Shawn Nelson Suspension

[JohnC]

Again, this is wrong. A first offense merits an automatic 4-game suspension, unless the player wins on appeal.

 

I'm going with the other guy. LOL

[DrDawkinstein]

Again, this is wrong. A first offense merits an automatic 4-game suspension, unless the player wins on appeal.

 

i want to believe you, if for no other reason than to get a final answer on this. but do you have a link to anything official?

 

i know a player who plays dline in the NFC, he is in "the program" after a failed test but has never been suspended. i think there are different scenarios receiving different punishments.

 

im looking online for something official. if you have something, please post it.

 

edit: so far everything ive found (which have been nothing more than articles written about the policy, I havent found the policy itself) agrees with what BuffaloJesus said:

 

If it is Steroids/Performance Enhancing, it's a 4-game suspension for first offense. Season suspension for second.

 

Anything else, weed, etc., you get put in the program and tested regularly. Second offense, 4-game suspension.

Edited September 8, 2010 by DrDankenstein

[JohnC]

i want to believe you, if for no other reason than to get a final answer on this. but do you have a link to anything official?

 

i know a player who plays dline in the NFC, he is in "the program" after a failed test but has never been suspended. i think there are different scenarios receiving different punishments.

 

im looking online for something official. if you have something, please post it.

 

Go with BuffaloJesus. He has more credibility. At least that is my opinion. If Doc comes up with a link confirming his position I will humbly and graciously acknowledge his position.

[DrDawkinstein]

Go with BuffaloJesus. He has more credibility. At least that is my opinion. If Doc comes up with a link confirming his position I will humbly and graciously acknowledge his position.

 

With all the different rules (failed test vs testing positive, PEDs vs illegal drugs, etc), I think we're all a little right and all a little wrong.

 

When searching for "nfl drug testing policy" and/or "nfl drug testing punishment", you get more links to articles talking about how haphazard and unpredictable it all is, and no link to anything official.

 

I don't doubt that is partly by league design so if/when a major star fails something, they can "change" the rules a little.

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

With all the different rules (failed test vs testing positive, PEDs vs illegal drugs, etc), I think we're all a little right and all a little wrong.

 

When searching for "nfl drug testing policy" and/or "nfl drug testing punishment", you get more links to articles talking about how haphazard and unpredictable it all is, and no link to anything official.

 

I don't doubt that is partly by league design so if/when a major star fails something, they can "change" the rules a little.

after some digging, I was able to find the NFL Policy & Program of Substance Abuse 2007 in Scribd.com.

 

here's basically what it says...

 

Testing

 

There's a few ways a player can get tested:

 

Pre-employment - rookie or vet (not on a team the year before) signing a contract & hasn't had a test in the last 4 months (combine tests excluded). Also a vet who was on a team the year before and agrees to take a pre-employment test.

 

Preseason - Players might take tests from April 20th - Aug 9th. The NFL Medical Director (NFLMD) decides that an entire team or position group, not individuals.

 

The team and player agree to unannounced testing - Results are passed to NFLMD. Positive tests result in mandatory entry to Intervention Stage 1.

 

Intervention:

 

3 stages- entrance can be from a positive test, behavior (i.e. arrest) or self-referral.

 

Stage 1 - can be tested as often as NFLMD decides. No right to challenge results. If positive test, results are passed to NFL Medical Advisor, NFLMD, and the team's Substance Abuse Physician. Stage 1 consists of evaluation by a regional team, treatment plans and testing.

 

No more than 90 days in Stage 1, but NFLMD decides how long player stays in Stage 1 and can extend it up to 6 months.

 

Stage 2 - Pretty much everyone in Stage 1 graduates to Stage 2. Might have to comply with a treatment plan, as determined by the NFLMD. Subject to unannounced testing.

 

1st Failure (i.e. positive test) to complete Stage 2 will result in a fine of 4/17 of salary (paragraph 5 of his NFL contract) and a suspension of 1-4 games.

