Again, ignoring the QB and OL situation will doom us this year...

[Merle Haggard]

 

 

 

 

I wanted Clausen too, particularly in the second. Still do. But whatever else you can say about Clausen, he wouldn't have saved us this year. That just wouldn't have happened.

 

Yet your headline says that it dooms us this year.

 

Read my headline again guy - ignoring our two biggest glaring weaknesses - the QB position AND the offensive line doomed us. Sure we have other issues, but for pete's sake if you don't have a QB and an OL you are not going to win squat.

 

I was talking about fans rooting for the team to win. I was not talking about the players on the field. They would be crazy to play to lose so that the team has as chance to draft a player better than them to replace each with.

As a fan, I do not want my team winning meaningless games in December if it costs them the #1 pick in a year when an impact player is available. I would never expect the players to want to lose. On a bad team, they're fighting for their professional lives.

 

I will never cheer for the Bills to lose. Regardless of the situation. Never.

[DanInUticaTampa]

Great, another QB sucks thread.

 

If only we did get mcnabb and shanny, we would have won this past game. Even though trent/gailey threw one TD more than mcnabb/shanny this past weekend. OH!

 

Let's face it, this team is going to be pretty doom and mediocre this year. If you think that is all trent's fault, you are just blind. There are so many things about our offense that sucks you cannot put the blame on edwards and the oline alone. We have mediocre/developing recievers and a very weak TE group.

 

Not to mention, the oline (besides green) played very well against a VERY tough miami Dline. I was expecting much worse from Bell.

[Van_phelaN1]

I disagree. You do play the win. That means you get the best players, best coaches and build a winning philosphy. You never lay down on the field. Never. Having actually played the game (college level)trust me that Lombardi's words will always ring true - "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing".

Laying down in December just for a high draft pick is not an option. The day that happens is the day our fan base should abandon this team. You play to win.

I have read through a lot of this post and I have to say, you are a little too quick to bash fellow fans about their opinions based on some posts that you have read. What makes your decisions correct? If we want to improve, this whole team needs to get better. Sam Bradford isn't guaranteed to be an elite QB in this league. I am not saying you are wrong. I agree there could have been more done to address the issues facing this team but I think Chan wants to start all over from scratch. In a few years I will be surprised if more than 25 percent of this roster is the same. It is okay to get fed up, but what were you expecting would happen?

[Roc Bronson]

I often wonder why any of you guys are not the GM or Head coach of the Bills.. Maybe we wouldn't have these issues to complain about. We was dealt a bad hand deal with it or become a fan of a winning organization...

[Merle Haggard]

Great, another QB sucks thread.

 

If only we did get mcnabb and shanny, we would have won this past game. Even though trent/gailey threw one TD more than mcnabb/shanny this past weekend. OH!

 

Let's face it, this team is going to be pretty doom and mediocre this year. If you think that is all trent's fault, you are just blind. There are so many things about our offense that sucks you cannot put the blame on edwards and the oline alone. We have mediocre/developing recievers and a very weak TE group.

 

Not to mention, the oline (besides green) played very well against a VERY tough miami Dline. I was expecting much worse from Bell.

 

Glad your delighted with the status quo, i.e. losing. I'm not. We looked as crappy as any team who doesn't have a QB or OL. After all these years of losing, you'd think we would have at least lucked into getting a few stars. Unreal.

 

I often wonder why any of you guys are not the GM or Head coach of the Bills.. Maybe we wouldn't have these issues to complain about. We was dealt a bad hand deal with it or become a fan of a winning organization...

 

Well one thing is for sure, "one of us guys" couldn't do much worse that what we've seen over the past decade or so.

 

I have read through a lot of this post and I have to say, you are a little too quick to bash fellow fans about their opinions based on some posts that you have read. What makes your decisions correct? If we want to improve, this whole team needs to get better. Sam Bradford isn't guaranteed to be an elite QB in this league. I am not saying you are wrong. I agree there could have been more done to address the issues facing this team but I think Chan wants to start all over from scratch. In a few years I will be surprised if more than 25 percent of this roster is the same. It is okay to get fed up, but what were you expecting would happen?

 

Disagreeing with my fellow Bills' nation compadres is hardly "bashing". I make no apologies to my passion and frustration with our "culture of losing". Oh, and I've seen enough to know that the decisions at OBD certainly are not working.

 

Again, the jury is still out on Gailey. He hasn't been a headcoach for a long, long time and was fired from his last gig. He was a risky choice, which I'm okay with. However, he will not get an indefinite free pass if we do not start seeing some sort of improvement. Unfortunately, without a QB and an offensive line, his chances of success will be a challenge. Let's hope he can "coach up" our roster of midling players. Sigh.

