Greed knows no bounds.

[purple haze]

Maybe, but in the grand scheme of things, it's hard to sympathize with a guy who is throwing a tantrum because he can't get his guaranteed millions.

 

I work in a place where (for the longest time) I felt I was underpaid and overworked compared to my peers. If I had refused to work because of that, my employers would have easily found someone else to do my job for the existing salary...even if they thought I was the best guy in the group.

 

You are right, you're employers would have found someone else because I am assuming you work in a field outside of professonial athletics. It is a different industry and we can't compare our situations to their situations. It's different. Revis isn't throwing a tantrum. He's using his right to hold out for what he believes he is worth; no crime in that. He will get it or the owner will keep it. Everybody loves to get mad at the players, but the owners are making billions of dollars.

[Skoobydum]

It's the rookie pay scale that makes this problem come to light, $50 Million guaranteed for a guy that has never played a down in the NFL is a slap to all the best players making less. Revis is a great player and does deserve more money, I don't know about $120 Guaranteed but more than he is making.

 

I'd give him $35 Million guaranteed this year and bumped up to $50 Million Guaranteed next year and $65 Million Guaranteed the next on a long term deal. This way it's broken out for the the club to pay a majority during this open cap year and a substantial amount less less during potentially capped years. You can still pay him $10 M a year for 12 years with pre-paid money like that, it seems alright.

[bartshan-83]

I work in a place where (for the longest time) I felt I was underpaid and overworked compared to my peers. If I had refused to work because of that, my employers would have easily found someone else to do my job for the existing salary...even if they thought I was the best guy in the group.

Yes, but that is the exact same situation Revis is in.

 

His employer (Jets) will decide if he is worth the money. If he is not, they will replace him with someone who is cheaper, even if they think he is the best guy (CB) in the group (team/league).

[altleg]

Top executives are paid to increase the value of the company. The vast majority of their pay is in stock/options. Therefore, their annual salary is tied directly and almost completely to the performance of their company, i.e.--their own performance. This is completely different from a top NFL CB, who can command a crazy large long term contract based on one good season, not on his current or future performance--or that of his team.

 

And when the stock market declines, these same top executives whine and complain and their Board of Directors re-price their out-of-the-money stock options to current market levels regardless of their performance.

[Wayne Cubed]

They spent their young years wanting to grab that big payout, and the fame. Many, when they cash in, start up a personal posse and bedeck themselves with bling. Don't you think that they somewhere along the line, learned the risks? Of course they did.

 

NFL players aren't little sheep lost in the woods. The folks who watch the tv games, buy the stadium tickets, buy the trinkets are appreciated, but at the end of the day, it is they that fork over the $ that pays the big dollars to this eclectic crowd who took their jobs with eyes (and wallets) wide open. The players act for themselves, first and forever.

 

How many of us work in a job that has a guaranteed contract? Has a minimum salary for even a few weeks of showing up? The CIN acquisition, wr Antonio Bryant, will pocket $8M if his knee continues to ail, simply because he passed his initial physical. And may never play a down for that club. There is no end of dangerous occupations - mining, iron working, chemicals, farming - you name it. And they have no guarantees.

 

+1

 

And Adding to Skoobys comment, these rookies sign for millions of dollars in guaranteed money, before even stepping on the field. Its ridiculous. I would love to have a job where i show up, do a piss poor job and still collect millions of dollars. Why should i feel bad for the player? He had ONE amazing year. So next year if he plays piss poor does he hand back the money he made? no, that will never happen. they are playing a sport and making money that most everyone here would dream of making. he signed this contract, he was gonna get 20 million in guaranteed. and i'm not surprised he is going after this money in uncapped year.

[CodeMonkey]

How is "the system" a mess?

The way it works now there really is very little point to even having a contract.

Player and team have a 10 year "contract" (no guarantee money) for example:

1) Team can cut player at any time with no repercussions.

2) Player can hold out for more money with no repercussions.

 

The only thing I see a contract doing is stopping other teams from making the player an outright offer at any time.

