Geno Smith's Arm Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 I really think that they could and should just hire they kids who play FB in the NCAA, the whole system needs to change, stop the scholarships and pay them outright. It has been and always will be a scam waiting to happen. It could be set up like hockey and just have a farm league under the NFL and a college system together. Hell if they did it internationally and put teams in sense-able places that might support American football global expansion would be much easier. I am thinking like Australia, NZ, Mexico, Canada, England and Germany any place that has a kind of football sport like Rugby or proximity to the US, should be considered for this kind of plan. The NFL is supporting the NCAA in this system as it is now to their own detriment. No one think creatively when there are static-quos and monopolies tho. As long as the laws in this country don't criminalize the NFL monopoly, we are held hostage and nothing changes it. There's no reason why it couldn't be considered a "School Job". The schools don't want to give up the money, and will put up smoke screens forever to keep it the way it is. As far as Reggie Bush is concerned, the real reason he got aught was because he tried to scam the agent. He brought it on himself, and of course the school.
loserlovers Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 this argument blaming D1 schools for making money off kids is ridiculous. Do those kids pay for the stadium and whole infrastructure that it takes to run a football program? No, they run and jump and catch a ball. They are the lowest men on the totem poll but since they are "stars" you act like they are slaves or something. They chose in this free country to play and get a free education and move on to big paydays after college. They get free housing food and other perks too. should this be different from every other business in the US where people who do the work get a small paycheck and the owner reaps the rewards? Its called investment and rewarding risk. Running around with a ball does not justify them being payed while in college, they could all chose to quit if its such a bad deal, why dont they? Why do famous actors start out as waiters and take bit parts for almost no money? SHould we pay janitors and bus drivers millions too, we couldnt have schools without them. And Dont we all have to work our way up? Where is this world you live in where everyone makes millions just for doing their part? Id go back to college right now and live their lives and I have a decent job and salary.
Ozymandius Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Nobody is saying to pay them millions. But about $500 a month would seem to go a long ways for some of these kids. Regular students that work in the school library get paid, right? On the other hand, athletes that perform much more valuable work (in terms of $$$) to the university don't get paid.
Mr. WEO Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Except they're not actual students, but are a money machine for the school. The difference them and the wealthy alumni is that the star athlete contributes millions to the school coffers between 18-22, not after 50. So what? What are their other opportunites? They can play for a big time football program and maybe end up in the NFL. If that doesn't happen, they can have what a tiny percentage of kids get in this country--a completey free college education and can begin their adult life debt free. What's the downside? Thanks for showing complete ignorance on how college"academics" work. The universities reap untold millions from the students, all while making it nearly impossible to play on a D-I team and actually pay enough attention to class to get a worthwhile degree. As for the giant signing bonuses, sure thats great for the 30-40 players that good money from the draft. But what about the other 8,000 D-I football players? So, in one post you say these guys show up to college with no plan on studying--in fact with the expectation that someone else will do the work for them. Then you say football makes it too hard for them to study. OK. Nobody is saying to pay them millions. But about $500 a month would seem to go a long ways for some of these kids. Regular students that work in the school library get paid, right? On the other hand, athletes that perform much more valuable work (in terms of $$$) to the university don't get paid. The kid in the library is not getting free tuition room and board. He likely actually has to study and succeed in college so he can go make a living to pay off his student loans.
BuffaloWings Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 where do you think Modrak gets all of his top flight info from Why do you even say that? It's not like even Modrak took any of Kiper's suggestions.
Fezmid Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 The kid in the library is not getting free tuition room and board. He likely actually has to study and succeed in college so he can go make a living to pay off his student loans. And the argument that these kids aren't real students, aren't really studying, etc, is lame -- yeah, many of them may be CHOOSING not to study. But that's a choice. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make 'em drink.
Ozymandius Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 The kid in the library is not getting free tuition room and board. He likely actually has to study and succeed in college so he can go make a living to pay off his student loans. Athletic scholarships are not the only kind given by a university. The kid in the library could've earned an academic scholarship given by either the university or an independent entity. Of course, it is tough to earn any scholarship -- athletic, academic, or otherwise.
Ramius Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 (edited) So, in one post you say these guys show up to college with no plan on studying--in fact with the expectation that someone else will do the work for them. Then you say football makes it too hard for them to study. OK. Yes. A large number of players simply show up and are the BMOC and expect everything to be done with them. There's also another subset of players who want to study and actually make something of themselves, and find it very difficult to succeed. I've been in the room when the Dean basically told an FSU recruit's handlers that its simply not possible for the kid to be both on the football team and to be able to graduate with an engineering undergrad degree. Football players are essentially limited to choosing from a handful of majors...that is, the ones that actually care about an education. I shouldn't have expected you to understand this, as you are normally incapable of any type of critical thought. So there, i broke it down for you. I'd recommend having someone read the first couple of sentences to you, then perhaps take a nap and regain your strength before you try to wrap your lump of gray matter around the final few sentences. Edited October 13, 2010 by Ramius
Fezmid Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Yes. A large number of players simply show up and are the BMOC and expect everything to be done with them. There's also another subset of players who want to study and actually make something of themselves, and find it very difficult to succeed. I've been in the room when the Dean basically told an FSU recruit's handlers that its simply not possible for the kid to be both on the football team and to be able to graduate with an engineering undergrad degree. Football players are essentially limited to choosing from a handful of majors...that is, the ones that actually care about an education. That's BS. There were a couple of guys from the Gophers football team in my physics classes at the U of Minnesota. I don't know if they were on a scholarship or not, but they were obviously studying and on the football team. (I'm not questioning what happened, I'm saying that it's bogus for anyone to say that to the students). Is it harder to do football and study for a "real" degree? Yes. Is it a choice the kids make if they decide to party and screw around instead of study? Yes. EDIT: Interesting link on Robert Smith. Kind of echos what you said, although Smith just quit and went into the NFL, then quit the NFL to go back to school. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1140635/index.htm
Mr. WEO Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Yes. A large number of players simply show up and are the BMOC and expect everything to be done with them. There's also another subset of players who want to study and actually make something of themselves, and find it very difficult to succeed. I've been in the room when the Dean basically told an FSU recruit's handlers that its simply not possible for the kid to be both on the football team and to be able to graduate with an engineering undergrad degree. Football players are essentially limited to choosing from a handful of majors...that is, the ones that actually care about an education. I shouldn't have expected you to understand this, as you are normally incapable of any type of critical thought. So there, i broke it down for you. I'd recommend having someone read the first couple of sentences to you, then perhaps take a nap and regain your strength before you try to wrap your lump of gray matter around the final few sentences. So how would giving money to these students change any of this? Anyway, you are now saying that it's impossible for a football player to graduate with an engineering degree---and that they are "limited" to certain less strenuous degree programs. Nonsense. Maybe that is true at "FSU"--but that is likely also true for any undergrad at that school. Smart athletes can and do succeed in rigorous academic pursuits. Some free advice: you should stay away from condescension--you're just not clever enough to convincingly pull it off. You should stick with the strong moves in your limited repertoire--like, say, gay bashing. You're pretty good at that kind of stuff.
