mpl6876 Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Not sure on Clausen and I wish him the best, but given who was already on our roster: Troup + Edwards + Brohm > Clausen + Edwards + Brohm. Not sure Clausen will be better than Trent in 2010, but even if he is, I don't think by a margin that makes up for not having Troup on the roster at NT. So in terms of building a winning team for 2010 this seems like a no brainer. If Clausen excels over the next few years and Edwards and Brohm don't, then we might be disappointed with the selection in the future. I believe we could have gotten Clausen at pick 2 and Troupe at pick 3 or 4.
Doc Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 But the original post was praising him for his "amazing" debut. And the fact remains that a lot of people argued that he was an immediate upgrade to the position. He isn't. You're just mad because you're gonna have to pay for case of beer. People were rushing to praise the guy after a 41 qb rating, 1 int, & 3 point performance. If he actually led his team to a td, people would be falling all over themselves. And people here were killing Maybin as a rookie. And Maybin is younger than Clausen. So if you going to criticize one young player, don't get mad when others criticize your golden boy. And I think I'm leaning toward Stellas. What I want to know is, what was the bet, and how did I miss out on it? I believe we could have gotten Clausen at pick 2 and Troupe at pick 3 or 4. With all dues respect, what you believe means nothing.
Koufax Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 I believe we could have gotten Clausen at pick 2 and Troupe at pick 3 or 4. Possibly, but hoping people slide isn't necessarily a great gamble. But yes, if you think you can have Troup + Clausen + Trent + Brohm then my equation isn't valid and you have to look at Clausen's marginal value compared to Trent/Brohm related to Carrington. But given that three other DTs went off the board between our 2nd and 3rd picks, I think that Troup likely would have been gone, even if Kiper and others didn't line it up that way.
John Cocktosten Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 What I want to know is, what was the bet, and how did I miss out on it? CB97 and I have a friendly bet. I think Clausen will be a good QB and he doesn't(in his own angry way) The parameters have not been set but the prize is a case of beer. Since it's almost impossible to find Zima by the case (CB97 requested "beer"), I better hope Clausen works out.
Doc Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 CB97 and I have a friendly bet. I think Clausen will be a good QB and he doesn't(in his own angry way) The parameters have not been set but the prize is a case of beer. Since it's almost impossible to find Zima by the case (CB97 requested "beer"), I better hope Clausen works out. That's probably why I didn't get in on the action. You need parameters before you bet on something. I suspect that once parameters of being a "good QB" are being proposed, the bet will fall apart.
mpl6876 Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 (edited) What I want to know is, what was the bet, and how did I miss out on it? With all dues respect, what you believe means nothing. That's where your wrong. What I believe means a lot to me and my wife, kids, friends, and co workers. With all due respect, what you believe means nothing to me. Edited August 23, 2010 by mpl6876
Doc Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 That's where your wrong. What I believe means a lot to me and my wife, kids, friends, and co workers. With all due respect, what you believe means nothing to me. Original. Although I suspect your wife, kids, friends, and co workers don't really care what you believe about the Bills getting Clausen in the 2nd and Troup in the 3rd or 4th.
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted August 23, 2010 Posted August 23, 2010 Friscos 3rd stringer Nate Davis impressed me much more than Clausen. He launched an absolute Rocket to ted Ginn. http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2010082251/2010/PRE2/vikings@49ers#tab:watch looks like he played well in preseason last year.... You look at this guy and think man, he might be really good in a season or two... Nice smooth toss effortless 25 yard strikes. It's nice to see.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 CB97 and I have a friendly bet. I think Clausen will be a good QB and he doesn't(in his own angry way) The parameters have not been set but the prize is a case of beer. Since it's almost impossible to find Zima by the case (CB97 requested "beer"), I better hope Clausen works out. And I'm not angry at all. I think Clausen looks like a career backup yet people wanted the guy because we needed an upgrade at QB. It was a terrible year for Qbs. Reaching for a player because you need to fill a position is how you end up with JP Losman. Clausen is JP with better pocket presence and a much worse arm. And I thought we set the parameters at 3 years. If he turns into a good NFL Qb (playoff quality with good stats), you get your B & J. And anything lower than that, I'm sipping on Stella.
stony Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 And I'm not angry at all. I think Clausen looks like a career backup yet people wanted the guy because we needed an upgrade at QB. It was a terrible year for Qbs. Reaching for a player because you need to fill a position is how you end up with JP Losman. Clausen is JP with better pocket presence and a much worse arm. And I thought we set the parameters at 3 years. If he turns into a good NFL Qb (playoff quality with good stats), you get your B & J. And anything lower than that, I'm sipping on Stella. 1) Isn't it a bit quick to label him a career backup after two preseason games. 2) yes it was. 3) What else do you see in him that reminds you of JP? I;m just curious because I have mixed feeling about him as well, although I think he turn out to be a good NFL starter.