At the end of the day, why have a contract if either side can opt out at any time?

 

 

It's no different than any other contractual situation. A valued employee thinks he's worth more than he's getting paid. His employer disagrees and wants him to report to work under the conditions of his current, negotiated contract. He refuses and is willing to not work and not get paid.

It is completely different. If I have a employment contract with my employer (which I do actually), if partway into the contract I say that I want more money or I will stop working. Do they negotiate with me? Hell no. They slap me with a breach of contract suit and take me to the cleaners. Just not get paid? Only in the NFL which also shows how the NFL system is a mess.

[Orton's Arm]

I could not agree more that the sheer volume of dollars being talked about here are grotesque (i.e.- from another dimension, uncanny, etc).

 

No player is worth that, and the game cannot support those kind of salaries. No game can. But, that is kinda the point, ain't it? Reach the pros, and it's not about "the game" anymore. Its a profession. Kill or be killed. Laws of the jungle.

 

Atleast that's from a players perspective (or so I've heard).

 

I don't that there is anything wrong with making a living for yourself, and if your talent is so rare that you are the top in your profession that you should be paid according to what the market will allow. I also look at movie stars, and when they gross something like $20-30 million for 1 movie, 1 freakin' movie w/maybe 4 months of "work" and no threat to their life or health (like professional athletes), and I say more power to them.

 

But at some level, with the rest of the world sinking in recessions, and riots, and protests, and devaluing of cash, lay-offs, etc...how is it that these major issues are not shown in the entertainment industry? Speaking of the bigger picture, are we all like the ostrich; just sticking our heads in the proverbial sand while being besieged with entertainment to deny the very stiff realities that we are finding ourselves more, and more faced with on a daily basis?

 

I don't think greed is the correct judgement. I think, looking at the bigger picture, if you can't afford your rent or mortgage, you shouldn't be supporting Revis', either. If you can't pay your phone bill, you should not be buying "gear". If you can't put food on the table or are on welfare, owning a jersey should be the farthest thing from any realistic thought.

 

After all, aren't we, the fans, the ones who give our dollars to this cause? Don't we support the market that builds the "pie" that players like Revis keep wanting to take a bigger piece out of?

 

I used to have this old shop teacher in high school that used to say "every time you point the finger at somebody, there are 4 more pointing back at you". Instead of pointing the finger at Revis for wanting to be paid according to his ability, maybe you should ask why you keep supporting the very ability for him to even fathom the thought.

This.

[bartshan-83]

I could not agree more that the sheer volume of dollars being talked about here are grotesque (i.e.- from another dimension, uncanny, etc).

 

No player is worth that, and the game cannot support those kind of salaries. No game can. But, that is kinda the point, ain't it? Reach the pros, and it's not about "the game" anymore. Its a profession. Kill or be killed. Laws of the jungle.

 

Atleast that's from a players perspective (or so I've heard).

 

I don't that there is anything wrong with making a living for yourself, and if your talent is so rare that you are the top in your profession that you should be paid according to what the market will allow. I also look at movie stars, and when they gross something like $20-30 million for 1 movie, 1 freakin' movie w/maybe 4 months of "work" and no threat to their life or health (like professional athletes), and I say more power to them.

 

But at some level, with the rest of the world sinking in recessions, and riots, and protests, and devaluing of cash, lay-offs, etc...how is it that these major issues are not shown in the entertainment industry? Speaking of the bigger picture, are we all like the ostrich; just sticking our heads in the proverbial sand while being besieged with entertainment to deny the very stiff realities that we are finding ourselves more, and more faced with on a daily basis?

 

I don't think greed is the correct judgement. I think, looking at the bigger picture, if you can't afford your rent or mortgage, you shouldn't be supporting Revis', either. If you can't pay your phone bill, you should not be buying "gear". If you can't put food on the table or are on welfare, owning a jersey should be the farthest thing from any realistic thought.

 

After all, aren't we, the fans, the ones who give our dollars to this cause? Don't we support the market that builds the "pie" that players like Revis keep wanting to take a bigger piece out of?

