Again, ignoring the QB and OL situation will doom us this year...

[Merle Haggard]

Sorry guys, I remain hopping mad that we ignored the QB and OL this past offseason. I have said it will cost us dearly, and it is turning out I am correct. I'm hard pressed to find any team we can beat at this juncture. I'm hard pressed to find any other team that would even start our mediocre QBs. The stinkin' fins threw our guys around like rag dolls. Pathetic.

 

Now I know some of you guys will howl, "but Merle, there was nobody available so we were smart to pass on a QB and OLmen." To this I say hogwash. We could have traded a pick or two for some talented vets that certainly would be better than wha twe have now.

 

As for Gailey, the jury is still out. To say the team looked "rusty" is an understatement. He was a risky selection, let's hope he pays off. Rest assured I will not continue to give him a free pass if we look as gawd awful as we did last week.

Edited September 15, 2010 by Merle Haggard

[akm0404]

The Bills will win at least a couple games, but it is perfectly reasonable to assume that they will be an underdog in every game they play this season.

 

But yeah, it's pretty much scientifically proven that you can't consistently compete in the NFL without an elite-level quarterback leading the team. We're in limbo until we get lucky and get one, which will be difficult seeing how we aren't really trying.

[Merle Haggard]

The Bills will win at least a couple games, but it is perfectly reasonable to assume that they will be an underdog in every game they play this season.

 

But yeah, it's pretty much scientifically proven that you can't consistently compete in the NFL without an elite-level quarterback leading the team. We're in limbo until we get lucky and get one, which will be difficult seeing how we aren't really trying.

 

The thought of only winning a couple of games this season makes me fit the puke. I'm sick of us standing shoulder to shoulder with the celler dwellers of the NFL.

Edited September 15, 2010 by Merle Haggard

[Koufax]

Sorry guys, I remain hopping mad that we ignored the QB and OL this past offseason. I have said it will cost us dearly, and it is turning out I am correct. I'm hard pressed to find any team we can beat at this juncture. I'm hard pressed to find any other team that would even start our mediocre QBs. The stinkin' fins threw our guys around like rag dolls. Pathetic.

 

Now I know some of you guys will howl, "but Merle, there was nobody available so we were smart to pass on a QB and OLmen." To this I say hogwash. We could have traded a pick or two for some talented vets that certainly would be better than wha twe have now.

 

As for Gailey, the jury is still out. To say the team looked "rusty" is an understatement. He was a risky selection, let's hope he pays off. Rest assured I will not continue to give him a free pass if we look as gawd awful as we did last week.

 

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

[bills in va]

Sorry guys, I remain hopping mad that we ignored the QB and OL this past offseason. I have said it will cost us dearly, and it is turning out I am correct. I'm hard pressed to find any team we can beat at this juncture. I'm hard pressed to find any other team that would even start our mediocre QBs. The stinkin' fins threw our guys around like rag dolls. Pathetic.

 

Now I know some of you guys will howl, "but Merle, there was nobody available so we were smart to pass on a QB and OLmen." To this I say hogwash. We could have traded a pick or two for some talented vets that certainly would be better than wha twe have now.

 

As for Gailey, the jury is still out. To say the team looked "rusty" is an understatement. He was a risky selection, let's hope he pays off. Rest assured I will not continue to give him a free pass if we look as gawd awful as we did last week.

+1 read my post on "where's the fire" to view my opinion on Gailey so far.

[buffaloaggie]

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

We're still years away from a total fix. Our LB corps is also going to be a hole. Poz is terrible, Ellis and Denney are out of place, and Maybin is still not showing much.

[Merle Haggard]

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

 

What I wouldn't have done is ignored the OL and QB positions which is what we did. Bold thinking gets us out of the NFL celler, not the status quo. Unlike some of you, I find it unacceptable to do nothing. Trade a pick or two for some proven vets.

Short term fix? Not hardly. We need more players, a mix of proven vets and youngsters - Trent Edwards would be hard pressed to be 3rd string on any other team, the same goes for most all of our OLinemen.

Are you even old enough to remember when the Bills had their Super Bowl runs? Continued patience approach is a recipe for continued dissapointment.

[billsfreak]

The thought of only winning a couple of games this season makes me fit the puke. I'm sick of us standing shoulder to shoulder with the celler dwellers of the NFL.