Pete Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 Claussen will be lucky to do as well in the NFL as Ron Paulos, Rick Mirer, and Tony Banks.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 1) Isn't it a bit quick to label him a career backup after two preseason games. 2) yes it was. 3) What else do you see in him that reminds you of JP? I;m just curious because I have mixed feeling about him as well, although I think he turn out to be a good NFL starter. You're right and I'm not saying it will happen 100%. I just never got wowed by the guy. My reasons: - He had a top 5 receiving core. I believe the special Qbs have to carry average talent. - A great OC (terrible head coach) who made Quinn into a 1st rounder - Pete Carroll who gameplanned for him for several years passed on him twice. So did mike holmgrem and his own college coach who know a thing about NFL Qbs. - ND played a really weak schedule and his best games came against terrible pass defenses. - his upbringing. Held back twice to gain an edge and would have been 24 as a rookie if he decided to stay for his true senior year. Also, I get the Marvonich vibe because of the private QB tutors since childhood. QBs aren't made in a lab. They are made on a football field. - his record in college was a losing one. Obviously, it's a team stat but college QBs have an insane impact on their teams. Cutler had a losing college record and still hasn't had a winning one in the pros. - The draft. Terrible draft for QBs and that's the reason he got as much play as he did. And McDaniels trading up Tebow, who has to learn how to throw again, speaks volumes. - Finally, his attitude. Downplay it all you want, guys don't play for pricks and guys they don't like. See Losman, Cutler, and George. Don't mean to hate on the guy but I'm so glad the Bills passed on him. I would take any of the possible Qbs from next years draft - Locker, Luck, Mallett, Pryor, Jerrod Johnson, Ponder- over Clausen. If turns out to be a stud, I'll admit I was wrong. But I got a similar vibe from Leinart and he was a winner in college. They are guys I want to build our franchise around.
John Cocktosten Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 Claussen will be lucky to do as well in the NFL as Ron Paulos, Rick Mirer, and Tony Banks. Tony Banks went to Mich St. Tony Rice went to ND.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 Tony Banks went to Mich St. Tony Rice went to ND. And Tony Banks sadly had a better NFL career than all of those ND guys.
stony Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 You're right and I'm not saying it will happen 100%. I just never got wowed by the guy. My reasons: - He had a top 5 receiving core. I believe the special Qbs have to carry average talent. - A great OC (terrible head coach) who made Quinn into a 1st rounder - Pete Carroll who gameplanned for him for several years passed on him twice. So did mike holmgrem and his own college coach who know a thing about NFL Qbs. - ND played a really weak schedule and his best games came against terrible pass defenses. - his upbringing. Held back twice to gain an edge and would have been 24 as a rookie if he decided to stay for his true senior year. Also, I get the Marvonich vibe because of the private QB tutors since childhood. QBs aren't made in a lab. They are made on a football field. - his record in college was a losing one. Obviously, it's a team stat but college QBs have an insane impact on their teams. Cutler had a losing college record and still hasn't had a winning one in the pros. - The draft. Terrible draft for QBs and that's the reason he got as much play as he did. And McDaniels trading up Tebow, who has to learn how to throw again, speaks volumes. - Finally, his attitude. Downplay it all you want, guys don't play for pricks and guys they don't like. See Losman, Cutler, and George. Don't mean to hate on the guy but I'm so glad the Bills passed on him. I would take any of the possible Qbs from next years draft - Locker, Luck, Mallett, Pryor, Jerrod Johnson, Ponder- over Clausen. If turns out to be a stud, I'll admit I was wrong. But I got a similar vibe from Leinart and he was a winner in college. They are guys I want to build our franchise around. 1) Sure did. Although I know we need help in more pressing positions (actually maybe not after the injuries of this camp) I would love to see either Floyd or Rudolph in a Bills uni next year. 2)Very good point. Perhaps even more poignant by the fact he actually played decent against USC too. Basically Pete said Whitehurst > Clausen. 3)Yes. If you're gonna gamble and roll the dice, its nice to have some options.
Zulu Cthulhu Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 Idiots always point to some amorphous "it" factor based on things they pull out of thin air when a player's actual real life performance doesn't justify the hype they've heaped on the player.
John Cocktosten Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 Idiots always point to some amorphous "it" factor based on things they pull out of thin air when a player's actual real life performance doesn't justify the hype they've heaped on the player. What's more idiotic? Comparing him to Brady Quinn or saying that he is a bust after his 2nd preseason game? 30 teams passed on Brees, Brady, B. Marshall, Welker, T. Thomas, A. Reed.... How is that an inictment of a player? I'm not going to argue that he must be an a**hole because that much is obvious, but to put his stats FROM HIS 2ND CAREER PRESEASON GAMEand make that the reason why you believe he is BQ 2.0, is less idiotic and more retarded.
Zulu Cthulhu Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 They ran the same system, on the same team with the same coach. Their draft experiences were similar (although Jimmy had the good sense to stay home on draft day). That's where the quinn 2.0 comparison comes from. Will he end up better than Quinn? For your sake i hope so. No one here is calling him a bust John, either. All some of us are trying to point out (and apparently you still aren't getting) is that stroking this kid after one so-so preseason performance and calling him better than anything we have is dumb. Pointing to his "drive," and "urge to learn" as more evidence of his superiority is beyond dumb. It's criminally stupid.
tennesseeboy Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 I wish Clausen well, although if he does well there will be a lot of "I told you so's" from the Clausen for Buffalo crowd. I wasn't one of them, but I really do think he will do okay.
John Cocktosten Posted August 24, 2010 Posted August 24, 2010 They ran the same system, on the same team with the same coach. Their draft experiences were similar (although Jimmy had the good sense to stay home on draft day). That's where the quinn 2.0 comparison comes from. Will he end up better than Quinn? For your sake i hope so. No one here is calling him a bust John, either. All some of us are trying to point out (and apparently you still aren't getting) is that stroking this kid after one so-so preseason performance and calling him better than anything we have is dumb. Pointing to his "drive," and "urge to learn" as more evidence of his superiority is beyond dumb. It's criminally stupid. Oh that makes sense. By that brilliant logic, Bradford must be Jason White 2.0. I can't figure out whether Aaron Rodgers is Kyle Boller 2.0, David Carr 2.0 or Akili Smith 2.0...I mean they all played for Tedford in the same QB friendly system right? Does that make Matt Cassel Tom Brady 2.0 or does it not count because they are in the NFL? I'm just not sure how your rules works. If you're comparing the 2 based on the fact that they had the same coach and ran the same system I would call that criminally stupid.
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