 

I used to have this old shop teacher in high school that used to say "every time you point the finger at somebody, there are 4 more pointing back at you". Instead of pointing the finger at Revis for wanting to be paid according to his ability, maybe you should ask why you keep supporting the very ability for him to even fathom the thought.

This.

Seconded again.

 

When is last time someone complained about a WNBA chick holding out for $50MM?

 

We all cringe at the $$$ amounts being discussed, but if you are legitimately upset about Revis's situation, remember there is one thing, and one thing only, separating HIM from that WNBA shooting guard:

 

 

 

YOU.

[Rob's House]

+1

 

Don't think the Washington situation isn't playing a role here. Jets players saw first hand how "loyal" the front office is. Not that they're any different than the rest of the owners. Washington was negotiating in good faith, got hurt, and never got his deal.

 

Fug 'em. Why people side with billionaires over millionaires is crazy to me.

 

What if the billionaire is right? Do we only look at who has more and make a blind assessment based on that and that alone?

 

Many of us resent guys like Revis who are offered top compensation in their field and pout and play victim b/c someone else is getting a little more and he wants the bragging rights. There is a limit to how many millions of $$s billionares can afford to throw at players salaries, and spending over $15mil/yr on 1 guy who isn't even your QB is crazy.

 

The guy does have 3 yrs left on his contract. I know, I know. The team can cut you and you can hold out. Well, sit out then, but don't expect sympathy.

[silvermike]

Honestly, with very rare exceptions, I don't care which side wins in an extended holdout. It's not my money and it's not my problem.

 

When it's a Bills player, I generally want him to make less money, so we can spend it on other guys, and with Jets/Dolphins/Patriots, I want him to make more for the same reasons. But I'm not sympathetic to players' demands that they need to put food on their table and I'm not sympathetic to owners' insistence that they're going broke.

 

I don't feel any kind of moral outrage that a player holds out having signed a contract. It's a contract that sets up a specific, league-established system for holdouts. Team should negotiate contracts with players that establish stiffer penalties for missing time, and if they don't, then it's not my problem.

 

But bottom line, I want to see every NFL-caliber player playing NFL football. I don't care which side picks the fight, player, agent, or team. I just want the problems solved. And given that every side in these debates tends to be unwilling to resolve the situation, I don't really care what happens.

[K Gun Special]

hes holding out to get the most money possible. so what. if you could get more money to do what you do at your job, many of you would take it in a heartbeat. He doesnt have that option. NFL have short careers and he's free to work outside the NFL if he wants.

 

A lot of this holier than thou stuff and you hardliners really dont have an idea how the business works.

[BillsneedaSuperbowl]

regis should just take the money.

[CosmicBills]

What if the billionaire is right? Do we only look at who has more and make a blind assessment based on that and that alone?

 

Many of us resent guys like Revis who are offered top compensation in their field and pout and play victim b/c someone else is getting a little more and he wants the bragging rights. There is a limit to how many millions of $$s billionares can afford to throw at players salaries, and spending over $15mil/yr on 1 guy who isn't even your QB is crazy.

 

The guy does have 3 yrs left on his contract. I know, I know. The team can cut you and you can hold out. Well, sit out then, but don't expect sympathy.

This is a ridiculous stance on many, many levels.

 

Athletes have a very limited time to make their lifetime earnings -- if they're lucky they get 2 contracts. If they're really lucky they get 3. During any of those contracts they're a play away from a career ending injury, possibly a life ending one.

 

Owners exploit the talents of these young men and have the right to cut them, void their contracts AT ANY POINT they wish. No other job can you be fired without cause like you can in sports. The owners can't be fired. They have guaranteed money from TV deals that dwarf the sums made by the players they depend on to deliver the product.

 

The Owners also play you, the fan, for a fool in this situation. Where is all this bad press coming from about Revis? From the owners. They want the public to pressure him to play. Yet when Revis, or any player, tries to do the same, it's considered whining. No one blinked an eye when the Jets fu*C*ed over Washington. This guy was negotiating on good faith. Playing out his contract as everyone here says Revis should -- then he gets hurt and rather than get the money the Jets promised, they traded him to Seattle where he has to start over again.