I stand by what I said a few months earlier, when a few members of this board went apeshit wanting to bet me that the Bills wouldn't be in the top ten picks of the draft. They will be in the top 3, and most likely they won't be standing shoulder to shoulder, they will be below the normal cellar dwellars. I was not and am not going to bet against the Bills, as I am as big of a fan as anyone on this board, but unlike some others, I am a realist. You are correct in that most teams would have addressed the two most glaring needs (OL/QB), but not this regime, which is one reason why there will be no improvement over last year, but regression instead. Every time they bring in a new coaching staff, new FO, etc. they hype up things and get everyone excited and expecting improvement, but the wheels keep spinning in mud and no consistent improvement results in the management changes. Until things change, this new regime will be no different, and the results are only going to get worse. They spend their first round pick on a RB (could be great, but has a better chance of getting killed on this team), which will only stunt their growth another season. We had two running backs on the roster who have already rushed for over 1,000 yards in the NFL, there are no other positions in the NFL that need seasoning at the NFL level more than QB and Offensive Tackle, before they become legitimate NFL caliber players, so the longer we take to get someone in these positions, the longer until we become respectable. There are no fans in the NFL that get tortured like Bills fans have for over a decade, we are the Pittburgh Pirates of the NFL.

Edited September 15, 2010 by billsfreak

[akm0404]

Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford?

 

Yes.

 

100% oh my God hell yes.

 

I'd give St. Louis C.J. Spiller plus ANY FIVE players they wanted off our roster for Sam Bradford.

 

You can't consistently win in the NFL without elite-level quarterback play. The catch is, that is somewhat hard to find. But I'm willing to mortgage absolutely everything until we have that.

[Alaska Darin]

I'd give St. Louis C.J. Spiller plus ANY FIVE players they wanted off our roster for Sam Bradford.

The Rams wouldn't make that deal. I doubt they'd have traded out of the 1 spot for less than multiple firsts plus a few other day one picks spread over multiple drafts. Then everyone would be complaining when Bradford got ruined because we couldn't surround him with talent.

 

It's a process and what wasn't broken overnight won't be fixed that way either.

[Merle Haggard]

So you would trade Spiller for Anthony Davis / Bulaga? Or you would trade Troup for Claussen? Or you would trade Spiller plus to move up for injured Okung? Or you want to mortgage the future and send Spiller plus multiple picks for Bradford? Or Troup and another pick to move up for Saffold or Tebow?

 

I'm just not sure where you see the better value at these positions than what we drafted that will be a short term fix. I look forward to having a great QB, but mostly I look forward to having a good team. Wasting multiple picks to move up or reaching for need are not ways to have this roster get the most talented it can get.

 

I don't like our weak spots, and I am iffy on Bell and not sold on Trent, but I just don't see the un-doom options out there that would have made us a better football team.

 

 

Your damn right I would have made some bold moves to have acquired Sam Bradford.

 

I stand by what I said a few months earlier, when a few members of this board went apeshit wanting to bet me that the Bills wouldn't be in the top ten picks of the draft. They will be in the top 3, and most likely they won't be standing shoulder to shoulder, they will be below the normal cellar dwellars. I was not and am not going to bet against the Bills, as I am as big of a fan as anyone on this board, but unlike some others, I am a realist. You are correct in that most teams would have addressed the two most glaring needs (OL/QB), but not this regime, which is one reason why there will be no improvement over last year, but regression instead. Every time they bring in a new coaching staff, new FO, etc. they hype up things and get everyone excited and expecting improvement, but the wheels keep spinning in mud and no consistent improvement results in the management changes. Until things change, this new regime will be no different, and the results are only going to get worse. They spend their first round pick on a RB (could be great, but has a better chance of getting killed on this team), which will only stunt their growth another season. We had two running backs on the roster who have already rushed for over 1,000 yards in the NFL, there are no other positions in the NFL that need seasoning at the NFL level more than QB and Offensive Tackle, before they become legitimate NFL caliber players, so the longer we take to get someone in these positions, the longer until we become respectable. There are no fans in the NFL that get tortured like Bills fans have for over a decade, we are the Pittburgh Pirates of the NFL.