 

2nd Failure (i.e. 2 positive tests) results in a four game suspension without pay (if player was fined in the 1st failure) and a six game suspension without pay if the player was suspended for the 1st failure, along with a fine calculated by a formula.

 

Stage 3 - Players are usually dismissed from Intervention after successfully completing Stage 2. If you make it to Stage 3, you're in it for the rest of your NFL career.

 

From this, IMO, Shane Nelson had a positive test along the way, entered Stage 1, graduated to Stage 2, and then got another positive test, resulting in his 4 game suspension. If he didn't have a positive test in Stage 2 (i.e. he failed his treatment program), it seems like he might have gotten a lesser suspension, but it's clear he was enrolled in Intervention Stages 1 & 2, and got a 2nd (overall) positive test or possibly failed his treatment program.

 

It's also possible that he was fined for the 1st failure in Stage 2, but not suspended. Then he would have gotten a four game suspension for the 2nd failure in Stage 2, but not the 6 game stunner.

Edited September 8, 2010 by In-A-Gadda-Levitre

[Doc]

I looked into it further. For failing a PED test the first time, it's an automatic 4 game suspension. For other types of banned drugs, as outlined by In-A-Gadda, you're entered into the substance abuse program, and then are suspended for 4 games if you fail again.

[Red]

I asked Chris Brown of Inside the Bills about Shawn Nelsons suspension. He told me it was most likely due to a GNC supplement that had a banned substance. He said alot of rookies make similar mistakes, no big deal. I had to disagree with him and said that if it were that simple, why not say so instead of leaving the fans to wonder if he's a drug addict or just stupid for not reading labels. If alot of rookies make those mistakes then why not more suspensions? He then chastized me and said I shouldn't "throw stones" because I don't know all the facts. Well then why doesn't OBD provide some answers?

 

So my questions to you guys are:

What was the substance Shawn Nelson was suspended for?

If it was so innocent why the information blackout and secrecy?

Is Chris Brown just a master propoganda puppet for the Bills?

 

Hey man, I live in Northern VA.

 

But to get to your point: you seriously don't believe that most (if not all) of professional athletes are on some kind of performance enhacing drug, right?

 

Chris Brown is the mouthpiece of the Bills. He is certainly not one who can be counted on to disclose or even create any dissension in the ranks at OBD.

 

One thing I am sick of, is the 'GNC supplement' garbage that is perpetuated by the media know-nothings.

 

First off, I am not a novice. I have been a drug-free bodybuilder for the past 15 years. I've worked in the sport supplement industry for 5, I have my undergrad in Nutrition and Sport and am currently completing my Masters in Physical Education. I coach football; and have coached at different levels in the public school environment.

 

The 'GNC' line is weak. Reason being: there is no legal, over-the-counter supplement that contains anything anabolic. Think about it. If supplements worked like steroids, we would not have steroids (which are illegal, can cause a whole range of problems, and are mucho expensive and just plain stupid). No manufacturer is putting illegal substances into their product. Not a one. To do so is not only an undeniable risk of imprisonment and/ or fines, etc, but the company would not be in business for very long if it did this. Not going to happen. If you ever hear anyone use this, you are being fed a line of cr@p.

 

Of course, if we knew what the substance was, we could look at the NFL list of banned substances and be able to accurately determine if Chris Brown knows anything indeed about the situation. For example, caffeine, at high levels can be used as a performance enhancer. But caffeine, at high levels, is also a banned substance. Is Nelson being suspended for too much caffeine? I doubt it.

 

For the absolute disgusting face of the underworld of sports, one need only look further than the relatively recent scandals with Major League Baseball. I mean, I hate baseball anyways, but to think that steroids would be so rampant in that sport is truly amazing. It's just not in the same league of power sports like football and hockey.

 

Barry Bonds is an excellent example. I read an interview with him in a Muscle and Fitness, I believe, a few years ago- right before the GH/ steroid/ clear thing started. In it, he made meticulous mention of how many grams of protein he ate, carbs, fats, supplement intake, types of supplements, grams of Glutamine (an amino acid) he took along w/creatine. He talked about his supplement cycles, etc.