 

Is that really fair? Take the dollars out of it. They make more than 99% of us ever will. That's just the business. People get blinded by how much they're making and don't look at the real issues. This is a violent sport where rich white owners laugh their way to the bank while players don't ride off into the sunset, the hobble into it. If they even make it in the first place.

[BillsneedaSuperbowl]

This is a ridiculous stance on many, many levels.

 

Athletes have a very limited time to make their lifetime earnings -- if they're lucky they get 2 contracts. If they're really lucky they get 3. During any of those contracts they're a play away from a career ending injury, possibly a life ending one.

 

Owners exploit the talents of these young men and have the right to cut them, void their contracts AT ANY POINT they wish. No other job can you be fired without cause like you can in sports. The owners can't be fired. They have guaranteed money from TV deals that dwarf the sums made by the players they depend on to deliver the product.

 

The Owners also play you, the fan, for a fool in this situation. Where is all this bad press coming from about Revis? From the owners. They want the public to pressure him to play. Yet when Revis, or any player, tries to do the same, it's considered whining. No one blinked an eye when the Jets fu*C*ed over Washington. This guy was negotiating on good faith. Playing out his contract as everyone here says Revis should -- then he gets hurt and rather than get the money the Jets promised, they traded him to Seattle where he has to start over again.

 

Is that really fair? Take the dollars out of it. They make more than 99% of us ever will. That's just the business. People get blinded by how much they're making and don't look at the real issues. This is a violent sport where rich white owners laugh their way to the bank while players don't ride off into the sunset, the hobble into it. If they even make it in the first place.

you make some decent points but,

 

first of all, nfl players make wayyy too much money, they play a game. why should they make more than say doctors? or politicians?

life ending injury? thats highly unlikely, being a cab driver is more risky than being a football player.

and who says you cant get fired from a job for no reason? you can fired from any job for pretty much any reason. it may not be fair, but thats how jobs work.

[CosmicBills]

you make some decent points but,

 

first of all, nfl players make wayyy too much money, they play a game. why should they make more than say doctors? or politicians?

life ending injury? thats highly unlikely, being a cab driver is more risky than being a football player.

and who says you cant get fired from a job for no reason? you can fired from any job for pretty much any reason. it may not be fair, but thats how jobs work.

I'm not arguing if they make too much money. That's a losing argument. But facts are they make what they make because there's a market for it.

 

That's the thing. The average fan hears he's holding out for 12 million more, or 2 million more and they freak out because "how much money do you need?!" But then again, the owners, who make significantly more, are trying to hold out from paying 2 or 12 million more ... which is the same thing. But people don't look at it that way because they see someone as selfish for holding out. That's just not the case. It's business. And the owners are far more greedy than the players. Thems are just the facts.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

And I'm sick of owners cutting players without guaranteed contracts. The guarantee is all you got as a player. Leon Washington figured he'd come back on the one year deal instead of holding out, busted up his leg and will likely never get the contract. In football, I have no reservations about a player (especially a proven vet) holding out for as much guaranteed money as he can get. Most only have one shot at this. Get it while you can, cause you're likely to need it later in life to payy for medical expenses.

 

 

well, one little difference is the contractual language involved, but if you can get past that it's the same thing.

 

the player risks.

the owner risks.

one good year doesn't guarantee another.

the jets benefit from revis, revis benefits from the jets.

 

 

and on and on. maybe a lockout will help fix the system.

[bills_fan]

you make some decent points but,

 

first of all, nfl players make wayyy too much money, they play a game. why should they make more than say doctors? or politicians?

life ending injury? thats highly unlikely, being a cab driver is more risky than being a football player.

and who says you cant get fired from a job for no reason? you can fired from any job for pretty much any reason. it may not be fair, but thats how jobs work.

