Linemen protect well, but they tip cap to Fitz

[Another Point of View]

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-3/Linemen-protect-well-but-they-tip-cap-to-Fitz/03198867-371a-4181-9dc4-bb8bc338c48a

[qdawg in philly]

Well it looks like the key to the offense was communication, not just fitz! I just hope they do the same against kc! It is a regular week, so the bills don't have an extra week to prep!

If the d plays the gaps and lanes, we gotta shot! They need to be aggressive and punch kc in the mouth and KEEP PUNCHING THEM! Its very possible to get this win! They have to take the momentum from last week and play the same!

And I believe they will come out with the victory! BILLS NATION

[The Big Cat]

“Everybody, the line, the backs and just getting everybody on the same page,” said Fitzpatrick. “And there were just certain looks the Ravens gave us schematically we thought we’d be able to do some good things and it worked out like we thought it would throughout the game.

 

 

 

Trent used to say the exact opposite when Dick was around.

 

Was it Trent?

 

Was it Dick?

[ConradDobler]

“Everybody, the line, the backs and just getting everybody on the same page,” said Fitzpatrick. “And there were just certain looks the Ravens gave us schematically we thought we’d be able to do some good things and it worked out like we thought it would throughout the game.

 

 

 

Trent used to say the exact opposite when Dick was around.

 

Was it Trent?

 

Was it Dick?

 

Both. Good riddance, too. Trent was never going to be successful due to his limited skills. Dick was never going to be successful due to his stubborness. Gailey cut Trent 4 weeks into the season for underperforming. Maybin is in serious trouble. At least we have a coach that tries all combinations. When has been the last time that we saw over 500 yards of offense, a return from a 10 point defecit to force overtime, and a 350+ yd. passing game? Yes, the defense sucks. Get the D in order and score just 24 PPG and we'll win a few.

[Dan]

"Everybody, the line, the backs and just getting everybody on the same page," said Fitzpatrick. "And there were just certain looks the Ravens gave us schematically we thought we'd be able to do some good things and it worked out like we thought it would throughout the game.

 

 

 

Trent used to say the exact opposite when Dick was around.

 

Was it Trent?

 

Was it Dick?

Trent once said after a TC practice in 2009 (I believe), after looking pretty bad after a night practice; that he just had to get used to playing under all the bright lights with fans yelling.

 

 

Good riddance, too.

[The Big Cat]

Trent once said after a TC practice in 2009 (I believe), after looking pretty bad after a night practice; that he just had to get used to playing under all the bright lights with fans yelling.

 

So you're saying it was Trent and not a shoddy job by the coaching staff to prepare him?

[Dan]

So you're saying it was Trent and not a shoddy job by the coaching staff to prepare him?

Certainly a little of both. However, a much larger portion of the offensive ineptitude has to fall on Trent's shoulders based on the fact that Fitz has come in, twice now, to relieve Trent only to see the offensive production increase. I suppose you could prescribe to the theory that the coaches changed the offense game plan and preparation once Fitz started; but then still, wouldn't that indicate Trent is less than capable.

[RevWarRifleman]

Both. Good riddance, too. Trent was never going to be successful due to his limited skills. Dick was never going to be successful due to his stubborness. Gailey cut Trent 4 weeks into the season for underperforming. Maybin is in serious trouble. At least we have a coach that tries all combinations. When has been the last time that we saw over 500 yards of offense, a return from a 10 point defecit to force overtime, and a 350+ yd. passing game? Yes, the defense sucks. Get the D in order and score just 24 PPG and we'll win a few.

 

 

Eh, even if the defense does improve, better make that 28 pts a game.

[The Big Cat]

Certainly a little of both. However, a much larger portion of the offensive ineptitude has to fall on Trent's shoulders based on the fact that Fitz has come in, twice now, to relieve Trent only to see the offensive production increase. I suppose you could prescribe to the theory that the coaches changed the offense game plan and preparation once Fitz started; but then still, wouldn't that indicate Trent is less than capable.

 

I'm just in a pissy mood at work and want to play the "I told you so game."

 

Granted, Jauron was never going to be crowned World's Country's League's Conference's Team's Greatest Coach, but I often took umbrage at how quick everyone was to spout vitriol about the guy when we obliviously had a crippling deficiency at quarterback. Many MANY times I implored fans here to consider a universe where ANY coach could win with Trent taking snaps.