 

Great post. Comforting that their our some fellow lifelong Bills fans like myself, who see the forest through all those trees. LOL.

[jack_spikes]

Sorry guys, I remain hopping mad that we ignored the QB and OL this past offseason. I have said it will cost us dearly, and it is turning out I am correct. I'm hard pressed to find any team we can beat at this juncture. I'm hard pressed to find any other team that would even start our mediocre QBs. The stinkin' fins threw our guys around like rag dolls. Pathetic.

 

Now I know some of you guys will howl, "but Merle, there was nobody available so we were smart to pass on a QB and OLmen." To this I say hogwash. We could have traded a pick or two for some talented vets that certainly would be better than wha twe have now.

 

As for Gailey, the jury is still out. To say the team looked "rusty" is an understatement. He was a risky selection, let's hope he pays off. Rest assured I will not continue to give him a free pass if we look as gawd awful as we did last week.

If we're doomed this year then so be it. They're not going to win with this current collection anyway. If we have to lose again, please don't go 6-10 or 7-9. 2-14 or 3-13 is okay, knowing we'd have our choice between Luck, Locker, or Mallet. When we have our franchise QB, we can start to hope again. Picking first or second in the second round would also be like having another, low first rounder.

[Merle Haggard]

The Rams wouldn't make that deal. I doubt they'd have traded out of the 1 spot for less than multiple firsts plus a few other day one picks spread over multiple drafts. Then everyone would be complaining when Bradford got ruined because we couldn't surround him with talent.

 

It's a process and what wasn't broken overnight won't be fixed that way either.

 

You may be right and you may be wrong. We were stupid to pass on Clausen. I'm not convinced he is the real deal and like Bradford better. I am convinced he would have more upside then our middling trio of QBs who probably we would be no better than 3rd string on any other team. How can a legitimate NFL organization pass of fixing the two biggest gaping holes on their roster? Unbelievable.

 

If we're doomed this year then so be it. They're not going to win with this current collection anyway. If we have to lose again, please don't go 6-10 or 7-9. 2-14 or 3-13 is okay, knowing we'd have our choice between Luck, Locker, or Mallet. When we have our franchise QB, we can start to hope again. Picking first or second in the second round would also be like having another, low first rounder.

 

Yeah, that's just fricken great. The braintrust at OBD must strategize every year on how best to bungle things up so we have the best possible future draft picks.

[bowery4]

Sorry guys, I remain hopping mad that we ignored the QB and OL this past offseason. I have said it will cost us dearly, and it is turning out I am correct. I'm hard pressed to find any team we can beat at this juncture. I'm hard pressed to find any other team that would even start our mediocre QBs. The stinkin' fins threw our guys around like rag dolls. Pathetic.

 

Now I know some of you guys will howl, "but Merle, there was nobody available so we were smart to pass on a QB and OLmen." To this I say hogwash. We could have traded a pick or two for some talented vets that certainly would be better than wha twe have now.

 

As for Gailey, the jury is still out. To say the team looked "rusty" is an understatement. He was a risky selection, let's hope he pays off. Rest assured I will not continue to give him a free pass if we look as gawd awful as we did last week.

 

 

I stand by what I said a few months earlier, when a few members of this board went apeshit wanting to bet me that the Bills wouldn't be in the top ten picks of the draft. They will be in the top 3, and most likely they won't be standing shoulder to shoulder, they will be below the normal cellar dwellars. I was not and am not going to bet against the Bills, as I am as big of a fan as anyone on this board, but unlike some others, I am a realist. You are correct in that most teams would have addressed the two most glaring needs (OL/QB), but not this regime, which is one reason why there will be no improvement over last year, but regression instead. Every time they bring in a new coaching staff, new FO, etc. they hype up things and get everyone excited and expecting improvement, but the wheels keep spinning in mud and no consistent improvement results in the management changes. Until things change, this new regime will be no different, and the results are only going to get worse. They spend their first round pick on a RB (could be great, but has a better chance of getting killed on this team), which will only stunt their growth another season. We had two running backs on the roster who have already rushed for over 1,000 yards in the NFL, there are no other positions in the NFL that need seasoning at the NFL level more than QB and Offensive Tackle, before they become legitimate NFL caliber players, so the longer we take to get someone in these positions, the longer until we become respectable. There are no fans in the NFL that get tortured like Bills fans have for over a decade, we are the Pittburgh Pirates of the NFL.

