Ponder Watch

[Ramius]

I figure since the Bills appear to be extremely hard up for a QB in the near future, i'll provide a Christian Ponder watch this year. I'll recap his games every week, list the good/bad things he did and just provide some general information about the kid. We start off on September 4 against Samford.

[CarolinaBill]

I'll be on Enderle watch, first game is Sept 2nd Vs. N. Dakota Fighting Sioux

[Ramius]

Game 1 - FSU 59, Samford 6 - Ponder: 12/14 167 yards, 4 TDs, 1 INT, 2-7 rushing, in a half of action.

 

Not much to say about this game. FSU completely rolled Samford as expected. Ponder had all day to throw, and they didn't have any designed runs for him in the game plan (due to facing OU next week, things were kept under wraps). The INT wasn't his fault. His pass was deflected at the LOS right into the arms of a LB.

 

Next week we get a huge test in the Sooners as the 'Noles head out to Norman.

[Ramius]

Game 2 - Oklahoma 47, FSU 17 - Ponder - 11/28 113 yards, 0 TD, 2 INT, 9 rushes for 23 yards

 

Uhg. This was an ugly game overall. Nobody played well, including Ponder. The OL was weak, they couldn't establish a running game, WRs were dropping passes, Ponder didn't play well, and Kimbo Fisher channelled Dick Jauron yesterday with his refusal to make any changes to the game plan.

 

As for Ponder himself, there were 2 separate Ponders. The first was the QB who went 7-11 for 70 yards, ran for 15, and led the team to a TD on the opening drive. Then, the wheels came off. After than point, Ponder played arguably the worst football i have seen him play in his 3 years as a starter. He was rushing his passes, wasn't getting set, and looked a bit panicked in the pocket. He forced too many throws into coverage and didn't go through his progressions. On his 2 INTs, the first one he locked on his WR from the snap and threw into triple coverage. The second pick was a ball he tried to force into a well covered receiver.

 

Not much else to say about this game. Aside from the opening drive, it was cover your eyes bad in all aspects, including Ponder. All i ask is that you consider this is arguably the worst i have ever seen him play at FSU.

[Ramius]

Game 3, FSU 34, BYU 10 - Ponder: 14/21, 149 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 13-50 rushing, 1 rush TD.

 

Ponder bounced back into his usual shape against BYU. He was calm, collected and efficient. He actually didn't throw too much, as FSU rolled up nearly 300 yards rushing. Ponder made the throws he needed to make, most of the short to medium variety. He didn't make any glaring errors. Just played a good, solid game overall.

 

Also, it came out today that he's been playing with a bruised tricep on his throwing arm, so this is part of the reason why we're running the ball a ton and not taking too many shots down the field.

[Ramius]

Game 3, FSU 34, BYU 10 - Ponder: 24-37, 243 yards, 2 TD, 0 INT, 11-11 rushing, 1 rush TD.

 

Ponder looked very good last weekend against Wake Forest. He was extremely efficient in moving the ball up and down the ball on the Wake D. He also made some great throws throughout the game. He went downfield a few times, and doesn't seem to be suffering too many ill effects from the triceps bruise he has/had. ponder's first TD pass was a very nice throw on the run after he was flushed form the pocket. He scrambled, found a wide-open WR, and made a beautiful pass on the run. I can't think of any seriously glaring mistakes he made in the passing game. They've been running him quite a bit the past few weeks with some wildcat and/or option plays. About the only "bad" part of saturday's game was he fumbled after being blindsided.

 

The kid is playing at a high level, and there are few worries that the offense will score when he's playing his best. The kid simply knows how to run an offense, and shows good awareness as when to check out of a certain playcall. He's doing everything that is asked of him and doing it at a very high level.

[Ramius]

Game 5, FSU 34, Virginia 14 - Ponder 17/29, 172 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 10-17 rushing.

 

Ponder had another solid (if unspectacular) outing in the beatdown of Virginia. Again in this game, FSU had clsoe to 300 yards rushing (3 straight games with over 200 rushing yards) the football, so Ponder hasn't been asked to do a whole lot through the air. Jimbo is perfectly fine running the ball. He made the throws when needed to, and he also rushed/scrambled for a couple of key first downs. While he's not piling up pinball numbers, watching Ponder, he's shown an ability to get the first down when needed. Even if its a 4 yard scramle or a short dump off, he's been great at finding seams or the open man to get whats needed to keep the drive alive. The kid's simply playing some good, smart, solid football.

