Keep back peddling guy.

 

Oh and if you want to talk about elevating the play of everyone on the field you only need to look back at how well Johnson and Parrish played with out previous QB.

 

I was down on Fitz and said all of this stuff from day one and how he was not the guy and was as good as he was going to get. Well guess what, I was WRONG. He might not be headed to the Hall of Fame but we were wrong when we assumed he was a career back up. At least I am man enough to admit it.

 

Fine line between being a man and gross overreaction to a couple good games, which as you'll recall Lossman had in 2006. I too am man enough to admit I previously thought he was not one of the best 32 QB's in football and now I believe he is. So by that definition he's not a career backup. Personally that's not really what I'm shooting for in my QB though.

[JohnC]

You do know that the rams lost to arizona, oakland, detroit, and san fran.. and they are 4-6 in the nfc west, and.. the bills could have easily been 4-6 or better in the AFC east, with a better D. Just saying....

 

We need a D first and an o-line in a veryyyy close second.

 

How many games did the Rams win the previous year? Who do you think is odds on going to be the rookie of the year this year? Being a franchise qb doesn't mean that you are going to be a miracle man. The Rams now have the most important position on the team addressed for a decade or more (assuming health). Now they can address their other needs.

 

Drafting a qb with a high draft pick doesn't mean that you can't address some other critical defensive needs with your other picks and some free agent pickups.

[Bill from NYC]

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

aHEM, uh....err....I mean, uh, interesting point, my friend.

 

( )

 

LOL!

 

I must admit that you surprise me. You seem to think that it is just impossible for Mallett to be a top qb in this league. You know, you and the pundits could be wrong. It isn't impossible.

 

Take it from me......I thought RJ would be a star, and that Pat Williams was washed up when we cut him.

[Kelly the Dog]

Completion percentage is very often an entirely inaccurate look into a quarterback's accuracy. With the types of passes Fitzpatrick throws, with this line, with this defense not giving him good field position and often playing behind, 60% is not only good, it's excellent. He doesn't dump the ball off to backs all that often. He rarely is asked to throw safe passes to TEs. He doesn't throw a lot of WR screens and swing passes that are essentially running plays but bump up your completion percentage and -- perhaps most importantly -- he doesn't throw 4-5 yard passes on 3rd and 8-15 like a lot of QBs do, he almost always tries for the first down or the tough pass. 59-60% is great for the kinds of balls he throws and chooses to throw. 59-60% would be lousy for a safe QB, or one who played in an offense with a lot of dump offs and screens.

 

He's also often extremely accurate on tough passes, fit into tight windows. He is inaccurate too much on throws he should make, which is why he has the bad rap for inaccuracy. But if he completed two more of those per game, and yet didn't complete two of the really hard ones he often does hit, people wouldn't say he was inaccurate.

 

To be candid, I thought he was too inaccurate as well, and said it all the time. There used to be too many passes he needs to hit with guys open. But those are becoming less and less. And he seems to have gotten over that hump with experience, and with the confidence Gailey has given him. It remains to be seen if he can keep this up. But I am not, for the first time, betting against it. This week against the Steelers, at home, could go a long way answering some questions. The last six weeks should tell us a lot. I don't think right now we know if he is our guy or not, but for the first time, he very well could be.

[JohnC]

LOL!

 

Take it from me......I thought RJ would be a star, and that Pat Williams was washed up when we cut him.

 

Pat Williams was cut because Donahoe gave him a take it or leave it contract offer. He left it. At the time of his release he was playing at a very high level. That was a long term damaging decision for our defense. Typical Donahoe decision-making process. It revolves around his ego and his dictatorial tendencies.

 

There was a lot of people, including me, who thought RJ was going to be an impact player. He was the type of player whose sterling parts didn't equal the end product. At the qb position exceptional physical talents get neutralized with inadequate mental talents. RJ and JP were similar type players. All bodies and no brains. Instinct for the game is not easily measured but it very evident when watching the games. Neither had it.

Edited November 23, 2010 by JohnC

[No Cease Fires]

Fine line between being a man and gross overreaction to a couple good games, which as you'll recall Lossman had in 2006. I too am man enough to admit I previously thought he was not one of the best 32 QB's in football and now I believe he is. So by that definition he's not a career backup. Personally that's not really what I'm shooting for in my QB though.