 

For some perspective:

 

Last year league AVERAGE ppg was 21.4

 

We scored 16.1

 

One more touchdown per game (not a major leap if you implement even a shred of quarterbacking competency) and we're scoring right around league average.

 

Scoring at league average, would have won us four different games, since four of our 10 losses came even when our defense held the opponent below league average. That gives us a record of 10-6 under the much-maligned and "totally hapless" Dick.

 

---OR---

 

Scoring an extra 5 ppg alone would have netted us three more wins, putting the 2009 record at 9-7.

 

Either way, winning seasons. And not in spite of Dick Jauron, but because somebody with just a smidgen of a clue could have been back there throwing.

Edited October 29, 2010 by The Big Cat

[Dan]

I'm just in a pissy mood at work and want to play the "I told you so game."

 

Granted, Jauron was never going to be crowned World's Country's League's Conference's Team's Greatest Coach, but I often took umbrage at how quick everyone was to spout vitriol about the guy when we obliviously had a crippling deficiency at quarterback. Many MANY times I implored fans here to consider a universe where ANY coach could win with Trent taking snaps.

 

For some perspective:

 

Last year league AVERAGE ppg was 21.4

 

We scored 16.1

 

One more touchdown per game (not a major leap if you implement even a shred of quarterback competency) and we're scoring right around league average.

 

Scoring at league average, would have won us four different games, as four of our 10 losses our defense held the opponent below league average. That gives us a record of 10-6 under the much-maligned and "totally hapless" Dick.

 

Scoring an extra 5 ppg alone would have netted us three more wins, putting the 2009 record at 9-7.

 

Either way, winning seasons. And not in spite of Dick Jauron, but because somebody with just a smidgen of a clue could have been back there throwing.

I, personally, gave Jauron a full 3 seasons before I officially gave up on him. Granted, I had my doubts prior to year 4, but held out hope he could turn it around. IMO, Jauron being a bad coached was measured by far more than just poor offensive production. As HC, he couldn't change the culture of losing on the team, he couldn't keep his players healthy, he couldn't make any in-game adjustments, he couldn't motivate or inspire anyone, he couldn't determine which players were starter and which weren't, he couldn't do many of the basic functions of a HC.

 

Gailey, although I'm not in any way whatsoever so sold on, is doing a measurably better job in most all of those categories - already. If he sees his fault in hiring a piss-poor OC and DC, maybe he'll become a decent HC. The jury is very much still out.

Edited October 29, 2010 by Dan

[GaryPinC]

I'm just in a pissy mood at work and want to play the "I told you so game."

 

Granted, Jauron was never going to be crowned World's Country's League's Conference's Team's Greatest Coach, but I often took umbrage at how quick everyone was to spout vitriol about the guy when we obliviously had a crippling deficiency at quarterback. Many MANY times I implored fans here to consider a universe where ANY coach could win with Trent taking snaps.

 

For some perspective:

 

Last year league AVERAGE ppg was 21.4

 

We scored 16.1

 

One more touchdown per game (not a major leap if you implement even a shred of quarterbacking competency) and we're scoring right around league average.

 

Scoring at league average, would have won us four different games, since four of our 10 losses came even when our defense held the opponent below league average. That gives us a record of 10-6 under the much-maligned and "totally hapless" Dick.

 

---OR---

 

Scoring an extra 5 ppg alone would have netted us three more wins, putting the 2009 record at 9-7.

 

Either way, winning seasons. And not in spite of Dick Jauron, but because somebody with just a smidgen of a clue could have been back there throwing.

 

 

You're right, TE's utter failure vindicates Jauron to a small extent but let's not forget Jauron's "play not to lose" conservatism which was infuriating late in close games. Also, Jauron should have been the one to yank Edwards. He looked at all the game films. Anybody who watched Trent play could see the guy wouldn't throw downfield unless the receiver was wide open and Jauron was ok with that. Fewell took care of the problem as soon as he took over. Finally, seems like Jauron got canned in Chicago for pretty much the same reasons he got canned here. It's a shame a decent, intelligent man like Jauron can't learn from his mistakes but that's who he is. The fact that he got fired from here mid-season and couldn't get a coordinator job tells you what the league thought of his head coaching abilities also.