 

In other words: the guy was very much informed and on top of the substances he was putting into his body, how much of them, when, etc. He was not ignorant.

 

Yet in spite of this article, we are then supposed to believe (well, most idiots believed it) that somehow, somebody like his trainer purposely spiked his massage cream w/the "clear"? He asked what it was, was not given a good answer, and then allowed the trainer to just continue?

 

Come freakin on!

 

Not for a guy that can tell you what time is best for his creatine/ glutamine/ protein shake!!

 

So, ignorance is not only a defense, in the case of professional athletes it is not even in the realm of possible.

 

These guys (and females who used to be females but started taking MALE hormones and have become she-men- Jennifer "Romo" Capriati, anyone?), are physical machines. They have to be, as their body is their livelihood. They are not putting performance enhancing substances into their bodies out of ignorance, stupidity, or by mistake.

 

Now, if he's just got caught snorting some lines of coke, you can disregard this response.

[Red]

With all the different rules (failed test vs testing positive, PEDs vs illegal drugs, etc), I think we're all a little right and all a little wrong.

 

When searching for "nfl drug testing policy" and/or "nfl drug testing punishment", you get more links to articles talking about how haphazard and unpredictable it all is, and no link to anything official.

 

I don't doubt that is partly by league design so if/when a major star fails something, they can "change" the rules a little.

 

Well, and that's another excellent point, and one that very few care to even acknowledge.

 

To use the Major League Baseball analogy again, to think the Commissioner Selig did not know of what was going on with the Home Rub Derby between McGwire and Sosa, suddenly broken records w/inflated body types, etc one would have to be clinically insane.

 

A great book on the topic, is Juicing The Game, by Howard Bryant. In it, Bryant describes the culture of baseball post-strike. Smaller fields, strike zone changes, etc. And steroids. Baseball was in a PR crises. It lost a tremendous amount of fans from the strike. It desperately needed to excitement to place butts in the seats. Turning a blind eye to the Steroid Era of Baseball does not waive one of guilt. Selig knew what was going on. In fact, it was only after our do-nothing Congress got involved in a PR event of their own to "save Baseball" from itself did MLB finally, FINALLY give way to drug testing and suspensions.

 

And please, don't get me started on the Olympics. They're all doped. But the only guilty ones are the ones being caught.

 

Does that spell conspiracy?

 

Well, let's just say that the public is always wanting bigger, stronger, and faster (and an excellent documentary movie of the same name). Nature is limited. Pharmaceuticals can help extend and insure a players career. Quicker recovery, more muscle mass thus more power/ speed....what's not to love?

 

I think the organizations involved all know about the drug use by professional athletes. Romo, or the late Alzado coming out publicly about their steroid use is not the minority. They are the ones who talk openly about it. Stallone got busted with a bag full coming from Australia. Arnold admitted to using. That type of muscle hypertrophy is not possible without anabolic assistance.

 

But alot of money is changing hands. Do we as a fan base want a bunch of 250 lb lineman? Myself, I'd love to see real men playing football, and not dopers. 180 lb RB's, etc. But does the rest of the nation want to see reality?

 

Then you must also look at the cost of testing. There isn't even a reliable test for HGH.

[The Dean]

I looked into it further. For failing a PED test the first time, it's an automatic 4 game suspension. For other types of banned drugs, as outlined by In-A-Gadda, you're entered into the substance abuse program, and then are suspended for 4 games if you fail again.

 

That was always my understanding 9(with "4 games" replaced with "4 games being typical"). It'd be nice to see it on something official, though.

[1B4IDie]

I asked Chris Brown of Inside the Bills about Shawn Nelsons suspension. He told me it was most likely due to a GNC supplement that had a banned substance. He said alot of rookies make similar mistakes, no big deal. I had to disagree with him and said that if it were that simple, why not say so instead of leaving the fans to wonder if he's a drug addict or just stupid for not reading labels. If alot of rookies make those mistakes then why not more suspensions? He then chastized me and said I shouldn't "throw stones" because I don't know all the facts. Well then why doesn't OBD provide some answers?