 

You guys ever hear the phrase "nobody likes an I told you so"? Why are you telling us? We didn't do it. Write a letter to Ralph or something.

[Thurman#1]

Again, ignoring the QB and OL situation will doom us this year...

 

 

 

We were doomed this year before those decisions were made. We were a lousy team last year, not a team that was close to having the switch click on. That was a mirage. We had many huge holes and there was no way we were going to be good this year. No way.

 

We are rebuilding. This shouldn't have been obvious just now. It's been obvious for years that we desperately needed a rebuild, whether or not we actually went through with it. The good thing is that Gailey and Nix obviously knew it. You can't come out and say it in the modern world where you have to sell tickets, but their quotes have shown as clearly as reasonably possible that they knew they were rebuilding.

 

The QB and OL situation won't doom us this year. The QB and OL situation and the switch from the 4 - 3 to the 3 - 4 and the WR situation and the DL situation and our utter lack of OLBs and our mediocre ILBs and the time it takes for teams to learn a new system and get used to it and the fact that our OL still needs a season or so for the young guys to get experience and the whole group to gel and the fact that it takes a year or so in a serious Strength and Conditioning program to repair the damage from the lousy S&C program we've had since Rusty Jones left, not just two months or so, and the fact that we don't have any real locker room leaders ... and frankly, there's more ... all those things, all of them together, will doom us this year.

 

But the ones among us who are more realistic have known this for months. Why didn't you know it?

 

 

You may be right and you may be wrong. We were stupid to pass on Clausen. I'm not convinced he is the real deal and like Bradford better. I am convinced he would have more upside then our middling trio of QBs who probably we would be no better than 3rd string on any other team. How can a legitimate NFL organization pass of fixing the two biggest gaping holes on their roster? Unbelievable.

 

 

 

I wanted Clausen too, particularly in the second. Still do. But whatever else you can say about Clausen, he wouldn't have saved us this year. That just wouldn't have happened.

 

Yet your headline says that it dooms us this year.

Edited September 15, 2010 by Thurman#1

[jack_spikes]

You may be right and you may be wrong. We were stupid to pass on Clausen. I'm not convinced he is the real deal and like Bradford better. I am convinced he would have more upside then our middling trio of QBs who probably we would be no better than 3rd string on any other team. How can a legitimate NFL organization pass of fixing the two biggest gaping holes on their roster? Unbelievable.

 

 

 

Yeah, that's just fricken great. The braintrust at OBD must strategize every year on how best to bungle things up so we have the best possible future draft picks.

Well, if they do(strategize to bungle things up for the sake of drafting high), then they suck at that just as much as they do picking players in the draft to put the team in a position to win. They've finished 6-10 or 7-9 the last four years and they're stuck in the mud. Drafting in the middle of the round isn't getting it done.

[Merle Haggard]

We were doomed this year before those decisions were made. We were a lousy team last year, not a team that was close to having the switch click on. That was a mirage. We had many huge holes and there was no way we were going to be good this year. No way.

 

We are rebuilding. This shouldn't have been obvious just now. It's been obvious for years that we desperately needed a rebuild, whether or not we actually went through with it. The good thing is that Gailey and Nix obviously knew it. You can't come out and say it in the modern world where you have to sell tickets, but their quotes have shown as clearly as reasonably possible that they knew they were rebuilding.

 

The QB and OL situation won't doom us this year. The QB and OL situation and the switch from the 4 - 3 to the 3 - 4 and the WR situation and the DL situation and our utter lack of OLBs and our mediocre ILBs and the time it takes for teams to learn a new system and get used to it and the fact that our OL still needs a season or so for the young guys to get experience and the whole group to gel and the fact that it takes a year or so in a serious Strength and Conditioning program to repair the damage from the lousy S&C program we've had since Rusty Jones left, not just two months or so, and the fact that we don't have any real locker room leaders ... and frankly, there's more ... all those things, all of them together, will doom us this year.

 

But the ones among us who are more realistic have known this for months. Why didn't you know it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wanted Clausen too, particularly in the second. Still do. But whatever else you can say about Clausen, he wouldn't have saved us this year. That just wouldn't have happened.