Fezmid Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Some free advice: you should stay away from condescension--you're just not clever enough to convincingly pull it off. You should stick with the strong moves in your limited repertoire--like, say, gay bashing. You're pretty good at that kind of stuff.
buffaloaggie Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 He was always suspect, but his ranking Claussen as the best QB proves he was on the take!!! This fact alone should be damning enough to fry Kiper. ESPN needs to fire him. The NFL obviously listens closely to Kiper judging from Clausen's freefall.
Ramius Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Yeah, i dont get that either. I guess its ok to make up outrageous lies about someone else when you're backed into a corner.
Bill from NYC Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 Yeah, i dont get that either. I guess its ok to make up outrageous lies about someone else when you're backed into a corner. This stuff is as old as the hills. Neccessary Roughness Scroll down and check out the description. The entire system is hypocritical and has been for many decades.
Ramius Posted October 13, 2010 Posted October 13, 2010 So how would giving money to these students change any of this? Anyway, you are now saying that it's impossible for a football player to graduate with an engineering degree---and that they are "limited" to certain less strenuous degree programs. Nonsense. Maybe that is true at "FSU"--but that is likely also true for any undergrad at that school. Smart athletes can and do succeed in rigorous academic pursuits. Your argument was that the money given to them was in form of a scholarship. My point was that the scholarship is worthless. There's not enough time for 99.9% of D-I athletes to pursue a rigorous course of studies and spend the necessary amount of time weight training, practicing, etc. I've seen it happen as an undergrad at a school with a D-I hockey team, and i've seen and heard it happen down here. Paying the players is necessary because the NCAA exploits the collegiate player for untold millions, and these guys can't even get $10 to buy a pizza.
Mr. WEO Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 Yeah, i dont get that either. I guess its ok to make up outrageous lies about someone else when you're backed into a corner. Not sure what corner you imagine me cornered in, but your history here regarding that penchant of yours is as lengthy as it is revealing/ironic. Anyway, I really don't care if they pay these guys outright, I guess. The whole Reggie Bush affair was nonsense. He had no on-field advantage knowing his moms had a nice apartment to live in. Your contention that 99.9% of college football players are forced into meaningless degree programs is unconvincing and likely something you simply made up.
boyst Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 Amazing, ESPN looks kind of bad in this, you know they'd never put this article out there. The whole thing is a work in so many ways.
Corp000085 Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 Great read. This guy's story confirms what we all have known for a while. It'll be interesting to watch the fall out, if there is any, and to see if this Luchs guy fluffed the piece at all.
Ramius Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 Not sure what corner you imagine me cornered in, but your history here regarding that penchant of yours is as lengthy as it is revealing/ironic. Anyway, I really don't care if they pay these guys outright, I guess. The whole Reggie Bush affair was nonsense. He had no on-field advantage knowing his moms had a nice apartment to live in. Your contention that 99.9% of college football players are forced into meaningless degree programs is unconvincing and likely something you simply made up. I'm bashing you because you're an idiot, not because you're gay.
GG Posted October 14, 2010 Posted October 14, 2010 So what? What are their other opportunites? They can play for a big time football program and maybe end up in the NFL. If that doesn't happen, they can have what a tiny percentage of kids get in this country--a completey free college education and can begin their adult life debt free. What's the downside? So, in one post you say these guys show up to college with no plan on studying--in fact with the expectation that someone else will do the work for them. Then you say football makes it too hard for them to study. OK. The kid in the library is not getting free tuition room and board. He likely actually has to study and succeed in college so he can go make a living to pay off his student loans. This is a perspective if you think that the primary objective of most D-I players is to attend college vs getting a shot for the pros, and that's where your argument falls apart. The kid in the library is there because he wants the degree which he needs for his future job. Plus, that kid in the library probably gets paid for that work, or he can get another work-study job or even better - a real paid internship, while still on a full scholarship if he's a smart kid. But god forbid that star football players who are directly responsible for filling 100,000 seats at $50/pop religiously on Saturdays can't earn a dime. If the NFL or NBA had junior leagues like NHL or MLB, you wouldn't have as many kids going to college. Why do you think star b-ball players only play 1 or 2 yrs of NCAA ball? Would football players stay the minimum three years if the courts sided with Maurice Clarett? Hypocrisy, thy name is NCAA.
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