 

 

Define too much money...because the owners will just keep it if they don't pay the players. NFL is entertainment, just like the movies. The more people spend on it, the higher the take for the owners and players. Don't like it...don't spend your money on the NFL.

[stuckincincy]

I'm not arguing if they make too much money. That's a losing argument. But facts are they make what they make because there's a market for it.

 

That's the thing. The average fan hears he's holding out for 12 million more, or 2 million more and they freak out because "how much money do you need?!" But then again, the owners, who make significantly more, are trying to hold out from paying 2 or 12 million more ... which is the same thing. But people don't look at it that way because they see someone as selfish for holding out. That's just not the case. It's business. And the owners are far more greedy than the players. Thems are just the facts.

 

 

The NFL is and always has been nothing but show business, and it contains all the greed and lack of ethics that define show business. It's all for the buck.

 

Why are you shilling for either side? The players work throughout their youth to get in a position to grab a pile of gold. The owners provide the venue for them, chasing the same pot of gold.

[JohnC]

How is "the system" a mess?

 

It's no different than any other contractual situation. A valued employee thinks he's worth more than he's getting paid. His employer disagrees and wants him to report to work under the conditions of his current, negotiated contract. He refuses and is willing to not work and not get paid.

 

This is how it works.

 

Anyway, if he was really offered that kind of contract and turned it down, he is either crazy or very poorly advised. There is no conceivable circumstance where anyone in the future would offer him more money after he has sat out a year.

 

The Jets are a serious team with a capable owner compared to the Bills who are not a serious team with an incapable owner. The contract will be settled after a lot of posturing from both sides. When all is said and done the best or second best CB in football is going to get a contract at the level where he is ranked as a player, near the top. Revis is one of the top impact defensive players in the league. He will get signed. All those complaints about how this particular player is being selfish will fade away once he is back on the field and making his presence felt.

 

The predictable ranting over contracts doesn't make sense. The player is trying to get what he feels he is worth. The team is trying to balance his contract needs with the team's contract needs for the rest of the roster. It is simply standard negotiations and cap management. It will be resolved. I don't understand the fuss.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

This is a ridiculous stance on many, many levels.

 

Athletes have a very limited time to make their lifetime earnings -- if they're lucky they get 2 contracts. If they're really lucky they get 3. During any of those contracts they're a play away from a career ending injury, possibly a life ending one.

 

Owners exploit the talents of these young men and have the right to cut them, void their contracts AT ANY POINT they wish. No other job can you be fired without cause like you can in sports. The owners can't be fired. They have guaranteed money from TV deals that dwarf the sums made by the players they depend on to deliver the product.

 

The Owners also play you, the fan, for a fool in this situation. Where is all this bad press coming from about Revis? From the owners. They want the public to pressure him to play. Yet when Revis, or any player, tries to do the same, it's considered whining. No one blinked an eye when the Jets fu*C*ed over Washington. This guy was negotiating on good faith. Playing out his contract as everyone here says Revis should -- then he gets hurt and rather than get the money the Jets promised, they traded him to Seattle where he has to start over again.

 

Is that really fair? Take the dollars out of it. They make more than 99% of us ever will. That's just the business. People get blinded by how much they're making and don't look at the real issues. This is a violent sport where rich white owners laugh their way to the bank while players don't ride off into the sunset, the hobble into it. If they even make it in the first place.

 

i think you're underestimating the ability of the average fan to sort through these situations and formulate their own opinions. the owner can say all he wants, as can the player, but that doesn't mean we have to believe it.

 

fair has never had anything to do with it. it never will. if everything was fair, you wouldn't need a contract, and scott norwood would have made the kick, and i'd have had a great career with the bills. and for every rich owner there are dozens of wealthy-beyond-belief players with otherwise unremarkable life skills.

 

i can appreciate the concern about taking care of former players and their expenses, and while i'd stop short at calling it exploitation, i'd certainly agree that all parties----owners, union, current players and retired players with wealth should be able to figure out a program to help their own. like any negotiation, however, the owners agreeing to carve out a boatload of much needed relief to former players has to take every other element of their business into consideration.