[Paup 1995MVP]

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

We had NO business drafting Spiller when we had two excellent RB's and can always find someone decent one off the street (J. Bell) If we absolutely hated Davis or Bulaga, we should have tried our hardest to trade down and draft one of them at a spot that was more in line with their supposed value. We still could have than taken Clausen in the 2nd round and probably Troup as well with the extra picks taken. I would have even taken Brandon Graham at 9 over Spiller. Nix was just being stupid. Clausen was easily worth the risk in the 2nd round. We have noone who can play OT or QB on the roster. (Although I think we will be much, thats right I said it, much better with Fitzie starting) Nix's draft made no sense. You don't just ignore your biggest needs. Simple as that Sandy.

[Merle Haggard]

We had NO business drafting Spiller when we had two excellent RB's and can always find someone decent one off the street (J. Bell) If we absolutely hated Davis or Bulaga, we should have tried our hardest to trade down and draft one of them at a spot that was more in line with their supposed value. We still could have than taken Clausen in the 2nd round and probably Troup as well with the extra picks taken. I would have even taken Brandon Graham at 9 over Spiller. Nix was just being stupid. Clausen was easily worth the risk in the 2nd round. We have noone who can play OT or QB on the roster. (Although I think we will be much, thats right I said it, much better with Fitzie starting) Nix's draft made no sense. You don't just ignore your biggest needs. Simple as that Sandy.

 

I agree with all you say above except the part about Fitz. He may be better than Edwards, but that ain't saying much. He certainly wouldn't start with any other team. It was madness to do nothing about the QB and OL.

[Benjamin Barker]

You guys ever hear the phrase "nobody likes an I told you so"? Why are you telling us? We didn't do it. Write a letter to Ralph or something.

 

I don't know, some people do kinda like a good, old fashioned "I told you so"

[Merle Haggard]

I don't know, some people do kinda like a good, old fashioned "I told you so"

 

Interesting how some around here dismissed the concerns of many of us when the OBD folks ignored the QB and OL situation this offseason. They were in a state of denial and appear to still be. Weird.

Edited September 15, 2010 by Merle Haggard

[Merle Haggard]

Why do we continue to not address our obvious needs?

[Bill from NYC]

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

 

I agree with both of you to an extent. They didn't want to trade down and were hell bent on drafting Spiller, a running back, so in this sense Merle is correct. With extra picks, they could have done more at other positions, especially the OL.

 

As for the above, let's hope that Spiller is what he is being sold as. But even if he is, they absolutely must address the OL. and more than likely the QB position next season. The BPA theory doesn'y fly (IMO) as well on a team with no foundation. Like you seem to, I pretty much give them a pass this season because they did make an effort to fortify the defensive front, and I appreciate this.

 

Sadly, the Bills will be drafting very early next season. They will have a shot at building a solid foundation. If they do not, we will lose for another decade or so. At least Levy/Mauron aren't here to screw it up.

[billsfreak]

We were doomed this year before those decisions were made. We were a lousy team last year, not a team that was close to having the switch click on. That was a mirage. We had many huge holes and there was no way we were going to be good this year. No way.

 

We are rebuilding. This shouldn't have been obvious just now. It's been obvious for years that we desperately needed a rebuild, whether or not we actually went through with it. The good thing is that Gailey and Nix obviously knew it. You can't come out and say it in the modern world where you have to sell tickets, but their quotes have shown as clearly as reasonably possible that they knew they were rebuilding.

 

The QB and OL situation won't doom us this year. The QB and OL situation and the switch from the 4 - 3 to the 3 - 4 and the WR situation and the DL situation and our utter lack of OLBs and our mediocre ILBs and the time it takes for teams to learn a new system and get used to it and the fact that our OL still needs a season or so for the young guys to get experience and the whole group to gel and the fact that it takes a year or so in a serious Strength and Conditioning program to repair the damage from the lousy S&C program we've had since Rusty Jones left, not just two months or so, and the fact that we don't have any real locker room leaders ... and frankly, there's more ... all those things, all of them together, will doom us this year.

 

But the ones among us who are more realistic have known this for months. Why didn't you know it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wanted Clausen too, particularly in the second. Still do. But whatever else you can say about Clausen, he wouldn't have saved us this year. That just wouldn't have happened.

 

Yet your headline says that it dooms us this year.

You are correct in both highlighted areas, but the truth is, for every year you delay filling the two most important positions on the offense, if not the entire team, it is another year that you delay any respectability returning to your franchise. It happens once in a blue moon that an QB or LT comes in and saves the day as a rookie, both positions take a few seasons, normally, to adjust to the speed of the NFL game. Clausen wouldn't have saved us this year, but he would moved us one season closer to being decent, and a losing season, as we all know is a long one.