 

Another big test comes this week when we head down to miami. Hopefully Ponder will have a better showing than the OU road game.

[Ramius]

Game 6, FSU 45, Virginia 17 - Ponder 12/21, 173 yards, 2 TD, 1 INT, 4-15 rushing

 

Ponder continued his good play as we obliterated the "U". Again, FSU ran for close to 250 yards in the game, so there was no need to put up pinball passing numbers. He scrambled for a few key 1st downs. His 1st TD pass was on a screen, and the second was a thing of beauty. He threw a perfect fade pattern to the back corner. Put it where only the WR could catch it. And on 3rd down no less. His INT was a poor decision, as he threw the ball up for grabs deep down the field to a triple covered WR. However, it was on a 3rd down from Miami's 45 or so, and the INT came inside Miami's 5, so it had the same effect as a punt. Next up, BC.

[Ramius]

Game 7, FSU 24, BC 19. Ponder 19/31, 170 yards, 2 TD, 3 INT. 8 for -5 rushing due to sacks.

 

Ponder had an odd game against BC. The stat line doesn't say a lot for him, but his play was literally up and down all game long. He made some spectacular throws (for 1 of the TDs), and made an awesome throw on the run back across his body through a tiny window to convert a 3rd and long. The throw was amazing. He wasn't terribly effective running the ball, but did convert some key first downs with his feet. That ability can't be understated. As for his INTs, 2 of them came on deep outs to the wide side of the field. Both balls floated on him and the DB jumped the route. Ponder simply didn't look right in making the passes, and after the game, it was revealed that Ponder was playing with a ruptured bursa sac in his throwing elbow. So, to me, his poor passes had a lot to do with the injury.

 

Again, not his best game as a QB, but it was more of the half a dozen fantastic plays from him and then a handful of boneheaded ones, as opposed to consistent good or bad play.

[Ramius]

Game 8, NC St. 28, FSU 24. Ponder 17/29 for 196. 1 TD, 0 INT. 11-21 rushing with 2 running TDs.

 

Thankfully i waited until today to do the write-up. Had i done it last night (thursday), you'd have thought that Ponder was the worst QB in college football, because i was so unbelievably pissed at him and the team.

 

That being said, on to the game. Ponder had an overall decent game, not a great one. The offense couldn't get untracked for large parts of the game, but most of it wasn't his fault. Penalties killed FSU in the first half, but Ponder still led the team on 3 second quarter TD drives. He was using his typical dink and dunk passing. Jimbo doesn't call many deep plays, and with some OL injuries, the pass protection isn't what it was in the past. On the positive side, his elbow seemed to have healed up and wasn't giving him any problems with putting zip on the ball. He overthrew his WRs once or twice. He made a gutsy run to score a TD with a dive for the pilon. He added another nice scramble for a TD. But, to me, his biggest mistake was just a bonehead play. Mid 4th quarter, FSU was driving. Ponder had a designed run on 3rd and 3. He hit the hole, and just had to go forward to pick up 1 more yard for the first. He would have easily had it, but instead he bounced outside to try to gain more, and was stopped short. That made settle us for 3 instead a probable 7.

 

He did drive us downfield in the final seconds however, until we had a 2nd goal, when our RB smacked into him after the snap, causing a fumble.

[LongLiveRalph]

Thankfully i waited until today to do the write-up. Had i done it last night (thursday), you'd have thought that Ponder was the worst QB in college football, because i was so unbelievably pissed at him and the team.

 

The games I've seen, he's been absolutely terrible. Far, far below the top QB prospects that I've watched. All rinky-dink passes (a function of the offense I realize) but certainly not EVERY play is called to be a 3-yard pass. He hasn't made any "wow" plays or even any winning plays in the games I've seen.

 

So...I fully expect the Bills to draft him in '11. Probably with a few traded picks from '12 to get him.

[Ramius]

The games I've seen, he's been absolutely terrible. Far, far below the top QB prospects that I've watched. All rinky-dink passes (a function of the offense I realize) but certainly not EVERY play is called to be a 3-yard pass. He hasn't made any "wow" plays or even any winning plays in the games I've seen.

 

So...I fully expect the Bills to draft him in '11. Probably with a few traded picks from '12 to get him.

 

Sorry, i spend time on these for people who actually want to have a discussion. If you'd got legit complaints and criticisms, voice them in an adult manner. Save the lowbrow, thoughtless BS one liners for the main board. But feel free to explain why he's "far far below" others based on the 1 or 2 games you've seen him play.