 

Fitzpatrick has already exceeded Losman's 2006 TD total with six games to play.

 

I'm in no way advocating Fitz as the team's cure-all moving forward, but it's kind of funny the lengths some fans will go to to downplay what he's done for the team this season.

[zow2]

I'm tired of all the "franchise quarterback" talk. I really am. In the NFL there are some great QBs, some bad QBs and the rest are kind of bunched up. Fitz is in that bunched up category but he has climbed rapidly this year to near the top of that heap. There's no reason to believe that if he had a better team around him, that whe would not improve into a great QB. Somehow, people seem to think that Brady, Manning and Brees never have a bad game or throw a bad pass or two? Didn't Peyton just throw away a game last weekend at NE? Didn't Brady get completely punked and look awful at Cleveland a couple weeks ago (and a few other games)? Brees didn't look good at all early in the season. I mean, why do posters expect Fitz to be perfect on every throw every week? my gosh, it's ridiculous. I would like people to realize that Fitz is playing at a very high level on a very mediocre to below club. If i could trade Fitz for one of these guys today, I'd do it in a heartbeat. That's between 11-13 guys. That's it. This is who i'd rather have then Fitz and its a pretty short list. I think the team should still grab one of the Elite QB's on the draft to groom for the future, but i would not be at all upset if they went heavy on D and O-line.

 

Michael Vick

Philip Rivers

Ben Roethlisberger

Tom Brady

Aaron Rodgers

Peyton Manning

Drew Brees

Matt Ryan

Joe Flacco

Eli Manning

Tony Romo

Mark Sanchez (maybe)

Kyle Orton (maybe)

[The Big Cat]

I'm tired of all the "franchise quarterback" talk. I really am. In the NFL there are some great QBs, some bad QBs and the rest are kind of bunched up. Fitz is in that bunched up category but he has climbed rapidly this year to near the top of that heap. There's no reason to believe that if he had a better team around him, that whe would not improve into a great QB. Somehow, people seem to think that Brady, Manning and Brees never have a bad game or throw a bad pass or two? Didn't Peyton just throw away a game last weekend at NE? Didn't Brady get completely punked and look awful at Cleveland a couple weeks ago (and a few other games)? Brees didn't look good at all early in the season. I mean, why do posters expect Fitz to be perfect on every throw every week? my gosh, it's ridiculous. I would like people to realize that Fitz is playing at a very high level on a very mediocre to below club. If i could trade Fitz for one of these guys today, I'd do it in a heartbeat. That's between 11-13 guys. That's it. This is who i'd rather have then Fitz and its a pretty short list. I think the team should still grab one of the Elite QB's on the draft to groom for the future, but i would not be at all upset if they went heavy on D and O-line.

 

Michael Vick

Philip Rivers

Ben Roethlisberger

Tom Brady

Aaron Rodgers

Peyton Manning

Drew Brees

Matt Ryan

Joe Flacco

Eli Manning

Tony Romo

Mark Sanchez (maybe)

Kyle Orton (maybe)

 

Fixed, and a big ole +1

[zow2]

Fixed, and a big ole +1

 

You're the man. Kind of agree w/ your revisions...

[Alphadawg7]

Completion percentage is very often an entirely inaccurate look into a quarterback's accuracy. With the types of passes Fitzpatrick throws, with this line, with this defense not giving him good field position and often playing behind, 60% is not only good, it's excellent. He doesn't dump the ball off to backs all that often. He rarely is asked to throw safe passes to TEs. He doesn't throw a lot of WR screens and swing passes that are essentially running plays but bump up your completion percentage and -- perhaps most importantly -- he doesn't throw 4-5 yard passes on 3rd and 8-15 like a lot of QBs do, he almost always tries for the first down or the tough pass. 59-60% is great for the kinds of balls he throws and chooses to throw. 59-60% would be lousy for a safe QB, or one who played in an offense with a lot of dump offs and screens.

 

He's also often extremely accurate on tough passes, fit into tight windows. He is inaccurate too much on throws he should make, which is why he has the bad rap for inaccuracy. But if he completed two more of those per game, and yet didn't complete two of the really hard ones he often does hit, people wouldn't say he was inaccurate.

