A Cry For Honesty in Discussing Bills Players

[Wizard]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

[cåblelady]

omg........

[marauderswr80]

nice post....but with all the facts you bring, all I find myself doing is pointing the finger at the front office who brought these guys in and made the moves to get them here. Nothing will change unless ownership changes.

[Dr. Fong]

I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?"

 

Wang was born in Virginia, not China. Just in the interest of "honesty."

[Punch]

I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

Based on your roster assessment, today is not that day.

[Billy in 4C]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

 

+1. And if you get drunk enough she might look like a 7 or 8 - good enough to look at for 3 hours once per week.

 

Disagree on Williams though - it's not his fault the LBs suck.

[evilbuffalobob]

My rhelm of experience with 4's is that they suck and generally swallow. Still though, they can't even do that well. It's like they suck, but can't suck well enough.

 

Pretty good post, but I think we'd see Kyle Williams excell as the NT if he had any sort of help. He hammered a couple of Pats reaLLY f'ing hard yesterday. Lil Dante laid a couple of licks too. If we had won the game, would you have felt the need to post this?

[The Dean]

So, apparently "honesty" is being negative.

 

And "True Statements" are clearly statements of opinion.

 

Wizard, indeed.

[Bob in STL]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

 

 

Decent evaluation.

 

I think that Evans is good, getting rid of him just create another huge hole.

 

Kyle Williams would be a great swing lineman but we need a stud NT to make the 3-4 work.

 

Teams with great 3-4 defenses have lots of good LBs. We sure don't.

 

Bell is progressing too. He is not a converted TE.

Edited September 28, 2010 by Bob in STL

[Hapless Bills Fan]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

Well, just gag me with a spoon. Here I thought I was about to read me a really high-falutin' standard-setting example.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

So which are you after? Honest opinions and discussion or dressing up your opinions by stating them as facts ("true statements")

I don't have a quarrel with your opinions; based on observations and the facts that we have, they're not unreasonable.

 

I've seen too many similar "true statements" in football that seemed reasonable....until they were proven to be so much ca-ca.

 

The truth is, no one really knows what Brohm is or could be, 'cuz he really hasn't played enough to show one way or the other.

It's reasonable to have the opinion he may have potential, based on how just over-the-top talented the GB #1 and #2 are and on Brohm's collegiate record.

It's reasonable to have the opinion he's not a starter, based on lack of impact and "wow!" factor in the game glimpses we've had of him.

 

I could perform a similar dissection on the rest of your "truths" but why.

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

 

This goes beyond "gag me with a spoon" and straight into "pitch me with a fork!"

Somehow it reminds me of the joke about the gas grill and the middle-aged wife.

Move along now!

[uncle flap]

Decent evaluation.

 

I think that Evans is good, getting rid of him just create another huge hole.

 

Kyle Williams would be a great swing lineman but we need a stud NT to make the 3-4 work.

 

Teams with great 3-4 defenses have lots of good LBs. We sure don't.

 

Bell is progressing too. He is not a converted TE.

 

I agree that evans is good, but i think we should trade him now - for as many draft picks/prospects possible - while he has value. by the time the bills' right the ship, evans will be old and maybe have lost a step. as the op noted, we have so many weak positions but a wr's status is instantly upgraded with a solid qb. getting rid of evans creates a huge talent hole, but in the scope of the whole team, it's not that big of a deal. i'd much rather lack at wr than ol, lb, or dl.

 

while williams is no 'stud' nt, he does a great job and i think his performance doesn't detract from the 3-4. of course a better player would make the defense as a whole better, but he's one of our better players on d.

 

and i too have noticed bell's progression, let's hope he keeps it up.

[Typical TBD Guy]

So, apparently "honesty" is being negative.

 

And "True Statements" are clearly statements of opinion.

 

Wizard, indeed.

 

 

 

His analysis is evidently as shallow as his personality.

 

All he really did was assemble and regurgitate all the hackneyed, negative talking points from this message board: QB's suck, Evans is overrated, tackles suck, Hangartner sucks, Stroud is old, Williams is too small to play NT, Kelsay sucks, Maybin sucks, Poz always gets injured, etc...

 

But to top it all off, he resorts to objectifying women as nothing more than their sum physical beauty, rated on a quantitative scale for our convenience.

[Johnny Coli]

Can someone please point out which posters on this sports message board haven't been completely honest? I need to know who's opinion I can trust.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I edited your post so we can talk about the Bills players as they really are, I excluded all the nonfactual stuff to help your quest for truth.

 

QB: Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year.

WR: Lee...He is fast and has good hands;

LT: Bell is related to Karl Malone, Bell is not Peters, we won't catch lightning in a bottle

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina

TE: Nelson is fast

NT: Kyle Williams is a white guy. He was picked in the latter rounds

LB's: Kelsay is a captain. Maybin is fast

Edited September 28, 2010 by over 20 years of fanhood

[mob16151]

This was definitely a "cry" by the OP.

[evilbuffalobob]

I edited your post so we can talk about the Bills players as they really are, I excluded all the nonfactual stuff to help your quest for truth.