 

So my questions to you guys are:

What was the substance Shawn Nelson was suspended for?

If it was so innocent why the information blackout and secrecy?

Is Chris Brown just a master propoganda puppet for the Bills?

 

There is a confidentiality agreement in place when a player flunks a drug test. The details of the flunk are confidential.

All signs and innuendo around this incident point to a supplement not any narcotic.

On the bright side maybe with the 4 weeks off Nelson can make it through 12 regular season games without getting insured.

 

Gailey seems to realize if you have a QB that likes to dump off the ball put people that can make something happen after the catch in the positions the QB will dumb off to. The increased role of Roscoe and the starting of Spiller Time point to that. On paper Shawn Nelson is a guy that could turn on a dump off into a first down but its TBD until he makes it on the field.

Edited September 8, 2010 by Levitre + Wang = Wood

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

Here's the NFL Policy on Anabolic Steroids and Related Substances

 

Their definition of steroids and related substances is stated upfront, and it sure sounds like they mean PEDs, amongst others.

 

1. General Statement of Policy

The National Football League prohibits the use by NFL players of anabolic/androgenic steroids (including exogenous testosterone), certain stimulants, human or animal growth hormones, whether natural or synthetic, and related or similar substances. (See Appendix A). For convenience, these substances, as well as masking agents or diuretics used to hide their presence, will be referred to as “Prohibited Substances”.

 

then later on under Suspension and Related Discipline, it clearly says the 1st positive is a minimum 4 game suspension.

 

Step One:

The first time a player violates this Policy by testing positive; attempting to substitute, dilute or adulterate a specimen; manipulating a test result; or by violation of law (see Section 5), he will be suspended without pay for a minimum of four regular and/or postseason games.

 

and the second offense is a mandatory 8 game suspension...

 

So, it looks like my previous post about policy on substance abuse probably doesn't apply if he tested positive under this 'steroids and related policy'.

Edited September 8, 2010 by In-A-Gadda-Levitre

[Doc]

Here's the NFL Policy on Anabolic Steroids and Related Substances

 

Their definition of steroids and related substances is stated upfront, and it sure sounds like they mean PEDs, amongst others.

 

 

 

then later on under Suspension and Related Discipline, it clearly says the 1st positive is a minimum 4 game suspension.

 

 

 

and the second offense is a mandatory 8 game suspension...

 

So, it looks like my previous post about policy on substance abuse probably doesn't apply if he tested positive under this 'steroids and related policy'.

He definitely tested positive for PED's, since he's not allowed to practice with the team while he's suspended. If he was suspended for banned non-PED's (or violated the PCP), he'd be able to practice with the team.

Edited September 9, 2010 by Doc

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

He definitely tested positive for PED's, since he's not allowed to practice with the team while he's suspended. If he was suspended for banned non-PED's (or violated the PCP), he'd be able to practice with the team.

Where does it say that? It didn't look like it was mentioned in the 'steroids & related' policy, or the CBA. I'm not doubting you, but it seems that would've been spelled out somewhere.

[ChasBB]

I talk X's and O's at length and will be leaving for Buffalo Friday after work for the game. I bring it up because it got buried under alot of other topics, many of which I posted and I wanted to know if others had more info. So before you tell a 30+ year fan to "go away", smack yourself in the face a few times and save me the trouble. I still laugh when people like you post the rudest crap while you hide behind your computer. I never start any smack talk on a fan message board as its petty and juvenille, but I darn sure will defend myself. Next time I post a topic do us both a favor and skip it. I enjoy reading opposing opinions and being educated by other fans who know more than me on any topic, but rude comments in response to a question are over the decency line.

For Nelson's interview about his suspension, go to the video section of buffalobills.com and look for the link posted on 8/21/10 entitled "Shawn Nelson Statement on Suspension".

 

I apologize for being rude. Your question about what went down was a fair one.

 

Nevertheless, find and watch his statement on video. I think he is telling the truth that it wasn't illegal drugs or anything like that.