 

To be candid, I thought he was too inaccurate as well, and said it all the time. There used to be too many passes he needs to hit with guys open. But those are becoming less and less. And he seems to have gotten over that hump with experience, and with the confidence Gailey has given him. It remains to be seen if he can keep this up. But I am not, for the first time, betting against it. This week against the Steelers, at home, could go a long way answering some questions. The last six weeks should tell us a lot. I don't think right now we know if he is our guy or not, but for the first time, he very well could be.

 

Fitz may be the most inaccurate QB at throwing a screen I have ever seen. Several have been into the ground, even a couple that were backward and turned into live fumbles, along with a couple sailing into the sidelines. More importantly, not only does he throw way too many incompletes on screens, the completed ones are too frequently at the recievers ankles, behind him, above his head, etc, making it impossible for the player to make a move and advance the ball.

 

Someone needs to spend some serious time working on this with him, its about the easiest throw in football and he struggles to execute it consistently.

 

And, I am sorry, his accuracy is an issue and he is not extrememly accurate on tough passes as you say. Yes, he has made some tough passes, some great ones even, but he also has thrown a lot of bad INT's, had a dozen more dropped INT's that were just terrible throws, and most of them occured on timing routes which are tough passes and require the QB to make an accurate throw. Of course, he has also had some that were just so far from the WR they resmebled a wild pitch in baseball. More importantly, if you watch the games rather then check the stat page, you will see many of his completed passes were inaccurately thrown causing the WR to take a bad hit, catch it below his knees, go up and make a crazy tough catch, cause the reciever to break off his route or break momenutm, etc.

 

If someone wants to argue his guts, grit, heart, etc then fine, that makes sense, and he has all that. But to argue that this QB with a career 58% completion rate is accurate is a little silly.

[Alphadawg7]

I'm tired of all the "franchise quarterback" talk. I really am. In the NFL there are some great QBs, some bad QBs and the rest are kind of bunched up. Fitz is in that bunched up category but he has climbed rapidly this year to near the top of that heap. There's no reason to believe that if he had a better team around him, that whe would not improve into a great QB. Somehow, people seem to think that Brady, Manning and Brees never have a bad game or throw a bad pass or two? Didn't Peyton just throw away a game last weekend at NE? Didn't Brady get completely punked and look awful at Cleveland a couple weeks ago (and a few other games)? Brees didn't look good at all early in the season. I mean, why do posters expect Fitz to be perfect on every throw every week? my gosh, it's ridiculous. I would like people to realize that Fitz is playing at a very high level on a very mediocre to below club. If i could trade Fitz for one of these guys today, I'd do it in a heartbeat. That's between 11-13 guys. That's it. This is who i'd rather have then Fitz and its a pretty short list. I think the team should still grab one of the Elite QB's on the draft to groom for the future, but i would not be at all upset if they went heavy on D and O-line.

 

Michael Vick

Philip Rivers

Ben Roethlisberger

Tom Brady

Aaron Rodgers

Peyton Manning

Drew Brees

Matt Ryan

Joe Flacco

Eli Manning

Tony Romo

Mark Sanchez (maybe)

Kyle Orton (maybe)

 

The problem here is that you are living off of 2 games for Fitz, Balt and Cincy. He was not very efficient in the NE game, in fact, we were down 16 even with a Spiller KO return for a TD, or we would have been down 23 with 4 min to go as he struggled to find any consistency all day. He was awful against the Jets, and disappeared in the 2nd half against the Jags until he got a garbage time TD with 1 min left and the Jags just giving away the middle of the field to keep the clock rolling. He had a great statistical game at Balt, but his 2 INT's in the 3rd quarter gave away our lead for good. KC he had about 50 yards passing in the first half, and only one good drive the entire game which was the late 4th quarter TD which he followed it up with an INT when we were close to FG range and a chance to win the game in regulation. In fact, after the one TD, he completed just 33% of his passes with an INT over the last 4 drives, all game winning potential drives. His 2 INT's hurt us bad against Chi, struggled against Det, and then started the game with an INT this weekend that Cincy gifted him back where that first TD drive shouldnt have even happened, but Cincy bailed us out 3 times to keep the drive alive. Conincidentally, he was awful against Cincy until the 2 safeties got hurt. I mean just look at how bad they blew the coverage on SJ when he was so open he could have had a picnic and my grandma could have completed the throw to him.