 

LMFAO

 

The main fact is that Williams is a White Guy, ain't no way to change it... it be just the way it is.

[DC Tom]

Can someone please point out which posters on this sports message board haven't been completely honest? I need to know who's opinion I can trust.

 

I'm an inveterate liar. Don't trust anything I post.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

It all started with the "can't wait to see Brian Brohm threads" and "Fitzpatrick just might be the answer at QB comments." I would love to have a day where a true and intelligent discussion can take place that honestly presents one's opinion in harmony with what skill/ability level the Bills currently have in players on their roster.

 

I'll go first.

 

True Statement: The Bills are a QB, LT, C, RT, TE, 2 WR's, a legitimate NT, a DE, and 2 LB's (one inside and one outside) from being an elite level football team. Now...let's have true statements about the positions of need

 

QB: Ryan Fitzpatrick has more guts than Edwards. Brian Brohm may be capable of starting a few games in Fitzpatrick's place for the Bills this year. Otherwise, both are career backups (nothing more than that..period)

 

WR: It was a huge mistake to sign Lee Evans to a long-term deal. He is fast and has good hands; otherwise, he has been a huge disappointment the last five years. Roscoe Parrish is fun to watch but will never be more than a #3. The other WR's are feel good stories, but there is less than a 10% chance that any of the receivers (including the beloved Steve Johnson) are going to be legitimate #1 or #2 starters in this league.

 

LT: It is nice that Bell is related to Karl Malone, and we all wish he had his dad's talent, but Bell is not Peters (so as much as it hurts) we won't catch lightning in a bottle twice and have a TE become converted to a solid LT. We have no viable LT or LT prospect on our roster. And, for those that say Wang is a legitimate LT, I reply, "how many LT's have been drafted in the NFL from China in the 5th round?" Be honest...Wang, Meredith, Bell, and the other guys are not real LT's.

 

C: Hangartner was a starter in Carolina (when the team was a little better). He really isn't a starter but the o-line is so bad that he occasionally looks serviceable. The truth is he is nothing more than a backup. It's like holding onto a girlfriend that is a "6" hoping she'll become a "7" but the truth is...she doesn't have it in her...and you know (deep down inside that you honestly haven't had anything better than a "6" and won't...so you are stuck with her.

 

RT: Cornell Green sucks...He's old and useless, but he probably is the Bills second or third best tackle on the team.

 

TE: The Bills haven't had a legitimate TE in about 10-12 years. Nelson is fast but he'll never be a good blocker (a desperate need with a terrible o-line), and Stupar and other TE's are just waiver-wire guys that good franchises didn't have room for.

 

NT: We love Kyle Williams because he is a hardworking, overachieving, white guy who is a blue collar player. He was picked in the latter rounds, and his motor is consistent. He's gritty. He's a solid rotational guy, but he isn't ever going to be a solid NT. He's much better as a DE in a 4-3.

 

DE: Edwards and Stroud are solid backups but they aren't particularly good at anything anymore (other than leadership or nice guy personalities)

 

LB's: Some people are still delusional thinking Kelsay is worthwhile. Note: If you think Kelsay is a good player (you should be banned from this board for the season). Again, we like him because he has "stuck with the team, is a captain, a nice guy, and is "gritty." Poz is okay but is nothing more than what he is...an injury prone reach LB that we all hoped was Shane Conlan 2.0. Davis was a nice pickup because we can't get anyone. The rest of the LB's really are nothing more than backups. Maybin is what he is...Yes...he is fast...but we hate to admit it inside, but he is....__________________ (something with the words bust...useless....one dimensional are appropriate)

 

 

So deep down....keep in mind that the Bills really are what you know they are rather than what you hope they are.... So, if that is true (and it is), please stop with the Brian Brohm or Ryan Fitzpatrick chants...And, yes...Chan Gailey is an upgrade over Jauron and Nix is an upgrade over (whoever that marketing guy pretending to know football guy is).

 

But again, the Bills are a girl rated as a "4". She's chunky, some stretch marks, some staining on her teeth, etc. but you've been with her for years and she occasionally shows flashes of excitement. The same is true for the Bills offense, defense, and for the franchise. While I commend everyone for their "faithfulness, fidelity, integrity, and loyalty" to your "4", let's talk about the Bills players as they really are.

 

 

i honestly think it's presumptuous of you to assume that everyone who likes kyle williams likes him because he's a white guy. i honestly think it's presumptuous of you to assume other people are not honest because they have an opinion that might conflict with yours. i honestly think it's a mistake to try and sound like you're the voice of reason when you toss in a self-serving and unverifiable statement like "there is less than a 10% chance...". i honestly think the poster who pointed out that Wang wasn't born in China was honestly correct. and i honestly am not sure if the girl scale you're using is based on a 5 or a 10 and honestly that makes a big difference.

 

oh, and i honestly think you make some decent points otherwise.

[Mr. WEO]

 

 

 

But to top it all off, he resorts to objectifying women as nothing more than their sum physical beauty, rated on a quantitative scale for our convenience.

Nice avitar.

[bowery4]

Dude, you talking about your wife, your Mom, or your sister? Come on, tell the truth.