[The Big Cat]

You're right, TE's utter failure vindicates Jauron to a small extent but let's not forget Jauron's "play not to lose" conservatism which was infuriating late in close games. Also, Jauron should have been the one to yank Edwards. He looked at all the game films. Anybody who watched Trent play could see the guy wouldn't throw downfield unless the receiver was wide open and Jauron was ok with that. Fewell took care of the problem as soon as he took over. Finally, seems like Jauron got canned in Chicago for pretty much the same reasons he got canned here. It's a shame a decent, intelligent man like Jauron can't learn from his mistakes but that's who he is. The fact that he got fired from here mid-season and couldn't get a coordinator job tells you what the league thought of his head coaching abilities also.

 

You're right, Trent's benching should have happened much, much sooner, and for that Jauron is to blame.

 

But again, I don't know how we can lay the 'conservatism' at Jauron's feet given the meter-busting level of 'conservatism' (read: incompetence) at which Trent played.

 

Otherwise, I think you're right on the money with everything you've said.

[PDaDdy]

I honestly thought that it was more Ralph and Modrak that was responsible for crowning Trent the king and doing everything in their power to give him the job. We could have brought in SOOO many free agents that were better. Oddly enough the one free agent we did bring in that we thought was a career backup and wasn't up to the task of beating Trent out for the job is now the #2 ranked QB in the entire NFL. Four games is not a season or a career but Fitz is more than a one hit wonder at this point. There is no reason he can't continue to play at a respectable, functional high level if not continue the tear he is on.

 

Fitz is playing so well in fact that some have dared to say that QB is no longer our primary need in the 2011 draft. It will take the rest of the season at least to be able to truly seriously answer that question but so far so good.

[GaryPinC]

You're right, Trent's benching should have happened much, much sooner, and for that Jauron is to blame.

 

But again, I don't know how we can lay the 'conservatism' at Jauron's feet given the meter-busting level of 'conservatism' (read: incompetence) at which Trent played.

 

Otherwise, I think you're right on the money with everything you've said.

 

There are a few other anecdotal things I can add about Jauron and his conservatism. You've got Schonert's comment about Jauron's "Pop Warner" offense after Schonert was fired. Jauron went through 3 offensive coordinators, 2 of them ex-QB's. When I watched the odd game for each of the different OC's, I thought I could see a difference in their style of attack between the 20's. Inside the redzone or when backed up near our goal line the playcalling seemed different, horribly conservative. Then there was all the timeouts we wasted down in or near the red zone. To me, that was Jauron and his OC debating about the playcalling, but I believe Jauron called the shots in the critical areas. Also, Trent's quotes about hearing different things from different coaches. I think this was Jauron's philosophical differences with his OC. Also, before Schonert and Van Pelt got hired people like Lee Evans and Jim Kelly had the odd quote that they liked what each of these OC's was saying they would do with the playcalling. But once these guys got the position there offense wasn't very aggressive. Finally, at one point last year when people were being critical of Edward's checkdowns he had a quote saying that's the way he'd been coached.

 

Sadly, I don't think anyone will ever set the record straight about what really went on there, so we're left to speculate. And when Gailey proved Trent was incompetent I thought the same thing as you, maybe Jauron wasn't that bad a coach. I really don't know but for all the reasons I've posted I think Jauron's incompetence still largely overshadows Trent's (though slightly less). I respect your opinion on the matter though and thought I'd share mine. Thanks for the great discussion!

[It's in My Blood]

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-3/Linemen-protect-well-but-they-tip-cap-to-Fitz/03198867-371a-4181-9dc4-bb8bc338c48a

 

Articles like that give me a whole lotta hope. I just hope my beloved Bills don't let me down for the 567,000 time and lay an egg against the Chiefs.

[It's in My Blood]

I'm just in a pissy mood at work and want to play the "I told you so game."

 

Granted, Jauron was never going to be crowned World's Country's League's Conference's Team's Greatest Coach, but I often took umbrage at how quick everyone was to spout vitriol about the guy when we obliviously had a crippling deficiency at quarterback. Many MANY times I implored fans here to consider a universe where ANY coach could win with Trent taking snaps.

 

For some perspective:

 

Last year league AVERAGE ppg was 21.4

 

We scored 16.1

 

One more touchdown per game (not a major leap if you implement even a shred of quarterbacking competency) and we're scoring right around league average.