 

Oh, and I've been a fan for 40 years now, but that's not important. I just want to see that excitement return to being a Bills fan and facing the Dolphins on opening day and was just initially put off by this being dragged out even after Nelson made a public statement, but that's neither here nor there and doesn't excuse rudeness.

 

Go Bills!!

[JohnC]

I looked into it further. For failing a PED test the first time, it's an automatic 4 game suspension. For other types of banned drugs, as outlined by In-A-Gadda, you're entered into the substance abuse program, and then are suspended for 4 games if you fail again.

 

Or to put it simply you are altering your first position. Nothing wrong with that. Just stay humble. It makes you a better person.

[Doc]

He definitely tested positive for PED's, since he's not allowed to practice with the team while he's suspended. If he was suspended for banned non-PED's (or violated the PCP), he'd be able to practice with the team.

Where does it say that? It didn't look like it was mentioned in the 'steroids & related' policy, or the CBA. I'm not doubting you, but it seems that would've been spelled out somewhere.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/09/01/different-rules-apply-to-santonio-roethlisberger-suspensions/

For suspensions of less than one year under the substance abuse policy, the player is not completely banned from the facility. NFL spokesman Greg Aiello explained via e-mail that the team "may allow player to be at facility and attend meetings but not practice."

As to suspensions for violation of the steroids policy or the Personal Conduct Policy, a different set of rules applies. The player "may not be at the facility or stadium or be involved in team football-related activities away from team facilities," Aiello said.

So a player that violates the PED or PCP policy (got that one wrong) cannot attend any team-related activities, while a player who violates the SA policy can attend meetings, but not practice.

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/09/01/different-rules-apply-to-santonio-roethlisberger-suspensions/

 

 

So a player that violates the PED or PCP policy (got that one wrong) cannot attend any team-related activities, while a player who violates the SA policy can attend meetings, but not practice.

ok, good find, but I still have 1 problem...

 

I haven't read anything (yet) that says he was suspended for violating the 'steroid & related substances policy'. Actually, most of the articles like this one from the Buffalo News point to the 'policy and program for substances of abuse'. The phrase policy and program isn't in the title of the steroids document.

 

According to the NFL, Bills tight end Shawn Nelson has been suspended without pay for the team’s first four games of the season for violating the NFL Policy and Program for Substances of Abuse.

 

Have you seen something specific that says he was suspended for violating the 'steroids & related' policy?

 

I think I'm back to the original, everything but steroids drug policy, and it's his 2nd positive test.

[Kelly the Dog]

ok, good find, but I still have 1 problem...

 

I haven't read anything (yet) that says he was suspended for violating the 'steroid & related substances policy'. Actually, most of the articles like this one from the Buffalo News point to the 'policy and program for substances of abuse'. The phrase policy and program isn't in the title of the steroids document.

 

 

 

Have you seen something specific that says he was suspended for violating the 'steroids & related' policy?

 

I think I'm back to the original, everything but steroids drug policy, and it's his 2nd positive test.

Nelson himself flat out said "it wasn't anything illegal", which everyone took, I think rightfully, to mean it wasn't recreational drugs it was performance enhancing drugs.

[In-A-Gadda-Levitre]

Nelson himself flat out said "it wasn't anything illegal", which everyone took, I think rightfully, to mean it wasn't recreational drugs it was performance enhancing drugs.

+1

[justnzane]

hey guys i am working for carmadee.com along with my youtube show. My boss, Carma, interviewed shawn recently (http://www.carmadee....-interview.html) and this is what he said regarding the topic:

 

 

CD: What is your side of the story with regards to your recent four game suspension from the Buffalo Bills?

SN: You know the only thing that bothered me is that there were rumors that it had something to do with marijuana or some other type of drug. That is not true. I don't do drugs and have never done any type of drug. My teammates, friends, family and church family know that I am a guy of a particular character. At this point in my career I would never risk what I have accomplished over drugs.[/font]

Edited September 9, 2010 by justnzane