 

So really, you are hanging you hat on 3 quarters of play against Balt (1st, 2nd, and 4th) and two quarters against Cincy (3rd and 4th where he was great). Outside of that, he has been largely ineffective and mistake prone. In fact he has 7 INT's over his last 5 games and KC dropped 2 right in their hands and Cincy gave one back to start the game this weekend plus several other dropped INT's he has been lucky on.

 

So, the point is, no one expects him to be perfect every week on every throw, but what some of us with a more realistic eye of what he has done want to see is more consistency and less complete bone head throws before we bye into him. I REALLY hope he develops more and can be that guy, would love to be able to just have our QB spot settled, but thus far, he has really not done as much as it seems considering almost HALF of his TD's have come in 2 games along with 36% of his yards and yet critical mistakes and struggles have been present in most of his games.

[Kelly the Dog]

Fitz may be the most inaccurate QB at throwing a screen I have ever seen. Several have been into the ground, even a couple that were backward and turned into live fumbles, along with a couple sailing into the sidelines. More importantly, not only does he throw way too many incompletes on screens, the completed ones are too frequently at the recievers ankles, behind him, above his head, etc, making it impossible for the player to make a move and advance the ball.

 

Someone needs to spend some serious time working on this with him, its about the easiest throw in football and he struggles to execute it consistently.

 

And, I am sorry, his accuracy is an issue and he is not extrememly accurate on tough passes as you say. Yes, he has made some tough passes, some great ones even, but he also has thrown a lot of bad INT's, had a dozen more dropped INT's that were just terrible throws, and most of them occured on timing routes which are tough passes and require the QB to make an accurate throw. Of course, he has also had some that were just so far from the WR they resmebled a wild pitch in baseball. More importantly, if you watch the games rather then check the stat page, you will see many of his completed passes were inaccurately thrown causing the WR to take a bad hit, catch it below his knees, go up and make a crazy tough catch, cause the reciever to break off his route or break momenutm, etc.

 

If someone wants to argue his guts, grit, heart, etc then fine, that makes sense, and he has all that. But to argue that this QB with a career 58% completion rate is accurate is a little silly.

I'm only talking about his accuracy this season, which has substantially improved. Up until now, I also thought, and said even in the post you responded to that he was inaccurate on too many passes, especially ones that are relatively easy. It cost us the NE game when he overthrew an open Parrish at the goalline that was intercepted. It's happened often this year, especially on a few bombs to Evans.

 

But to me (taking velocity out of the equation) he's like a fastball throwing pitcher who throws a lot of wild pitches and when he's bad he's really bad -- BUT -- at the same time, overall he throws more strikes than guys with more consistent control. And if he is getting more batters out and striking more guys out, plus the walks or wild pitches are not hurting him, the optics of the bad pitches are distorting the reality of the sum of the parts.

 

If Fitz threw a lot to the backs and TEs he would easily be at 65%. That's considered very good in this league. He also has to throw immediately because our line gives him two seconds not three or four like other lines do.

 

He throws a TON of extremely accurate passes, often into tight spots. And I totally disagree that a good percentage of his completions are bad passes. He hits guys in stride all the time. Those passes (I would say there have been 15-20 over the season) that are low to the ground that Stevie Johnson has caught right at the first down marker or endzone are extremely accurate passes. Perfect in fact. If you think they are not accurate because they were low, that is just nonsense.

 

He has thrown a lot of bad screen passes, I would agree. That is something he does not do great. But they don't hurt us all that much and it's not something I'm at all worried about. He's thrown some very good ones, too, and those are not such easy balls. In fact, it's hard to throw consistently good screen passes and a lot of QBs can't throw them. It's also difficult on TV a lot of times to see why that happened.

 

Right now, if Fitzpatrick didn't misfire on the 2-3 passes a game that he probably should hit, he would be playing at an all-pro franchise quarterback level. I am not saying he isnt inaccurate with passes that he should make. That's his major problem right now. BUT, I think you are others are totally misreading the sum of the game, and giving too many demerits for those few a game when he is making more than that many tough passes a game. If he continues at this pace, he's going to throw 32 TDs in 14 games. Jim Kelly threw 33 once in his career, and never more than that. And Fitz is on this team, not a Super Bowl team

[The Big Cat]

Fitz may be the most inaccurate QB at throwing a screen I have ever seen. Several have been into the ground, even a couple one that were went backward and turned into live fumbles, along with a couple sailing into the sidelines. More importantly, not only does he throw way too many incompletes on screens, the completed ones are too frequently at the recievers ankles, behind him, above his head, etc, making it impossible for the player to make a move and advance the ball.