[Guest LongLiveRalph]

Sorry, i spend time on these for people who actually want to have a discussion. If you'd got legit complaints and criticisms, voice them in an adult manner. Save the lowbrow, thoughtless BS one liners for the main board. But feel free to explain why he's "far far below" others based on the 1 or 2 games you've seen him play.

[LongLiveRalph]

Sorry, i spend time on these for people who actually want to have a discussion. If you'd got legit complaints and criticisms, voice them in an adult manner. Save the lowbrow, thoughtless BS one liners for the main board. But feel free to explain why he's "far far below" others based on the 1 or 2 games you've seen him play.

 

I've seen 3 FSU games this year and parts of a 4th. He throws nothing but slants and dumpoffs. Like I mentioned, I realize that can be a function of the offense. His red zone abilities and decision making appear sub-par, which is especially worrisome for a senior QB. He can pick up a few 1st downs in between the 20's but he doesn't make winning plays. Mallett and Luck do. Not that winning is everything in college, as I'd gladly take Locker and his .043 winning percentage over Ponder. Ponder plays with no edge and his field presence is underwhelming.

 

As for your "discussion" here, I'm happy to help, seeing as apparently I'm the only one who has replied. Feel free to continue on with your highbrow, thoughtful, oustanding insight! I will refrain from adding my lowbrow BS opinion, and just join the rest of the board in not caring. Carry on with your "discussion."

[Ramius]

I've seen 3 FSU games this year and parts of a 4th. He throws nothing but slants and dumpoffs. Like I mentioned, I realize that can be a function of the offense. His red zone abilities and decision making appear sub-par, which is especially worrisome for a senior QB. He can pick up a few 1st downs in between the 20's but he doesn't make winning plays. Mallett and Luck do. Not that winning is everything in college, as I'd gladly take Locker and his .043 winning percentage over Ponder. Ponder plays with no edge and his field presence is underwhelming.

 

As for your "discussion" here, I'm happy to help, seeing as apparently I'm the only one who has replied. Feel free to continue on with your highbrow, thoughtful, oustanding insight! I will refrain from adding my lowbrow BS opinion, and just join the rest of the board in not caring. Carry on with your "discussion."

 

I've seen all of the games this season, as well as last, and the year before, and all the way back to 2003. So i've seen a bit more of Ponder than you have. For starters, i've never claimed he's better than, or should be taken before guys like Luck, Mallet, or Locker. This is simply a thread for some analysis on a potential QB who would (probably) be in the Bills' sights in early round 2, should they pass on a QB at the top of round 1.

 

Ponder throws a lot more than "slants and dumpoffs". Fisher uses the bubble screen as a large part of the offense which is why he throws so many of them. As for the lack of deep passes, there are a few reasons: 1. Ponder's been having arm trouble this year with the bruised tricep and ruptured bursa sac. So why make him throw downfield when his arm isn't 100%. He can make the throws, because he's made them without issue in the past. He needs a bit of tweaking on his deep ball, but that's a release point issue and not an arm strength issue. 2. The offensive line this year has been hit with injuries and hasn't been pass protecting as well. Ponder hasn't had the time to spend all day throwing deep like he did last season. 3. Our WRs blow. We've got a good up and coming sophomore in Willie Haulstead, but the rest of our WRs are either inconsistent (Reed and Easterling), or young (guys like Kenny Shaw).

 

As for his decision making, his "poor decision making" is nothing more than his trying to do too much on some plays. He's forced some stupid throws in a couple of games, as all QBs do, but overall, his decision making is far from "poor". Neither are his red-zone abilities. He can throw a perfect fade, as he's done numerous times. He can put the ball in the endzone, as he's done plenty of times with his arm and feet. He can buy time and find the open WR, which he has done numerous times. But, i'm sure you'd be happy to come up with a series of plays and games where he's shown what you deem "poor red-zone abilities"

 

As for the bull **** "winning plays" argument, what do you count as a "winning play" by a QB. Is a winning play one where the QB finds an open WR in the endzone for the game winning TD on the last play of the game in 2009 against Miami, but the WR drops it? Is that the QBs fault? Is it the QBs fault when he moves the team into FG range for the game winning FG, but the kicker misses it? Is is the QBs fault when the RB knocks the ball out of his hands on the 4 yard line after said QB has driven the team the length of the field in under 2 minutes?

