Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 WHINE ON, HARVEST MOON!!!!! Then - when you're all done whining - explain how that helps or changes anything, speaking of 'moronic' What's done is done. Jauron's gone, we have a new coach, a new mind-set, a new GM with a history of successful drafts. If all you can do is whine, please go get yourself a big tall glass of STFU. My sticking point is confidence in the "new mind-set" and "new GM with history of successful drafts" bit. I (and I think many of us) worry about the mind-set when we see acquisitions like Green and extensions like Kelsey, and ask if Torbor and Ayodele were really the best LB acquisitions available at the time (or just homies to Edwards from Miami) :wallbash: (Though I gotta give Torbor big props for leadership) We worry about the "history of successful drafts" bit when we ask how much the scouting had to do with the picks and ask "how much has the scouting changed?". It's that GIGO phenomenon - Nix can't do everything, and even Superman would slow down at age 70. Back atcha with some metamush: you've commented elsewhere the "ignore" feature and how valuable you find it. Instead of insults and advising others to "STFU" why not just use that famous feature? It's no hair off my palms what ya say (or whether ya choose to ignore me) Just curious about the choice to complain about negativity and rudeness on the board in one thread, while calling folks "whining" "moronic" and cussing them in another. Is it "do as I say, don't do as I do" time in the Senate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Boy, I wish I had bought these stocks over the last decade... Chico's FAS +3,790.889% Apple +3,504.444% Frontier Oil +2,367.556% Oshkosh Truck +2,153.455% Clean Harbors +1,995.059% Echostar Communications +1,870.947% Gilead Sciences +1,816.260% American Eagle Outfitters +1,737.162% Holly Corp. +1,706.189% XTO Energy +1,629.161% I have owned Chicos in my portfolio on occasion (I do not hold any now) and I had no idea that they beat out Apple. Oh for a time machine .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 (edited) My sticking point is confidence in the "new mind-set" and "new GM with history of successful drafts" bit. I (and I think many of us) worry about the mind-set when we see acquisitions like Green and extensions like Kelsey, and ask if Torbor and Ayodele were really the best LB acquisitions available at the time (or just homies to Edwards from Miami) :wallbash: (Though I gotta give Torbor big props for leadership) We worry about the "history of successful drafts" bit when we ask how much the scouting had to do with the picks and ask "how much has the scouting changed?". It's that GIGO phenomenon - Nix can't do everything, and even Superman would slow down at age 70. Back atcha with some metamush: you've commented elsewhere the "ignore" feature and how valuable you find it. Instead of insults and advising others to "STFU" why not just use that famous feature? It's no hair off my palms what ya say (or whether ya choose to ignore me) Just curious about the choice to complain about negativity and rudeness on the board in one thread, while calling folks "whining" "moronic" and cussing them in another. Is it "do as I say, don't do as I do" time in the Senate? Actually, it's 'do unto others as they have done unto you' time in the Senate - if you review the thread you'll notice it was perpetual whiner DarthICE that requested of me... "Can you and others stop with moronic posts like this?" I suppose, since I can't put everyone on my 'ignore' list, the most effective way of ignoring everyone would be to not come here at all - that's not happening, so once in while, yeah, I'm gonna snap back when someone calls one of my posts 'moronic'. Edited October 31, 2010 by The Senator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 see Lions, Detroit 2000-2009 1st rounders 2000 Stockar McDougle, OT Oklahoma 2001 Jeff Backus, OT Michigan 2002 Joey Harrington, QB Oregon 2003 Charles Rogers, WR Michigan State 2004 Roy Williams WR Texas Kevin Jones, RB Virginia Tech 2005 Mike Williams, WR USC 2006 Ernie Sims, LB Florida State 2007 Calvin Johnson, WR Georgia Tech 2008 Gosder Cherilus, OT Boston College 2009 Matthew Stafford, QB Georgia Brandon Pettigrew, TE Oklahoma State Exempt the 09 picks, and that's one thin crew there. Fascinating. Do also note that three times they drafted offensive tackles in the first round.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Fascinating. Do also note that three times they drafted offensive tackles in the first round.... What's your point? That bad front offices can draft bad offensive tackles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 What's your point? That bad front offices can draft bad offensive tackles? Among others... actually, I had two points. One was to give you credit for some fascinating information, and give you a chance to show some good grace. Too bad about that. The other was just to say that any draft pick is always something of a crap shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Among others... actually, I had two points. One was to give you credit for some fascinating information, and give you a chance to show some good grace. Too bad about that. The other was just to say that any draft pick is always something of a crap shoot. Sometimes hard to tell what people are thinking through words alone on a message board. A lot of fans aren't high on taking OT's in favor of skill positions. If I offended, my apologies. I took it to mean you were casting doubt on the drafting of OT's is not the solution I do not believe the draft is a total crap shoot. Sure, guys like Polian, Parcells, and Belichick have made mistakes, but their track record is markedly better than many others. The Bills regardless need a starting QB, LT, pass rushers, and probably a RT. It's also funny to see the Cowboys with all their high priced skill guys can't win games and protect their QB. They haven't drafted an OT in the top two rounds since I believe Flozell Adams in 1998. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 Sometimes hard to tell what people are thinking through words alone on a message board. A lot of fans aren't high on taking OT's in favor of skill positions. If I offended, my apologies. I took it to mean you were casting doubt on the drafting of OT's is not the solution I do not believe the draft is a total crap shoot. Sure, guys like Polian, Parcells, and Belichick have made mistakes, but their track record is markedly better than many others. The Bills regardless need a starting QB, LT, pass rushers, and probably a RT. It's also funny to see the Cowboys with all their high priced skill guys can't win games and protect their QB. They haven't drafted an OT in the top two rounds since I believe Flozell Adams in 1998. I know how a lot of nerves get rubbed raw in these discussions. We could all profit from taking deep breaths before assuming the worst, and I include myself in that. Another interesting point at the end. The Cowboys example is especially good considering that means that even Bill Parcells could not be moved to draft an OT. Which fits in with my general feeling that there is no single silver bullet for drafting that the geniuses always follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 The discussion has value as it does frame the value that Tom Modrak has brought to the Bills organization working with multiple coaching staffs and war room panels. Of course, a few would rather not have that put under the microscope quite yet as Modrak is still with the Bills. I know how a lot of nerves get rubbed raw in these discussions. We could all profit from taking deep breaths before assuming the worst, and I include myself in that. Another interesting point at the end. The Cowboys example is especially good considering that means that even Bill Parcells could not be moved to draft an OT. Which fits in with my general feeling that there is no single silver bullet for drafting that the geniuses always follow. As far as the lines go, Gailey is an old-fashioned coach that would prefer to line his guys up and blow the opponent off the ball. Part of the reason the team is worse this year is that this change in philosophy wasn't well suited to the roster Jauron built, which was the opposite approach of having smaller, faster players that could outflank and play in space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 The discussion has value as it does frame the value that Tom Modrak has brought to the Bills organization working with multiple coaching staffs and war room panels. Of course, a few would rather not have that put under the microscope quite yet as Modrak is still with the Bills. As far as the lines go, Gailey is an old-fashioned coach that would prefer to line his guys up and blow the opponent off the ball. Part of the reason the team is worse this year is that this change in philosophy wasn't well suited to the roster Jauron built, which was the opposite approach of having smaller, faster players that could outflank and play in space. I think that is very true, which is also why I am not surprised that he will need more time to improve the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 I know how a lot of nerves get rubbed raw in these discussions. We could all profit from taking deep breaths before assuming the worst, and I include myself in that. Another interesting point at the end. The Cowboys example is especially good considering that means that even Bill Parcells could not be moved to draft an OT. Which fits in with my general feeling that there is no single silver bullet for drafting that the geniuses always follow. Parcells may not be likable or perfect in the draft but he spent top picks and resources on OT's in Miami with Jake Long and re-signed Vernon Carey soon after taking over in MIA. When he arrived in Dallas, Flozell was a good OT and they could protect Romo. 4 years later a lot's changed. Finding OT's in today's NFL is not easy with the athletic OLB's rushing passers in the 34. You don't find these guys very often outside the top rounds, though exceptions remain like James Harrison. To rebuild this team, they'll need pass rushers, and that's what Parcells found in Dallas in DeMarcus Ware and Anthony Spencer. Buffalo's rebuild will take a long time unless they devote major dollars and scout better UFA's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsguy Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 WHINE ON, HARVEST MOON!!!!! Then - when you're all done whining - explain how that helps or changes anything, speaking of 'moronic' What's done is done. Jauron's gone, we have a new coach, a new mind-set, a new GM with a history of successful drafts. If all you can do is whine, please go get yourself a big tall glass of STFU. What is really moronic is repeating the same excuses every 3 years! Wade Phillips is gone- why complain? Gregg Williams is gone - why complain? Mularkey is gone - why complain? Donahoe is gone - why complain? Jauron is gone - why complain? Draft picks are horrendous for the last decade- why complain? Ralph Wilson has been the driving force for this failure. What's moronic is ignoring the past! "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Senator Posted October 31, 2010 Share Posted October 31, 2010 What is really moronic is repeating the same excuses every 3 years! Wade Phillips is gone- why complain? Gregg Williams is gone - why complain? Mularkey is gone - why complain? Donahoe is gone - why complain? Jauron is gone - why complain? Draft picks are horrendous for the last decade- why complain? Ralph Wilson has been the driving force for this failure. What's moronic is ignoring the past! "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana I blame today's loss on Wade Phillips, Gregg Williams, Mike Mularkey, Tom Donahoe, and Dick Jauron! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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