 

Scoring at league average, would have won us four different games, since four of our 10 losses came even when our defense held the opponent below league average. That gives us a record of 10-6 under the much-maligned and "totally hapless" Dick.

 

---OR---

 

Scoring an extra 5 ppg alone would have netted us three more wins, putting the 2009 record at 9-7.

 

Either way, winning seasons. And not in spite of Dick Jauron, but because somebody with just a smidgen of a clue could have been back there throwing.

 

Your absolutely right. However , the reason why Dick Jauron is no longer our HC is because he failed to recognize our ineptitude at QB and put Fitz in.

[The Big Cat]

There are a few other anecdotal things I can add about Jauron and his conservatism. You've got Schonert's comment about Jauron's "Pop Warner" offense after Schonert was fired. Jauron went through 3 offensive coordinators, 2 of them ex-QB's. When I watched the odd game for each of the different OC's, I thought I could see a difference in their style of attack between the 20's. Inside the redzone or when backed up near our goal line the playcalling seemed different, horribly conservative. Then there was all the timeouts we wasted down in or near the red zone. To me, that was Jauron and his OC debating about the playcalling, but I believe Jauron called the shots in the critical areas. Also, Trent's quotes about hearing different things from different coaches. I think this was Jauron's philosophical differences with his OC. Also, before Schonert and Van Pelt got hired people like Lee Evans and Jim Kelly had the odd quote that they liked what each of these OC's was saying they would do with the playcalling. But once these guys got the position there offense wasn't very aggressive. Finally, at one point last year when people were being critical of Edward's checkdowns he had a quote saying that's the way he'd been coached.

 

Sadly, I don't think anyone will ever set the record straight about what really went on there, so we're left to speculate. And when Gailey proved Trent was incompetent I thought the same thing as you, maybe Jauron wasn't that bad a coach. I really don't know but for all the reasons I've posted I think Jauron's incompetence still largely overshadows Trent's (though slightly less). I respect your opinion on the matter though and thought I'd share mine. Thanks for the great discussion!

 

 

Trying to determine who was calling the shots is nearly impossible, but one shot we can all agree on (see below) was Jauron's decision to not **** can Edwards before the 2009 season even began.

 

 

Your absolutely right. However , the reason why Dick Jauron is no longer our HC is because he failed to recognize our ineptitude at QB and put Fitz in.

 

I agree.

[Hplarrm]

Interesting article which confirms a couple of things for me:

 

1. The Bills are least a player and a half away from being the OL we want them to be. This assumes:

 

LeVitre continues to develop and is a quality fixture at LG- a good bet.

 

Bell continues to develop and is at least an adequate player at LT- a 50/50 bet- he is a talented athlete who will get even better with time but early injury issues make this a 50/50 shot at best

 

Right tackle is a void that must be filled- right now its Cordero- its a marginal shot I would put at about 10%

 

Hamgartner is smart player from playing at several positions but this simply points to him being a good C with a lot of help and I like him better at G A vet yes but not nearing retirement- 50/50 to be the C we need but 75% to be the G we need

 

Wood- Solid player with great natural healing ability and determination to boot- 75% chance of being the G or C we need.

 

Add a new RT and a swing guy and we are good to go after a year of developing chemistry next year.

 

2. As long as Fitz stays healthy this puts a fork in the killer move of drafting a QB in the 1st.

 

Gailey has a clear MO of taking previously failed QBs and somehow building an O they can fit into to get significant production out of them,

 

As enthralled as some Bills fan are in the notion of drafting a "franchise" QB in the 1st, if we took this route AND the player turned out to Peyton Manning rather than Ryan Leaf, (Joey Harrington, Akili Smith whathisname Oakland wasted a pick on or the cast of many others, drafting a QB in the first would likely be fatal to this team. The sad thing is that this is true even if he worked out to be a great one.

 

Imagine Peyton Manning's first year on his way to a brilliant career but then do this without the significant investment Indy had made in their OL even before Manning got there. Even with his quick release he led Indy to the same record with him as without him (which allowed them to get Edgerrin, Dungy, the best kicker in the NFL and the other pieces the best GM in the NFL put together so they could win it once. In the face of reality folks seem to want to claim it is only about the QB. Actually it is only about the TEAM.

 

Gailey's history is one of getting production out of journeymen QBs who have seen a lot of games. I think it is even doubtful a rookie QB survives behind this line no matter how talented he is.