 

I could go on and on about bulllshit "winning plays" that Ponder has made while here at FSU, especially given the fact the team hasn't been wildly successful (in large part due to the defense: see 2009).

 

Perhaps you can enlighten us as to all the winning plays that Jake Locker has made, or about the winning plays that Ryan Mallet made against Alabama this year.

[LongLiveRalph]

FSU was 4-5 with Ponder racking up ACC-leading passing stats last year. He got injured and they finished 3-1, including a bowl game victory.

 

This season, they've just lost two in a row to the powerhouse NC schools, then Ponder sits and they beat Clemson this week.

 

FSU fans better enjoy these last few games of the Ponder Era...They might not see QB talent like that again for another year or two!

 

I once compared Ponder to Mark Bulger, and I think the comparison fits. He passes the eye test and looks the part of QB. He will have his nice statistical lines and win some games, but nobody confuses him with a winner.

 

Jake Locker has beaten USC two years in a row, including when they were #5 in the nation last season. What's Ponder's signature win? BYU???

[Ramius]

FSU was 4-5 with Ponder racking up ACC-leading passing stats last year. He got injured and they finished 3-1, including a bowl game victory.

 

This season, they've just lost two in a row to the powerhouse NC schools, then Ponder sits and they beat Clemson this week.

 

FSU fans better enjoy these last few games of the Ponder Era...They might not see QB talent like that again for another year or two!

 

I once compared Ponder to Mark Bulger, and I think the comparison fits. He passes the eye test and looks the part of QB. He will have his nice statistical lines and win some games, but nobody confuses him with a winner.

 

Jake Locker has beaten USC two years in a row, including when they were #5 in the nation last season. What's Ponder's signature win? BYU???

 

Again, nowhere did i say ponder was better than locker, Luck, or mallet. But thank you for showing your complete and utter ignorance on FSU football, especially regarding the 2009 season. You don't have a foot to stand on him with your attempted criticism of him, so you rely on the tired old "the team sucked so its his fault" argument.

 

Now i remember you. You're the same guy who kept trotting the "Ponder sucks because the team had losses last year and because he doesn't have a 'signature win'" baseless arguement all last year and over the summer. Sorry, the NFL doesn't care about "signature wins" when evaluating QBs. Funny how you claim Ponder sucks because the team had a poor record, but you give locker a pass for the exact same circumstances.

[LongLiveRalph]

I made one reply previously to your thread that was titled something like "Christian Ponder- Opinions". Your original post requested opinions on Ponder and wanted considerations on his chances of winning the 2010 Heisman trophy. I responded with a post that he wasn't a Heisman candidate in my mind, and that he was lacking in several areas.

 

I don't claim Ponder "sucks" but I know that he has played poorly in the games I've seen. And I only point to the fact that they have been quite successful when he has been out of the lineup, so obviously the team is not horrible. Their only loss in five games over the previous two seasons with Ponder out of the lineup was to #1 ranked Florida.

 

Anybody with two eyes can see that UW is a bad team even with Locker, but without him they'd struggle to beat a high school team. I mentioned his victories over USC because you asked for enlightenment on the "winning plays" that Locker has made. How about 24-40, 310 yds, 1 TD, 0 INT, and 12 rush for 110 yds...Including a 54-yard run on the final drive to kick a last second FG to win 32-31 at the Los Angeles Coliseum over USC. Is that making "b.s. winning plays"?

 

There can be different ways of viewing it, of course. I'm sure you blame the FSU WR for dropping the pass in the end zone against Miami in 2009, and absolve Ponder for throwing a garbage pass 4 inches off the grass to a wide open receiver. Throwing a strike to the guy's hands would've been "making a winning play" just as the WR catching a low ball would've been "making a winning play" because, you see, they would've WON rather than LOST. I know there are 1,000 other events in each game that lead up to that moment. But when that moment comes, as you know, the best make it happen.

 

My opinion is strictly that...An opinion. Apparently it's wrong because it disagrees with yours and your desire for FSU to be relevant. Stop pretending that football is this incredibly difficult game to analyze, and that nobody could possibly have the understanding that you have.

[Ramius]

To the rest of you, i'm not going to engage the monkey anymore. He's the same poster who was continually attacking Ponder all summer long leading up to the start of the college season. Continue with the PMs with more questions about Ponder, they're always welcome.

 

Unfortunately, this, as with many other threads, is done due to the general asshattery of a specific poster who is more interested in tearing apart a player he's seen once or twice than he is in engaging any actual meaningful discussion.