Gabe Northern Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Disturbing article from ESPN on the Pirates. Basically, the ownership is quite content to field miserable teams as long as they can generate the cash flow to make $20 million distributions to team owners. This really makes you think when re-reading Mark Gaughan's article about the Bills ranking dead last in 2009 cap spending and 8th from last in terms of cash outlays. From 1960 to 2010, Ralph Wilson's ownership interest in the Bills has grown by nearly 25% per year -- from $25,000 to a fair value of $900 million. This investment income far surpasses whatever current revenue is generated by big market cities from PSLs, luxury boxes, and other factors. Yet, rather than spend some of this money, the Bills -- like the Pirates -- seem content to generate profits rather than field a competitive team.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Part of the problem is the fans, who for some reason tolerate this behavior (both here and in Pittsburgh).
Sisyphean Bills Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Why is this surprising to anyone? Given the age of the owner and that his family doesn't want the team after he passes on, why would Mr. Wilson not be positioning the team for sale?
kota Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 LOL ok. Yes Free Agent signings make teams awesome. IT works every year right? LOL ok. Oh wait i know the bills need to spend 14 million a year on a corner. If they did this the fans would be happy? Sorry but your conclusions from two articles about two different cities and two different sports are poor. I don't understand how you can draw comparisons between the two.
nero47 Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 This is a business! Not an app on iphones. How much does Jerry Johnson or the redskins generate in profits each year. If you can get more you will spend more. I wish you kids would get better educated. How about we look into your finances and tell you how you should spend them to better interest prospective employers to follow your career. My guess is you would not spend what others think you should to make you better.
PromoTheRobot Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Part of the problem is the fans, who for some reason tolerate this behavior (both here and in Pittsburgh). Very simple solution: stay home. No team, no problem. PTR
DanInUticaTampa Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Part of the problem is the fans, who for some reason tolerate this behavior (both here and in Pittsburgh). You're right. The fans should stop going to the games in protest, that way people will say that buffalo doesn't have a fanbase and they should move the team to another city out of buffalo. YEAH! That sounds like a GREAT plan
PromoTheRobot Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Ralph Wilson does not try to field bad teams. He keeps hiring the wrong people to field his teams. He doesn't know how to pick good managers. But we got lucky when he hired Russ Brandon because Ralph trusts Russ enough to let hem make some decisions. Russ hired Buddy and Buddy hired Chan, so I think we are finally on the right track. PTR
dhg Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Part of the problem is the fans, who for some reason tolerate this behavior (both here and in Pittsburgh). Unfortunately the fans have zero say in it.
kota Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Where do the Saints, Indy, Pittsburg, and NE all fall in terms of players contract spending?
Coach Tuesday Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Unfortunately the fans have zero say in it. 100% wrong. You vote with your checkbooks.
DanInUticaTampa Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 100% wrong. You vote with your checkbooks. No.
BillsVet Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 This is a business! Not an app on iphones. How much does Jerry Johnson or the redskins generate in profits each year. If you can get more you will spend more. I wish you kids would get better educated. How about we look into your finances and tell you how you should spend them to better interest prospective employers to follow your career. My guess is you would not spend what others think you should to make you better. Do you really think it's as black and white as you make it out to be? Any financial adviser would point out a myriad of issues contributing to RW's decision making process. There's a lockout coming, estate taxes, setting up the family, et al. In the interim, maximize revenue (Toronto, raised ticket prices, etc) hype the team, and make preparations for the inevitable. Buffalo's salary will most likely decrease, like many other teams, from 2009 to 2010. Ticket prices went up, as I'm sure advertising and other revenue sources did. The Bills made 39M according to Forbes last season. Why would they spend more if the team's going to be sold? Who puts money into a car that'll be sold in short order? Fans need to face facts: the Bills aren't as interested in winning as we'd like them to be. Minnesota is one of the smaller NFL markets and has the highest dollar amount for contracts in the NFL. Don't give me that tired song and dance that Buffalo is small market and can't spend. GB spends as do other small markets.
nick in* england Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 This is BS for one simple reason: as a SuperBowl champ you make a LOT more money...
PromoTheRobot Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 This is BS for one simple reason: as a SuperBowl champ you make a LOT more money... You can't compare Major League Baseball to the NFL because of the lack of a salary cap. Baseball is rigged so the richest markets alway have the best teams. Once in a while a well-run smaller market breaks through but they can never last because they can't hang on to their best players. Most MLB teams are just farm teams for the Yankees and Red Sox. PTR
ndirish1978 Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 100% wrong. You vote with your checkbooks. You can't say that on this board. I suggested the same thing last year and was called every name in the book for it.
MaineMoxie Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 As I've said before in other threads, we now live in an age when not only do the number of fans in the seats not matter as much, but even winning doesn't seem to matter as much anymore. It's all about a marketable product. Sadly, not only do I see the Bills falling into this pattern, but the Sabres - who have been lucky in the winning department - are the same way. There's absolutely no effort to try to compete. Either it's a deliberately cynical ploy to maximize profits or it is simply giving up and admitting defeat to the wealthier teams.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 No. Really, you'll have to explain yourself. I fail to understand how free market economics does not apply to the Buffalo Bills.
weehawk Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Sounds like people are finally realizing that this team is being setup for a sale and not for a playoff run. The argument that you dont invest much money in something that you fully intend to sell is right on. The real discussion should be about what happens after a sale. I still argue that no business people in their right mind (local or not) will invest over $900 million in WNY at an avg of ~$55 a ticket. The team will be sold and will operate in WNY for about 3-5 years afterwards. In that time prices (on everything) will skyrocket, the team will continue to lose, the fan base will diminish, and the team will move.
CodeMonkey Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 I fail to understand how free market economics does not apply to the Buffalo Bills. Well you have to admit that the Bills actually do defy free market economics to a degree! What other product can you think of that has sucked ass for 9 years and yet has a record sales year like the Bills did last year with season tickets. Plus it really isn't a free market at all. Profit sharing and a even split of TV revenue means teams aren't competing for dollars at all.
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