 

Okay so far.

 

Someone needs to spend some serious time working on this with him, its about the easiest throw in football and because he struggles to execute it consistently.

 

I'm not sure who made this rule. I'd actually go so far as to say that the touch passes are far and away the harder ones to throw.

 

And, I am sorry, his accuracy is an issue and he is not extrememly accurate on tough passes as you say. Yes, he has made some tough passes, some great ones even, but he also has thrown a lot of bad INT's, had a dozen two or three more dropped INT's that were just terrible throws, and most of them occurred on timing routes which are tough passes and require the QB to make an accurate throw. Of course, he has also had some that were just so far from the WR they resembled a wild pitch in baseball. But sometimes in that situation, the passer and the receiver just aren't on the same page. More importantly, if you watch the games rather then check the stat page, you will see many of his completed passes were inaccurately thrown causing the WR to take a bad hit, catch it below his knees, go up and make a crazy tough catch, cause the reciever to break off his route or break momenutm, etc.

 

Boy, once you get past all the falsehoods and exaggerations of your post, it's actually quite substantive.

[zow2]

The problem here is that you are living off of 2 games for Fitz, Balt and Cincy. So really, you are hanging you hat on 3 quarters of play against Balt (1st, 2nd, and 4th) and two quarters against Cincy (3rd and 4th where he was great). Outside of that, he has been largely ineffective and mistake prone. In fact he has 7 INT's over his last 5 games and KC dropped 2 right in their hands and Cincy gave one back to start the game this weekend plus several other dropped INT's he has been lucky on.

 

I was at the Miami game last year and Indy for that matter....hence i was pounding the lecturn so to speak to have Fitz start the opener this year vs. Miami. Made me ill that Gailey threw Tony SParano a gift by starting Edwards in that game. Sparano would have told you which QB he would rather have faced seeing as Fitz carved up his team in Orchard Park last fall. Anyway, the point is I'm not hanging my hat on 3 Qtrs vs. Baltimore and 2 Qtrs vs. Cinci. Nice try. I actually like his "body of work" since he's been here. If you want to pick apart every teams QB to that level of detail, then I'm sure you can try to convince yourself that Brees, Rivers, Ryan, Flacco etc,,, are very flawed QB's as well. I guess only Mike Vick is off the hook since he hasn't thrown a pick yet this season or an inaccurate pass. So far this season, Fitz's attempts, yards, completion % and TD's are way up. Maybe it's not a coincidence since he is now working under Chan Gailey.

 

Just try not to work so hard to convince yourself that Fitz is not good. It's like some posters are on a crusade against the guy. Jeez!

[ajzepp]

LOL!

 

I must admit that you surprise me. You seem to think that it is just impossible for Mallett to be a top qb in this league. You know, you and the pundits could be wrong. It isn't impossible.

 

Take it from me......I thought RJ would be a star, and that Pat Williams was washed up when we cut him.

 

Oh, trust me brother, I'm USUALLY wrong

 

I think it's just that the only other time I've really felt strongly about a particular player on the Bills (in a negative way, that is), was with Bledsoe. When I see Mallett, I see Drew...and it scares the HELL out of me. I know you said before you'd be happy with a Drew type player, but I would really struggle with that. I just don't like players who put up all sorts of big numbers but then wither in the big games or against better teams. It's been beaten to death, I know, but that's why I keep beating the anti-Mallett drum lol

[finknottle]

If a Manning type player is there you take him, its silly to argue otherwise. i mean cmon mannnnn

 

And if a winning lottery ticket is there, you buy it. i mean cmon mannnnn

[section122]

So after reading this entire thread I am left with a few questions I wouldn't mind some answers to

 

1. Who besides luck fits your guys description of a franchise qb? Mallet? Ponder? Locker?

 

2. With what pick would you be willing to take said franchise qb with? Top 5? top 10?

 

3. Who do you feel is better than fitz or will be better than fitz?

 

4. Will we realistically have a chance to draft this qb with what is looking to be a pick in the 4-10 range?