 

Yet your headline says that it dooms us this year.

 

LOL. Nice spin. Trust me pal, I've been living through our years upon years of supposed "rebuilding" ever since Jim Kelly retired. Your patience with the braintrust at OBD is admirable, but misguided. Shrugging your shoulders year after year and saying "oh well it's a rebuilding year" may work for a few of you. The rest of us say enough already.

 

Well, if they do(strategize to bungle things up for the sake of drafting high), then they suck at that just as much as they do picking players in the draft to put the team in a position to win. They've finished 6-10 or 7-9 the last four years and they're stuck in the mud. Drafting in the middle of the round isn't getting it done.

 

LOL. Great point. The OBD guys can't even screw up getting the first round pick right. LOL.

[Albany,n.y.]

Yes.

 

100% oh my God hell yes.

 

I'd give St. Louis C.J. Spiller plus ANY FIVE players they wanted off our roster for Sam Bradford.

 

You can't consistently win in the NFL without elite-level quarterback play. The catch is, that is somewhat hard to find. But I'm willing to mortgage absolutely everything until we have that.

That's why I have a problem with people who want to win meaningless games in December. Months ago I started a thread that stated that if the Bills are in contention for the top spot in December, I'm rooting for them to lose. I got it from the "You play to win the game" people. Some were just in denial as to how bad we were going to be this year & were just reacting to anything that suggested the Bills would be bad enough to be in contention for the #1 pick by December. My response when people don't want to lose a meaningless game is Herm Edwards was wrong saying "You play to win the game." The correct phrase is "You play to win the Super Bowl". If we have to suffer through a horrible 2-14 or worse year this year, but we get the franchise QB and win the Super Bowl within the next 4, it's a lot better than going 5-11, missing out on any of the QBs, and 5 years from now we're still considering 8-8 an accomplishment. Even though we didn't win the Super Bowl, does anyone think we make 4 in a row if in 1984 we finished 5-11 and still went for a DE & drafted Ron Holmes, who had a fair career but was nowhere in Bruce Smith's league? Now I know he wasn't a QB, but we got lucky and got Kelly in the top-middle of the 1st and had his rights before Bruce was drafted.

Edited September 15, 2010 by Albany,n.y.

[Merle Haggard]

That's why I have a problem with people who want to win meaningless games in December. Months ago I started a thread that stated that if the Bills are in contention for the top spot in December, I'm rooting for them to lose. I got it from the "You play to win the game" people. Some were just in denial as to how bad we were going to be this year & were just reacting to anything that suggested the Bills would be bad enough to be in contention for the #1 pick by December. My response when people don't want to lose a meaningless game is Herm Edwards was wrong saying "You play to win the game." The correct phrase is "You play to win the Super Bowl". If we have to suffer through a horrible 2-14 or worse year this year, but we get the franchise QB and win the Super Bowl within the next 4, it's a lot better than going 5-11, missing out on any of the QBs, and 5 years from now we're still considering 8-8 an accomplishment. Even though we didn't win the Super Bowl, does anyone think we make 4 in a row if in 1984 we finished 5-11 and still went for a DE & drafted Ron Holmes, who had a fair career but was nowhere in Bruce Smith's league?

 

I disagree. You do play the win. That means you get the best players, best coaches and build a winning philosphy. You never lay down on the field. Never. Having actually played the game (college level)trust me that Lombardi's words will always ring true - "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing".

Laying down in December just for a high draft pick is not an option. The day that happens is the day our fan base should abandon this team. You play to win.

[Albany,n.y.]

I disagree. You do play the win. That means you get the best players, best coaches and build a winning philosphy. You never lay down on the field. Never. Having actually played the game (college level)trust me that Lombardi's words will always ring true - "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing".

Laying down in December just for a high draft pick is not an option. The day that happens is the day our fan base should abandon this team. You play to win.

I was talking about fans rooting for the team to win. I was not talking about the players on the field. They would be crazy to play to lose so that the team has as chance to draft a player better than them to replace each with.

As a fan, I do not want my team winning meaningless games in December if it costs them the #1 pick in a year when an impact player is available. I would never expect the players to want to lose. On a bad team, they're fighting for their professional lives.