[bowery4]

Interesting how some around here dismissed the concerns of many of us when the OBD folks ignored the QB and OL situation this offseason. They were in a state of denial and appear to still be. Weird.

 

 

"I told you so" might be in order around week 12 and on at the earliest (and only about this season as you can't use it about the future). This is not a 1 year project anyone who thinks so has their heads looking up somewhere at a whole lot of brown. IT WAS ONE GAME!!!!! They will see what they have and what is salvageable.

 

Bill is right they improved where they thought that they could in the offseason this year on the D. Last year they made some nice picks on the Oline and even D backfield.

 

I know it has been 10 years I been through it too, I have my own criticisms of the job they did but playmakers are a NEED we have NO star players. CJ is supposed to fill that role. ML's contract is up in 2012, Fred is going to last a few/couple years. It was a good pick as he was BPA. I think if you are going to doubt a choice Troop would be it but that was also a need.

 

It is not denial to realize ones limitations some things had to be addressed according to who is the best option too address those needs. The uncertainty of 2011 no doubt had a role in what happened too. You can"t expect the to fix it all in one season, this team has at least of 4 years before of very bad management. We have one player from drafts 7 years ago, 1 and it is Chris Kelsey.

 

I'm still excited about this and next year. Even if they don't win a lot. I think we will see progress. That is what I am looking for. Rome wasn't built in a day.

[Doc]

There were no real options at QB or on the O-line in the draft or FA. The Bills will have to dance with who they brought, and so far Trent is showing that he's the same as he ever was.

[Merle Haggard]

You are correct in both highlighted areas, but the truth is, for every year you delay filling the two most important positions on the offense, if not the entire team, it is another year that you delay any respectability returning to your franchise. It happens once in a blue moon that an QB or LT comes in and saves the day as a rookie, both positions take a few seasons, normally, to adjust to the speed of the NFL game. Clausen wouldn't have saved us this year, but he would moved us one season closer to being decent, and a losing season, as we all know is a long one.

 

Exactly.

Why is this so hard for some around here to understand?

[R. Rich]

There were no real options at QB or on the O-line in the draft or FA. The Bills will have to dance with who they brought, and so far Trent is showing that he's the same as he ever was.

 

 

Sure there was.

 

The Bills could've traded their first and second round picks to Carolina for Jake Delhomme. Then, they could've shipped the third and fourth picks to St. Louis for Alex Barron. That way, they'd have a pair of veteran players to fix some huge needs for the offense. Who needs early draft picks when your team "sucks"?

[Malazan]

How many times does it have to be said:

 

1) A football team is not a cure for your depression or 'feeling sick'. You need to see a professional about that.

 

2) That if a player of value is not available in a position of need when you're trying to rebuild then you don't select him and take the best player you can get.

 

 

 

This is not a difficult concept to grasp. If you have a 'bad' player at right tackle and take a 'marginally less bad' player at right tackle. You still have a bad right tackle.

 

Instead, you take the best players that you can get. This allows you to have good football players all over. This philosophy has not been adhered to for the Bills so it takes more than one year which is recognized by the current regime. Honestly, it should be obvious to anyone with a pulse. However, I understand how personal depression skews things.

[uncle flap]

How many times does it have to be said:

 

1) A football team is not a cure for your depression or 'feeling sick'. You need to see a professional about that.

 

2) That if a player of value is not available in a position of need when you're trying to rebuild then you don't select him and take the best player you can get.

 

 

 

This is not a difficult concept to grasp. If you have a 'bad' player at right tackle and take a 'marginally less bad' player at right tackle. You still have a bad right tackle.

 

Instead, you take the best players that you can get. This allows you to have good football players all over. This philosophy has not been adhered to for the Bills so it takes more than one year which is recognized by the current regime. Honestly, it should be obvious to anyone with a pulse. However, I understand how personal depression skews things.

[gobillsinytown]

How many times does it have to be said:

 

1) A football team is not a cure for your depression or 'feeling sick'. You need to see a professional about that.

 

2) That if a player of value is not available in a position of need when you're trying to rebuild then you don't select him and take the best player you can get.

 

 

 

This is not a difficult concept to grasp. If you have a 'bad' player at right tackle and take a 'marginally less bad' player at right tackle. You still have a bad right tackle.

 

Instead, you take the best players that you can get. This allows you to have good football players all over. This philosophy has not been adhered to for the Bills so it takes more than one year which is recognized by the current regime. Honestly, it should be obvious to anyone with a pulse. However, I understand how personal depression skews things.

 

+1, especially the part about taking professional football too seriously.

[reddogblitz]

I would trade Troupe for Clausen in a New York heartbeat.

 

I wanted us to do what Cleveland did. Flush the lame QBs we got and bring in Jake Delhomme off the waiver wire and trade a low pick for Seneca Wallace. We blew it, big time.